Re: [PSES] AW: [PSES] EN Standard amendments
Thanks Charlie! Yes, you are right that as a client the test lab follows the instructions of required testing. The product compliance engineer is ideal to have testing experience in order to understand the test results. Regards, Scott On Thu, 14 Apr 2022 at 03:42, Charlie Blackham wrote: > Scott > > > > The A11 amendments to EN 55032 and 55035 do not make any technical changes > to the standard, so a test report without them can be used to support a DoC > that lists them – you should just add a covering comment in your Technical > File > > > > As to your point about which version a lab tests against – they should > test against the version that you ask them to – it’s your responsibility as > the manufacturer which standard you apply, not the test labs – their > responsibility is to perform the required tests correctly > > > > Best regards > > Charlie > > > > *Charlie Blackham* > > *Sulis Consultants Ltd* > > *Tel: +44 (0)7946 624317* > > *Web: https://sulisconsultants.com/ <https://sulisconsultants.com/> * > > Registered in England and Wales, number 05466247 > > > > *From:* Scott Xe > *Sent:* 13 April 2022 16:16 > *To:* EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG > *Subject:* Re: [PSES] AW: [PSES] EN Standard amendments > > > > Hi Bernd, > > > > Many thanks for your comments. Can we consider IEC amendment as non-EN > amendment and it should be applied by non-EU countries. > > > > I have a recent case on a conformity test report that adopts A1 amendment > only. However in OJEU it states A11. There is a risk for the market > surveillance to challenge the missing A11 amendment. I am unsure if both > A1 and A11 refer to the same topic or different one. > > > > In the similar case, the public test house will do the conformity test > using the latest version of standard. If OJEU does not or has not adopted > the latest version of a standard as harmonised standard, it may bring us > unnecessary frustration about invalid standard applied when we deal with > market surveillance. Of course, we can adopt whatever standards apart from > harmonised standards but need to convene the market surveillance in > agreement. > > > > Best regards, > > > > Scott > > > > > > On Wed, 13 Apr 2022 at 19:17, Dürrer Bernd wrote: > > Hi Scott, > > > > all amendments published by CENELEC are applicable. You may check on > published amendments using the standards search provided by CENELEC (for > EN 55032 https://standards.cencenelec.eu/dyn/www/f?p=205:105:0:). > Typically, an amendment A11 is published by CENELEC to establish the > correspondence between the standard and the essential requirements of the > applicable EU directive. This may also include modifications to the > standard (for example in EN 55032/A11: “With respect to Clause 11 > (Measurement uncertainty), the following shall not be applied, if Clause 5 > (Requirements) is applied for the purposes of the presumption of > conformity: 'Refer to CISPR TR 16-4-3 for guidance on the applicability of > the limits to a series production MME'.”). Such an amendment A11 is now a > legal prerequisite of having the standard listed in the Official Journal of > the EU. The OJEU may not list all amendments (for EN 55032, the amendment > A1 is not listed, cf. https://ec.europa.eu/docsroom/documents/45365). > Nevertheless, you are free to reference standards in your Declaration of > Conformity that are not listed in the OJEU (even non-EN standards), and if > your DoC resp. your test report is based on an unlisted standard or > amendment (e.g. EN 55032/A1), I recommend to reference it in the DoC. > > > > Kind regards, > > > > Bernd > > > > *Von:* Scott Xe > *Gesendet:* Mittwoch, 13. April 2022 12:53 > *An:* EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG > *Betreff:* [PSES] EN Standard amendments > > > > EN standards have two types of amendment: A1 - A9 and/or A11 - A19. As > far as I know, A1 - A9 come from IEC/CISPR standard whereas A11 - A19 from > CENELEC EN standard. For products to EU markets, does the product comply > with A11 - A19 only? > > > > For example, EN 55032 : 2015 has both A1 : 2020 and + A11 : 2020. Is A1 : > 2020 only applied for markets outside the EU? > > > > Thanks and regards, > > > > Scott > > - > > > This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc > discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to < > emc-p...@ieee.org> > > All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: > http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pst
Re: [PSES] AW: [PSES] EN Standard amendments
