EV Digest 7072
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: Air-cooled VW to 8" Motor adaptor plate Question
by Paul <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: parallel batteries
by Jack Murray <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: Hanging with Victor...EVision replaces all gauges in White Zombie
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: was DIY Electric now forums redux
by "John G. Lussmyer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: Bridgestone Ecopia EP-03 Tires
by MIKE WILLMON <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: Air-cooled VW to 8" Motor adaptor plate Question
by "Roland Wiench" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: Lester SCR Battery Charger
by Tom Gocze <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Controller precharge resistor drain?
by "Roger Daisley" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) NEDRA Nationals Raffle motor
by Jim Husted <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: Hanging with Victor...EVision replaces all gauges in White Zombie
by Jim Husted <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) RE: Air-cooled VW to 8" Motor adaptor plate Question
by Mike Willmon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Re: NEDRA Nationals Raffle motor
by Rod Hower <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Re: NEDRA Nationals Raffle motor
by Michael Barkley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) AMC project motor, DIY potbox kit thoughts
by James Massey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Re: NEDRA Nationals Raffle motor
by Tim Brehm <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: Air-cooled VW to 8" Motor adaptor plate Question
by "Roland Wiench" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: NEDRA Nationals Raffle motor
by Paul <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Re: NEDRA Nationals Raffle motor
by Jim Husted <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Re: Bridgestone Ecopia EP-03 Tires
by Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Re: Controller precharge resistor drain?
by James Massey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) RE: A123 chemistry
by Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Re: NEDRA Nationals Raffle motor
by Dave Cover <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
I see this is lacking responses. I don't have one apart at this time
but I have in the past...
On Jul 24, 2007, at 11:59 PM, Mike Willmon wrote:
The stock flywheel seems to have to set down about ~3/8" into the
housing with about an RCH clearance. I mean its pretty tight.
The flywheel doesn't seem to be perfectly true or else the
alignment holes are not prefectly true on center because it rubs the
housing. We wound up trying 3 different flywheels as well as
rotating them 90 degrees until just about the last one fit and
didn't rub the side of the adaptor housing. So has anyone done a
Bug that can tell us if the flywheel is supposed to sit down
inside that housing, or are we mounting it in too far? If it is
supposed to fit inside somewhat, is there any problem turning off
the ring gear as well as .125" off the OD.
The Beetle flywheel sits just *slightly* inside the stock engine
case. The amount is not very much, I don't think any part of the
flywheel is outside the face of the transaxle (in other words, its
inside by less than the thickness of the centering ring on the back
of the engine.) The ring gear should be completely inside the transaxle.
You mentioned that one flywheel fit. You should make sure its not a
180mm clutch flywheel. That's no fair and no good (they have enough
trouble with later stock VW engines, that's why VW went to a 200mm
clutch.)
While we got one iteration of our different fitments to work
without rubbing I'm concerned that the weight of the motor hanging
unsupported off the transaxle might set down on the flywheel
causing it to rub again. Would .125" off the O.D. be sufficient
clearance?
Things here better not be moving! The Beetle had no problem hanging a
247 lb. engine off the back of the transaxle. Shake, rattle, and
roll, it was never a problem (unless someone didn't tighten the
bolts!) When grinding out a 40HP tranny to fit a 200mm clutch
flywheel its not uncommon to stop grinding with only 0.01 inch of
clearance for the larger ring gear.
HTH,
Paul "neon" Gooch
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
NiMH parallel no problem to discharge. They can't be charged in
parallel because their voltage drops once fully charged, but they still
accept current, so the other strings will continue to overcharged the
weakest one to death. The solution is to use a switch or diode so a
string can't be charged by another one, and charge each string
independently. You need a BMS to handle it, its not difficult, just
adds expense, but adds a lot of other value as well, like balancing and
monitoring.
Jack
Dale Ulan wrote:
As I understand it, lead acid batteries work okay being in parallel
and NiMH don't work well in parallel.
Question for those who have more knowledge on this point... NiMH don't
parallel well, but what about having several strings that are
either higher or lower in voltage than the motor+controller
need, and a buck/boost bidirectional converter for each string,
dumping power into (or out of, in the case of regen) the main
'bus'. Say, 6 or 10 192 volt strings, with a 156 volt bus. Each
converter would need to be capable of maybe between 40 and 100 amps,
depending on your power level. Obviously, synchronizing them might
be a bit of effort, but could this work? I would think buck for
driving, boost for regen would make the most sense to me from an
efficiency and minimizing switching loss point of view. Obviously
the output capacitors on the bus would need to handle full ripple
current of the motor and controller.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I'll be releasing them for general sale in about 4 weeks.
John got to give me a feedback first...
Victor
Zeke Yewdall wrote:
So... where do we get them? I want one.
