Re: [EVDL] EVLN: No tumbling Leaf EV values

[Lawrence Rhodes via EV]

That is a very good deal.  Did you get the O down O% financing?  Does it have 
the 6.6kw charger?  Chademo?  If you want the battery to last don't too deeply 
discharge it.  That is get home with 1 mile on the range or accelerate fast.  
Don't drive 65 on the freeway too much.  I try to keep the energy consumption 
to 5miles per kw.  That increases range.  Learn about the displays.  Battery 
percentage.  Energy use.  Etc...It is controlled by the top left of four 
buttons above the charge port button.  Coast down hill when you can especially 
if it increases speed.  Not exceeding 2 blue dots gives the best speed and fuel 
consumption.  3 dots or 4 to accelerate on to the freeway.  My freeway speeds 
vary from 45 to 65 mph depending on the terrain.  Lawrence Rhodes.

  From: David Kerzel 
 To: 'Lawrence Rhodes' ; 'Electric Vehicle 
Discussion List'  
 Sent: Wednesday, February 10, 2016 1:59 AM
 Subject: RE: [EVDL] EVLN: No tumbling Leaf EV values
   
I also just got a 2013 Leaf-S, 16K miles for under $10K.  I don't understand 
all this battery talk, the warranty on the battery is 96 months or 100K miles.
;
-Original Message-
From: EV [mailto:ev-boun...@lists.evdl.org] On Behalf Of Lawrence Rhodes via EV
Sent: Tuesday, February 09, 2016 11:09 AM
To: ev@lists.evdl.org; ev-requ...@lists.evdl.org
Subject: Re: [EVDL] EVLN: No tumbling Leaf EV values

This could not be further from the real truth.  You can't get a very good deal 
on a new Leaf Lease.  You can however get a  5 thousand dollar discount on used 
Leafs or off lease cars..  I bought a 2013 vehicle near pristine for 14k.  18 k 
would be the price I'd have to pay for my 2012. Minus 5k that is still 13 
thousand for a year older with 39k and a degraded battery pack and a 3.3kw 
charger vs. the 2013 with a 6.6 charger. The 2013 has a better battery pack 
since it only has 2600 miles on it...yes 2600.  No typo.  I could have gotten a 
22k mile vehicle(2013) for 10k.  So adjustments have been made.  You will 
simply pay more for a 2016 with extended range. Much less for a used Leaf.  
Plus Nissan is committed to a replacement pack for 5500 dollars.  A used Leaf 
2013 or newer is the best deal.  Stay away from 2012 and 2011 models.  Seems 
the battery packs are not as good as 2013 on.  Lawrence Rhodes
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Re: [EVDL] EVLN: No tumbling Leaf EV values

[Willie2 via EV]

On 02/10/2016 03:59 AM, David Kerzel via EV wrote:

I also just got a 2013 Leaf-S, 16K miles for under $10K.  I don't understand 
all this battery talk, the warranty on the battery is 96 months or 100K miles.

Nissan resists honoring their warranty.


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Re: [EVDL] EVLN: No tumbling Leaf EV values

[David Kerzel via EV]

I also just got a 2013 Leaf-S, 16K miles for under $10K.  I don't understand 
all this battery talk, the warranty on the battery is 96 months or 100K miles.
;
-Original Message-
From: EV [mailto:ev-boun...@lists.evdl.org] On Behalf Of Lawrence Rhodes via EV
Sent: Tuesday, February 09, 2016 11:09 AM
To: ev@lists.evdl.org; ev-requ...@lists.evdl.org
Subject: Re: [EVDL] EVLN: No tumbling Leaf EV values

This could not be further from the real truth.  You can't get a very good deal 
on a new Leaf Lease.  You can however get a  5 thousand dollar discount on used 
Leafs or off lease cars..  I bought a 2013 vehicle near pristine for 14k.  18 k 
would be the price I'd have to pay for my 2012. Minus 5k that is still 13 
thousand for a year older with 39k and a degraded battery pack and a 3.3kw 
charger vs. the 2013 with a 6.6 charger. The 2013 has a better battery pack 
since it only has 2600 miles on it...yes 2600.  No typo.  I could have gotten a 
22k mile vehicle(2013) for 10k.  So adjustments have been made.  You will 
simply pay more for a 2016 with extended range. Much less for a used Leaf.  
Plus Nissan is committed to a replacement pack for 5500 dollars.  A used Leaf 
2013 or newer is the best deal.  Stay away from 2012 and 2011 models.  Seems 
the battery packs are not as good as 2013 on.  Lawrence Rhodes
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Re: [EVDL] EVLN: No tumbling Leaf EV values

