Re: [Emc-users] Jogging non-trivial kins with joypad
On Mon, Jul 18, 2011 at 11:12 PM, Kyle Kerr wrote: > I would only ask, is there a concern with using a wireless device in a > shop setting to control your welding arm? It would seem to me that > dragging a cable around would bring more safety that worrying about a > stray radio signal causing the robot to go nuts. The chance that stray radio would imitate the WiFi signal and get interpreted as a command is practically zero. The RF interference could swamp WiFi and prevent the pendant from talking to the machine, but then again, stray low frequency EM could couple through the cabes and disable the wired pendant---it is not clear which effect is more serious and/or more difficult to protect against.. In fact, WiFi operates in a narrow band around 2.4GHz, so the wideband welding RF interference is probably delivering very little power into that band. Actually, I'd worry more about concentrated 2.4GHz interference, like, for instance, leakage from microwave owens---the famous 60-second WiFi dropouts. In any case, I'd say the wireless is worth trying. -- Magic Quadrant for Content-Aware Data Loss Prevention Research study explores the data loss prevention market. Includes in-depth analysis on the changes within the DLP market, and the criteria used to evaluate the strengths and weaknesses of these DLP solutions. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51385063/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] Jogging non-trivial kins with joypad
I would only ask, is there a concern with using a wireless device in a shop setting to control your welding arm? It would seem to me that dragging a cable around would bring more safety that worrying about a stray radio signal causing the robot to go nuts. -- Magic Quadrant for Content-Aware Data Loss Prevention Research study explores the data loss prevention market. Includes in-depth analysis on the changes within the DLP market, and the criteria used to evaluate the strengths and weaknesses of these DLP solutions. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51385063/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] Jogging non-trivial kins with joypad
2011/7/18 Viesturs Lācis : > of this approach - keyboard has jog keys only for 4 axes, so, if there > are more, they should be connected to halui pins, which mean jogging > each of them one at a time. But other than that - should work. What do > You think? To have all axes jogging with keyboard you might try this http://article.gmane.org/gmane.linux.distributions.emc.user/12642 Andrew -- AppSumo Presents a FREE Video for the SourceForge Community by Eric Ries, the creator of the Lean Startup Methodology on "Lean Startup Secrets Revealed." This video shows you how to validate your ideas, optimize your ideas and identify your business strategy. http://p.sf.net/sfu/appsumosfdev2dev ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] Jogging non-trivial kins with joypad
2011/7/18 Spiderdab <77...@tiscali.it>: > ..and simply into joint mode i had the 4 singular axis (tetrapod) > working together, than when switching to world mode my 3 joystick axis > would move X,Y and Z of the tetrapod junction, but as soon as touched 2 > axis at a time, it crushed. > So do I understand correctly that jogging non-trivial kinematics with joypad already work out of the box with the limitation of one axis at a time? Somebody with empirical knowledge, please, confirm this statement. 2011/7/18 andy pugh : > On 18 July 2011 14:24, Spiderdab <77...@tiscali.it> wrote:> >> >> But, what about the thing that one can perfectly jog into world mode >> with the keyboard? i mean, all 3 directions together! why not with a >> joystick? where is the difference? > > I think the difference is where halui.jog feeds into the system > compared with where the keyboard input feeds in. > > Have you tried using the jog-minus and jog-plus pins instead of > jog-analog? Maybe that is the difference? Yes, that is what I recall from previous discussions - keyboard presses go through Axis GUI, but joystick button presses go to halui. Those 2 never meet and that is why there is no easy fix to make joypad perform the same way as keyboard. So that is why I think that using jog-minus / jog-plus instead of jog-analog will make no difference. If somebody has a chance to test it in real life, please, inform the list about the results. BTW, today I found out about application called "qjoypad". It can map joypad buttons so that Linux apps (and hopefully, also EMC) treat them as keyboard presses. And that would allow jogging several axes at a time, just like with a keyboard. There is just one downside of this approach - keyboard has jog keys only for 4 axes, so, if there are more, they should be connected to halui pins, which mean jogging each of them one at a time. But other than that - should work. What do You think? Viesturs -- AppSumo Presents a FREE Video for the SourceForge Community by Eric Ries, the creator of the Lean Startup Methodology on "Lean Startup Secrets Revealed." This video shows you how to validate your ideas, optimize your ideas and identify your business strategy. http://p.sf.net/sfu/appsumosfdev2dev ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] Jogging non-trivial kins with joypad