Scott The A11 amendments to EN 55032 and 55035 do not make any technical changes to the standard, so a test report without them can be used to support a DoC that lists them – you should just add a covering comment in your Technical File As to your point about which version a lab tests against – they should test against the version that you ask them to – it’s your responsibility as the manufacturer which standard you apply, not the test labs – their responsibility is to perform the required tests correctly Best regards Charlie Charlie Blackham Sulis Consultants Ltd Tel: +44 (0)7946 624317 Web: https://sulisconsultants.com/ Registered in England and Wales, number 05466247 From: Scott Xe Sent: 13 April 2022 16:16 To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG Subject: Re: [PSES] AW: [PSES] EN Standard amendments Hi Bernd, Many thanks for your comments. Can we consider IEC amendment as non-EN amendment and it should be applied by non-EU countries. I have a recent case on a conformity test report that adopts A1 amendment only. However in OJEU it states A11. There is a risk for the market surveillance to challenge the missing A11 amendment. I am unsure if both A1 and A11 refer to the same topic or different one. In the similar case, the public test house will do the conformity test using the latest version of standard. If OJEU does not or has not adopted the latest version of a standard as harmonised standard, it may bring us unnecessary frustration about invalid standard applied when we deal with market surveillance. Of course, we can adopt whatever standards apart from harmonised standards but need to convene the market surveillance in agreement. Best regards, Scott On Wed, 13 Apr 2022 at 19:17, Dürrer Bernd mailto:bernd.duer...@wilo.com>> wrote: Hi Scott, all amendments published by CENELEC are applicable. You may check on published amendments using the standards search provided by CENELEC (for EN 55032 https://standards.cencenelec.eu/dyn/www/f?p=205:105:0:). Typically, an amendment A11 is published by CENELEC to establish the correspondence between the standard and the essential requirements of the applicable EU directive. This may also include modifications to the standard (for example in EN 55032/A11: “With respect to Clause 11 (Measurement uncertainty), the following shall not be applied, if Clause 5 (Requirements) is applied for the purposes of the presumption of conformity: 'Refer to CISPR TR 16-4-3 for guidance on the applicability of the limits to a series production MME'.”). Such an amendment A11 is now a legal prerequisite of having the standard listed in the Official Journal of the EU. The OJEU may not list all amendments (for EN 55032, the amendment A1 is not listed, cf. https://ec.europa.eu/docsroom/documents/45365). Nevertheless, you are free to reference standards in your Declaration of Conformity that are not listed in the OJEU (even non-EN standards), and if your DoC resp. your test report is based on an unlisted standard or amendment (e.g. EN 55032/A1), I recommend to reference it in the DoC. Kind regards, Bernd Von: Scott Xe mailto:scott...@gmail.com>> Gesendet: Mittwoch, 13. April 2022 12:53 An: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG<mailto:EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG> Betreff: [PSES] EN Standard amendments EN standards have two types of amendment: A1 - A9 and/or A11 - A19. As far as I know, A1 - A9 come from IEC/CISPR standard whereas A11 - A19 from CENELEC EN standard. For products to EU markets, does the product comply with A11 - A19 only? For example, EN 55032 : 2015 has both A1 : 2020 and + A11 : 2020. Is A1 : 2020 only applied for markets outside the EU? Thanks and regards, Scott - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org>> All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html<https://eur04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ieee-pses.org%2Femc-pstc.html=04%7C01%7C%7C624ea41f1afc4c402cdc08da1d3bc311%7C39288a38ff19432c80111cd9d0dff445%7C0%7C0%7C637854439761766405%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000=nbMG%2B8gw5yuFwig3Rvw28hpT1Po5s%2BCCDdx7B710Rno%3D=0> Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/<https://eur04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fproduct-compliance.oc.ieee.org%2F=04%7C01%7C%7C624ea41f1afc4c402cdc08da1d3bc311%7C39288a38ff19432c80111cd9d0dff445%7C0%7C0%7C637854439761766405%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000=0eFEdxHIH9%2BDN2co6RgOaAA3Ieou%2FWjiq%2BZ7toh7c8U%3D=0> can be used for graphics (in well-used formats), large fi
Re: [PSES] AW: [PSES] EN Standard amendments
