Re: [Emc-users] No clean solder flux, how to buy in Sweden

[Rafael Skodlar]

On 2/24/19 1:14 PM, Chris Albertson wrote:

Lead solder is not yet banned in the US.  But it is banned in almost all
  the world.   The US is not the biggest user of solder and few companies
want to make a US-only product so we get what is available on the world
market.But you can still find lead solder. But I've 100% moved on.
The best stuff is silver based now.  Use that.


Not always. Old equipment needs to be worked on with older kind of 
solder. If nothing else it is to preserve the artifacts in museum(s). 
Silver is harder to work with because of the temperature difference so 
PCB would get damaged before the solder joint would be complete.



The reason they have banned lead is that EVERY electronic device eventually
ends up in a land fill.  The lead then leaches into the water table.

Not exactly true!!!


Sounds silly that tiny phone might contaminate an entire aquifer but Apple
sells something like five million phones every month and now that the
market is started this means 5 million phones go into landfills every


that is unlikely. People do recycle stuff these days. Manufacturers are 
taking back old equipment for recovering precious and other metals that 
can be used in manufacturing again.


We have scrap metal and electronics collection in place here in Silicon 
Valley. Every few months recycling specialists pickup anything of that 
sort left in our driveways with attached note. They don't dump it in 
landfills.



month.   Or another way to think of this is that EVERY pound of lead solder
manufactured eventually goes to a land fill.  Lead is mostly not to
harmful to older adults but has a serious effect on babies and children and
the effects of exposure can't be removed, the effects are permanent.

They passed a law years ago in China that ALL phones must use USB chargers
with a standardized USB-A connector.   Notice that the entire world is now


Any such laws come from CA in US first as far as I know. China keeps 
polluting their sea and that can be traced across Pacific to US West 
coast. Watch nature programs that show pollution affecting animal world 
on the way.



following China's charger regulations.   The effect is millions of tons
fewer used chargers in landfills.   Now that chargers are standardized
people keep them.  China got that one right.


China is the last one to be given credit for cleaning up the environment 
based on what I see on Asian TV programs alone. Japan, S. Korea care 
about the environment way more than red PRC.



About freight for stuff on eBay.  Most of what I buy there is with free
shipping.The free shipping is mostly from items shipped from China as
postage is very low there.


That postage is subsidized by USPS based on some old obscure law that 
was put in place to help undeveloped countries I heard.


--
Rafael


___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] No clean solder flux, how to buy in Sweden

[Bruce Layne]

Fortunately, "EVERY electronic device eventually ends up in a land fill"
is a patently false statement.  At least in the US and probably to a
greater extent in Europe, almost all electronic devices are recycled. 
They're shredded and the metals are chemically extracted and separated. 
It's probably less expensive than constantly sourcing raw materials from
ores and then throwing those products in a landfill five years later, so
the recycling is a commercially viable venture that requires no
government mandates.  The market can manage this environmentally
friendly process, which probably implies that electronics recycling is a
worldwide phenomenon, regardless of any government policies that may exist.



On 2/24/19 4:14 PM, Chris Albertson wrote:
> The reason they have banned lead is that EVERY electronic device eventually
> ends up in a land fill.  The lead then leaches into the water table.
> Sounds silly that tiny phone might contaminate an entire aquifer but Apple
> sells something like five million phones every month and now that the
> market is started this means 5 million phones go into landfills every
> month.




___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] No clean solder flux, how to buy in Sweden

[Chris Albertson]

Lead solder is not yet banned in the US.  But it is banned in almost all
 the world.   The US is not the biggest user of solder and few companies
want to make a US-only product so we get what is available on the world
market.But you can still find lead solder. But I've 100% moved on.
The best stuff is silver based now.  Use that.

The reason they have banned lead is that EVERY electronic device eventually
ends up in a land fill.  The lead then leaches into the water table.
Sounds silly that tiny phone might contaminate an entire aquifer but Apple
sells something like five million phones every month and now that the
market is started this means 5 million phones go into landfills every
month.   Or another way to think of this is that EVERY pound of lead solder
manufactured eventually goes to a land fill.  Lead is mostly not to
harmful to older adults but has a serious effect on babies and children and
the effects of exposure can't be removed, the effects are permanent.

They passed a law years ago in China that ALL phones must use USB chargers
with a standardized USB-A connector.   Notice that the entire world is now
following China's charger regulations.   The effect is millions of tons
fewer used chargers in landfills.   Now that chargers are standardized
people keep them.  China got that one right.

About freight for stuff on eBay.  Most of what I buy there is with free
shipping.The free shipping is mostly from items shipped from China as
postage is very low there.