Il giorno lun, 18/07/2011 alle 14.49 +0100, andy pugh ha scritto: > On 18 July 2011 14:24, Spiderdab <77...@tiscali.it> wrote: > > > but, you are talking about jogging one axis at a time without errors, > > not how to solve that, is it? > > Yes, it is a potential workaround to avoid the problem, not a fix for > the problem. > > > But, what about the thing that one can perfectly jog into world mode > > with the keyboard? i mean, all 3 directions together! why not with a > > joystick? where is the difference? > > I think the difference is where halui.jog feeds into the system > compared with where the keyboard input feeds in. > > Have you tried using the jog-minus and jog-plus pins instead of > jog-analog? Maybe that is the difference? > No, i have not. but right now the sistem isn't with me so i can't do anything. -- AppSumo Presents a FREE Video for the SourceForge Community by Eric Ries, the creator of the Lean Startup Methodology on "Lean Startup Secrets Revealed." This video shows you how to validate your ideas, optimize your ideas and identify your business strategy. http://p.sf.net/sfu/appsumosfdev2dev ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] Jogging non-trivial kins with joypad
On Monday, July 18, 2011 10:17:01 AM andy pugh did opine: > On 18 July 2011 12:24, Spiderdab <77...@tiscali.it> wrote: > > ..and simply into joint mode i had the 4 singular axis (tetrapod) > > working together, than when switching to world mode my 3 joystick axis > > would move X,Y and Z of the tetrapod junction, but as soon as touched > > 2 axis at a time, it crushed. > > i wish you'll be more lucky! > > As a workaround, a HAL component that only passes through one non-zero > float value would be simple. > three pins (or 6) for jogx, jogy jogz (joga, jogb, jogc) > Looks for the biggest value, and passes that through to output pins, > setting others to zero. > Optionally you could require a return all zero (all small would be > better) before allowing a change of active axis. > > This would also help with Gene's problem. Sounds like it should address it, but would that not disable the 8 point atari mode these gamepad sticks can also do. That TBT, would also be a smallish loss, at least for me, but when jogging to the next cut, would slow me down. And the power just failed, I'm on UPS. WTH? Cheers, gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) All your files have been destroyed (sorry). Paul. -- AppSumo Presents a FREE Video for the SourceForge Community by Eric Ries, the creator of the Lean Startup Methodology on "Lean Startup Secrets Revealed." This video shows you how to validate your ideas, optimize your ideas and identify your business strategy. http://p.sf.net/sfu/appsumosfdev2dev ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] Jogging non-trivial kins with joypad
On 18 July 2011 14:24, Spiderdab <77...@tiscali.it> wrote: > but, you are talking about jogging one axis at a time without errors, > not how to solve that, is it? Yes, it is a potential workaround to avoid the problem, not a fix for the problem. > But, what about the thing that one can perfectly jog into world mode > with the keyboard? i mean, all 3 directions together! why not with a > joystick? where is the difference? I think the difference is where halui.jog feeds into the system compared with where the keyboard input feeds in. Have you tried using the jog-minus and jog-plus pins instead of jog-analog? Maybe that is the difference? -- atp "Torque wrenches are for the obedience of fools and the guidance of wise men" -- AppSumo Presents a FREE Video for the SourceForge Community by Eric Ries, the creator of the Lean Startup Methodology on "Lean Startup Secrets Revealed." This video shows you how to validate your ideas, optimize your ideas and identify your business strategy. http://p.sf.net/sfu/appsumosfdev2dev ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] Jogging non-trivial kins with joypad
Il giorno lun, 18/07/2011 alle 12.34 +0100, andy pugh ha scritto: > On 18 July 2011 12:24, Spiderdab <77...@tiscali.it> wrote: > > > ..and simply into joint mode i had the 4 singular axis (tetrapod) > > working together, than when switching to world mode my 3 joystick axis > > would move X,Y and Z of the tetrapod junction, but as soon as touched 2 > > axis at a time, it crushed. > > i wish you'll be more lucky! > > As a workaround, a HAL component that only passes through one non-zero > float value would be simple. > three pins (or 6) for jogx, jogy jogz (joga, jogb, jogc) > Looks for the biggest value, and passes that through to output pins, > setting others to zero. > Optionally you could require a return all zero (all small would be > better) before allowing a change of active axis. > > This would also help with Gene's problem. > i don't understand, maybe 'cause i'm not english speaking.. but, you are talking about jogging one axis at a time without errors, not how to solve that, is it? But, what about the thing that one can perfectly jog into world mode with the keyboard? i mean, all 3 directions together! why not with a joystick? where is the difference? thanks, Davide. -- AppSumo Presents a FREE Video for the SourceForge Community by Eric Ries, the creator of the Lean Startup Methodology on "Lean Startup Secrets Revealed." This video shows you how to validate your ideas, optimize your ideas and identify your business strategy. http://p.sf.net/sfu/appsumosfdev2dev ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] Jogging non-trivial kins with joypad
On 18 July 2011 12:24, Spiderdab <77...@tiscali.it> wrote: > ..and simply into joint mode i had the 4 singular axis (tetrapod) > working together, than when switching to world mode my 3 joystick axis > would move X,Y and Z of the tetrapod junction, but as soon as touched 2 > axis at a time, it crushed. > i wish you'll be more lucky! As a workaround, a HAL component that only passes through one non-zero float value would be simple. three pins (or 6) for jogx, jogy jogz (joga, jogb, jogc) Looks for the biggest value, and passes that through to output pins, setting others to zero. Optionally you could require a return all zero (all small would be better) before allowing a change of active axis. This would also help with Gene's problem. -- atp "Torque wrenches are for the obedience of fools and the guidance of wise men" -- AppSumo Presents a FREE Video for the SourceForge Community by Eric Ries, the creator of the Lean Startup Methodology on "Lean Startup Secrets Revealed." This video shows you how to validate your ideas, optimize your ideas and identify your business strategy. http://p.sf.net/sfu/appsumosfdev2dev ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] Jogging non-trivial kins with joypad
Il giorno lun, 18/07/2011 alle 05.46 -0400, gene heskett ha scritto: > On Monday, July 18, 2011 05:38:21 AM Spiderdab did opine: > > > Il giorno lun, 18/07/2011 alle 11.28 +0300, Viesturs Lācis ha scritto: > > > Hello, gentlemen! > > > > > > The client wants me to set up the welding robot so that they can use a > > > remote pendant to jog it. > > > > > > The 10K $ question is: how can I talk EMC2 in doing something like > > > that? _Any_ feasible workaround will do. > > > > > > I recall that there have been discussions on this list that it is not > > > really possible for machines with non-trivial kins. > > > And looking at > > > http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?Simple_Remote_Pendant > > > shows that it will jog machine in joint mode: > > > net joy-x-jog halui.jog.0.analog <= input.0.abs-x-position > > > > > > Is there anything I can do instead of purchasing extended USB cable > > > and making operator walk around machine with keyboard in hands? > > > Can I somehow trick Linux by assigning certain buttons on joypad work > > > as if certain keys on keyboard were pressed? > > > > > > Viesturs > > > > This will be very interesting also for me. as I have a non-trivial > > machine, and have never being able to jog into world mode with a > > joystick without errors. > > In my case i could jog only one axis at a time. as i tried to jog > > 'diagonally' x and y together, i had error. > > Nobody could help me, so if you find a solution i will be happy twice! > > > I followed the directions on the wiki to use a game controller, and one of > the reasons I don't use it all that much is the difficulty of making it > only do one axis at a time. Using the analog sticks in analog mode, the y > always creeps when moving X, or vice versa. In the 8 point "atari" mode > its a lot better but the speeds are fixed. Increasing the analog > 'deadband' helps, but whats really needed are much longer joysticks, those > tilting buttons just don't cut it for me. maybe it can be useful for you to add also buttons to enable axis, so you don't have to worry about y when moving x ect.. longer joystick are much better of course, but always need a larger deadband in my opinion. > I don't recall ever logging a > joint error when using it though. > Cheers, gene was that a NON-trivial kinematics? -- AppSumo Presents a FREE Video for the SourceForge Community by Eric Ries, the creator of the Lean Startup Methodology on "Lean Startup Secrets Revealed." This video shows you how to validate your ideas, optimize your ideas and identify your business strategy. http://p.sf.net/sfu/appsumosfdev2dev ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] Jogging non-trivial kins with joypad
