Re: [EVDL] [GGEVA] CPUC meeting via the web. Concerning expensive fees to kill solar. (j...@k6ccc.org)
I think this is the missing file from my computer. Sorry for that Lawrence Rhodes https://www.cpuc.ca.gov/nemrevisit ___ Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org No other addresses in TO and CC fields UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ LIST INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org
Re: [EVDL] [GGEVA] CPUC meeting via the web. Concerning expensive fees to kill solar.
A good cause, but suboptimal in light of a raging pandemic. - Mark Sent from my Fuel Cell powered iPhone > On Jan 5, 2022, at 2:49 PM, cleanair--- via EV wrote: > > A gathering in front of the SF CPUC office is scheduled to protest the > increase.Hope to see some familiar faces. > Danny > -- > 2) Join us on January 13th in Los Angeles and San Francisco. The news media > is our best megaphone. They covered our 300-foot long Huntington Beach sand > protest and our 200-person human billboard in Sacramento. Now we want to > stage a 1,000+ demonstration of consumers, solar workers and community > leaders to send the ultimate SOS message to our Governor: "Save Our Solar". > Sign up > -- > Save Our Solar Rally - San Francisco (CPUC Building) and Los Angeles > (Pershing Square) January 13 at 11 a.m. > > Stand up for your right to make energy from the sun! > > | > | > | > | | | > > | > > | > | > | | > Stand up for your right to make energy from the sun! > > You have the right to make solar energy on your property, without > unreasonable interference by the utility or th... > | > > | > > | > > > > > > ------ next part -- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: > <http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20220105/cafe2c7c/attachment.html> > ___ > Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org > No other addresses in TO and CC fields > UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub > ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ > LIST INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org > ___ Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org No other addresses in TO and CC fields UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ LIST INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org
[EVDL] EVLN: Fiat hops in bed with Amazon
I wonder which one will lie back and think of England. Rivian may still supply some EVs to Amazon. But they will not be an exclusive supplier. Amazon are also buying more of the "Stellantis" (Fiat) trucks that their drivers report regularly fail them (Fix It Again, Tony) - except that they'll have motors and batteries instead of engines and gas tanks. I guess that's good, for some definition of "good." Also, it appears that Fiat will be sending your vehicle data, which they already collect behind your back, to Amazon Web Services. Say hallelujah. https://www.cnbc.com/2022/01/05/rivian-stock-plunges-after-news-of-amazon- stellantis-deal.html If that link is borked: https://v.gd/c50tRu David Roden, EVDL moderator & general lackey To reach me, don't reply to this message; I won't get it. Use my offlist address here : http://evdl.org/help/index.html#supt = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = I think [Rio de Janeiro mayor Marcelo] Crivella will be remembered as a mayor to be forgotten. -- Alvaro Costa e Silva = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = ___ Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org No other addresses in TO and CC fields UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ LIST INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org
[EVDL] LIST BUSINESS - addresses - please read (short)
I had to reject a couple of messages today because non-list email addresses were in the CC and/or TO fields. Sorry, but would you want someone revealing your email address to 650 people you don't know? I thought not. Therefore, please don't do that. Address EV list messages TO ev@lists.evdl.org - and nowhere else, please. However, you can put any other address(se) you want in the BCC field. The listserver ignores it. David Roden, EVDL moderator & general lackey To reach me, don't reply to this message; I won't get it. Use my offlist address here : http://evdl.org/help/index.html#supt = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = If the environment were a bank, it would have been saved already. -- Bernie Sanders = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = ___ Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org No other addresses in TO and CC fields UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ LIST INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org
Re: [EVDL] [GGEVA] CPUC meeting via the web. Concerning expensive fees to kill solar.
A gathering in front of the SF CPUC office is scheduled to protest the increase.Hope to see some familiar faces. Danny -- 2) Join us on January 13th in Los Angeles and San Francisco. The news media is our best megaphone. They covered our 300-foot long Huntington Beach sand protest and our 200-person human billboard in Sacramento. Now we want to stage a 1,000+ demonstration of consumers, solar workers and community leaders to send the ultimate SOS message to our Governor: "Save Our Solar". Sign up -- Save Our Solar Rally - San Francisco (CPUC Building) and Los Angeles (Pershing Square) January 13 at 11 a.m. Stand up for your right to make energy from the sun! | | | | | | | | | | | Stand up for your right to make energy from the sun! You have the right to make solar energy on your property, without unreasonable interference by the utility or th... | | | -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20220105/cafe2c7c/attachment.html> ___ Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org No other addresses in TO and CC fields UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ LIST INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org
Re: [EVDL] CPUC meeting via the web. Concerning expensive fees to kill solar.