On Sun, Feb 24, 2019 at 6:50 AM Gene Heskett  wrote:

> On Sunday 24 February 2019 09:28:26 Nicklas Karlsson wrote:
>
> > Anyone in Sweden have experience buying no clean solder flux?
> >
> > Last time I succeeded but this time only reseller I know about Elfa I
> > failed registration form. I tried Ebay a few months ago but never
> > received and now there is only a little bit left. Companies outside
> > Sweden send by air freight and refuse to sell it. I tried only other
> > local store I know about once but got sparc between pins so this is no
> > good stuff.
> >
> I've noted a general lack of availability of decent rosin cored solders
> here too. The anti lead folks are getting laws passed by people who have
> no knowledge of the technology involved. So called lead free, is mostly
> tin, and tin grows whiskers that short to adjacent connections. So the
> last time I saw 3% silver but otherwise eutectic solder for sale I
> stocked up what I thought was a lifetime supply, but I'm beginning to
> worry I may run out while I am still sucking air. Expect to pay north of
> $100 a pound for good stuff.  And it may be completely under the table
> stuff in another 10 years, Stock up when you get a chance.
> >
> > Nicklas Karlsson
> >
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett
> --
> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
> Genes Web page 
>
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>


-- 

Chris Albertson
Redondo Beach, California

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] No clean solder flux, how to buy in Sweden

[Ralph Stirling]

We just switched to lead-free this school year, and I have been very happy
with FCT SN100C type solder (both wire and paste), and NC26 no clean flux.
I ordered it from Pacwest Supply, but I have no idea whether you can get 
FCT products in Sweden.

I discovered that applying a little dab of the NC26 flux to smd pads from a 
syringe
makes the solder paste stick to the pad much better when applying paste from
a syringe.  For most boards we get a stencil and apply the paste with a putty 
knife,
but for the occasional single part, the flux and paste by syringe works well.  
The
flux is also excellent for assisting in removing solder bridges between 
fine-pitch
leads.  I did have to crank up the temperature on our reflow oven a bit, and 
lengthen
the heating cycle to get heavier parts to reflow reliably, and I've had some 
requests
for hotter soldering iron cartridges, but otherwise the switch was much less 
painful
than I was fearing.  We aren't so concerned with long-term reliability of 
joints though.

-- Ralph

From: Jon Elson [el...@pico-systems.com]
Sent: Sunday, February 24, 2019 11:13 AM
To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
Subject: Re: [Emc-users] No clean solder flux, how to buy in Sweden

On 02/24/2019 08:48 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> I've noted a general lack of availability of decent rosin cored solders
> here too. The anti lead folks are getting laws passed by people who have
> no knowledge of the technology involved. So called lead free, is mostly
> tin, and tin grows whiskers that short to adjacent connections. So the
> last time I saw 3% silver but otherwise eutectic solder for sale I
> stocked up what I thought was a lifetime supply, but I'm beginning to
> worry I may run out while I am still sucking air. Expect to pay north of
> $100 a pound for good stuff.  And it may be completely under the table
> stuff in another 10 years, Stock up when you get a chance.
>
Well, I've been buying some of my wire solder (SAC305) on
eBay for a while.  Lots of outfits are selling the stuff for
about half the distributor price (which is wildly expensive).

As for plain flux, GC chemicals made the stuff I use.  I
think you can still get this from distributors.I add a bit
of butanol to keep it at the right consistency, but that is
not something everybody has around.I also use some
water-soluble liquid flux for my dip soldering process, get
that from eBay also.

Jon


___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users


___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] No clean solder flux, how to buy in Sweden

[Jon Elson]

On 02/24/2019 08:48 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:

I've noted a general lack of availability of decent rosin cored solders
here too. The anti lead folks are getting laws passed by people who have
no knowledge of the technology involved. So called lead free, is mostly
tin, and tin grows whiskers that short to adjacent connections. So the
last time I saw 3% silver but otherwise eutectic solder for sale I
stocked up what I thought was a lifetime supply, but I'm beginning to
worry I may run out while I am still sucking air. Expect to pay north of
$100 a pound for good stuff.  And it may be completely under the table
stuff in another 10 years, Stock up when you get a chance.

Well, I've been buying some of my wire solder (SAC305) on 
eBay for a while.  Lots of outfits are selling the stuff for 
about half the distributor price (which is wildly expensive).


As for plain flux, GC chemicals made the stuff I use.  I 
think you can still get this from distributors.I add a bit 
of butanol to keep it at the right consistency, but that is 
not something everybody has around.I also use some 
water-soluble liquid flux for my dip soldering process, get 
that from eBay also.


