Re: [Emc-users] linuxcnc-sim on Mint 17.1 LTS

[Jon Elson]

On 01/01/2015 10:12 PM, Sebastian Kuzminsky wrote:
> On 01/01/2015 08:59 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
>> So, what amd64 flavor of Ubuntu stands the best chance of working with the
>> existing repo's?  And which name do I then put in /etc/apt/sources.list?
> I run LinuxCNC on Ubuntu Precise (12.04) on some of my machines.  I'm
> not a fan of the Ubuntu UI, but it works.  Instructions here:
>
>
You can make 12.04 revert to the Gnome Classic desktop.  The 
only problem I had was
the window borders were too narrow to grab for resizing, 
there is a hack that requires
editing the metacity theme file.  if anyone needs to know 
how to do this, just email
me.

Jon

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Re: [Emc-users] linuxcnc-sim on Mint 17.1 LTS

[Sebastian Kuzminsky]

On 01/01/2015 08:59 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> So, what amd64 flavor of Ubuntu stands the best chance of working with the 
> existing repo's?  And which name do I then put in /etc/apt/sources.list?

I run LinuxCNC on Ubuntu Precise (12.04) on some of my machines.  I'm
not a fan of the Ubuntu UI, but it works.  Instructions here:

http://www.linuxcnc.org/docs/2.7/html/getting-started/index.html#_installing_on_ubuntu_precise


I personally prefer Debian Wheezy, which works "out of the box" using
the new Live/Install Image.  Instructions for that are here:

http://www.linuxcnc.org/docs/2.7/html/getting-started/index.html#_getting_linuxcnc


-- 
Sebastian Kuzminsky

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[Emc-users] linuxcnc-sim on Mint 17.1 LTS

[Gene Heskett]

Greetings, and I hope everyone will have a better year in 2015;

Mint 17.1 LTS with cinnamon gui has arrived, called Rebecca.  It looks 
decent enough but the synaptic shipped for a package manager, is quite 
broken.  No "mark all updates" button for starters, and while it does 
identify a group of packages as being upgradeable, the only action offered 
is to remove them when you click on them.  Bummer.  Aptitude fares little 
better, mostly because I long ago forgot how to run it.

Adding the line for the buildbot so I could install the master-sim, lucid 
as a repo refuses because most of the python etc stuff is newer so it 
fails even though it says >=1.40 for the dependency and its 1.55 
installed.  Going to the web page, I find several other names I can switch 
in for Lucid, but I've never tracked a distro by name, so other than 8.04 
being Hardy (I think) I am lost.  Lucid can see the sim but will not allow 
it to be installed.  Precise can't even see it.  So I need some guidance I 
believe, or should I wipe and install ubu-14.4 LTS in some flavor.  Scary, 
the reports are that it is also severely broken, with won't even boot at 
the top of the lists I am seeing.

Trying to do this because there is only a few more months of support left 
for the 10.04.4 LTS server editions now, and its time to update the OS 
itself.

I have also about worn out the i386 model since I have a quad core 64 bit 
phenom, and the 64 bit versions of stuff like firefox run a heck of a lot 
faster.

So, what amd64 flavor of Ubuntu stands the best chance of working with the 
existing repo's?  And which name do I then put in /etc/apt/sources.list?

Thanks all.

Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
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 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 
US V Castleman, SCOTUS, Mar 2014 is grounds for Impeaching SCOTUS

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[Emc-users] CNC Workshop 2015

[Ron Ginger]

The CNC workshop will return in June of 2015. This is the continuation 
of the event started more than 10 years ago by Roland Friestad, then 
later run by DIGITAL MACHINIST magazine.

This year the workshop will be held at the TechShop in Allen Park 
Michigan, between Detroit and Ann Arbor. the location is very convenient 
to the Detroit area, the Detroit airport, and just across the road from 
the Henry Ford Museum. The workshop will run between June 15 and 20, 
with the main session opening Wednesday morning, June 17.

