Re: [PSES] IEC 62368-1: To understand chapter 5.4.11
Hi Piotr USB circuit is internal circuit. There are no transients expected on USB. Clause 5.4.11 is not applicable for power supply with USB output. Paired conductor is a telecommunication network that we had in old times (analogue network, ISDN,...). I hope this helps. If you need more info, you can contact me. Best regards, Boštjan -Original Message- From: Piotr Galka Sent: Tuesday, May 7, 2024 5:40 PM To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG Subject: [PSES] IEC 62368-1: To understand chapter 5.4.11 CAUTION: This email originated from outside of our organisation. Do not click links or open attachments unless you recognise the sender and know the content is safe. Trying to understand 62368-1... I have got laptop with type A power supply so it looks being not excluded from 5.4.11 by rules in 5.4.11.1. For me USB are external circuits indicated in Table 14, ID numbers 1 and 2 (I think USB is 'Paired conductor', but even not it certainly is 'Any other conductors'). The note in Table 14 about not taking into account transients for external circuits installed wholly within the same building is only about transients so I think it doesn't make USB being not indicated in table. USB cable can be used to connect laptop to printer and in printer USB can be earthed, I think. Dos this means that according to first sentence of 5.4.11.2 each USB port in this laptop should be separated from its other USB ports? I don't believe there is such requirement. My real problem to understand is as follows: Typical access controller have several not separated from each other inputs (several RFID reader inputs, door state control input, tamper inputs and others). I need to understand if the access controller powered from (external to it) 12V DC buffered (= having accu in it) supply is permanently connected equipment or not? To disconnect it from 12V supply you need tools, to disconnect 12V supply from mains you need tools, but 12V supply has isolation in it so access controller is not electrically connected to mains and 3.3.3.4 says about needing tools to disconnect from mains (if something is not connected than tools are not needed to make it being disconnected, I think). Being permanently connected equipment is the easiest way for controller to be excluded from 5.4.11. But if it is not permanently connected than its inputs are in the same situation as laptop USB ports I described first as more common to everyone. What I miss or wrongly understand? Regards Piotr Galka P.S. Last month free time I spend browsing about 2800 EMC-PSTC posts collected by my mail program for few years. - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: https://www.mail-archive.com/emc-pstc@listserv.ieee.org/ Website: https://ewh.ieee.org/soc/pses/ Instructions: https://ewh.ieee.org/soc/pses/list.html (including how to unsubscribe) List rules: https://ewh.ieee.org/soc/pses/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Mike Sherman at: msherma...@comcast.net Rick Linford at: linf...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: _ To unsubscribe from the EMC-PSTC list, click the following link: https://listserv.ieee.org/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=EMC-PSTC=1 - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: https://www.mail-archive.com/emc-pstc@listserv.ieee.org/ Website: https://ewh.ieee.org/soc/pses/ Instructions: https://ewh.ieee.org/soc/pses/list.html (including how to unsubscribe) List rules: https://ewh.ieee.org/soc/pses/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Mike Sherman at: msherma...@comcast.net Rick Linford at: linf...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: _ To unsubscribe from the EMC-PSTC list, click the following link: https://listserv.ieee.org/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=EMC-PSTC=1
[PSES] IEC 62368-1: To understand chapter 5.4.11
Trying to understand 62368-1... I have got laptop with type A power supply so it looks being not excluded from 5.4.11 by rules in 5.4.11.1. For me USB are external circuits indicated in Table 14, ID numbers 1 and 2 (I think USB is 'Paired conductor', but even not it certainly is 'Any other conductors'). The note in Table 14 about not taking into account transients for external circuits installed wholly within the same building is only about transients so I think it doesn't make USB being not indicated in table. USB cable can be used to connect laptop to printer and in printer USB can be earthed, I think. Dos this means that according to first sentence of 5.4.11.2 each USB port in this laptop should be separated from its other USB ports? I don't believe there is such requirement. My real problem to understand is as follows: Typical access controller have several not separated from each other inputs (several RFID reader inputs, door state control input, tamper inputs and others). I need to understand if the access controller powered from (external to it) 12V DC buffered (= having accu in it) supply is permanently connected equipment or not? To disconnect it from 12V supply you need tools, to disconnect 12V supply from mains you need tools, but 12V supply has isolation in it so access controller is not electrically connected to mains and 3.3.3.4 says about needing tools to disconnect from mains (if something is not connected than tools are not needed to make it being disconnected, I think). Being permanently connected equipment is the easiest way for controller to be excluded from 5.4.11. But if it is not permanently connected than its inputs are in the same situation as laptop USB ports I described first as more common to everyone. What I miss or wrongly understand? Regards Piotr Galka P.S. Last month free time I spend browsing about 2800 EMC-PSTC posts collected by my mail program for few years. - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: https://www.mail-archive.com/emc-pstc@listserv.ieee.org/ Website: https://ewh.ieee.org/soc/pses/ Instructions: https://ewh.ieee.org/soc/pses/list.html (including how to unsubscribe) List rules: https://ewh.ieee.org/soc/pses/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Mike Sherman at: msherma...@comcast.net Rick Linford at: linf...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: _ To unsubscribe from the EMC-PSTC list, click the following link: https://listserv.ieee.org/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=EMC-PSTC=1
[PSES] New Machinery Regulation and "emergency rescue"
Hello Experts, As you are probably aware, the Machinery Regulation has a new criterion related to emergency rescue... EHSR 1.6.2, paragraph 2 - "In the case of machinery or related products into which persons shall enter for operation, adjustment, maintenance or cleaning, the machinery accesses shall be dimensioned and adapted for the use of rescue equipment in such a way that an emergency rescue of the persons is possible." I am wondering how this will tend to be interpreted. Any input would be welcome. I expect the Commission will provide some guidance but am not sure of their intended publication schedule. Is there already a machinery standard published, or other fairly authoritative guidance, that would illuminate the details? Is there a standard set of rescue equipment that should be anticipated - such as minimum space for a rescue stretcher? Of course, this seems to be close in concept to US EPA confined space concerns, but I am not yet certain it should be understood with that level of detail. Best Regards, Lauren Crane Product Safety/Environmental Regulatory Compliance Specialist LAM RESEARCH CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail transmission, and any documents, files, or previous e-mail messages attached to it, (collectively, "E-mail Transmission") may be subject to one or more of the following based on the associated sensitivity level: E-mail Transmission (i) contains confidential information, (ii) is prohibited from distribution outside of Lam, and/or (iii) is intended solely for and restricted to the specified recipient(s). If you are not the intended recipient, or a person responsible for delivering it to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of any of the information contained in or attached to this message is STRICTLY PROHIBITED. If you have received this transmission in error, please immediately notify the sender and destroy the original transmission and its attachments without reading them or saving them to disk. Thank you. Confidential - Limited Access and Use - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: https://www.mail-archive.com/emc-pstc@listserv.ieee.org/ Website: https://ewh.ieee.org/soc/pses/ Instructions: https://ewh.ieee.org/soc/pses/list.html (including how to unsubscribe) List rules: https://ewh.ieee.org/soc/pses/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Mike Sherman at: msherma...@comcast.net Rick Linford at: linf...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: _ To unsubscribe from the EMC-PSTC list, click the following link: https://listserv.ieee.org/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=EMC-PSTC=1
