Re: High Speed Clock Routing
All, Clock frequency: 100MHz Rise Time: 1.5ns Voltage pk-pk: 3.3V Traces are impedance controlled, and in a stripline configuration Scott |-+---> | | RPickard@hyperco| | | m.com | | | | | | 10/24/2002 02:26| | | PM | | | | |-+---> >---| | | |To: scott@jci.com | |cc: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org | |Subject: Re: High Speed Clock Routing | >---| Hi Scott, First, I think we all need a bit more information for a specific response. Such as: - what is the clock frequency? - what is the clock rise time? - what is the clock signal amplitude? - overshoot or undershoot? - are these clock traces impedance controlled? - stripline or microstrip? And, you probably won't get a specific response anyway. That's what consultants are for. :-) But for rules of thumb with clock traces (and other high energy traces), it is important to keep layer changes to a minimum, if not zero, and keep them routed away from other susceptible traces to reduce crosstalk. In general, use a series termination located next to the output pin. Also, almost always avoid trace branches for clock traces. Its also important to keep everything well decoupled. IHTH. Best regards, Ron Pickard rpick...@hypercom.com owner-emc-pstc@majordo mo.ieee.org To: emc-p...@ieee.org cc: 10/24/02 10:20 AM Subject: High Speed Clock Routing Please respond to Scott.Mee All, I have a question regarding trace routing for high-speed clock signals. I have one driver, and two receivers. The distance between the driver and 1st receiver is roughly 2.5cm, the distance between 1st receiver and 2nd receiver is 3cm, and the distance between driver and 2nd receiver is 3.5cm. I actually have 2 questions: 1) What is a good rule of thumb for routing and termination of this high-speed clock trace? 2) Is daisy chain routing preferred (meaning driver to 1st receiver, then 2nd receiver), or should 2 traces of equal length be routed, 1 to each receiver (each of these two traces will have twice the impedance of the single trace emanating from the driver so that impedance matching will be maintained)? Any information, in general, or in specific on the subject is greatly appreciated. Thank you. Best Regards, Scott Mee Johnson Controls Inc. Automotive Systems Group EMC Product Compliance 616.394.2565 scott@jci.com --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on "browse" and then "emc-pstc mailing list" --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on "browse" and then "emc-pstc mailing list"
High Speed Clock Routing
All, I have a question regarding trace routing for high-speed clock signals. I have one driver, and two receivers. The distance between the driver and 1st receiver is roughly 2.5cm, the distance between 1st receiver and 2nd receiver is 3cm, and the distance between driver and 2nd receiver is 3.5cm. I actually have 2 questions: 1) What is a good rule of thumb for routing and termination of this high-speed clock trace? 2) Is daisy chain routing preferred (meaning driver to 1st receiver, then 2nd receiver), or should 2 traces of equal length be routed, 1 to each receiver (each of these two traces will have twice the impedance of the single trace emanating from the driver so that impedance matching will be maintained)? Any information, in general, or in specific on the subject is greatly appreciated. Thank you. Best Regards, Scott Mee Johnson Controls Inc. Automotive Systems Group EMC Product Compliance 616.394.2565 scott@jci.com --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on "browse" and then "emc-pstc mailing list"
Re: Frequency Allocations for EU Countries
Thank you to all that have replied! You've been very helpful as usual. Scott |-+-> | | scott@jci.com | | | Sent by: | | | owner-emc-pstc@majordo| | | mo.ieee.org | | | | | | | | | 10/22/2002 11:53 AM | | | Please respond to | | | Scott.Mee | | | | |-+-> >---| | | |To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org | |cc: | |Subject: Frequency Allocations for EU Countries | >---| All, I have a question regarding frequency allocations for the European Union countries. Is anyone on this list aware of a source for the allocation of the RF spectrum in the EU? I'm looking for something similar to the following Domestic chart: http://www.ntia.doc.gov/osmhome/allochrt.pdf But for EU instead... Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thank you. Best Regards, Scott Mee Johnson Controls Inc. Automotive Systems Group EMC Product Compliance 616.394.2565 scott@jci.com --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on "browse" and then "emc-pstc mailing list" --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on "browse" and then "emc-pstc mailing list"