This year the format will be similar to the past years- we will have 3 
days of continuous seminars about CNC aimed at the home shop user. We 
have classrooms ranging from a tiered auditorium for over 150 people to 
small conference rooms. We will have an area for commercial vendors to 
show their products, and an area for individuals to exhibit their projects.

We are now seeking people that want to present a seminar session, or 
exhibit their project. Speakers and exhibitors will receive a discount 
on the registration fee.

TechShop has setup a web form to collect input at 
http://tinyurl.com/techshopcncworkshop. Please use the form to get your 
name on the list for further information and to let us know what you are 
willing to present, or what you would like to hear about.

An added feature this year will be 2 days reserved for special, in-depth 
training session. TechShop will be offering selected training on using 
various machines, and we may have vendor specific training. These 
sessions will be on Monday and Tuesday before the main Workshop sessions 
begin. There may be an additional charge for these sessions. Please let 
us know on the information form of your interest in any in-depth training.

A build class, based on the micro mill from LittleMachineShop.com and 
led by Weston Bye will be included. This session is limited to 12 
people, so if you are interested in building your own CNC mill please 
let us know quickly.

Registration will open about February 1. Please use the information form 
to get your name on the list and to tell us what you would like to see 
and hear at the workshop.

I hope we can make this years workshop even better than those of the 
previous years. Please let us know of your interest so we can plan the 
best workshop ever.

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Re: [Emc-users] Possibly dumb question - 7i76 encoder for spindle speed feedback

[Gene Heskett]

On Thursday 01 January 2015 11:16:02 John Alexander Stewart did opine
And Gene did reply:
> Ok - I had an issue with the encoder scale - setting it to a fraction
> seems to have helped.
> 
> It seems like I'm having lots of noise, though. Halscope on
> hm2_5i25.encoder.00.input-a gives me a nice smooth signal, but reading
> a spindle setting under about 500rpm gives me a reading of approx
> 500rpm or more.
> 
> Pushing it through a limit2 seems to have smoothed the faster
> velocities.
> 
> Above, say, 800 rpm, the system tracks quite well; up to the max of
> 2250rpm. I can easily tell if the machine is in low or high gear, but
> only when running at a requested speed of above 800 rpm.
> 
> I'm going to put the 6n138 on a small bit of pc board to reduce the
> long leads, and see if that reduces the noise somewhat.
> 
> I am confused, though, that Halscope gives me a perfect signal, but the
> encoder output is haywire. I guess I'm used to old-school scopes,
> either digital or analog screens and with real probes and stuff...

I have come to the conclusion that for such as this, the halscope isn't 
always telling us the truth.  And I believe the timing jitters we are 
seeing are an artifact of a finite sampling period, which is relatively 
short, so a one count ambiguity represents a rather large amount of noise 
when the software is doing the sampling.  Putting a 5i25 in my lathe setup 
reduced it a lot, but the ideal situation is not available in the modules 
directory for LCNC.  IMO a shift register, at least 16 bits or more wide, 
and 4 shift stages would be ideal, each register summed with a gain of 
.25, which should balance out any cyclic/mechanical irregularities.

I suppose one could coble something up and halcomp it just to prove the 
point, but that wouldn't drop my minimum rpm enough to make a huge 
difference.  Currently I am good down to about 200-250 revs before it gets 
to hammering the backgears too badly.  Before the 5i25, it was hammering 
the backgears at 5 or 600 revs, but with the 5i25 I can triple the PGain, 
making it pretty stiff even at 175 revs.

