[PSES] DoC for Republic of Ireland and Republic of Cyprus markets

[Scott Xe]

Both countries are using BS 1363 plugs and sockets.  We have a cord
extension set for the UK market and complies with Plugs and Sockets etc.
(Safety) Regulations 1994 (SI 1994/1768).  Do both Republic of Ireland and
Republic of Cyprus recognise the UK compliance as EU LVD compliance in EU
DoC?

Thanks and regards,

Scott

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[PSES] Position available

[Steve Brody]

Hi all,

I have a client in San Jose, CA, looking for a full time product 
safety/compliance engineer. Product are in the UL 61010-1, EN 61010-1, EN 
60204-1, NFPA-79 playground with NRTL and CE.

If interested please email me privately at stev...@productehsconsulting.com 
mailto:stev...@productehsconsulting.com

Thanks,

Steve Brody
sgbr...@comcast.net mailto:sgbr...@comcast.net
C - 603 617 9116

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[PSES] AW: [PSES] Origin of steps in radiated emissions limit lines

[Dürrer Bernd]

Hi James,

you may have a look at CISPR TR 16-4-4 (CISPR TR 
16-4-4:2007+AMD1:2017+AMD2:2020 CSV | IEC 
Webstore) that describes several 
methods for the derivation of limits.

Kind regards,

Bernd

Von: James Pawson (U3C) 
Gesendet: Dienstag, 3. Mai 2022 11:42
An: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Betreff: [PSES] Origin of steps in radiated emissions limit lines

Hello all,

A question I get asked by our customers, and that I've not found a satisfactory 
answer to, is why are there steps in the limit lines for radiated emissions?

This kind of leads to the question of how do limit lines get specified in the 
first place? For emissions and immunity.

I know that it relates to protection of radio receivers - the limits in CISPR 
25 or EN 60945 are good examples - but how are the limits set?

Apologies for the vague expression of the question!

All the best
James


James Pawson
Managing Director & EMC Problem Solver

Unit 3 Compliance Ltd
EMC : Environmental & Vibration : Electrical Safety : CE & UKCA : Consultancy

www.unit3compliance.co.uk
  |  ja...@unit3compliance.co.uk
+44(0)1274 911747  |  +44(0)7811 139957
2 Wellington Business Park, New Lane, Bradford, BD4 8AL
Registered in England and Wales # 10574298





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Re: [PSES] Origin of steps in radiated emissions limit lines

[T.Sato]

On Tue, 3 May 2022 10:42:23 +0100,
  "James Pawson (U3C)"  wrote:

> A question I get asked by our customers, and that I've not found a
> satisfactory answer to, is why are there steps in the limit lines for
> radiated emissions?
>
> This kind of leads to the question of how do limit lines get specified in
> the first place? For emissions and immunity.

For emission, maybe worth to read the following articles:

"A Historical Look Back: The 1977 CBEMA Paper on Electromagnetic Emanations"
(Daniel D. Hoolihan, published in In Compliance Magagine) 

https://incompliancemag.com/article/a-historical-look-back-the-1977-cbema-paper-on-electromagnetic-emanations/
https://incompliancemag.com/article/a-historical-look-back-the-1977-cbema-paper-on-electromagnetic-emanations-2/
https://incompliancemag.com/article/a-historical-look-back-the-1977-cbema-paper-on-electromagnetic-emanations-part-3/

Regards,
Tom

-- 
Tomonori Sato  
URL: http://t-sato.in.coocan.jp

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Re: [PSES] Origin of steps in radiated emissions limit lines

[Michael Viau]

I don't know much about the commercial side, but there is a really
well-written document for the US military standard (MIL-STD-461) called SAE
EIA EMCB 1-1 - Historical Rationale for Military EMI Limits (behind a
damned paywall, unfortunately, but I can try to send it to you if you'd
like). (https://standards.globalspec.com/std/10021073/EIA%20EMCB%201-1)
Every test has it's own unique origin story, but I think the answer often
tends to be starting with a known problem, doing the analysis work to say
what it would take to solve it, throwing on an extra x dB of margin and
making minor course corrections based on the feedback you get from the
community along the way.   Sprinkle in some marketing, bias, and
in-fighting and you've got yourself a standard!
To be clear, I say this from a perspective of having never served on a
standards committee (despite desperately wanting to fill a former
colleagues position on the tri-service working group).
I'm sure Ken and others in the group will have a much more valuable input
here, but I just so happen to be fascinated with the history and finding
any old rationale document I can.

I'm always telling newer folks that it really doesn't matter if the limit
or test methodology (as written in the standard) is "wrong", so long as
it's predictive and everyone does it the same wrong way.
And the tests are really good at predicting that you won't have a problem
down the road when you pass... and not so great at predicting anything when
you fail.  Even some of the easiest tests to translate to installation
(CE106 and CS104) don't do a great job at predicting actual problems when
they've failed the test.  I've seen things fail CS104 for broad swathes of
frequencies at -40 dBm and surrounded by emitters in that frequency range,
and it performs just fine on the aircraft... until one day when it
won't...  but now I've strayed too far from your original question.


On Tue, 3 May 2022 at 04:42, James Pawson (U3C) 
wrote:

> Hello all,
>
>
>
> A question I get asked by our customers, and that I’ve not found a
> satisfactory answer to, is why are there steps in the limit lines for
> radiated emissions?
>
>
>
> This kind of leads to the question of how do limit lines get specified in
> the first place? For emissions and immunity.
>
>
>
> I know that it relates to protection of radio receivers – the limits in
> CISPR 25 or EN 60945 are good examples – but how are the limits set?
>
>
>
> Apologies for the vague expression of the question!
>
>
>
> All the best
>
> James
>
>
>
>
>
> James Pawson
>
> Managing Director & EMC Problem Solver
>
>
>
> *Unit 3 Compliance Ltd*
>
> *EMC : Environmental & Vibration : Electrical Safety : CE & UKCA :
> Consultancy*
>
>
>
> www.unit3compliance.co.uk  |  ja...@unit3compliance.co.uk
>
> +44(0)1274 911747  |  +44(0)7811 139957
>
> 2 Wellington Business Park, New Lane, Bradford, BD4 8AL
>
> Registered in England and Wales # 10574298
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG antivirus software.
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> 
>
> This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc
> discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to <
> emc-p...@ieee.org>
>
> All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at:
> http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html
>
> Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at
> http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in
> well-used formats), large files, etc.
>
> Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/
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[PSES] Origin of steps in radiated emissions limit lines

[James Pawson (U3C)]

Hello all,

 

A question I get asked by our customers, and that I've not found a
satisfactory answer to, is why are there steps in the limit lines for
radiated emissions?

 

This kind of leads to the question of how do limit lines get specified in
the first place? For emissions and immunity.

 

I know that it relates to protection of radio receivers - the limits in
CISPR 25 or EN 60945 are good examples - but how are the limits set? 

 

Apologies for the vague expression of the question!

 

All the best

James

 

 

James Pawson

Managing Director & EMC Problem Solver

 

Unit 3 Compliance Ltd

EMC : Environmental & Vibration : Electrical Safety : CE & UKCA :
Consultancy

 

  www.unit3compliance.co.uk  |
 ja...@unit3compliance.co.uk 

+44(0)1274 911747  |  +44(0)7811 139957

2 Wellington Business Park, New Lane, Bradford, BD4 8AL

Registered in England and Wales # 10574298

 

 

 



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