Jon


___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] No clean solder flux, how to buy in Sweden

[Peter Blodow]

Nicklas,
I wrote you to get a little block of colophonium rosin for violins from 
the MUSIC STORE, and there ought to be a music store somewhere in 
Sweden. Pay it directly in cash, Swedish crowns, right over the table, 
no internet. Or ask a violinist in your neighborhood for it. And get a 
tiny bottle of 80% rum from the alcohol store. Good, strong home brew 
will do, too. No foreign payment required. And don't fuss with fir trees 
out in the woods, you'll just get sticky all over and the result will be 
hair lotion, in the best case.

Peter

Am 24.02.2019 um 18:42 schrieb Nicklas Karlsson:

On Sun, 24 Feb 2019 17:29:22 +0100
Peter Blodow  wrote:


Nicklas, although buying rosin core solder is no problem hereabouts, I
still prefer to make my own flux: Dissolve one or two large spoons full
of crushed colophonium (the cheapest quality from the music store) in a
little bottle of 95% cleaning alcohol. Probably 80% Jamaica rum works
just the same. This makes a protective liquid to apply to a PCB with a
little brush and at the same time you have the rosin wherever you are
soldering. Even smells good!
Greeetings
Peter

They have rosin at Farnell but do not sell to Sweden, really annoying.

Found another another one Electrokit, less to chose from but they accepted 
direct bank transfer and did not try man in the middle attack via billing 
company as have happened before, it works in seconds, they receive money but no 
information possible to withdraw more money. I consider it a good option to 
conclude business transactions on internet, then money is received they get the 
order but otherwise nothing happens.

Could pick some colophonium myself then I work in forest, it's the cheapest quality. I 
recognize the smell of rum, use it in the "lemonade" then I go out dancing, 
theory is it will keep teeth from rotten then there is sugar in the lemonade.


Best regards Nicklas Karlsson


___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users





___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] No clean solder flux, how to buy in Sweden

[Gene Heskett]

On Sunday 24 February 2019 09:58:18 Nicklas Karlsson wrote:

> > > Anyone in Sweden have experience buying no clean solder flux?
> > >
> > > Last time I succeeded but this time only reseller I know about
> > > Elfa I failed registration form. I tried Ebay a few months ago but
> > > never received and now there is only a little bit left. Companies
> > > outside Sweden send by air freight and refuse to sell it. I tried
> > > only other local store I know about once but got sparc between
> > > pins so this is no good stuff.
> >
> > I've noted a general lack of availability of decent rosin cored
> > solders here too. The anti lead folks are getting laws passed by
> > people who have no knowledge of the technology involved. So called
> > lead free, is mostly tin, and tin grows whiskers that short to
> > adjacent connections. So the last time I saw 3% silver but otherwise
> > eutectic solder for sale I stocked up what I thought was a lifetime
> > supply, but I'm beginning to worry I may run out while I am still
> > sucking air. Expect to pay north of $100 a pound for good stuff. 
> > And it may be completely under the table stuff in another 10 years,
> > Stock up when you get a chance.
>
> There are plenty of the stuff available on Ebay so supply is no
> problem but freight is.
>
> Payment system is also a problem. Old honest system with ordinary bank
> transfer beforehand work great but selling company refuce to accept it
> and instead want credit card. It might also be they are not happy with
> delivery address and also want both E-mail and telephone but I refuse
> because my child use it to order stuff on Internet. 

Thats a good enough excuse, but it also time to adjust the childs 
attitude. Mine are now in their later 40's and I think have turned out 
fairly well, but they always understood that they got medical care when 
they needed it, warm clothes, 3 hots & a cot. Anything else was gravy. 
If I could afford it, yeah, but if I said no that WAS the end of it. But 
they never did w/o something they needed.  They had a puter to play with 
a year before I got one for me. And I am welcome to their bed and food 
anytime I park my truck there.  Their birth mother is not so lucky. 
Anything she can get a wrecking bar under goes to the pawn shop when 
she's around. One by one, they've had the sheriff remove her.

> These cand idiotic 
> systems make me really pistoff.
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users


Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 



___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] No clean solder flux, how to buy in Sweden

[Nicklas Karlsson]

On Sun, 24 Feb 2019 17:29:22 +0100
Peter Blodow  wrote:

> Nicklas, although buying rosin core solder is no problem hereabouts, I 
> still prefer to make my own flux: Dissolve one or two large spoons full 
> of crushed colophonium (the cheapest quality from the music store) in a 
> little bottle of 95% cleaning alcohol. Probably 80% Jamaica rum works 
> just the same. This makes a protective liquid to apply to a PCB with a 
> little brush and at the same time you have the rosin wherever you are 
> soldering. Even smells good!
> Greeetings
> Peter

They have rosin at Farnell but do not sell to Sweden, really annoying.