[Jay Summet via EV]

On 02/09/2016 03:06 PM, Roland wrote:

Hello Jay,
A local Nissan dealers normally are not EV technicians.  The dealer
wants you to purchase the whole battery case which includes 33 modules,
a battery charger, controller, and bms system.


My 2013 Nissan Leaf battery contained 48 "modules", some contractors, 
temperature sensors, resistive heaters, a fuse and the BMS system, but 
did not contain a charger.


(The chargers in the 2011/2013 leafs are located in the trunk region, 
and in 2013+ leafs are integrated with the power distribution box on the 
top of the "engine stack" under the hood.)


Hybrid Auto center is a good source if you don't want to pull the 
modules from a wreaked leaf yourself, but you can save a serious amount 
of cash by doing the work yourself.


My per module cost is currently at $18.55 (yes, less than $20 a module!) 
after selling off most of the car to offset the purchase price of the 
wreck.


I spent more money on the charger/BMS/EVSE part of my upgrade than I did 
on the actual modules (but I did put in hundreds of hours of work 
getting them out of the car and putting them into my truck,  as well as 
selling everything else off of the car.)  I only have a few pieces of 
the car left to sell, so I don't expect my per module cost to drop too 
much more ;>


Jay

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Re: [EVDL] EVLN: No tumbling Leaf EV values

[Roland via EV]

   
Hello Jay,

 

A local Nissan dealers normally are not EV technicians.  The dealer wants you 
to purchase the whole battery case which includes 33 modules, a battery 
charger, controller, and bms system.  

 

I found one in Las Vegas which has a EV shop, that can replace bad modules and 
any other related items.  There address is: 

 

Hybrid Auto Center LLC 

5360 Cameron St, #5 

Las Vegas, NV 89118

 

Ph No. 1-702-374-8602 

 

The Contact Technician is:  "Nick Tranakiev"  
nikmas...@gmail.com<mailto:nikmas...@gmail.com> 

 

A Nissan pack has a 24kw/h pack or 33 modules.  

 

I order three 11KW/h Nissan battery blocks 182V /60AHh (24 modules) for $7470.00

 

or $2490.00 each NEW for 72 modules.   

 

To increase the voltage to 226.8 volts, I added 3 more modules per battery 
block or 9 more modules total.  

 

Each module cost about $103.00 each or $927.00.

 

This included all the plated copper buss bars, wire and cables, bms connection 
wires to all the cells, and mounting hardware. 

 

This made a 45.3 Kw/h pack for $8910.00.

 

This EV shop pre-balance all the modules for exact voltage match with in 0.001 
volt of each other.  This what I normally do before I install any cells in a 
cell group.  My cell group is three modules parallel or one cell group at 8.4 
volts at 199.8 ah.

 

Nick is a EV guy and knows about the EV Album group.  

 

You can email Nick any time for any question you want.  

 

Roland 


- Original Message - 

From: Jay Summet via EV<mailto:ev@lists.evdl.org> 

To: ev@lists.evdl.org<mailto:ev@lists.evdl.org> 

Sent: Tuesday, February 09, 2016 10:49 AM

Subject: Re: [EVDL] EVLN: No tumbling Leaf EV values





On 02/09/2016 11:22 AM, John Lussmyer via EV wrote:
> On Tue Feb 09 08:08:55 PST 2016 ev@lists.evdl.org said:
>> Plus Nissan is committed to a replacement pack for 5500 dollars.
>
> I wonder if it will be possible to just go to a Nissan Dealership and just 
> buy a "replacement" pack...
>
>

Just like buying a starter battery, you'll pay more if you are not 
trading in a "core" or used battery.