Frequency Allocations for EU Countries
All, I have a question regarding frequency allocations for the European Union countries. Is anyone on this list aware of a source for the allocation of the RF spectrum in the EU? I'm looking for something similar to the following Domestic chart: http://www.ntia.doc.gov/osmhome/allochrt.pdf But for EU instead... Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thank you. Best Regards, Scott Mee Johnson Controls Inc. Automotive Systems Group EMC Product Compliance 616.394.2565 scott@jci.com --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on "browse" and then "emc-pstc mailing list"
A2LA Equivalent
Thank you to all that replied, you've been most helpful, as usual. __ To All, What is the European equivalent to A2LA here in the U.S.? Thank you. Best Regards, Scott Mee Johnson Controls Inc. Automotive Systems Group EMC Product Compliance 616.394.2565 scott@jci.com --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on "browse" and then "emc-pstc mailing list" --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on "browse" and then "emc-pstc mailing list"
A2LA Equivalent
To All, What is the European equivalent to A2LA here in the U.S.? Thank you. Best Regards, Scott Mee Johnson Controls Inc. Automotive Systems Group EMC Product Compliance 616.394.2565 scott@jci.com --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on "browse" and then "emc-pstc mailing list"
Re: 2.45 GHz filter
Company Micro-tronics part number: (BRM50701) The part works great! Best Regards, Scott Mee Johnson Controls Inc. Automotive Systems Group EMC Product Compliance 616.394.2565 scott@jci.com |-+-> | | kcc...@hkpc.org | | | Sent by: | | | owner-emc-pstc@majordo| | | mo.ieee.org | | | | | | | | | 04/19/02 05:07 AM | | | Please respond to | | | kcchan| | | | |-+-> >--| | | |To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org | |cc: | |Subject: 2.45 GHz filter | >--| I am looking for a notch filter for microwave oven and bluetooth emission measurement. Any suggested suppliers for this. Thank you. --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on "browse" and then "emc-pstc mailing list" --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on "browse" and then "emc-pstc mailing list"
Re: Question concerning antenna carousels, their usefulness, credibility of data collected, and......
Jeffrey, You are correct. The standards do not address the usage of multiple antennas. We have not participated in any Round Robin testing multiple antennas in the test chamber, so I am not exactly sure what the possible effects would be in terms of getting accurate and/or repeatable results. >From my experience, I would guess that any object in an absorption chamber that does not absorb, will affect things like repeatability, and uncertainty in your measurements. It would be another question to ask just how much? and is it worth considering? Best Regards, Scott Mee Johnson Controls Inc. Automotive Systems Group EMC Product Compliance 616.394.2565 scott@jci.com |-+-> | | Jeff.Greilich@asl-tk.c| | | om| | | Sent by: | | | owner-emc-pstc@majordo| | | mo.ieee.org | | | | | | | | | 04/16/02 02:15 PM | | | Please respond to | | | Jeff.Greilich | | | | |-+-> >--| | | |To: emc-p...@ieee.org | |cc: | |Subject: Question concerning antenna carousels, their usefulness, credibility of data collected, and..| >--| Et Al: I am soliciting opinions from anyone who has attempted using an antenna carousel that aids in doing automated EMI measurements under CISPR 25. The CISPR 25 specification provides requirements in terms of spacings of the antenna elements from the walls of the room, size of the room, use of anechoic material, etc but not pertaining to adjacent antennas. In addition, certain automotive companies place further requirements in terms of expected performance relative to Round Robin results of a Test Artifact taken at several labs before allowing a new lab to be listed as AEMCLRP accredited. I look forward to hearing from those involved in the Automotive Industry who have information either good/bad relating to this issue. Regards, Jeffrey W. Greilich --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on "browse" and then "emc-pstc mailing list" --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on "browse" and then "emc-pstc mailing list"