I think that you are mistaken. The comment period ends mid-month, and then there will be a round of reply comments. - Mark Sent from my Fuel Cell powered iPhone > On Jan 5, 2022, at 12:01 PM, Lawrence Rhodes via EV wrote: > > Please do your part to complain about these proposed fees. If this goes > through, what is the point of having solar...I will disconnect from the grid > and get batteries. > https://www.cpuc.ca.gov/events-and-meetings/cpuc-voting-meeting-01-13-2022 > This is the link for a meeting of the CPUC over proposed fees for owning and > connecting solar to the grid. A lot of buried information that must be sorted > through. Below links to contact board members which is not obvious. Lawrence > Rhodes > > https://apps.cpuc.ca.gov/apex/f?p=401%3A56%3A0%3A%3ANO%3ARP%2C57%2CRIR%3AP5_PROCEEDING_SELECT%3AR2008020 > comment link. Couldn't figure it out. > Parties: https://ia.cpuc.ca.gov/servicelists/R2008020_88217.htm > ___ > Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org > No other addresses in TO and CC fields > UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub > ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ > LIST INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org > ___ Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org No other addresses in TO and CC fields UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ LIST INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org
Re: [EVDL] [GGEVA] CPUC meeting via the web. Concerning expensive fees to kill solar.
That's the agenda I went through and couldn't find it. I also went through most of the docs that pop up by searching on the meeting date. On Wed, Jan 5, 2022 at 12:53 PM (-pEEf-) via EV wrote: > Yeah, You are right Jim, Here's the Agenda for the 13th: > > https://docs.cpuc.ca.gov/SearchRes.aspx?DocTypeID=1&DocTitleStart=Current%20Meeting%20Agenda&Latest=1 > > On Wed, Jan 5, 2022 at 12:49 PM jim--- via EV wrote: > > > The file location you posted is on your hard drive. Not available to us. > > > > And I can't find anything on the agenda related to solar. > > > > Jim > > > > > > > > > > -Original Message- > > From: "Lawrence Rhodes via EV" > > Sent: Wednesday, January 5, 2022 12:44 > > To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" > > Cc: "Lawrence Rhodes" > > Subject: Re: [EVDL] [GGEVA] CPUC meeting via the web. Concerning > expensive > > fees to kill solar. > > > > file:///C:/Users/owner/Downloads/371909265.PDF This is the .pdf of the > > tarrif(tax) on solar proposal. It is a complicated document which I have > > only started to go through. Couldn't find the fee structure. Lawrence > Rhodes > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Wednesday, January 5, 2022, 12:01:07 PM PST, Lawrence Rhodes < > > primobass...@sbcglobal.net> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Please do your part to complain about these proposed fees. If this goes > > through, what is the point of having solar...I will disconnect from the > > grid and get batteries. > > > https://www.cpuc.ca.gov/events-and-meetings/cpuc-voting-meeting-01-13-2022 > > This is the link for a meeting of the CPUC over proposed fees for owning > > and connecting solar to the grid. A lot of buried information that must > be > > sorted through. Below links to contact board members which is not > obvious. > > Lawrence Rhodes > > > > > > > https://apps.cpuc.ca.gov/apex/f?p=401%3A56%3A0%3A%3ANO%3ARP%2C57%2CRIR%3AP5_PROCEEDING_SELECT%3AR2008020 > > comment link. Couldn't figure it out. > > Parties: https://ia.cpuc.ca.gov/servicelists/R2008020_88217.htm > > > > > > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- > > Groups.io Links: You receive all messages sent to this group. > > View/Reply Online (#887): https://groups.io/g/GGEVA/message/887 > > Mute This Topic: https://groups.io/mt/88222411/2384437 > > Group Owner: ggeva+ow...@groups.io > > Unsubscribe: > > https://groups.io/g/GGEVA/leave/10047416/2384437/1584999544/xyzzy [ > > primobass...@sbcglobal.net] > > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- > > > > > > ___ > > Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org > > No other addresses in TO and CC fields > > UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub > > ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ > > LIST INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org > > > > > > ___ > > Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org > > No other addresses in TO and CC fields > > UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub > > ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ > > LIST INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org > > > -- next part -- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: < > http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20220105/81a42faa/attachment.html > > > ___ > Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org > No other addresses in TO and CC fields > UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub > ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ > LIST INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org > -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20220105/e73c18f7/attachment.html> ___ Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org No other addresses in TO and CC fields UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ LIST INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org
Re: [EVDL] [GGEVA] CPUC meeting via the web. Concerning expensive fees to kill solar.
Yeah, You are right Jim, Here's the Agenda for the 13th: https://docs.cpuc.ca.gov/SearchRes.aspx?DocTypeID=1&DocTitleStart=Current%20Meeting%20Agenda&Latest=1 On Wed, Jan 5, 2022 at 12:49 PM jim--- via EV wrote: > The file location you posted is on your hard drive. Not available to us. > > And I can't find anything on the agenda related to solar. > > Jim > > > > > -Original Message- > From: "Lawrence Rhodes via EV" > Sent: Wednesday, January 5, 2022 12:44 > To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" > Cc: "Lawrence Rhodes" > Subject: Re: [EVDL] [GGEVA] CPUC meeting via the web. Concerning expensive > fees to kill solar. > > file:///C:/Users/owner/Downloads/371909265.PDF This is the .pdf of the > tarrif(tax) on solar proposal. It is a complicated document which I have > only started to go through. Couldn't find the fee structure. Lawrence Rhodes > > > > > > > On Wednesday, January 5, 2022, 12:01:07 PM PST, Lawrence Rhodes < > primobass...@sbcglobal.net> wrote: > > > > > > Please do your part to complain about these proposed fees. If this goes > through, what is the point of having solar...I will disconnect from the > grid and get batteries. > https://www.cpuc.ca.gov/events-and-meetings/cpuc-voting-meeting-01-13-2022 > This is the link for a meeting of the CPUC over proposed fees for owning > and connecting solar to the grid. A lot of buried information that must be > sorted through. Below links to contact board members which is not obvious. > Lawrence Rhodes > > > https://apps.cpuc.ca.gov/apex/f?p=401%3A56%3A0%3A%3ANO%3ARP%2C57%2CRIR%3AP5_PROCEEDING_SELECT%3AR2008020 > comment link. Couldn't figure it out. > Parties: https://ia.cpuc.ca.gov/servicelists/R2008020_88217.htm > > > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- > Groups.io Links: You receive all messages sent to this group. > View/Reply Online (#887): https://groups.io/g/GGEVA/message/887 > Mute This Topic: https://groups.io/mt/88222411/2384437 > Group Owner: ggeva+ow...@groups.io > Unsubscribe: > https://groups.io/g/GGEVA/leave/10047416/2384437/1584999544/xyzzy [ > primobass...@sbcglobal.net] > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- > > > ___ > Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org > No other addresses in TO and CC fields > UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub > ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ > LIST INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org > > > ___ > Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org > No other addresses in TO and CC fields > UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub > ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ > LIST INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org > -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20220105/81a42faa/attachment.html> ___ Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org No other addresses in TO and CC fields UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ LIST INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org
Re: [EVDL] [GGEVA] CPUC meeting via the web. Concerning expensive fees to kill solar.
The file location you posted is on your hard drive. Not available to us. And I can't find anything on the agenda related to solar. Jim -Original Message- From: "Lawrence Rhodes via EV" Sent: Wednesday, January 5, 2022 12:44 To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" Cc: "Lawrence Rhodes" Subject: Re: [EVDL] [GGEVA] CPUC meeting via the web. Concerning expensive fees to kill solar. file:///C:/Users/owner/Downloads/371909265.PDF This is the .pdf of the tarrif(tax) on solar proposal. It is a complicated document which I have only started to go through. Couldn't find the fee structure. Lawrence Rhodes On Wednesday, January 5, 2022, 12:01:07 PM PST, Lawrence Rhodes wrote: Please do your part to complain about these proposed fees. If this goes through, what is the point of having solar...I will disconnect from the grid and get batteries. https://www.cpuc.ca.gov/events-and-meetings/cpuc-voting-meeting-01-13-2022 This is the link for a meeting of the CPUC over proposed fees for owning and connecting solar to the grid. A lot of buried information that must be sorted through. Below links to contact board members which is not obvious. Lawrence Rhodes https://apps.cpuc.ca.gov/apex/f?p=401%3A56%3A0%3A%3ANO%3ARP%2C57%2CRIR%3AP5_PROCEEDING_SELECT%3AR2008020 comment link. Couldn't figure it out. Parties: https://ia.cpuc.ca.gov/servicelists/R2008020_88217.htm -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Groups.io Links: You receive all messages sent to this group. View/Reply Online (#887): https://groups.io/g/GGEVA/message/887 Mute This Topic: https://groups.io/mt/88222411/2384437 Group Owner: ggeva+ow...@groups.io Unsubscribe: https://groups.io/g/GGEVA/leave/10047416/2384437/1584999544/xyzzy [primobass...@sbcglobal.net] -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- ___ Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org No other addresses in TO and CC fields UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ LIST INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org ___ Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org No other addresses in TO and CC fields UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ LIST INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org
Re: [EVDL] CPUC meeting via the web. Concerning expensive fees to kill solar.
The first link Lawrence provided is a link to the meeting: https://www.cpuc.ca.gov/events-and-meetings/cpuc-voting-meeting-01-13-2022 You can watch online, and then call in on the phone to voice your objection in 1 minute. It's next Thu at 10am! On Wed, Jan 5, 2022 at 12:34 PM jim--- via EV wrote: > Neither could I. I answered based on newspaper articles. > > Jim > > > > > -Original Message- > From: "David Murphy via EV" > Sent: Wednesday, January 5, 2022 12:20 > To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" > Cc: "David Murphy" > Subject: Re: [EVDL] CPUC meeting via the web. Concerning expensive fees to > kill solar. > > I don’t seem to be able to find this on the agenda…can you provide a link > to that or to the title of the agenda item? > > On Wed, Jan 5, 2022 at 12:10 PM jim--- via EV wrote: > > > > > The fees are not the big issue - it's the killing net metering part. > > I'm with you however, if they kill net metering, I will largely turn off > > my solar. > > > > > > Jim > > > > > > > > -Original Message- > > From: "Lawrence Rhodes via EV" > > Sent: Wednesday, January 5, 2022 12:00 > > To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" > > Cc: "Lawrence Rhodes" > > Subject: [EVDL] CPUC meeting via the web. Concerning expensive fees to > > kill solar. > > > > Please do your part to complain about these proposed fees. If this goes > > through, what is the point of having solar...I will disconnect from the > > grid and get batteries. > > > https://www.cpuc.ca.gov/events-and-meetings/cpuc-voting-meeting-01-13-2022 > > This is the link for a meeting of the CPUC over proposed fees for owning > > and connecting solar to the grid. A lot of buried information that must > be > > sorted through. Below links to contact board members which is not > obvious. > > Lawrence Rhodes > > > > > > > https://apps.cpuc.ca.gov/apex/f?p=401%3A56%3A0%3A%3ANO%3ARP%2C57%2CRIR%3AP5_PROCEEDING_SELECT%3AR2008020 > > comment link. Couldn't figure it out. > > Parties: https://ia.cpuc.ca.gov/servicelists/R2008020_88217.htm > > ___ > > Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org > > No other addresses in TO and CC fields > > UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub > > ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ > > LIST INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org > > > > > > ___ > > Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org > > No other addresses in TO and CC fields > > UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub > > ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ > > LIST INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org > > > -- next part -- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: < > http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20220105/f9bfa568/attachment.html > > > ___ > Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org > No other addresses in TO and CC fields > UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub > ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ > LIST INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org > > > ___ > Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org > No other addresses in TO and CC fields > UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub > ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ > LIST INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org > -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20220105/deb39e13/attachment.html> ___ Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org No other addresses in TO and CC fields UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ LIST INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org
Re: [EVDL] [GGEVA] CPUC meeting via the web. Concerning expensive fees to kill solar.