> On Tue, Dec 30, 2014 at 10:38 PM, Peter C. Wallace  
wrote:
> > On Tue, 30 Dec 2014, John Alexander Stewart wrote:
> > > Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2014 21:45:14 -0500
> > > From: John Alexander Stewart 
> > > Reply-To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)"
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)"
> > >  > > 
> > > Subject: [Emc-users] Possibly dumb question - 7i76 encoder for
> > > spindle
> > 
> > speed
> > 
> > > feedback
> > > 
> > > Hi all;
> > > 
> > > I'm back working on my mill with spindle tachometer, to utilize
> > > Andy
> > 
> > Pugh's
> > 
> > > automatic spindle speed selector example code.
> > > 
> > > I have, from the spindle sensor, input going to a 6N138
> > > optoisolator's input. Ground and voltage source tied to machine.
> > > It sources enough
> > 
> > current
> > 
> > > to drive the input quite well. (originally sent to the input of an
> > > Amtel processor in the LED spindle speed display)
> > > 
> > > Output of 6N138, with +5v, ground, to the 7i76 ENCA+ and
> > > surrounding connectors on the 7i76.
> > > 
> > > Looking with Halscope gives me a pretty good signal on
> > > hm2_5i25.0.encoder.00.input-a. Running at 1,000 rpm gives me 14
> > > "square" teeth, running at 500 rpm gives me 7, and running at
> > > 300rpm gives me 4. (not that the counts mean much, except that the
> > > reading tracks spindle speed linearly)
> > > 
> > > The 7i76 jumper is set for TTL input. ONLY the ENCA+ input pin has
> > 
> > anything
> > 
> > > connected, the IDX, ENCB+/- and ENCA- are all left floating.
> > > 
> > > The issue I have is that the velocity never seems to do much other
> > > than just futz around between 6 and 40, no matter what the spindle
> > > speed.
> > > 
> > > Here's my ini code:
> > >setp hm2_5i25.0.encoder.00.counter-mode  1
> > >setp hm2_5i25.0.encoder.00.filter 1
> > >setp hm2_5i25.0.encoder.00.index-invert 0
> > >setp hm2_5i25.0.encoder.00.index-mask 0
> > >setp hm2_5i25.0.encoder.00.index-mask-invert 0
> > >setp hm2_5i25.0.encoder.00.latch-enable 0
> > >setp hm2_5i25.0.encoder.00.scale -16
> > >setp hm2_5i25.0.encoder.00.vel-timeout 1.0
> > > 
> > > Should I tie the other encoder lines high/low or to somewhere?
> > 
> > (especially
> > 
> > > the index pulse)
> > > 
> > > Anybody with some advice?
> > > 
> > > Thank you - John A. Stewart.
> > 
> > If the inputs are jumpered for TTL levels you must leave the -inputs
> > unconnected. The + inputs have 2K pullups to 5V so will be in a high
> > state if
> > left open. I forget the 7I76 encoder polarity but you may need to
> > ground the
> > ENCB+ input to get the count direction correct (ENCB is the direction
> > input in
> > count = COUNT/DIR mode )
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > -
> > -
> > 
> > > Dive into the World of Parallel Progr

Re: [Emc-users] Advanced bipod question

[andy pugh]

On 1 January 2015 at 02:16, poormansairforce H
 wrote:

> I have been trying to join the forum but can't get past the registration
> page, says there are errors:(

You will get better answers here anyway.

> I have a question about setting up a bipod hot wire cutter. Simply, in CAD
> I have figured out that on my dream machine setup, at a 4' 6" cutting
> length when the wire is angled 22.5 degrees on the vertical axis the wire
> moves 3mm from its intended position due to the attach points swinging in
> to compensate for the shortening of its length.

I don't quite get what you are saying. Is this an effect in addition
to the simple calculations in the kinematics module?

Can you expand the "its" into the actual components being discussed?
Maybe you are looking at the effect of the pulley diameter not being
infinitesimal?