Re: AC 97
Darrell, Yes, we are also dealing with the AC 97 Codec. Our experience has been that it produces RF Emissions, but I would say that both common mode and differential mode noise contribute to the overall RF Emissions problem. I don't believe that you will solve the Emissions problem with components alone, you will need to look at your PCB layout in order to achieve the best EMC performance. I would take a look at the datasheet for this device; there is a layout diagram showing preferred grounding, and power feeds. This device creates an interesting situation since there are digital and analog partitions, that need to be supported by layout and component selection. I would also be interested in knowing other's EMC experience with this device. Regards, Scott Mee EMC Engineer Johnson Controls Inc. PH: 616.394.2565 EMAIL: scott@jci.com DLocke@advanced-input.c om To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Sent by: cc: owner-emc-pstc@majordomSubject: AC 97 o.ieee.org 02/22/02 11:11 AM Please respond to DLocke Esteemed Colleages; Has anyone had experience using Audio-Codec '97 (AC 97) topology with respect to EMC performance. It is commonly used in PC sound cards. We have a device that incorporates this technology for voice recognition and are seeing very high emissions between 100-600 MHz. The offending RF noise source appears to be entirely differential. Thanks Darrell Locke Advanced Input Devices --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on "browse" and then "emc-pstc mailing list" --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on "browse" and then "emc-pstc mailing list"
Re: CISPR Compliant EMI Receiver/SA
Richard, We have had great experience using the Rohde & Schwarz ESI-7. (20Hz - 7GHz) This receiver takes measurements very quickly, and is very friendly over the GPIB bus. If you're concerned about price, this unit may not be for you, but if you are willing to spend some money, you will get what you pay for. It has more features than I can even begin to describe on this posting, and is capable of taking several hundred thousand measurements points in one "sweep." It is also equipped with a Spectrum Analyzer mode, so you can actually get two types of measurements with one piece of equipment. If you're interested in high frequency, they have a bigger - "brother" model that goes up to 26GHz. Let me know if you are interested in finding out more about this receiver and my personal experience with it. Regards, Scott Mee EMC Engineer Johnson Controls Inc. PH: 616.394.2565 EMAIL: scott@jci.com richwo...@tycoint.com Sent by: To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org owner-emc-pstc@majordomcc: o.ieee.org Subject: CISPR Compliant EMI Receiver/SA 02/07/02 01:40 PM Please respond to richwoods If cost was a concern, which CISPR compliant EMI receiver or SA, new or used, would you recommend for measurements up to 1 GHz and why that one? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on "browse" and then "emc-pstc mailing list" --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on "browse" and then "emc-pstc mailing list"
Re: Immunity for Automobiles
Lou, It depends upon where in the world this automobile will be sold. But here are a few basic immunity requirements for automobiles sold in the US: 1. Radiated Immunity (Antenna Method) 2. Bulk Current Injection 3. Direct RF Injection 4. Tri-Plate 5. Magnetic Field Immunity 6. Conducted Transient Immunity Most, if not all of these methods can be found in the SAE J1113-XX publication. Please let me know if you would like more details. Regards, Scott Mee EMC Engineer Johnson Controls Inc. PH: 616.394.2565 EMAIL: scott@jci.com ai...@gulftel.com Sent by: To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org owner-emc-pstc@majordomcc: o.ieee.org Subject: Immunity for Automobiles 01/25/02 12:40 AM Please respond to aiken Gentlefolk: Will any of you EMC experts tell me what immunity standard(s) apply to a new production automobile? I am a PSE person and therefore discard most of the EMC messages, but I seem to remember a string of automobile concerns not too long ago but evidently I have already dumped them. Regards, Lou Lou Aiken 27109 Palmetto Drive Orange Beach, AL 36561 USA Tel ++1 251 981 6786 Fax ++1 251 981 3054 Cel ++1 251 979 4648 --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server.