Jay
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Re: [EVDL] EVLN: No tumbling Leaf EV values

[fotajoye via EV]

Nissan policy ties specific range restricted battery packs to specific models
and they don't offer range upgraded battery packs for older models; this
restricts the functionality of the older models and decreases their resale
value greatly.  Replacing a battery that cost almost as much as the chassis
makes little sense.  This is bad policy for the customer.   On the other
hand BMW builds a 'standard battery form factor' that allows upgrades across
their entire line.  If you buy and keep the car, BMW is the wiser decision. 

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Re: [EVDL] EVLN: No tumbling Leaf EV values

[Jay Summet via EV]

On 02/09/2016 12:49 PM, Lawrence Rhodes via EV wrote:

You can get a wrecked Leaf for next to nothing.  Pull that pack out and use it 
as you wish.  Lawrence


To put a number on "next to nothing":

I bought a wrecked leaf for $3200 + auction fees & delivery of around 
$4100 total price. (I believe this was at the very low end of the 
wrecked leaf price range...)




Jay
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Re: [EVDL] EVLN: No tumbling Leaf EV values

[Jay Summet via EV]

On 02/09/2016 11:22 AM, John Lussmyer via EV wrote:

On Tue Feb 09 08:08:55 PST 2016 ev@lists.evdl.org said:

Plus Nissan is committed to a replacement pack for 5500 dollars.


I wonder if it will be possible to just go to a Nissan Dealership and just buy a 
"replacement" pack...




Just like buying a starter battery, you'll pay more if you are not 
trading in a "core" or used battery.


Jay
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Re: [EVDL] EVLN: No tumbling Leaf EV values

[Lawrence Rhodes via EV]

I suspect you will have to provide a core.  But why.  You can get a wrecked 
Leaf for next to nothing.  Pull that pack out and use it as you wish.  Lawrence

  From: John Lussmyer 
 To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List ; Lawrence Rhodes 
 
 Sent: Tuesday, February 9, 2016 8:22 AM
 Subject: Re: EVLN: No tumbling Leaf EV values
   
On Tue Feb 09 08:08:55 PST 2016 ev@lists.evdl.org said:
> Plus Nissan is committed to a replacement pack for 5500 dollars.  

I wonder if it will be possible to just go to a Nissan Dealership and just buy 
a "replacement" pack...


--

Tigers prowl and Dragons soar in my dreams...

  
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Re: [EVDL] EVLN: No tumbling Leaf EV values

[John Lussmyer via EV]

On Tue Feb 09 08:08:55 PST 2016 ev@lists.evdl.org said:
> Plus Nissan is committed to a replacement pack for 5500 dollars.  

I wonder if it will be possible to just go to a Nissan Dealership and just buy 
a "replacement" pack...


--

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Re: [EVDL] EVLN: No tumbling Leaf EV values

[Lawrence Rhodes via EV]

This could not be further from the real truth.  You can't get a very good deal 
on a new Leaf Lease.  You can however get a  5 thousand dollar discount on used 
Leafs or off lease cars..  I bought a 2013 vehicle near pristine for 14k.  18 k 
would be the price I'd have to pay for my 2012. Minus 5k that is still 13 
thousand for a year older with 39k and a degraded battery pack and a 3.3kw 
charger vs. the 2013 with a 6.6 charger. The 2013 has a better battery pack 
since it only has 2600 miles on it...yes 2600.  No typo.  I could have gotten a 
22k mile vehicle(2013) for 10k.  So adjustments have been made.  You will 
simply pay more for a 2016 with extended range. Much less for a used Leaf.  
Plus Nissan is committed to a replacement pack for 5500 dollars.  A used Leaf 
2013 or newer is the best deal.  Stay away from 2012 and 2011 models.  Seems 
the battery packs are not as good as 2013 on.  Lawrence Rhodes
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[EVDL] EVLN: No tumbling Leaf EV values

[brucedp5 via EV]

'Cheap Oil Is Not Killing EVs'

http://www.autoremarketing.com/trends/no-falling-leaf-values-heres-why
No falling LEAF values — here's why
Feb. 02, 2016  Joe Overby

[image  
http://www.autoremarketing.com/sites/default/files/styles/story_page_main_image/public/nissan%20leaf_3.jpg?itok=aeqRpi6o
(red leaf EV)
]

IRVINE, Calif. - The car whose late-model auction values showed the most
positive change during the fourth quarter?