file:///C:/Users/owner/Downloads/371909265.PDF This is the .pdf of the tarrif(tax) on solar proposal. It is a complicated document which I have only started to go through. Couldn't find the fee structure. Lawrence Rhodes On Wednesday, January 5, 2022, 12:01:07 PM PST, Lawrence Rhodes wrote: Please do your part to complain about these proposed fees. If this goes through, what is the point of having solar...I will disconnect from the grid and get batteries. https://www.cpuc.ca.gov/events-and-meetings/cpuc-voting-meeting-01-13-2022 This is the link for a meeting of the CPUC over proposed fees for owning and connecting solar to the grid. A lot of buried information that must be sorted through. Below links to contact board members which is not obvious. Lawrence Rhodes https://apps.cpuc.ca.gov/apex/f?p=401%3A56%3A0%3A%3ANO%3ARP%2C57%2CRIR%3AP5_PROCEEDING_SELECT%3AR2008020 comment link. Couldn't figure it out. Parties: https://ia.cpuc.ca.gov/servicelists/R2008020_88217.htm -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Groups.io Links: You receive all messages sent to this group. View/Reply Online (#887): https://groups.io/g/GGEVA/message/887 Mute This Topic: https://groups.io/mt/88222411/2384437 Group Owner: ggeva+ow...@groups.io Unsubscribe: https://groups.io/g/GGEVA/leave/10047416/2384437/1584999544/xyzzy [primobass...@sbcglobal.net] -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- ___ Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org No other addresses in TO and CC fields UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ LIST INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org
Re: [EVDL] CPUC meeting via the web. Concerning expensive fees to kill solar.
On 5 Jan 2022 at 20:00, Lawrence Rhodes via EV wrote: > I will disconnect from the grid and get batteries. Wouldn't blame you, but can you actually do that? I vaguely recall reading years ago that once your house is connected, at least some utilities can legally force you to stay. My memory might be getting paranoid in its old age, though. You could just stop paying your bill and let them disconnect you, but that would damage your credit rating. The electric utilities, like the oil companies, are a force for destruction and IMO are best left to rot and topple of their own weight. If I were building a house today I wouldn't connect to the commercial grid at all. Fully off-grid would be OK, but I'd really like to see collectively-managed nonprofit neighborhood grids (microgrids). V2G EVs could potentially be a part of such a scheme. There's a small movement promoting microgrids in Puerto Rico, where the electric utility is effectively past redemption. https://resilientpowerpr.org/ (Not an endorsement) David Roden, EVDL moderator & general lackey To reach me, don't reply to this message; I won't get it. Use my offlist address here : http://evdl.org/help/index.html#supt = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Permission is hereby granted to any person obtaining a copy of this software and associated materials to make use of the software and associated materials according to the terms of the MIT License (see included file `LICENSE_MIT`) IF AND ONLY IF they have not read any portion of this file. Any person who has read any portion of this file may not make any use of the software and associated materials for any purpose whatsoever. Any permissions previously granted to any person to use this software and associated materials terminate and are revoked with immediate effect upon their reading of any portion of this file. -- Voynix software license = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = ___ Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org No other addresses in TO and CC fields UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ LIST INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org
Re: [EVDL] CPUC meeting via the web. Concerning expensive fees to kill solar.
Neither could I. I answered based on newspaper articles. Jim -Original Message- From: "David Murphy via EV" Sent: Wednesday, January 5, 2022 12:20 To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" Cc: "David Murphy" Subject: Re: [EVDL] CPUC meeting via the web. Concerning expensive fees to kill solar. I don’t seem to be able to find this on the agenda…can you provide a link to that or to the title of the agenda item? On Wed, Jan 5, 2022 at 12:10 PM jim--- via EV wrote: > > The fees are not the big issue - it's the killing net metering part. > I'm with you however, if they kill net metering, I will largely turn off > my solar. > > > Jim > > > > -Original Message- > From: "Lawrence Rhodes via EV" > Sent: Wednesday, January 5, 2022 12:00 > To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" > Cc: "Lawrence Rhodes" > Subject: [EVDL] CPUC meeting via the web. Concerning expensive fees to > kill solar. > > Please do your part to complain about these proposed fees. If this goes > through, what is the point of having solar...I will disconnect from the > grid and get batteries. > https://www.cpuc.ca.gov/events-and-meetings/cpuc-voting-meeting-01-13-2022 > This is the link for a meeting of the CPUC over proposed fees for owning > and connecting solar to the grid. A lot of buried information that must be > sorted through. Below links to contact board members which is not obvious. > Lawrence Rhodes > > > https://apps.cpuc.ca.gov/apex/f?p=401%3A56%3A0%3A%3ANO%3ARP%2C57%2CRIR%3AP5_PROCEEDING_SELECT%3AR2008020 > comment link. Couldn't figure it out. > Parties: https://ia.cpuc.ca.gov/servicelists/R2008020_88217.htm > ___ > Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org > No other addresses in TO and CC fields > UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub > ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ > LIST INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org > > > ___ > Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org > No other addresses in TO and CC fields > UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub > ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ > LIST INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org > -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20220105/f9bfa568/attachment.html> ___ Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org No other addresses in TO and CC fields UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ LIST INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org ___ Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org No other addresses in TO and CC fields UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ LIST INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org
Re: [EVDL] CPUC meeting via the web. Concerning expensive fees to kill solar.
I don’t seem to be able to find this on the agenda…can you provide a link to that or to the title of the agenda item? On Wed, Jan 5, 2022 at 12:10 PM jim--- via EV wrote: > > The fees are not the big issue - it's the killing net metering part. > I'm with you however, if they kill net metering, I will largely turn off > my solar. > > > Jim > > > > -Original Message- > From: "Lawrence Rhodes via EV" > Sent: Wednesday, January 5, 2022 12:00 > To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" > Cc: "Lawrence Rhodes" > Subject: [EVDL] CPUC meeting via the web. Concerning expensive fees to > kill solar. > > Please do your part to complain about these proposed fees. If this goes > through, what is the point of having solar...I will disconnect from the > grid and get batteries. > https://www.cpuc.ca.gov/events-and-meetings/cpuc-voting-meeting-01-13-2022 > This is the link for a meeting of the CPUC over proposed fees for owning > and connecting solar to the grid. A lot of buried information that must be > sorted through. Below links to contact board members which is not obvious. > Lawrence Rhodes > > > https://apps.cpuc.ca.gov/apex/f?p=401%3A56%3A0%3A%3ANO%3ARP%2C57%2CRIR%3AP5_PROCEEDING_SELECT%3AR2008020 > comment link. Couldn't figure it out. > Parties: https://ia.cpuc.ca.gov/servicelists/R2008020_88217.htm > ___ > Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org > No other addresses in TO and CC fields > UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub > ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ > LIST INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org > > > ___ > Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org > No other addresses in TO and CC fields > UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub > ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ > LIST INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org > -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20220105/f9bfa568/attachment.html> ___ Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org No other addresses in TO and CC fields UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ LIST INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org
Re: [EVDL] CPUC meeting via the web. Concerning expensive fees to kill solar.
The fees are not the big issue - it's the killing net metering part. I'm with you however, if they kill net metering, I will largely turn off my solar. Jim -Original Message- From: "Lawrence Rhodes via EV" Sent: Wednesday, January 5, 2022 12:00 To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" Cc: "Lawrence Rhodes" Subject: [EVDL] CPUC meeting via the web. Concerning expensive fees to kill solar. Please do your part to complain about these proposed fees. If this goes through, what is the point of having solar...I will disconnect from the grid and get batteries. https://www.cpuc.ca.gov/events-and-meetings/cpuc-voting-meeting-01-13-2022 This is the link for a meeting of the CPUC over proposed fees for owning and connecting solar to the grid. A lot of buried information that must be sorted through. Below links to contact board members which is not obvious. Lawrence Rhodes https://apps.cpuc.ca.gov/apex/f?p=401%3A56%3A0%3A%3ANO%3ARP%2C57%2CRIR%3AP5_PROCEEDING_SELECT%3AR2008020 comment link. Couldn't figure it out. Parties: https://ia.cpuc.ca.gov/servicelists/R2008020_88217.htm ___ Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org No other addresses in TO and CC fields UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ LIST INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org ___ Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org No other addresses in TO and CC fields UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ LIST INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org
[EVDL] CPUC meeting via the web. Concerning expensive fees to kill solar.
Please do your part to complain about these proposed fees. If this goes through, what is the point of having solar...I will disconnect from the grid and get batteries. https://www.cpuc.ca.gov/events-and-meetings/cpuc-voting-meeting-01-13-2022 This is the link for a meeting of the CPUC over proposed fees for owning and connecting solar to the grid. A lot of buried information that must be sorted through. Below links to contact board members which is not obvious. Lawrence Rhodes https://apps.cpuc.ca.gov/apex/f?p=401%3A56%3A0%3A%3ANO%3ARP%2C57%2CRIR%3AP5_PROCEEDING_SELECT%3AR2008020 comment link. Couldn't figure it out. Parties: https://ia.cpuc.ca.gov/servicelists/R2008020_88217.htm ___ Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org No other addresses in TO and CC fields UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ LIST INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org
Re: [EVDL] Regen toll (was: Tesla Y actual wall outlet efficiency)
In addition to motors, motor controllers, and batteries, tires are part of the efficiency chain, both in acceleration and deceleration (regen braking). I anecdotally heard once that tires can be as low as 75% efficient. I don't have a good source for that tire efficiency number, so if someone has a knowledgeable source for actual tire efficiency, that would be great to know. Thanks, Gary -Original Message- From: EV On Behalf Of (-Phil-) via EV Sent: Tuesday, January 4, 2022 2:45 PM To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List Cc: (-Phil-) Subject: Re: [EVDL] Regen toll (was: Tesla Y actual wall outlet efficiency) I can assure you that the Model 3/Y Powertrain is way above 85% efficient. 85% might have been reasonable for a mechanically commutated DC motor, but even modern non-Tesla powertrains are better than that! On Tue, Jan 4, 2022 at 3:27 AM Cor van de Water via EV wrote: > Reason you can't drive as conservatively as you'd like is simply: > other traffic. > If you are alone on a 45MPH road, nobody cares if you want to do 35, > but if 2 lanes of traffic are storming at you doing 55-60 then it is > mightily inconvenient if someone is blocking the road at 35. > The other reason of course is your own time. While it makes hardly any > difference if you are doing 55 iso 60 on a freeway in time difference, > you are still taking an extra 5 min on an hour trip and sometimes that > means missing appointments, so a higher speed may be necessary at > times. > > BTW, I question the 85% efficiency. Not at max (acceleration) power, > but I am under the impression that the majority of the driving is not > done at max acceleration and at lower power levels, the efficiency of > the drivetrain is usually higher. For example, doing a constant 55 on > a flat freeway takes only 15kW while max acceleration is about 6 times > that amount. > 15kW is about 40 Amps while max current is either 200 or 250A > depending on the vehicle. Running at 20% of max also means a Voltage > drop of 20% so resistive losses drop to 4% of max losses when running > at 20% power, so I presume that if max losses are 15% (=85% > efficiency) then the losses at 20% must be much lower, as long as the > *fixed* losses are orders smaller. > Cor, happily regenning before every traffic light that is not green > and for sharper turns. > > On Tue, Jan 4, 2022 at 3:04 AM EV List Lackey via EV > > wrote: > > > > On 4 Jan 2022 at 22:40, Bill Dube via EV wrote: > > > > > Whatever the drivetrain losses, they at least double when you > > > regeneratively brake. > > > > I see your point, but I think it's a bit academic. Assuming your > > 85% efficiency number, you aren't losing 30% on regen, you're losing 15%. > > You've already spent that other 15% by the time the energy gets to > > the wheels, so it's gone anyway. And 15% loss is a lot better than > > the 100% loss that you get burning it off in the friction brakes. > > > > > If you drive a bit more conservatively, you can avoid expending > > > that energy extra energy in the first place, > > > > Here I agree with you completely. Not using the energy in the first > place > > is better than using it and then recovering some of it. > > Unfortunately, > you > > still have to use energy to move, unless your trips are all > > downhill. :-) > > > > My point is that regen id like partly smoothing out the hills and > valleys. > > With good strong regen, properly used, your energy use for a given > > hilly route is only slightly more than if it were flat. > > > > If you're not in a hilly region, I agree that regen is of less value. > But > > as you say, with modern controllers, you get it essentially free, so > > it's always worth including and using. > > > > One other often forgotten benefit of regen is that it reduces > > friction > brake > > wear. That not only saves you money, it has environmental benefits > > in reducing vehicle particulate emissions. > > > > David Roden, EVDL moderator & general lackey > > > > To reach me, don't reply to this message; I won't get it. Use my > > offlist address here : > > https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fevd > > l.org%2Fhelp%2Findex.html%23supt&data=04%7C01%7Cgln103%40psu.edu > > %7C1e17a6cefd4a4d8d0b8208d9cfbabe4a%7C7cf48d453ddb4389a9c1c115526eb5 > > 2e%7C0%7C0%7C637769223232688435%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4w > > LjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sd > > ata=uvWOci1nEHtJXpmD3IpRpcsvQRfoAY7XtQXK3g1WE7I%3D&reserved=0 > > > > = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = > > We don't devote nearly enough scientific research to finding > > a cure for jerks. > > > >-- Bill Watterson, "Calvin and Hobbes" > > = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = > > = > > > > ___ > > Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org No other addresses in TO and