RF Field Uniformity and Antenna location
To All, We are working toward adding capability to perform Radiated Immunity Free Field Testing (Substitution Method), which is very similar to the IEC 61000-4-3 method. The main differences are the following: 1. We have a 15 position target area for uniformity instead of 16 2. Uniformity for 14 of the points is defined as being within +6/-0 dB with respect to the center position on the bottom row. (position 3 in the diagram below) *** 11 12 13 14 15 678910 12345 *** - position 3 must be higher in field strength than all 14 remaining points. My Questions: 1. Does anyone have experience with the physical placement of the transmitting antenna and its relative positioning to the target area? I'm looking for things like height between antenna/floor, distance between antenna/target, and antenna angle with respect to horizontal, etc. 2. Is there a need for absorbing material to be placed on the floor between the target and the antenna? If so, what areas, and how much is typically needed? 3. From experience, in general, how achievable is uniformity at low frequency (200MHz - 1GHz) vs. high frequency (1GHz - 4GHz). What hurdles, or obstacles are typical/need to be overcome? 4. Our experience has been that position 3, is generally lower in field strength when compared to other points in the grid. Is this normal? We have tried adjusting the antenna in several different positions/orientations etc. with not much success. Givens: 1. We are using a Double Ridged Wave Guide for 200MHz - 1GHz, and a high gain Horn antenna for 1GHz - 4GHz. 2. We are performing testing in a semi-anechoic chamber. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Regards, Scott Mee EMC Engineer Johnson Controls Inc. PH: 616.394.2565 EMAIL: scott@jci.com --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server.
Re: FW: ISO 11452-4 Bulk Current Injection Test Requirements
the harmonics. > The standard indicates that if a deviation in product performance occurs, > the first 5 harmonics (relative to the carrier) must be measured. These > harmonics must not exceed -9dBc. > > Here's where my question originates... The standard says "...it must be > ensured that any of the first five harmonics (up to 400MHz) shall not > exceed - 9dBc relative to the fundamental frequency." > > > I am looking for help with interpreting the text in the specification. > > > 1. Does the text indicate that only harmonics with frequencies from 1 - > 400MHz should be considered (carrier frequencies less than 80MHz)? > > 2. Does the text indicate that harmonics up to 2GHz (400MHz is the highest > test frequency - multiplied by 5 harmonics = 2GHz) SHOULD BE MEASURED.? > > 3. other? > > Any help would be greatly appreciated. > > Thank you. > > > Regards, > > Scott Mee > EMC Engineer > > Johnson Controls Inc. > PH: 616.394.2565 > EMAIL: scott@jci.com > > > --- > This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety > Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. > > Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ > > To cancel your subscription, send mail to: > majord...@ieee.org > with the single line: > unsubscribe emc-pstc > > For help, send mail to the list administrators: > Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org > Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net > > For policy questions, send mail to: > Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org > Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org > > All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: > No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages > are imported into the new server. > --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server. --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server.
ISO 11452-4 Bulk Current Injection Test Requirements
To All, We are performing BCI testing according to the test method described in ISO 11452-4 (Test Range 1MHz - 400MHz) We are unclear on the statement described in Section 3 - "Test Conditions" regarding measuring the harmonics. The standard indicates that if a deviation in product performance occurs, the first 5 harmonics (relative to the carrier) must be measured. These harmonics must not exceed -9dBc. Here's where my question originates... The standard says "...it must be ensured that any of the first five harmonics (up to 400MHz) shall not exceed - 9dBc relative to the fundamental frequency." I am looking for help with interpreting the text in the specification. 1. Does the text indicate that only harmonics with frequencies from 1 - 400MHz should be considered (carrier frequencies less than 80MHz)? 2. Does the text indicate that harmonics up to 2GHz (400MHz is the highest test frequency - multiplied by 5 harmonics = 2GHz) SHOULD BE MEASURED.? 3. other? Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thank you. Regards, Scott Mee EMC Engineer Johnson Controls Inc. PH: 616.394.2565 EMAIL: scott@jci.com --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server.