Z
On 7/26/07, Joseph T. <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
It's like the iphone, but for EVs.
On 7/26/07, John Wayland <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hello to All,
>
> Just a short post (is that possible?) about last week's enlightening
> time spent with Metric Mind's Victor Tichonov! I'm sure many have
...
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
At 04:57 PM 7/27/2007, john fisher wrote:
An advantage of forums that I haven't seen mentioned here is the
real-time posting. With digests you get a cacophony of duplicate and
out-of-order answers.
Umm, that is only an advantage if you are crazy enough to use Digest mode.
Most people I know just get each email as it comes in, which is
"real-time" posting.
--
John G. Lussmyer mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Dragons soar and Tigers prowl while I dream....
http://www.CasaDelGato.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
That may just mean they used more rubber and its probably a little heavier than
a similarly sized tire.
----- Original Message -----
From: Ricky Suiter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Friday, July 27, 2007 11:38 am
Subject: Re: Bridgestone Ecopia EP-03 Tires
To: EV List <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
> It was just brought to my attention that the Ecopia's
> I'm trying to get are load rated 89S or 1279lbs!
> That's a lot for a 14" tire.
>
> Rick
>
>
>
> ____________________________________________________________________________________
> Need a vacation? Get great deals
> to amazing places on Yahoo! Travel.
> http://travel.yahoo.com/
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hello Paul,
You do not need the ring gear. It will just press off. For spacing any
flywheel, go to a transmission shop and pick up a flywheel shim that fits
between the motor coupler and flywheel. You get these shims in any
thickness.
Yes, you can thin down the flywheel if its made of forge steel, not cast. I
have my flywheel reduce from 1.5 inch to about 3/4 inch.
Most of this material was at the edge of the flywheel which was step to hole
the ring gear. The center of the flywheel was at about 3/4 inch anyway.
Roland
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Friday, July 27, 2007 6:11 PM
Subject: Re: Air-cooled VW to 8" Motor adaptor plate Question
> I see this is lacking responses. I don't have one apart at this time
> but I have in the past...
>
> On Jul 24, 2007, at 11:59 PM, Mike Willmon wrote:
>
> > The stock flywheel seems to have to set down about ~3/8" into the
> > housing with about an RCH clearance. I mean its pretty tight.
> > The flywheel doesn't seem to be perfectly true or else the
> > alignment holes are not prefectly true on center because it rubs the
> > housing. We wound up trying 3 different flywheels as well as
> > rotating them 90 degrees until just about the last one fit and
> > didn't rub the side of the adaptor housing. So has anyone done a
> > Bug that can tell us if the flywheel is supposed to sit down
> > inside that housing, or are we mounting it in too far? If it is
> > supposed to fit inside somewhat, is there any problem turning off
> > the ring gear as well as .125" off the OD.
>
> The Beetle flywheel sits just *slightly* inside the stock engine
> case. The amount is not very much, I don't think any part of the
> flywheel is outside the face of the transaxle (in other words, its
> inside by less than the thickness of the centering ring on the back
> of the engine.) The ring gear should be completely inside the transaxle.
>
> You mentioned that one flywheel fit. You should make sure its not a
> 180mm clutch flywheel. That's no fair and no good (they have enough
> trouble with later stock VW engines, that's why VW went to a 200mm
> clutch.)
>
> > While we got one iteration of our different fitments to work
> > without rubbing I'm concerned that the weight of the motor hanging
> > unsupported off the transaxle might set down on the flywheel
> > causing it to rub again. Would .125" off the O.D. be sufficient
> > clearance?
>
> Things here better not be moving! The Beetle had no problem hanging a
> 247 lb. engine off the back of the transaxle. Shake, rattle, and
> roll, it was never a problem (unless someone didn't tighten the
> bolts!) When grinding out a 40HP tranny to fit a 200mm clutch
> flywheel its not uncommon to stop grinding with only 0.01 inch of
> clearance for the larger ring gear.
>
> HTH,
> Paul "neon" Gooch
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hey Jim,
I have dealt with tech support at Lester several times on non-SCR
chargers. I would suggest giving them a call. Their main person at
tech support
is a great guy( I think his name is George) who answered all my
stupid questions about using and troubleshooting a 20 year old Lester
120V charger that I was trying to use with nicads.
He was kind enough to FAX me all the operating info plus a schematic
and troubleshooting guide. Then he told me what pins to check for
component testing over the phone. Their parts are relatively
reasonable and are worth the price of the free support.
I am sure he would be happy to answer your questions AND they
occasionally have old stock and prototypes available.
Lester makes a big heavy charger but it is relatively efficient and
is a great domestic manufacturer to do business with!
Tom
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Curtis recommends a 750 ohm (25w) precharge resistor for a 1231C. Since it
is permanently connected across the contacts of the main contactor, it seems
like there would be a slow drain on the HV pack, even when the contactor is
OPEN. What am I missing here?
Roger Daisley
Pullman, WA
http://www.96-volt.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hey all
Being that lots of folks made the trek to PIR for the
Wayland invitational and being that it falls just a
month before the Nationals, I feel it makes it a bit
tougher to rally up the troops to come out and support
the group again. As this is NEDRA's 10th year (a
banner year at that!) anniversery I feel that it
should be supported and recognized for the efforts
made by those who have all helped to make doing an EV
convertion better, faster, and safer by pushing things
at the track and developing better ways to do things
8^)
With that said I was hoping to do more than the small
6.7" motor that I try to donate to the NEDRA events
8^) but I didn't have anything I could part with
larger than than a 6.7" 8^(
Last week Wayland calls me up and tells me that Tim
Brehm saw some motors in the scrap bin and shot him a
call (my ears perk up and I'm like ooH, do tell 8^)
Turns out John fetched out 5 motors for me! Four of
these are 7.5" X 13" Crown drive motors, two are
sep-ex and two are series wound. I'm going to be
stuffing an L91 shaft (old ones out already) into one
of the series wound motors and work it up so NEDRA can
raffle it off 8^)
For those wanting facts I took some measurements 8^P
The armature is a 45 bar /slot and wound with .090 X
.200 wire and the lamination body is 4.75" X 4.75".
The coils are 12 turn wound with .070 X .500 wire.
These Crowns are modeled after the ADC's and in fact
use the same brushes and these are an 8 brushed motor.
The total weight is 80 lbs. and is a lot more motor
than the 50 lbs 6.7" I've been doing.
Being that Tim and John look out for their little
motor buddy (thanks guys 8^) they have allowed me to
supply a lot nicer gift in support of the great work
this orginazation has done 8^) In fact this should be
looked at like a Plasma Torqued sponsored motor 8^o
I'll be posting pics soon. It isn't an MTC but I've
seen people using smaller motors than this in small
cars, if nothing else it'd be a nice beefy MC motor
although if Rod wins it it'll be on a scooter, LMAO.
I hate to say it but I'm still not even a NEDRA member
yet but I do what I can to help the guys out so they
can try to at least make ends meet and I'm calling you
all out to come help to 8^)
I'll end with this, you do not need to be a racer to
come out and help. In fact what I don't see is the
daily driver clubs who might have pamplets to hand out
to the public. Mike Willmon made some up and he was
handing them out like crazy 8^) I'm guilty of this
also though 8^(
The people asking questions want to know about where
and how they can learn about doing a daily driver.
Here's where the racers "wow" them but there needs to
be more advertising and instructions about how to and
where to start than is there right now IMO. In short,
if nothing else the more bodies that are there talking
to the public the more we are heard 8^)
I hope that this might help push anyone that's
teetering on the fence on whether or not they will
make the effort to attend, over to the attend side 8^)
Somebody's going to be taking it home, why not you~!
Hope to see EVeryone there.
Jim Husted
Hi-Torque Electric
____________________________________________________________________________________
Got a little couch potato?
Check out fun summer activities for kids.
http://search.yahoo.com/search?fr=oni_on_mail&p=summer+activities+for+kids&cs=bz
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
--- Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I'll be releasing them for general sale in about 4
> weeks.
> John got to give me a feedback first...
>
> Victor
Hey Victor
If it can survive Wayland you're golden 8^) I'm
guessing you or Tim put it in or he'd have broke it
already ;^)
Congrats on developing what looks like an awesome
unit, I wish you much success with it and it's a total
win, win, for both you and EVeryone with an EV.
Anyway I just got this picture of you as you
pondered... who can I get to try and break it, LMAO!
Just one answer, hehe.
Cya
Jim Husted
Hi-Torque Electric
____________________________________________________________________________________
Moody friends. Drama queens. Your life? Nope! - their life, your story. Play
Sims Stories at Yahoo! Games.
http://sims.yahoo.com/
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Roland,
I was the one that originally posed the question. The ring gear is cut into
the flywheel, which apears to be forged. We'll have
to turn the teeth off so I was wondering if it would hurt to turn down another
.125" off the OD. This would still leave enough
meat for the pressure plate bolts and prevent any rubbing of te flywheel on the
adaptor plate..
To Paul's question back to me, all of the flywheels that Bart had are 200mm.
Just one in particular didn't rub as much and we
were able to tap the adaptor plate enough with a rubber mallet before we
tightened it to get all the flywheel to clear the plate.
It seems like maybe the holes inthe adaptor and/or the alighment bolts on the
flywheel were a couple thou off. There was little
(not much but a little) play in the adaptor plate before we tightened it onto
the motor. It clears now so we'll see if it stays
centered while its bouncing around unsupported off the back end.
Thanks
Mike,
Anchorage, Ak.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Behalf Of Roland Wiench
> Sent: Friday, July 27, 2007 4:55 PM
> To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
> Subject: Re: Air-cooled VW to 8" Motor adaptor plate Question
>
>
> Hello Paul,
>
> You do not need the ring gear. It will just press off. For spacing any
> flywheel, go to a transmission shop and pick up a flywheel shim that fits
> between the motor coupler and flywheel. You get these shims in any
> thickness.
>
> Yes, you can thin down the flywheel if its made of forge steel, not cast. I
> have my flywheel reduce from 1.5 inch to about 3/4 inch.
> Most of this material was at the edge of the flywheel which was step to hole
> the ring gear. The center of the flywheel was at about 3/4 inch anyway.
>
> Roland
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I may have missed something in the emails flying by,
but why is this called a raffle motor? Is it only
available to those that attend the event? If not,
here's my suggestion.
Set up a NEDRA paypal account for those that can't
attend, but are willing to contribute $5 or so bucks
towards the raffle. There are hundreds of people on
this list, and I would think many would be willing to
put up some cash to win one of your motors Jim. Time
to expand the bidding?
Maybe Chip Gribben or somebody that has internet
skills could make this raffle much bigger and more
exciting to the people on this list! Maybe we could
even have an extra check box like the DMV that
contributes to John's bigger lithium pack?
Thanks,
Rod
--- Jim Husted <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hey all
>
> Being that lots of folks made the trek to PIR for
> the
> Wayland invitational and being that it falls just a
> month before the Nationals, I feel it makes it a bit
> tougher to rally up the troops to come out and
> support
> the group again. As this is NEDRA's 10th year (a
> banner year at that!) anniversery I feel that it
> should be supported and recognized for the efforts
> made by those who have all helped to make doing an
> EV
> convertion better, faster, and safer by pushing
> things
> at the track and developing better ways to do things
> 8^)
>
> With that said I was hoping to do more than the
> small
> 6.7" motor that I try to donate to the NEDRA events
> 8^) but I didn't have anything I could part with
> larger than than a 6.7" 8^(
>
> Last week Wayland calls me up and tells me that Tim
> Brehm saw some motors in the scrap bin and shot him
> a
> call (my ears perk up and I'm like ooH, do tell 8^)
> Turns out John fetched out 5 motors for me! Four of
> these are 7.5" X 13" Crown drive motors, two are
> sep-ex and two are series wound. I'm going to be
> stuffing an L91 shaft (old ones out already) into
> one
> of the series wound motors and work it up so NEDRA
> can
> raffle it off 8^)
>
> For those wanting facts I took some measurements 8^P
> The armature is a 45 bar /slot and wound with .090 X
> .200 wire and the lamination body is 4.75" X 4.75".
> The coils are 12 turn wound with .070 X .500 wire.
> These Crowns are modeled after the ADC's and in fact
> use the same brushes and these are an 8 brushed
> motor.
> The total weight is 80 lbs. and is a lot more motor
> than the 50 lbs 6.7" I've been doing.
>
> Being that Tim and John look out for their little
> motor buddy (thanks guys 8^) they have allowed me to
> supply a lot nicer gift in support of the great work
> this orginazation has done 8^) In fact this should
> be
> looked at like a Plasma Torqued sponsored motor 8^o
>
> I'll be posting pics soon. It isn't an MTC but I've
> seen people using smaller motors than this in small
> cars, if nothing else it'd be a nice beefy MC motor
> although if Rod wins it it'll be on a scooter, LMAO.
> I hate to say it but I'm still not even a NEDRA
> member
> yet but I do what I can to help the guys out so they
> can try to at least make ends meet and I'm calling
> you
> all out to come help to 8^)
>
> I'll end with this, you do not need to be a racer to
> come out and help. In fact what I don't see is the
> daily driver clubs who might have pamplets to hand
> out
> to the public. Mike Willmon made some up and he was
> handing them out like crazy 8^) I'm guilty of this
> also though 8^(
>
> The people asking questions want to know about where
> and how they can learn about doing a daily driver.
> Here's where the racers "wow" them but there needs
> to
> be more advertising and instructions about how to
> and
> where to start than is there right now IMO. In
> short,
> if nothing else the more bodies that are there
> talking
> to the public the more we are heard 8^)
>
> I hope that this might help push anyone that's
> teetering on the fence on whether or not they will
> make the effort to attend, over to the attend side
> 8^)
>
> Somebody's going to be taking it home, why not you~!
> Hope to see EVeryone there.
> Jim Husted
> Hi-Torque Electric
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________________
> Got a little couch potato?
> Check out fun summer activities for kids.
>
http://search.yahoo.com/search?fr=oni_on_mail&p=summer+activities+for+kids&cs=bz
>
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I'd certainly buy a ticket or two..... Not that I've
ever, ever won anything in my life, someone make this
happen.
--- Rod Hower <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I may have missed something in the emails flying by,
> but why is this called a raffle motor? Is it only
> available to those that attend the event? If not,
> here's my suggestion.
> Set up a NEDRA paypal account for those that can't
> attend, but are willing to contribute $5 or so bucks
> towards the raffle. There are hundreds of people on
> this list, and I would think many would be willing
> to
> put up some cash to win one of your motors Jim.
> Time
> to expand the bidding?
> Maybe Chip Gribben or somebody that has internet
> skills could make this raffle much bigger and more
> exciting to the people on this list! Maybe we could
> even have an extra check box like the DMV that
> contributes to John's bigger lithium pack?
> Thanks,
> Rod
> --- Jim Husted <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > Hey all
> >
> > Being that lots of folks made the trek to PIR for
> > the
> > Wayland invitational and being that it falls just
> a
> > month before the Nationals, I feel it makes it a
> bit
> > tougher to rally up the troops to come out and
> > support
> > the group again. As this is NEDRA's 10th year (a
> > banner year at that!) anniversery I feel that it
> > should be supported and recognized for the efforts
> > made by those who have all helped to make doing an
> > EV
> > convertion better, faster, and safer by pushing
> > things
> > at the track and developing better ways to do
> things
> > 8^)
> >
> > With that said I was hoping to do more than the
> > small
> > 6.7" motor that I try to donate to the NEDRA
> events
> > 8^) but I didn't have anything I could part with
> > larger than than a 6.7" 8^(
> >
> > Last week Wayland calls me up and tells me that
> Tim
> > Brehm saw some motors in the scrap bin and shot
> him
> > a
> > call (my ears perk up and I'm like ooH, do tell
> 8^)
> > Turns out John fetched out 5 motors for me! Four
> of
> > these are 7.5" X 13" Crown drive motors, two are
> > sep-ex and two are series wound. I'm going to be
> > stuffing an L91 shaft (old ones out already) into
> > one
> > of the series wound motors and work it up so NEDRA
> > can
> > raffle it off 8^)
> >
> > For those wanting facts I took some measurements
> 8^P
> > The armature is a 45 bar /slot and wound with .090
> X
> > .200 wire and the lamination body is 4.75" X
> 4.75".
> > The coils are 12 turn wound with .070 X .500 wire.
>
> > These Crowns are modeled after the ADC's and in
> fact
> > use the same brushes and these are an 8 brushed
> > motor.
> > The total weight is 80 lbs. and is a lot more
> motor
> > than the 50 lbs 6.7" I've been doing.
> >
> > Being that Tim and John look out for their little
> > motor buddy (thanks guys 8^) they have allowed me
> to
> > supply a lot nicer gift in support of the great
> work
> > this orginazation has done 8^) In fact this
> should
> > be
> > looked at like a Plasma Torqued sponsored motor
> 8^o
> >
> > I'll be posting pics soon. It isn't an MTC but
> I've
> > seen people using smaller motors than this in
> small
> > cars, if nothing else it'd be a nice beefy MC
> motor
> > although if Rod wins it it'll be on a scooter,
> LMAO.
> > I hate to say it but I'm still not even a NEDRA
> > member
> > yet but I do what I can to help the guys out so
> they
> > can try to at least make ends meet and I'm calling
> > you
> > all out to come help to 8^)
> >
> > I'll end with this, you do not need to be a racer
> to
> > come out and help. In fact what I don't see is
> the
> > daily driver clubs who might have pamplets to hand
> > out
> > to the public. Mike Willmon made some up and he
> was
> > handing them out like crazy 8^) I'm guilty of
> this
> > also though 8^(
> >
> > The people asking questions want to know about
> where
> > and how they can learn about doing a daily driver.
>
> > Here's where the racers "wow" them but there needs
> > to
> > be more advertising and instructions about how to
> > and
> > where to start than is there right now IMO. In
> > short,
> > if nothing else the more bodies that are there
> > talking
> > to the public the more we are heard 8^)
> >
> > I hope that this might help push anyone that's
> > teetering on the fence on whether or not they will
> > make the effort to attend, over to the attend side
> > 8^)
> >
> > Somebody's going to be taking it home, why not
> you~!
> > Hope to see EVeryone there.
> > Jim Husted
> > Hi-Torque Electric
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
____________________________________________________________________________________
> > Got a little couch potato?
> > Check out fun summer activities for kids.
> >
>
http://search.yahoo.com/search?fr=oni_on_mail&p=summer+activities+for+kids&cs=bz
> >
> >
> >
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
G'day All
First up: Maritime College project motor (I sponsored a student project of
the Australian Maritime College by re-building a motor with lots of sensors
and fields able to be reconfigured three ways).
We've had it on a pony brake dyno (a manually operated disc brake with a
newtons-scale meter on it to determine torque). The motor was able to drive
the scale to about 3.6kW out at about 75% efficiency (although the readings
were a bit quick so a better statement would be 70 to 80% efficiency). Far
too much for the poor disk brake, so only 30 seconds run at a time.
The motor has a pair of boat 'bilge blowers' as the cooling. Rotor heat is
a lot more than fields, going by the short runs we had. A clear window
where the brush timing lever sticks out really shows the effect of moving
the timing (like at 250A and neutral timing shows arcing from the edge of
the brush holder to the comm riser, due to a close clearance from part of
the modifications, goes away when the timing is advanced).
Their techs are out of time so they're paying me to wire up the control
system, but they've dumped other problems on me to sort out (like supplying
a wooden box with a flap lid to put it into, then saying "do what you need
to without spending too much.." Aaargh, they've just blown the budget by
needing to buy/build a real box!)
Second (re-starting of a previous thought path)
For their boat I've knocked up a 'pot-box' by taking the gearbox off a
little laboratory pump, in order to rotate a pot all the way from a limited
rotation arm.
This brings me back to an earlier thought of designing a kit of bits that
can be lazer cut to assemble a potbox from, with holes in all the right
places to assemble left or right handed, limit switches when/where needed,
etc.
As I see it the limitations of a Curtis-type potbox are as follows:
* There is a requirement for a special pot
* there is nowhere on the potbox to attach the sheath (outer) of the
control cable
* you have to decide ahead of time as to left or right handed, with or
without a limit switch
* the lever arm pick-up point is a "pick-a-hole" which may not get ideal
positioning, although I haven't heard anyone comment on this.
For my "kit" design I would look at:
* Since it would only rotate the pot a maximum of 90 degrees, for a Zilla
(which needs three wires) a suitable automotive throttle-body pot would be
needed. For a Curtis (which needs two wires) instead of a 5k pot rotating
270 degrees, a 20k pot rotated 67.5 degrees or a 25k pot rotated 54 degrees
will do instead. The kit parts would have holes to install whatever was
needed, although I haven't worked out the requirements for a throttle-body
pot yet.
* holes to insert end-of-travel stops to suit the various pot rotation
requirements
* the lever arm would have a series of slots rather than holes to attach
the cable to (or just a series of holes that are in two or three lines,
close enough together so that they overlap a little)
* The kit design would include a 'horn' either as part of the front plate,
or mountable to it, that gives a place to attach the cable outer to,
possibly slotted with a clamp to get a good alignment to the lever arm and
* a second 'horn' to connect the return spring to with a set of holes to
hook the springs into (so that the user can find easily-found extension
springs to use to set the throttle "weight" rather than an
around-in-a-circle spring to set the return 'weight'
* pre-positioned holes to mount standard miniature type micro switches in
various locations for zero throttle and full throttle mounting when required
As a one-off it'd be a bit expensive, but if I can sell/trade others it'd
be worth while.
Comments/opinions/4" x 2"?
Regards
[Technik] James
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
--- Rod Hower <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Maybe we could
> even have an extra check box like the DMV that
> contributes to John's bigger lithium pack?
> Thanks,
> Rod
I like this idea! It would be nice to have a couple
hundred more pounds of A123's for traction and 1400
additional amps to feed a second Z2K. Too bad we had
to give them back to Bill.
Tim
____________________________________________________________________________________
Pinpoint customers who are looking for what you sell.
http://searchmarketing.yahoo.com/
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hello Mike,
I just went to measure the pressure plate hole in my flywheel to the edge of
the fly wheel. It now reads 0.29 inches. The edge of the pressure plate is
right at the edge of the flywheel. So to go more, a person would have to
bolt on the pressure plate and turn down both together.
I would say that another 0.125 inch off may work. The bolt holes on my
large flange coupler on the motor is only 0.0626 from the edge of the
coupler and it held up for over 30 years now.
Roland
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Willmon" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Friday, July 27, 2007 8:18 PM
Subject: RE: Air-cooled VW to 8" Motor adaptor plate Question
> Roland,
> I was the one that originally posed the question. The ring gear is cut
> into the flywheel, which apears to be forged. We'll have
> to turn the teeth off so I was wondering if it would hurt to turn down
> another .125" off the OD. This would still leave enough
> meat for the pressure plate bolts and prevent any rubbing of te flywheel
> on the adaptor plate..
>
> To Paul's question back to me, all of the flywheels that Bart had are
> 200mm. Just one in particular didn't rub as much and we
> were able to tap the adaptor plate enough with a rubber mallet before we
> tightened it to get all the flywheel to clear the plate.
> It seems like maybe the holes inthe adaptor and/or the alighment bolts on
> the flywheel were a couple thou off. There was little
> (not much but a little) play in the adaptor plate before we tightened it
> onto the motor. It clears now so we'll see if it stays
> centered while its bouncing around unsupported off the back end.
> Thanks
> Mike,
> Anchorage, Ak.
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Behalf Of Roland Wiench
> > Sent: Friday, July 27, 2007 4:55 PM
> > To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
> > Subject: Re: Air-cooled VW to 8" Motor adaptor plate Question
> >
> >
> > Hello Paul,
> >
> > You do not need the ring gear. It will just press off. For spacing any
> > flywheel, go to a transmission shop and pick up a flywheel shim that
> > fits
> > between the motor coupler and flywheel. You get these shims in any
> > thickness.
> >
> > Yes, you can thin down the flywheel if its made of forge steel, not
> > cast. I
> > have my flywheel reduce from 1.5 inch to about 3/4 inch.
> > Most of this material was at the edge of the flywheel which was step to
> > hole
> > the ring gear. The center of the flywheel was at about 3/4 inch anyway.
> >
> > Roland
> >
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Oh, I am SOOOOO there!
On Jul 27, 2007, at 6:59 PM, Jim Husted wrote:
With that said I was hoping to do more than the small
6.7" motor that I try to donate to the NEDRA events
8^) but I didn't have anything I could part with
larger than than a 6.7" 8^(
Last week Wayland calls me up and tells me that Tim
Brehm saw some motors in the scrap bin and shot him a
call (my ears perk up and I'm like ooH, do tell 8^)
Turns out John fetched out 5 motors for me! Four of
these are 7.5" X 13" Crown drive motors, two are
sep-ex and two are series wound. I'm going to be
stuffing an L91 shaft (old ones out already) into one
of the series wound motors and work it up so NEDRA can
raffle it off 8^)
Well, I was there anyway and now my arm is hurting (quit twisting so
hard ;-)
Paul
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hey Chip, Brian, FT
You boys got your ears on? This is (will be) NEDRA's
motor to do as they see fit.
Couple of issues to address though if it went to a
don't have to be present to win raffle. One, it lets
you lazy bums sit on the couch reading posts and not
come out and have some fun, LMAO 8^P
Another is, it'd have to end before the event so if
the winner is present he doesn't have to wait and
occur freight etc. Freight would have to come from
winner or maybe NEDRA if they just raked in the bucks
by the wheelbarrows 8^)
And last, how to combine the online and present
tickets and draw the winner. None of these are to big
an issue but would need to be addressed and a NEDRA
body would need to take charge of this.
As stated, this could bring far more dollars in for
NEDRA if they are into it. If this doesn't pan out
for this event maybe I'll offer one later that could
be an online only raffle as a thought.
Hell I wish I had a motor this nice to play with 8^)
EVery time I build one up some bastard comes along and
takes it from me 8^(
For those who say they never win anything though, I
won an awesome Ebike that Brian Hall had brought up to
raffle at the event last year 8^) Never know if you
don't go 8^P
Anyway thanks for the ideas and support! In fact no
one from NEDRA has contacted me for this years
sponsoring so I'm getting the cart in front of the
horse being they're slow asses 8^o at least when they
aren't on the track 8^)
Cya
Jim Husted
Hi-Torque Electric
--- Michael Barkley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I'd certainly buy a ticket or two..... Not that I've
> ever, ever won anything in my life, someone make
> this
> happen.
>
>
> --- Rod Hower <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > I may have missed something in the emails flying
> by,
> > but why is this called a raffle motor? Is it only
> > available to those that attend the event? If not,
> > here's my suggestion.
> > Set up a NEDRA paypal account for those that can't
> > attend, but are willing to contribute $5 or so
> bucks
> > towards the raffle. There are hundreds of people
> on
> > this list, and I would think many would be willing
> > to
> > put up some cash to win one of your motors Jim.
> > Time
> > to expand the bidding?
> > Maybe Chip Gribben or somebody that has internet
> > skills could make this raffle much bigger and more
> > exciting to the people on this list! Maybe we
> could
> > even have an extra check box like the DMV that
> > contributes to John's bigger lithium pack?
> > Thanks,
> > Rod
____________________________________________________________________________________
Got a little couch potato?
Check out fun summer activities for kids.
http://search.yahoo.com/search?fr=oni_on_mail&p=summer+activities+for+kids&cs=bz
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Tire rolling resistance relative to width.
Because the narrower tire ends up with more weight per square inch and
an therefore a larger flatspot and higher force to multiply by the
friction coeffient it tends to balance out with the narrower but longer
patch. But a large change either direction from optimal is noticable.
My friends raced a highly prepared honda civic in SCCA with cantaliver
tires. These 2 brothers did this as a hobby after their first jobs of
being on the NISSAN race team (1 driver, 1 mechanic type) Anyhow, they
really did a lot of testing. The wider tires add wind resistance and
rotateing mass and wouldn't warm up and stick, the narrower tires were
over heated and slid around to much. Their was an optimum point.
Test it. :-(
The key to a low rolling resistance tire is not as simple as people
assume. Mainly a more flexible rubber that doesn't just rub off by
adding silica, the ability to be kept rounder with more air pressure
without being made stiffer by using a higher thread count of more
flexible threads in the casing and a diagonal ply arrangement on the
side-walls to allow them to flex without absorbing too much energy. As
the tire goes around the side walls are forced to flex and unflex and
the road pushing against the rolling tire forming a teardrop distortion
that adds drag. The addition of silica also gives the rubber an
interesting property kinda like old car wax in reverse. As it is sheared
off,it's coefficient of friction increases.
The Caseing is really important, it is a waste of time to put fancy
rubber on a poor foundation. Once you have a good foundation they even
have tried variable chemistries in a tire. a stripe down the center
having a higher silica content than the edges. As brakes are applied or
the vehicle corners hard, the grip goes up.
Ground level Ozone hurts rubber. What use to last 10 years lasts 5 now!
DOT* Race tires where it really matters are wrapped, are almost not
saleable after a year. They and usully mounted and shaved on a lathe
before use(this takes of about 1/2 the tread, getting rid of the rubber
on the surface that is contaminated with mold release and makes the
tread stiffer so it lasts longer. go figure)
DOT* Department of transportation. Tires approved for use on roads but
have really soft rubber on them and are used for SCCA racing.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
At 06:22 PM 27/07/07 -0700, Roger Daisley wrote:
Curtis recommends a 750 ohm (25w) precharge resistor for a 1231C. Since it
is permanently connected across the contacts of the main contactor, it seems
like there would be a slow drain on the HV pack, even when the contactor is
OPEN. What am I missing here?
G'day Roger
The Curtis instructions are essentially the minimum needed to see out the
warranty period. For safety you should have a contactor in the B- cable
(switched directly from the 'ignition'), and a relay in the precharge
resistor lead that is controlled the same. B+ contactor needs to be turned
on after pre-charge time.
Many (if not the majority) of Curtis controllers are in forklifts and
similar equipment where the batteries are unplugged from the equipment and
plugged into the charger at the end of each day - so the 'resistor across
the contacts' method is no problem.
One way of controlling the B+ contactor is with a latching relay that is
turned on by the "start" position of the 'ignition' key, dropped out when
you turn the 'ignition' off.
View with fixed-width font:
+12V
Start
|_____ +12V
| 'ignition'
| |
____|__ |
|_ | |
__| @|| o |
| @|| \ |
| _@|| o o |
| | |_______|
| |
| 12V
| neg
|
|________
@|| B+
@|| contactor
_@|| coil
|
12V neg
Another way is to build an automatic pre-charge module that turns on the B+
contactor once the voltage across the resistor is below a certain voltage.
I'm in process of adapting a design that Otmar was kind enough to send me
that he used to make for Curtis controllers. The adapting is to make it to
be available as a kit or pre-built module - but don't hold your breath for
it, though, as it's an as-when job so may not be ready for months yet.
Hope this helps
Regards
[Technik] James
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I had talked with them early, when they would talk to us normal people.
and Since then,via email, to the factory in china that claims to make
the cells for them until they get their own plant going and in both
conversations they have said Lithium-Iron-Phosphate.
But it is easier than this to check. Get out your voltmeter.
Lithium cobalt 3.6Vnominal 4.25Max charge
Lithium Iron Phosphate 3.2-3.4 3.7 max charge (Easy to tell)
Lithium-magenese 3.7-3.8 Nominal 4.2Max charge (ok, hard to tell
compared to cobalt)
http://www.batteryuniversity.com/partone-5A.htm
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
--- Rod Hower <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Set up a NEDRA paypal account for those that can't
> attend, but are willing to contribute $5 or so bucks
> towards the raffle. There are hundreds of people on
> this list, and I would think many would be willing to
> put up some cash to win one of your motors Jim. Time
> to expand the bidding?
I'm in! On race day print the list of online bidders and have some one fill out
raffle ticket.
Then throw them in the hat with the rest.
Dave Cover
--- End Message ---