Hi Bernd, Many thanks for your comments. Can we consider IEC amendment as non-EN amendment and it should be applied by non-EU countries. I have a recent case on a conformity test report that adopts A1 amendment only. However in OJEU it states A11. There is a risk for the market surveillance to challenge the missing A11 amendment. I am unsure if both A1 and A11 refer to the same topic or different one. In the similar case, the public test house will do the conformity test using the latest version of standard. If OJEU does not or has not adopted the latest version of a standard as harmonised standard, it may bring us unnecessary frustration about invalid standard applied when we deal with market surveillance. Of course, we can adopt whatever standards apart from harmonised standards but need to convene the market surveillance in agreement. Best regards, Scott On Wed, 13 Apr 2022 at 19:17, Dürrer Bernd wrote: > Hi Scott, > > > > all amendments published by CENELEC are applicable. You may check on > published amendments using the standards search provided by CENELEC (for > EN 55032 https://standards.cencenelec.eu/dyn/www/f?p=205:105:0:). > Typically, an amendment A11 is published by CENELEC to establish the > correspondence between the standard and the essential requirements of the > applicable EU directive. This may also include modifications to the > standard (for example in EN 55032/A11: “With respect to Clause 11 > (Measurement uncertainty), the following shall not be applied, if Clause 5 > (Requirements) is applied for the purposes of the presumption of > conformity: 'Refer to CISPR TR 16-4-3 for guidance on the applicability of > the limits to a series production MME'.”). Such an amendment A11 is now a > legal prerequisite of having the standard listed in the Official Journal of > the EU. The OJEU may not list all amendments (for EN 55032, the amendment > A1 is not listed, cf. https://ec.europa.eu/docsroom/documents/45365). > Nevertheless, you are free to reference standards in your Declaration of > Conformity that are not listed in the OJEU (even non-EN standards), and if > your DoC resp. your test report is based on an unlisted standard or > amendment (e.g. EN 55032/A1), I recommend to reference it in the DoC. > > > > Kind regards, > > > > Bernd > > > > *Von:* Scott Xe > *Gesendet:* Mittwoch, 13. April 2022 12:53 > *An:* EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG > *Betreff:* [PSES] EN Standard amendments > > > > EN standards have two types of amendment: A1 - A9 and/or A11 - A19. As > far as I know, A1 - A9 come from IEC/CISPR standard whereas A11 - A19 from > CENELEC EN standard. For products to EU markets, does the product comply > with A11 - A19 only? > > > > For example, EN 55032 : 2015 has both A1 : 2020 and + A11 : 2020. Is A1 : > 2020 only applied for markets outside the EU? > > > > Thanks and regards, > > > > Scott > > - > > > This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc > discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to < > emc-p...@ieee.org> > > All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: > http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html > <https://eur04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ieee-pses.org%2Femc-pstc.html=04%7C01%7C%7C624ea41f1afc4c402cdc08da1d3bc311%7C39288a38ff19432c80111cd9d0dff445%7C0%7C0%7C637854439761766405%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000=nbMG%2B8gw5yuFwig3Rvw28hpT1Po5s%2BCCDdx7B710Rno%3D=0> > > Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at > http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ > <https://eur04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fproduct-compliance.oc.ieee.org%2F=04%7C01%7C%7C624ea41f1afc4c402cdc08da1d3bc311%7C39288a38ff19432c80111cd9d0dff445%7C0%7C0%7C637854439761766405%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000=0eFEdxHIH9%2BDN2co6RgOaAA3Ieou%2FWjiq%2BZ7toh7c8U%3D=0> > can be used for graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc. > > Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ > <https://eur04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ieee-pses.org%2F=04%7C01%7C%7C624ea41f1afc4c402cdc08da1d3bc311%7C39288a38ff19432c80111cd9d0dff445%7C0%7C0%7C637854439761766405%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000=lql1WVuUFuRD9KeANz3rsMYU9Ab4txUhHLbVTlxZ0Sc%3D=0> > Instructions: http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to > unsubscribe) > <https://eur04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ieee-pses.org%2Flist.html=04
[PSES] AW: [PSES] EN Standard amendments