Il giorno lun, 18/07/2011 alle 12.22 +0300, Viesturs Lācis ha scritto: > 2011/7/18 Spiderdab <77...@tiscali.it>: > > > > In my case i could jog only one axis at a time. as i tried to jog > > 'diagonally' x and y together, i had error. > > > > Could You, please, share, how did You achieve that? > > Viesturs > Using either the remote pendant section in the EMC2 manual, and HIDCOMP (if i remember the name correcly..) which i don't have a link now, but preferred, because of a larger possibility of personalization. i.e. with that i could change the curve response of the joystick. ah, this is the link: http://hidcomp.sourceforge.net/ Davide. -- AppSumo Presents a FREE Video for the SourceForge Community by Eric Ries, the creator of the Lean Startup Methodology on "Lean Startup Secrets Revealed." This video shows you how to validate your ideas, optimize your ideas and identify your business strategy. http://p.sf.net/sfu/appsumosfdev2dev ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] Jogging non-trivial kins with joypad
Il giorno lun, 18/07/2011 alle 12.22 +0300, Viesturs Lācis ha scritto: > 2011/7/18 Spiderdab <77...@tiscali.it>: > > > > In my case i could jog only one axis at a time. as i tried to jog > > 'diagonally' x and y together, i had error. > > > > Could You, please, share, how did You achieve that? > > Viesturs ..and simply into joint mode i had the 4 singular axis (tetrapod) working together, than when switching to world mode my 3 joystick axis would move X,Y and Z of the tetrapod junction, but as soon as touched 2 axis at a time, it crushed. i wish you'll be more lucky! -- AppSumo Presents a FREE Video for the SourceForge Community by Eric Ries, the creator of the Lean Startup Methodology on "Lean Startup Secrets Revealed." This video shows you how to validate your ideas, optimize your ideas and identify your business strategy. http://p.sf.net/sfu/appsumosfdev2dev ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] Jogging non-trivial kins with joypad
2011/7/18 Viesturs Lācis : > I recall that there have been discussions on this list that it is not > really possible for machines with non-trivial kins. > And looking at > http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?Simple_Remote_Pendant > shows that it will jog machine in joint mode: > net joy-x-jog halui.jog.0.analog <= input.0.abs-x-position > It's possible with wireless USB joupad, for instance. Jogging works for both joint and world mode. But only one axis at a time. This http://www.dealextreme.com/p/2-4ghz-wireless-dual-shock-joypad-controller-gamepad-for-pc-3-aaa-44217 works for me. I partially configured my joypad with pncconf. Andrew -- AppSumo Presents a FREE Video for the SourceForge Community by Eric Ries, the creator of the Lean Startup Methodology on "Lean Startup Secrets Revealed." This video shows you how to validate your ideas, optimize your ideas and identify your business strategy. http://p.sf.net/sfu/appsumosfdev2dev ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] Jogging non-trivial kins with joypad
On Monday, July 18, 2011 05:38:21 AM Spiderdab did opine: > Il giorno lun, 18/07/2011 alle 11.28 +0300, Viesturs Lācis ha scritto: > > Hello, gentlemen! > > > > The client wants me to set up the welding robot so that they can use a > > remote pendant to jog it. > > > > The 10K $ question is: how can I talk EMC2 in doing something like > > that? _Any_ feasible workaround will do. > > > > I recall that there have been discussions on this list that it is not > > really possible for machines with non-trivial kins. > > And looking at > > http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?Simple_Remote_Pendant > > shows that it will jog machine in joint mode: > > net joy-x-jog halui.jog.0.analog <= input.0.abs-x-position > > > > Is there anything I can do instead of purchasing extended USB cable > > and making operator walk around machine with keyboard in hands? > > Can I somehow trick Linux by assigning certain buttons on joypad work > > as if certain keys on keyboard were pressed? > > > > Viesturs > > This will be very interesting also for me. as I have a non-trivial > machine, and have never being able to jog into world mode with a > joystick without errors. > In my case i could jog only one axis at a time. as i tried to jog > 'diagonally' x and y together, i had error. > Nobody could help me, so if you find a solution i will be happy twice! > I followed the directions on the wiki to use a game controller, and one of the reasons I don't use it