-- 
atp
If you can't fix it, you don't own it.
http://www.ifixit.com/Manifesto

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Re: [Emc-users] Possibly dumb question - 7i76 encoder for spindle speed feedback

[Peter C. Wallace]

On Thu, 1 Jan 2015, John Alexander Stewart wrote:

> Date: Thu, 1 Jan 2015 11:16:02 -0500
> From: John Alexander Stewart 
> Reply-To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)"
> 
> To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)" 
> Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Possibly dumb question - 7i76 encoder for spindle
> speed feedback
> 
> Ok - I had an issue with the encoder scale - setting it to a fraction seems
> to have helped.
>
> It seems like I'm having lots of noise, though. Halscope on
> hm2_5i25.encoder.00.input-a gives me a nice smooth signal, but reading a
> spindle setting under about 500rpm gives me a reading of approx 500rpm or
> more.
>
> Pushing it through a limit2 seems to have smoothed the faster velocities.
>
> Above, say, 800 rpm, the system tracks quite well; up to the max of
> 2250rpm. I can easily tell if the machine is in low or high gear, but only
> when running at a requested speed of above 800 rpm.
>
> I'm going to put the 6n138 on a small bit of pc board to reduce the long
> leads, and see if that reduces the noise somewhat.
>
> I am confused, though, that Halscope gives me a perfect signal, but the
> encoder output is haywire. I guess I'm used to old-school scopes, either
> digital or analog screens and with real probes and stuff.

It may be that you are double triggering because of noise
either in the high or low states or on edges

Halscope is limited in its ability to see this because
of its low (servo thread rate in this case) sampling rate


One option for fixing noise problems is lowering the bandwidth of the encoder 
input filter.

The default encoder sampling rate on a 5I25 is 33.33 MHz so with filtering 
enabled (15 count filter) the minimum detectable pulse width is 450 nS,
probably too fast for fuzzy/slow hardware like Optocouplers

Im pretty sure that 2.6 has the encoder sample frequency setting available, so
setting

setp hm2_5i25.0.encoder.sample-frequency 50

(set encoder sample frequency to 500 KHz)

for example, would now make the encoder input filter reject any
pulses of less than 30 usec in duration


>
> On Tue, Dec 30, 2014 at 10:38 PM, Peter C. Wallace  wrote:
>
>> On Tue, 30 Dec 2014, John Alexander Stewart wrote:
>>
>>> Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2014 21:45:14 -0500
>>> From: John Alexander Stewart 
>>> Reply-To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)"
>>> 
>>> To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)" >>
>>> Subject: [Emc-users] Possibly dumb question - 7i76 encoder for spindle
>> speed
>>> feedback
>>>
>>> Hi all;
>>>
>>> I'm back working on my mill with spindle tachometer, to utilize Andy
>> Pugh's
>>> automatic spindle speed selector example code.
>>>
>>> I have, from the spindle sensor, input going to a 6N138 optoisolator's
>>> input. Ground and voltage source tied to machine. It sources enough
>> current
>>> to drive the input quite well. (originally sent to the input of an Amtel
>>> processor in the LED spindle speed display)
>>>
>>> Output of 6N138, with +5v, ground, to the 7i76 ENCA+ and surrounding
>>> connectors on the 7i76.
>>>
>>> Looking with Halscope gives me a pretty good signal on
>>> hm2_5i25.0.encoder.00.input-a. Running at 1,000 rpm gives me 14 "square"
>>> teeth, running at 500 rpm gives me 7, and running at 300rpm gives me 4.
>>> (not that the counts mean much, except that the reading tracks spindle
>>> speed linearly)
>>>
>>> The 7i76 jumper is set for TTL input. ONLY the ENCA+ input pin has
>> anything
>>> connected, the IDX, ENCB+/- and ENCA- are all left floating.
>>>
>>> The issue I have is that the velocity never seems to do much other than
>>> just futz around between 6 and 40, no matter what the spindle speed.
>>>
>>> Here's my ini code:
>>>
>>>setp hm2_5i25.0.encoder.00.counter-mode  1
>>>setp hm2_5i25.0.encoder.00.filter 1
>>>setp hm2_5i25.0.encoder.00.index-invert 0
>>>setp hm2_5i25.0.encoder.00.index-mask 0
>>>setp hm2_5i25.0.encoder.00.index-mask-invert 0
>>>setp hm2_5i25.0.encoder.00.latch-enable 0
>>>setp hm2_5i25.0.encoder.00.scale -16
>>>setp hm2_5i25.0.encoder.00.vel-timeout 1.0
>>>
>>> Should I tie the other encoder lines high/low or to somewhere?
>> (especially
>>> the index pulse)
>>>
>>> Anybody with some advice?
>>>
>>> Thank you - John A. Stewart.
>>
>> If the inputs are jumpered for TTL levels you must leave the -inputs
>> unconnected. The + inputs have 2K pullups to 5V so will be in a high state
>> if
>> left open. I forget the 7I76 encoder polarity but you may need to ground
>> the
>> ENCB+ input to get the count direction correct (ENCB is the direction
>> input in
>> count = COUNT/DIR mode )
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>
>> --
>>> Dive into the World of Parallel Programming! The Go Parallel Website,
>>> sponsored by Intel and developed in partnership with Slashdot Media, is
>> your
>>> hub for all things parallel software development, from weekly thought
>>> leadership blogs to news, videos, case studies, tutorials and more. Take
>> 