Re: Stepping receiver, step sizes.
Thank you all for those that replied to my question. I found your suggestions to be exactly what I was looking for! The emc-pstc, and all who belong continue to be a great resource in the EMC world! Regards, Scott Mee EMC Engineer Johnson Controls Inc. PH: 616.394.2565 EMAIL: scott@jci.com --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server.
Stepping receiver, step sizes.
Hello Group! I would like to ask a question regarding EMI Receiver step sizes in the higher frequency range. We are performing radiated emissions testing in a semi-anechoic chamber using an EMI receiver. We plan to cover a high frequency range between 1 and 5 GHz (a large spanse to cover!). I would like to know what practical step size (ie. 8kHz or 20kHz or 80kHz) I could choose for such a wide range and keep: 1. The data accurate, meaning that I wouldn't be "missing" or stepping around energy by taking to large of a step. 2. Keep the amount of data I'm collecting to a reasonable amount so that I may process it (apply correction factors for antenna, cable loss, pre-amplifier). My question comes up primarily because I haven't found any specifications that require things like minimum scan time, maximum step size, or the like. Is anyone aware of a specification out there that covers this, or have any information/personal experience that could help me make a determination? Thanks for any help in advance! Regards, Scott Mee EMC Engineer Johnson Controls Inc. PH: 616.394.2565 EMAIL: scott@jci.com --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server.
Low Frequency Conducted Immunity....
Thank you to all who have responded to my LFC immunity issue. Your help is much appreciated. Regards, Scott Mee EMC Engineer Johnson Controls Inc. PH: 616.394.2565 EMAIL: scott@jci.com +++ Hello Group, I am working with and electronic device which contains and audio output. During a low frequency conducted immunity test, a tone can be heard at the output of the audio section with a frequency equal to that of the test frequency. The test starts at the lower end of the audio spectrum [~400Hz] and progresses over time up to the top end of the audio spectrum [~30kHz]. I would like to be able to filter the conducted noise from getting into my electronic device. This is an automotive application, so if I am unsuccessful alternator noise may also be heard in my audio signal during normal operation in the vehicle. I have tried a few things to reduce the amount of noise such as: 1. LC filter with a cutoff at 1kHz 2. Series inductance [large amounts ~ 3mH] 3. Various common mode choke types, each with different core materials [ie. iron core, ferrite core, etc] #1 helped some, but is not effective enough, #2 was very successful, but the size of the choke would be enormous and not practical in this application, #3 was not effective Can anyone suggest an improvement upon the three methods above, or suggest something different? I would like to implement something on the board itself if possible, but modification to the harness may be possible if necessary. Thank you in advance for any help! Regards, Scott Mee EMC Engineer Johnson Controls Inc. PH: 616.394.2565 EMAIL: scott@jci.com --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server. --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server.
Low Frequency Conducted Immunity....
Hello Group, I am working with and electronic device which contains and audio output. During a low frequency conducted immunity test, a tone can be heard at the output of the audio section with a frequency equal to that of the test frequency. The test starts at the lower end of the audio spectrum [~400Hz] and progresses over time up to the top end of the audio spectrum [~30kHz]. I would like to be able to filter the conducted noise from getting into my electronic device. This is an automotive application, so if I am unsuccessful alternator noise may also be heard in my audio signal during normal operation in the vehicle. I have tried a few things to reduce the amount of noise such as: 1. LC filter with a cutoff at 1kHz 2. Series inductance [large amounts ~ 3mH] 3. Various common mode choke types, each with different core materials [ie. iron core, ferrite core, etc] #1 helped some, but is not effective enough, #2 was very successful, but the size of the choke would be enormous and not practical in this application, #3 was not effective Can anyone suggest an improvement upon the three methods above, or suggest something different? I would like to implement something on the board itself if possible, but modification to the harness may be possible if necessary. Thank you in advance for any help! Regards, Scott Mee EMC Engineer Johnson Controls Inc. PH: 616.394.2565 EMAIL: scott@jci.com --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server.