Found another another one Electrokit, less to chose from but they accepted 
direct bank transfer and did not try man in the middle attack via billing 
company as have happened before, it works in seconds, they receive money but no 
information possible to withdraw more money. I consider it a good option to 
conclude business transactions on internet, then money is received they get the 
order but otherwise nothing happens.

Could pick some colophonium myself then I work in forest, it's the cheapest 
quality. I recognize the smell of rum, use it in the "lemonade" then I go out 
dancing, theory is it will keep teeth from rotten then there is sugar in the 
lemonade.


Best regards Nicklas Karlsson


___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] No clean solder flux, how to buy in Sweden

[Peter Blodow]

Nicklas, although buying rosin core solder is no problem hereabouts, I 
still prefer to make my own flux: Dissolve one or two large spoons full 
of crushed colophonium (the cheapest quality from the music store) in a 
little bottle of 95% cleaning alcohol. Probably 80% Jamaica rum works 
just the same. This makes a protective liquid to apply to a PCB with a 
little brush and at the same time you have the rosin wherever you are 
soldering. Even smells good!

Greeetings
Peter



Am 24.02.2019 um 15:28 schrieb Nicklas Karlsson:

Anyone in Sweden have experience buying no clean solder flux?

Last time I succeeded but this time only reseller I know about Elfa I failed 
registration form. I tried Ebay a few months ago but never received and now 
there is only a little bit left. Companies outside Sweden send by air freight 
and refuse to sell it. I tried only other local store I know about once but got 
sparc between pins so this is no good stuff.


Nicklas Karlsson


___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users





___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] No clean solder flux, how to buy in Sweden

[Nicklas Karlsson]

> > Anyone in Sweden have experience buying no clean solder flux?
> >
> > Last time I succeeded but this time only reseller I know about Elfa I
> > failed registration form. I tried Ebay a few months ago but never
> > received and now there is only a little bit left. Companies outside
> > Sweden send by air freight and refuse to sell it. I tried only other
> > local store I know about once but got sparc between pins so this is no
> > good stuff.
> >
> I've noted a general lack of availability of decent rosin cored solders 
> here too. The anti lead folks are getting laws passed by people who have 
> no knowledge of the technology involved. So called lead free, is mostly 
> tin, and tin grows whiskers that short to adjacent connections. So the 
> last time I saw 3% silver but otherwise eutectic solder for sale I 
> stocked up what I thought was a lifetime supply, but I'm beginning to 
> worry I may run out while I am still sucking air. Expect to pay north of 
> $100 a pound for good stuff.  And it may be completely under the table 
> stuff in another 10 years, Stock up when you get a chance.

There are plenty of the stuff available on Ebay so supply is no problem but 
freight is.

Payment system is also a problem. Old honest system with ordinary bank transfer 
beforehand work great but selling company refuce to accept it and instead want 
credit card. It might also be they are not happy with delivery address and also 
want both E-mail and telephone but I refuse because my child use it to order 
stuff on Internet. These cand idiotic systems make me really pistoff.


___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] No clean solder flux, how to buy in Sweden

[Gene Heskett]

On Sunday 24 February 2019 09:28:26 Nicklas Karlsson wrote:

> Anyone in Sweden have experience buying no clean solder flux?
>
> Last time I succeeded but this time only reseller I know about Elfa I
> failed registration form. I tried Ebay a few months ago but never
> received and now there is only a little bit left. Companies outside
> Sweden send by air freight and refuse to sell it. I tried only other
> local store I know about once but got sparc between pins so this is no
> good stuff.
>
I've noted a general lack of availability of decent rosin cored solders 
here too. The anti lead folks are getting laws passed by people who have 
no knowledge of the technology involved. So called lead free, is mostly 
tin, and tin grows whiskers that short to adjacent connections. So the 
last time I saw 3% silver but otherwise eutectic solder for sale I 
stocked up what I thought was a lifetime supply, but I'm beginning to 
worry I may run out while I am still sucking air. Expect to pay north of 
$100 a pound for good stuff.  And it may be completely under the table 
stuff in another 10 years, Stock up when you get a chance.
>
> Nicklas Karlsson
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users


Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 



___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

[Emc-users] No clean solder flux, how to buy in Sweden

[Nicklas Karlsson]

Anyone in Sweden have experience buying no clean solder flux?

Last time I succeeded but this time only reseller I know about Elfa I failed 
registration form. I tried Ebay a few months ago but never received and now 
there is only a little bit left. Companies outside Sweden send by air freight 
and refuse to sell it. I tried only other local store I know about once but got 
sparc between pins so this is no good stuff.


Nicklas Karlsson


___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users