Re: [Emc-users] Possibly dumb question - 7i76 encoder for spindle speed feedback

[John Alexander Stewart]

Ok - I had an issue with the encoder scale - setting it to a fraction seems
to have helped.

It seems like I'm having lots of noise, though. Halscope on
hm2_5i25.encoder.00.input-a gives me a nice smooth signal, but reading a
spindle setting under about 500rpm gives me a reading of approx 500rpm or
more.

Pushing it through a limit2 seems to have smoothed the faster velocities.

Above, say, 800 rpm, the system tracks quite well; up to the max of
2250rpm. I can easily tell if the machine is in low or high gear, but only
when running at a requested speed of above 800 rpm.

I'm going to put the 6n138 on a small bit of pc board to reduce the long
leads, and see if that reduces the noise somewhat.

I am confused, though, that Halscope gives me a perfect signal, but the
encoder output is haywire. I guess I'm used to old-school scopes, either
digital or analog screens and with real probes and stuff...


On Tue, Dec 30, 2014 at 10:38 PM, Peter C. Wallace  wrote:

> On Tue, 30 Dec 2014, John Alexander Stewart wrote:
>
> > Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2014 21:45:14 -0500
> > From: John Alexander Stewart 
> > Reply-To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)"
> > 
> > To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)"  >
> > Subject: [Emc-users] Possibly dumb question - 7i76 encoder for spindle
> speed
> > feedback
> >
> > Hi all;
> >
> > I'm back working on my mill with spindle tachometer, to utilize Andy
> Pugh's
> > automatic spindle speed selector example code.
> >
> > I have, from the spindle sensor, input going to a 6N138 optoisolator's
> > input. Ground and voltage source tied to machine. It sources enough
> current
> > to drive the input quite well. (originally sent to the input of an Amtel
> > processor in the LED spindle speed display)
> >
> > Output of 6N138, with +5v, ground, to the 7i76 ENCA+ and surrounding
> > connectors on the 7i76.
> >
> > Looking with Halscope gives me a pretty good signal on
> > hm2_5i25.0.encoder.00.input-a. Running at 1,000 rpm gives me 14 "square"
> > teeth, running at 500 rpm gives me 7, and running at 300rpm gives me 4.
> > (not that the counts mean much, except that the reading tracks spindle
> > speed linearly)
> >
> > The 7i76 jumper is set for TTL input. ONLY the ENCA+ input pin has
> anything
> > connected, the IDX, ENCB+/- and ENCA- are all left floating.
> >
> > The issue I have is that the velocity never seems to do much other than
> > just futz around between 6 and 40, no matter what the spindle speed.
> >
> > Here's my ini code:
> >
> >setp hm2_5i25.0.encoder.00.counter-mode  1
> >setp hm2_5i25.0.encoder.00.filter 1
> >setp hm2_5i25.0.encoder.00.index-invert 0
> >setp hm2_5i25.0.encoder.00.index-mask 0
> >setp hm2_5i25.0.encoder.00.index-mask-invert 0
> >setp hm2_5i25.0.encoder.00.latch-enable 0
> >setp hm2_5i25.0.encoder.00.scale -16
> >setp hm2_5i25.0.encoder.00.vel-timeout 1.0
> >
> > Should I tie the other encoder lines high/low or to somewhere?
> (especially
> > the index pulse)
> >
> > Anybody with some advice?
> >
> > Thank you - John A. Stewart.
>
> If the inputs are jumpered for TTL levels you must leave the -inputs
> unconnected. The + inputs have 2K pullups to 5V so will be in a high state
> if
> left open. I forget the 7I76 encoder polarity but you may need to ground
> the
> ENCB+ input to get the count direction correct (ENCB is the direction
> input in
> count = COUNT/DIR mode )
>
>
>
>
> >
> --
> > Dive into the World of Parallel Programming! The Go Parallel Website,
> > sponsored by Intel and developed in partnership with Slashdot Media, is
> your
> > hub for all things parallel software development, from weekly thought
> > leadership blogs to news, videos, case studies, tutorials and more. Take
> a
> > look and join the conversation now. http://goparallel.sourceforge.net
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >
>
> Peter Wallace
> Mesa Electronics
>
> (\__/)
> (='.'=) This is Bunny. Copy and paste bunny into your
> (")_(") signature to help him gain world domination.
>
>
>
> --
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> sponsored by Intel and developed in partnership with Slashdot Media, is
> your
> hub for all things parallel software development, from weekly thought
> leadership blogs to news, videos, case studies, tutorials and more. Take a
> look and join the conversation now. http://goparallel.sourceforge.net
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>
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Re: [Emc-users] Advanced bipod question

[Philipp Burch]

On 01.01.2015 03:16, poormansairforce H wrote:
> Hi all
> I have been trying to join the forum but can't get past the registration
> page, says there are errors:(
> I have a question about setting up a bipod hot wire cutter. Simply, in CAD
> I have figured out that on my dream machine setup, at a 4' 6" cutting
> length when the wire is angled 22.5 degrees on the vertical axis the wire
> moves 3mm from its intended position due to the attach points swinging in
> to compensate for the shortening of its length. Its obviously less then
> this with lesser angles but still significant when cutting wing cores, etc.
> On the horizontal plane it happens in 2 directions. Does LinuxCNC have skew
> compensation built in to account for this or can it be fixed with a config
> file/HAL correction??? I hope this makes senseThanks for any
> knowledge/answers
> Dan

Hi Dan,

happy new year, first of all ;)

I have to admit that I don't quite understand what you are talking
about, but it sounds like a transform problem of cartesian coordinates
(XYZABCUVW in G-Code) to joint space (motor movements). In LinuxCNC,
this is done by means of kinematics modules. The most basic one is
trivkins, suitable for most cartesian machines (like a small XYZ mill).
It simply maps each axis word (X, Y, etc.) 1:1 to the position command
of the respective joint. Then there are only slightly more complicated
modules, e.g. for gantry machines. And then there are the really complex
beasts for serial or parallel kinematics robots.
A few pre-built kinematics modules can be listed with

$ man kins

Maybe you can parameterize and then use the tripodkins? Otherwise it is
not too hard to invent your own kinematics, as long as you can
mathematically describe the forward and inverse transform and have some
knowledge of C programming ;)
An introduction about how to do it can be found in the docs:
http://linuxcnc.org/docs/html/motion/kinematics.html
And then there is the code in the source tree, which surely can serve as
a template/starting point.

Good luck!

Regards,
Philipp





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