Hi Scott, all amendments published by CENELEC are applicable. You may check on published amendments using the standards search provided by CENELEC (for EN 55032 https://standards.cencenelec.eu/dyn/www/f?p=205:105:0:). Typically, an amendment A11 is published by CENELEC to establish the correspondence between the standard and the essential requirements of the applicable EU directive. This may also include modifications to the standard (for example in EN 55032/A11: "With respect to Clause 11 (Measurement uncertainty), the following shall not be applied, if Clause 5 (Requirements) is applied for the purposes of the presumption of conformity: 'Refer to CISPR TR 16-4-3 for guidance on the applicability of the limits to a series production MME'."). Such an amendment A11 is now a legal prerequisite of having the standard listed in the Official Journal of the EU. The OJEU may not list all amendments (for EN 55032, the amendment A1 is not listed, cf. https://ec.europa.eu/docsroom/documents/45365). Nevertheless, you are free to reference standards in your Declaration of Conformity that are not listed in the OJEU (even non-EN standards), and if your DoC resp. your test report is based on an unlisted standard or amendment (e.g. EN 55032/A1), I recommend to reference it in the DoC. Kind regards, Bernd Von: Scott Xe Gesendet: Mittwoch, 13. April 2022 12:53 An: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG Betreff: [PSES] EN Standard amendments EN standards have two types of amendment: A1 - A9 and/or A11 - A19. As far as I know, A1 - A9 come from IEC/CISPR standard whereas A11 - A19 from CENELEC EN standard. For products to EU markets, does the product comply with A11 - A19 only? For example, EN 55032 : 2015 has both A1 : 2020 and + A11 : 2020. Is A1 : 2020 only applied for markets outside the EU? Thanks and regards, Scott - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org>> All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html<https://eur04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ieee-pses.org%2Femc-pstc.html=04%7C01%7C%7C624ea41f1afc4c402cdc08da1d3bc311%7C39288a38ff19432c80111cd9d0dff445%7C0%7C0%7C637854439761766405%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000=nbMG%2B8gw5yuFwig3Rvw28hpT1Po5s%2BCCDdx7B710Rno%3D=0> Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/<https://eur04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fproduct-compliance.oc.ieee.org%2F=04%7C01%7C%7C624ea41f1afc4c402cdc08da1d3bc311%7C39288a38ff19432c80111cd9d0dff445%7C0%7C0%7C637854439761766405%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000=0eFEdxHIH9%2BDN2co6RgOaAA3Ieou%2FWjiq%2BZ7toh7c8U%3D=0> can be used for graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/<https://eur04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ieee-pses.org%2F=04%7C01%7C%7C624ea41f1afc4c402cdc08da1d3bc311%7C39288a38ff19432c80111cd9d0dff445%7C0%7C0%7C637854439761766405%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000=lql1WVuUFuRD9KeANz3rsMYU9Ab4txUhHLbVTlxZ0Sc%3D=0> Instructions: http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to unsubscribe)<https://eur04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ieee-pses.org%2Flist.html=04%7C01%7C%7C624ea41f1afc4c402cdc08da1d3bc311%7C39288a38ff19432c80111cd9d0dff445%7C0%7C0%7C637854439761766405%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000=dGrU08tiUnzslDMluVi3h9wVXBXXSMvE9CgAuISP%2Bc8%3D=0> List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html<https://eur04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ieee-pses.org%2Flistrules.html=04%7C01%7C%7C624ea41f1afc4c402cdc08da1d3bc311%7C39288a38ff19432c80111cd9d0dff445%7C0%7C0%7C637854439761766405%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000=MVu9lbXMAONRbroWVEWiViWFgvrCITIvT6XvuFE%2F5xg%3D=0> For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas mailto:sdoug...@ieee.org>> Mike Cantwell mailto:mcantw...@ieee.org>> For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher mailto:j.bac...@ieee.org>> David Heald mailto:dhe...@gmail.com>> WILO SE Wilopark 1, 44263 Dortmund Amtsgericht Dortmund, HRB 21356 www.wilo.com Vorstand/Executive Board: Oliver Hermes (President & CEO), Dr. Patrick Niehr, Georg Weber, Mathias Weyers Aufsichtsratsvorsitzender/Chairman of the Supervisory Board: Lars Roßner Dieses Dokument ist vertraulich zu beh
[PSES] EN Standard amendments
EN standards have two types of amendment: A1 - A9 and/or A11 - A19. As far as I know, A1 - A9 come from IEC/CISPR standard whereas A11 - A19 from CENELEC EN standard. For products to EU markets, does the product comply with A11 - A19 only? For example, EN 55032 : 2015 has both A1 : 2020 and + A11 : 2020. Is A1 : 2020 only applied for markets outside the EU? Thanks and regards, Scott - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ Instructions: http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to unsubscribe) List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas Mike Cantwell For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: David Heald:
