RE: EMC Directive requirements for LINEAR power adapter
Hi Mark, If you ship the adapter (deemed active or not) with your device then the accountability of shipping a compliant device is your responsibility and will require you to test at system level to meet the requirements of 89/336. It goes back to the ole CE + CE = ??? Regards, Mark Schmidt _ From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org] On Behalf Of Mark Gandler Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2007 8:45 PM To: emc-p...@ieee.org Subject: EMC Directive requirements for LINEAR power adapter Group, I am not sure how I ended up caring so much for power adapters recently, but they just will not go away. Would you consider linear power adapter : 240V to 12V/1.5A consists of the transformer, bridge rectifier and capacitor to be EM active device? If it is not active, will it be safe to assume what it will be excluded from 89/336 directive based on EU guidelines? See http://ec.europa.eu/enterprise/electr_equipment/emc/guides/chapfive.htm Thanks, Mark Gandler _ Watch http://g.msn.com/8HMBENUS/2746??PS=47575 free concerts with Pink, Rod Stewart, Oasis and more. Visit MSN Presents today. __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas emcp...@ptcnh.net Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org David Heald: emc-p...@daveheald.com All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas emcp...@ptcnh.net Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org David Heald: emc-p...@daveheald.com All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
Re: EMC Directive requirements for LINEAR power adapter
In message 90511c6e9d0a89419745854eace4c7a8036b5...@whl46.e2v.com, dated Wed, 21 Mar 2007, Barker, Neil neil.bar...@e2v.com writes: As a technicality, forget 89/336/EC. It was repealed and replaced by 2004/108/EC. Not yet, but on 20 July 2007 (for some purposes) and 20 July 2009 (for everything else). -- OOO - Own Opinions Only. Try www.jmwa.demon.co.uk and www.isce.org.uk There are benefits from being irrational - just ask the square root of 2. John Woodgate, J M Woodgate and Associates, Rayleigh, Essex UK - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list.Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas emcp...@ptcnh.net Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org David Heald:emc-p...@daveheald.com All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __
RE: EMC Directive requirements for LINEAR power adapter
Mark, The switching spikes of a full wave bridge / capacitor arrangement can be found to extend above 1GHz if the design is poor. In no way is it a passive device! Regards Tim 6239 desk A1S77 P Please consider the environment before printing this email. From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org] On Behalf Of Mark Gandler Sent: Wednesday, March 21, 2007 12:45 AM To: emc-p...@ieee.org Subject: EMC Directive requirements for LINEAR power adapter *** WARNING *** This mail has originated outside your organization, either from an external partner or the Global Internet. Keep this in mind if you answer this message. SELEX Sensors and Airborne Systems Limited Registered Office: Sigma House, Christopher Martin Road, Basildon, Essex SS14 3EL A company registered in England Wales. Company no. 02426132 This email and any attachments are confidential to the intended recipient and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended recipient please delete it from your system and notify the sender. You should not copy it or use it for any purpose nor disclose or distribute its contents to any other person. - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list.Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas emcp...@ptcnh.net Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org David Heald:emc-p...@daveheald.com All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __
RE: EMC Directive requirements for LINEAR power adapter
Mark, I would say not. Your adapter includes diodes, which are a form of switching device and will cause interference of some description to an extent that depends on the speed of the diodes. An EM passive device would be something like a filament lamp or an electric heater (providing it doesn't have a thermostat); i.e. items that draw a constant current at supply frequency. You are fortunate that you are considering a low power device, otherwise you would definitely be having to consider harmonic emissions; a simple rectifier/capacitor configuration generates those very well. As a technicality, forget 89/336/EC. It was repealed and replaced by 2004/108/EC. Best regards Neil R. Barker CEng MIET FSEE MIEEE Manager Quality Engineering e2v technologies (uk) ltd 106 Waterhouse Lane Chelmsford Essex CM1 2QU UK Tel: (+44) 1245 453616 Fax: (+44) 1245 453571 Mob: (+44) 7801 723735 P Please consider the environment before printing this email. From: Mark Gandler [mailto:markgand...@hotmail.com] Sent: 21 March 2007 00:45 To: emc-p...@ieee.org Subject: EMC Directive requirements for LINEAR power adapter Group, I am not sure how I ended up caring so much for power adapters recently, but they just will not go away. Would you consider linear power adapter : 240V to 12V/1.5A consists of the transformer, bridge rectifier and capacitor to be EM active device? If it is not active, will it be safe to assume what it will be excluded from 89/336 directive based on EU guidelines? See http://ec.europa.eu/enterprise/electr_equipment/emc/guides/chapfive.htm Thanks, Mark Gandler __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ Sent by E2V TECHNOLOGIES PLC or a member of the E2V group of companies. A company registered in England and Wales. Company number: 04439718. Registered address: 106 Waterhouse Lane, Chelmsford, Essex, CM1 2QU, UK. - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas emcp...@ptcnh.net Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org David Heald: emc-p...@daveheald.com All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
Re: EMC Directive requirements for LINEAR power adapter
In message bay142-f29fcc5f0e9f0e511886e27ad...@phx.gbl, dated Tue, 20 Mar 2007, Mark Gandler markgand...@hotmail.com writes: Would you consider linear power adapter : 240V to 12V/1.5A consists of the transformer, bridge rectifier and capacitor to be EM active device? If it is not active, will it be safe to assume what it will be excluded from 89/336 directive based on EU guidelines? No, because it emits mains harmonic currents and, depending on the type of diode in the rectifier, perhaps emits conducted noise above 150 kHz. However, it's certain that its mains harmonic emissions are subject to no limits according to IEC/EN 61000-3-2 (lower bound for the application of limits is 75 W active input power), and 99.99% certain that it meets the limits for conducted emissions above 150 kHz. So, although it's not *excluded*, it can safely be claimed to meet the essential requirements of the EMC Directive without testing. Note that 89/336 is the old Directive, to be superseded for some purposes on 20 July this year and wholly on 20 July 2009 by the new Directive. -- OOO - Own Opinions Only. Try www.jmwa.demon.co.uk and www.isce.org.uk There are benefits from being irrational - just ask the square root of 2. John Woodgate, J M Woodgate and Associates, Rayleigh, Essex UK - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list.Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas emcp...@ptcnh.net Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org David Heald:emc-p...@daveheald.com All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __
EMC Directive requirements for LINEAR power adapter
Group, I am not sure how I ended up caring so much for power adapters recently, but they just will not go away. Would you consider linear power adapter : 240V to 12V/1.5A consists of the transformer, bridge rectifier and capacitor to be EM active device? If it is not active, will it be safe to assume what it will be excluded from 89/336 directive based on EU guidelines? See http://ec.europa.eu/enterprise/electr_equipment/emc/guides/chapfive.htm Thanks, Mark Gandler _ Watch free concerts with Pink, Rod Stewart, Oasis and more. Visit MSN Presents today. http://g.msn.com/8HMBENUS/2746??PS=47575 __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas emcp...@ptcnh.net Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org David Heald: emc-p...@daveheald.com All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