According to a Kelley Blue Book analysis, it was an electric vehicle:  the
Nissan LEAF.
 
This took place, even amid gas prices that tumbled more than 14 percent.

Specifically, KBB Auction Values on model-years 2012 through 2014 LEAF
vehicles were up 3 percent in Q4 from where they were in the third quarter.

Average gas prices fell $0.32 in Q4, a decline of 14.2 percent, KBB
reported.

“Despite the continued drop in fuel prices, the Nissan LEAF was the best
performing vehicle across all segments, appreciating 3 percent, or roughly
$300,” KBB analyst Sean Foyil said in the latest Blue Book Market Report.

“This rebound could be attributed to consumers now finding the current value
of electric vehicles more attractive at their current price point following
months of steady declines,” Foyil said.
[© autoremarketing.com]



http://www.cheatsheet.com/automobiles/why-cheap-oil-is-not-killing-electric-cars.html/?a=viewall
Why Cheap Oil Is Not Killing Electric Cars
February 02, 2016  Eric Schaal

[images  
http://www.cheatsheet.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/09/2016_nissan_leaf_07.jpg?504acc
2016_nissan_leaf_07  Source: Nissan

http://www.cheatsheet.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/GettyImages-486222318.jpg?504acc
BMW i3 Miles Willis/Getty Images
]

It’s no secret that standard hybrid cars have taken a beating since cheap
oil yielded cheap gas. Any markup on a vehicle to save a few miles per
gallon doesn’t make sense with gas below $2 in most U.S. states, and the
2015 sales charts reflect that problem with hybrid value. Electric vehicles
haven’t suffered the same fate. From exploding EV sales in Europe and China
to the steady churn in the U.S., the value and sustainability of electric
cars is saving them from a weak oil market.

Sales data from 2015 reveals the divergent fates of hybrids versus plug-in
vehicles in the U.S. All the major hybrids, including the Toyota Prius
family, saw declines in the U.S. market last year. Autoblog data for
alternative-fuel vehicles reveals big winners like the BMW i3, Volkswagen
e-Golf, and Tesla Model S — all of them pure electrics. Chevy Volt and
Nissan Leaf, two of the plug-in segment’s most popular models, saw declines
mainly due to their old model phase-out. Better sales are expected for 2016.

In Europe, EVs and plug-in hybrids saw an explosion in 2015 sales, with
Green Car Congress reporting an 80% increase through September, year over
year. Strong subsidies for electric models combined with higher fuel prices
helped the cause. The same can be said for China, where world EV sales
records were set in 2015.

Considering EVs are rarely cheaper than their gasoline equivalents, it’s
impossible to attribute the success of the plug-in market to purchase
incentives alone. Sustainability remains a huge factor for EV buyers, and
it’s easy to speculate they are considering the long-term value of an
electric car purchase as well. For the buyers flocking to U.S. dealerships
for new SUVs while gas is cheap, a rude awakening could be ahead in 2016.

In the last day of January trading, prices of crude oil rose to three-week
highs on the New York Mercantile Exchange. Anxiety from oil-producing
countries continues to cause speculation about production drops from members
of the OPEC cartel. Regardless of what happens, only a continuation of
record lows for oil will make SUV investments smart in the coming years.
That isn’t likely.

Electric vehicle drivers who depend on home chargers, some of them powered
by solar installations, can expect steady prices in the years ahead as they
charge car batteries. Furthermore, EV drivers of popular models can still
save about $2,500 over five years when compared to the average new vehicle
on sale in 2016. After subtracting $7,500 in tax credits and other
incentives from electric car MSRPs below $30,000, the investment looks like
a sound one from every angle.

As battery prices continue dropping and EV range gets longer, this trend
should continue in the U.S. and other regions where climate concerns are
intensifying. Electric cars are the greenest transportation option in the
U.S. by a wide margin, and even cheap oil hasn’t been able to make consumers
forget it. For those buyers of the Model S, America’s best-selling EV, oil
prices probably never crossed consumers’ minds.
[© cheatsheet.com]




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http://evdl.org/evln/


{brucedp.150m.com}

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