all that much is the difficulty of making it only do one axis at a time. Using the analog sticks in analog mode, the y always creeps when moving X, or vice versa. In the 8 point "atari" mode its a lot better but the speeds are fixed. Increasing the analog 'deadband' helps, but whats really needed are much longer joysticks, those tilting buttons just don't cut it for me. I don't recall ever logging a joint error when using it though. > > > -- AppSumo Presents a FREE Video for the SourceForge Community by > Eric Ries, the creator of the Lean Startup Methodology on "Lean Startup > Secrets Revealed." This video shows you how to validate your ideas, > optimize your ideas and identify your business strategy. > http://p.sf.net/sfu/appsumosfdev2dev > ___ > Emc-users mailing list > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users Cheers, gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) If you are not for yourself, who will be for you? If you are for yourself, then what are you? If not now, when? -- AppSumo Presents a FREE Video for the SourceForge Community by Eric Ries, the creator of the Lean Startup Methodology on "Lean Startup Secrets Revealed." This video shows you how to validate your ideas, optimize your ideas and identify your business strategy. http://p.sf.net/sfu/appsumosfdev2dev ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] Jogging non-trivial kins with joypad
2011/7/18 Spiderdab <77...@tiscali.it>: > > In my case i could jog only one axis at a time. as i tried to jog > 'diagonally' x and y together, i had error. > Could You, please, share, how did You achieve that? Viesturs -- AppSumo Presents a FREE Video for the SourceForge Community by Eric Ries, the creator of the Lean Startup Methodology on "Lean Startup Secrets Revealed." This video shows you how to validate your ideas, optimize your ideas and identify your business strategy. http://p.sf.net/sfu/appsumosfdev2dev ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] Jogging non-trivial kins with joypad
Il giorno lun, 18/07/2011 alle 11.28 +0300, Viesturs Lācis ha scritto: > Hello, gentlemen! > > The client wants me to set up the welding robot so that they can use a > remote pendant to jog it. > > The 10K $ question is: how can I talk EMC2 in doing something like > that? _Any_ feasible workaround will do. > > I recall that there have been discussions on this list that it is not > really possible for machines with non-trivial kins. > And looking at > http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?Simple_Remote_Pendant > shows that it will jog machine in joint mode: > net joy-x-jog halui.jog.0.analog <= input.0.abs-x-position > > Is there anything I can do instead of purchasing extended USB cable > and making operator walk around machine with keyboard in hands? > Can I somehow trick Linux by assigning certain buttons on joypad work > as if certain keys on keyboard were pressed? > > Viesturs This will be very interesting also for me. as I have a non-trivial machine, and have never being able to jog into world mode with a joystick without errors. In my case i could jog only one axis at a time. as i tried to jog 'diagonally' x and y together, i had error. Nobody could help me, so if you find a solution i will be happy twice! -- AppSumo Presents a FREE Video for the SourceForge Community by Eric Ries, the creator of the Lean Startup Methodology on "Lean Startup Secrets Revealed." This video shows you how to validate your ideas, optimize your ideas and identify your business strategy. http://p.sf.net/sfu/appsumosfdev2dev ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
[Emc-users] Jogging non-trivial kins with joypad
Hello, gentlemen! The client wants me to set up the welding robot so that they can use a remote pendant to jog it. The 10K $ question is: how can I talk EMC2 in doing something like that? _Any_ feasible workaround will do. I recall that there have been discussions on this list that it is not really possible for machines with non-trivial kins. And looking at http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?Simple_Remote_Pendant shows that it will jog machine in joint mode: net joy-x-jog halui.jog.0.analog <= input.0.abs-x-position Is there anything I can do instead of purchasing extended USB cable and making operator walk around machine with keyboard in hands? Can I somehow trick Linux by assigning certain buttons on joypad work as if certain keys on keyboard were pressed? Viesturs -- AppSumo Presents a FREE Video for the SourceForge Community by Eric Ries, the creator of the Lean Startup Methodology on "Lean Startup Secrets Revealed." This video shows you how to validate your ideas, optimize your ideas and identify your business strategy. http://p.sf.net/sfu/appsumosfdev2dev ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
