[FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
There was no mention of any angles at my first introductory TM lecture by Jerry Jarvis in 1965 at SIMS in Westwood. Bhairitu wrote: Is that what happens to beings living under bridges? There's no vertical descent in transcending. In the intro lecture we even described these dips or the vertical descent. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/message/169336
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
Richard J. Williams wrote: There was no mention of any angles at my first introductory TM lecture by Jerry Jarvis in 1965 at SIMS in Westwood. Bhairitu wrote: Is that what happens to beings living under bridges? There's no vertical descent in transcending. In the intro lecture we even described these dips or the vertical descent. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/message/169336 So they descend horizontally? ROTFLMAO! Not only do you need some smarts but a brain to put them in. The bubble diagram is an illustration of the experience. I'm not saying that the mantra goes literally vertical but in quick dips. But my experience when using a bij by itself is it takes a quick dip and that is most likely the experience of everyone here. The practice will produce a deepened state of consciousness. Longer mantras meander and slowly descend but also stay at that deeper state because they are longer. This is a very well known element of mantra shastra. OM centers. Try a bij with OM in front of it and you'll notice the experience is different. It's also important to note that some gurus use the term bij mantra as a reference to the guru mantra which is a different context than we are discussing here. What we probably should be saying is bij akshara.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
Bhairitu wrote: Not only do you need some smarts but a brain to put them in. Thanks, I'll make a note of that. The bubble diagram is an illustration of the experience. I'm not saying that the mantra goes literally vertical but in quick dips. But my experience when using a bij by itself is it takes a quick dip and that is most likely the experience of everyone here. The practice will produce a deepened state of consciousness. Longer mantras meander and slowly descend but also stay at that deeper state because they are longer. This is a very well known element of mantra shastra. OM centers. Try a bij with OM in front of it and you'll notice the experience is different. It's also important to note that some gurus use the term bij mantra as a reference to the guru mantra which is a different context than we are discussing here. What we probably should be saying is bij akshara. The bija is the bindu, the point of origin; the bindu is not the 'point of return' for the shakti - the bindu is the point of origin. Every Shankara tantric knows the order of evolutes contained in the Sri Yantra. The bindu is the point of origin - the petals and the gates are the point of return. Perhaps you should read the primary texts of the Shankara Sri Vidya - the Saundaryalahari. Have you ever even seen an image of the Sri Yantra? If so, did you see that little dot in the middle of of the intersecting triangles? That's the bindu, Bhairitu, the central focus of every Dasanami Sanyasin. The bij doesn't go hither and thither, up or down, descending or ascending; it returns to it's point of origin. The Srividya, because it consists of indestructible seed syllables (bijaksara) rather than words, transcends such mundane considerations as semantic meaning. A bija-only is not only esoteric but inherently superior (95). Work cited: 'The Secret of the Three Cities' An Introduction to Hindu Sakta Tantrism by Douglas Renfrew Brooks University Of Chicago Press, 1998 http://tinyurl.com/37yzmw
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
Bhairitu wrote: What TM teacher training course did you graduate from? You only need to attend one single TM introductory lecture to know that there's no mantra angle mentioned. And you only need one single advanced technique to know that you only get one single bij mantra for TM practice. If you had attended either of these you would already know this. What TM teacher training course did you graduate from? Bhairitu wrote: In the intro lecture we even described these dips or the vertical descent. Richard J. Williams wrote: There's no mention of a angle of the mantra in a TM introductory lecture. Did you make that up? If so then you were not teaching TM. You only get one mantra in TM instruction. There are no advanced technique bija mantras. The added phrases in advanced techniques, such as Shree and Namah, are just Sanskrit words, not bija mantras. The mystic syllable OM is not considered to be a bija mantra.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
Since the Absolute is always there, the experience of a blackout is, er, go figure, AN EXPERIENCE OF THE ABSOLUTE. Since no memory can be dredged up about the experience, it could only be the Absolute that was present. Get that? Nothing is what was experienced. No thing. Not even awareness, not even amness. Sorry to tell ya TBs and bliss seekers, but that's the actual real deal bottomline goal of goals. Consult your local Buddhist about the void. It is that no-thingness that will be discovered to be the only identity one has ever had. The rest is a dross of verbiage floating on the illusion of consciousness. Edg --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, endlessrainintoapapercup [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Kirk said: Some yogis have noted TMers--esp. TM-Sidhi practitioners have blocks in their nervous system (actually their pranic bodies) that can prevent such full awakening. What exactly causes these alleged blocks? --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Kirk kirk_bernhardt@ wrote: That vampired look I have determined comes from squeezing the eyes shut for many hours a day which gives a person bruises under their eyes (dark circles) and also from the lack of sunlight. I used to look like that from rounding. Most people do at some point. - Original Message - From: Vaj To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, March 11, 2008 7:26 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience On Mar 11, 2008, at 12:56 AM, endlessrainintoapapercup wrote: I don't know what type of experience you are talking about, matrixmonitor...I'm only addressing the issue of conscious transcendence. If transcendence isn't conscious, how can anyone say with any certainty that it exists? My words about deeper states of meditative absorption were not intended to reflect TM-teach. I was just acknowledging that the experience I described, of pure consciousness beyond form, is just the beginning of culturing deeper and deeper meditative states. TM may not acknowledge them, but other meditation traditions do. My original question was simply whether TM produces conscious transcendence for others, as it doesn't seem to do so for me. Until you're centered and fully transcended at the level of the makara-bindu and open the eye of knowledge, the third eye as the TM puja mentions, most TMers will just languish in a laya-samadhi. The techniques to actually awaken awareness there aren't taught in TM, so unless you're somehow predisposed to awaken so highly, it just doesn't happen. Some yogis have noted TMers--esp. TM-Sidhi practitioners have blocks in their nervous system (actually their pranic bodies) that can prevent such full awakening. Rounding continuously for decades in a laya can't be a good thing. But if you've ever met the sickly Purusha's of the TMO and the resultant distorted personality types, one does start to wonder how healthy it is. Some of these guys looks like they were vampirized for years. It's also probably why TM doesn't make the brain very coherent at all like as is seen in deep meditation/samadhi.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
Richard J. Williams wrote: Bhairitu wrote: What TM teacher training course did you graduate from? You only need to attend one single TM introductory lecture to know that there's no mantra angle mentioned. And you only need one single advanced technique to know that you only get one single bij mantra for TM practice. If you had attended either of these you would already know this. What TM teacher training course did you graduate from? Biarritz spring 1976. Now that I answered your question please tell which one you graduated from? If you had you would have heard the lecture on advanced techniques and the talk about the difference between the first and advanced. Many teachers when asked about advanced techniques usually paraphrase from these lectures. You obviously aren't a teacher but like to pose as a TM expert which is very difficult to do unless you attended the TTCs especially the later ones which were longer and more information provided (and for those who attended the quick early TTCs they got more info on their AofE courses). While we're at it please answer the other question I asked last week about what war we're fighting over in Iraq. How do you gauge if we're won that war? And isn't really an occupation?
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
--Precisely, Edg! IMO some misconceptions regarding Samadhi have crept into our history of what the experience is all about, due to some statements of Ramakrishna (1836-1886) regarding going into Samadhi - in which he was temporarily oblivious to the outer world, but had an inner awareness of Pure Consciousness coupled with (perhaps) some memories of inner visions. To a degree, MMY has made some headway in setting the record straight; along with Buddhism as a whole. - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Duveyoung [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Since the Absolute is always there, the experience of a blackout is, er, go figure, AN EXPERIENCE OF THE ABSOLUTE. Since no memory can be dredged up about the experience, it could only be the Absolute that was present. Get that? Nothing is what was experienced. No thing. Not even awareness, not even amness. Sorry to tell ya TBs and bliss seekers, but that's the actual real deal bottomline goal of goals. Consult your local Buddhist about the void. It is that no-thingness that will be discovered to be the only identity one has ever had. The rest is a dross of verbiage floating on the illusion of consciousness. Edg --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, endlessrainintoapapercup endlessrainintoapapercup@ wrote: Kirk said: Some yogis have noted TMers--esp. TM-Sidhi practitioners have blocks in their nervous system (actually their pranic bodies) that can prevent such full awakening. What exactly causes these alleged blocks? --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Kirk kirk_bernhardt@ wrote: That vampired look I have determined comes from squeezing the eyes shut for many hours a day which gives a person bruises under their eyes (dark circles) and also from the lack of sunlight. I used to look like that from rounding. Most people do at some point. - Original Message - From: Vaj To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, March 11, 2008 7:26 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience On Mar 11, 2008, at 12:56 AM, endlessrainintoapapercup wrote: I don't know what type of experience you are talking about, matrixmonitor...I'm only addressing the issue of conscious transcendence. If transcendence isn't conscious, how can anyone say with any certainty that it exists? My words about deeper states of meditative absorption were not intended to reflect TM-teach. I was just acknowledging that the experience I described, of pure consciousness beyond form, is just the beginning of culturing deeper and deeper meditative states. TM may not acknowledge them, but other meditation traditions do. My original question was simply whether TM produces conscious transcendence for others, as it doesn't seem to do so for me. Until you're centered and fully transcended at the level of the makara-bindu and open the eye of knowledge, the third eye as the TM puja mentions, most TMers will just languish in a laya-samadhi. The techniques to actually awaken awareness there aren't taught in TM, so unless you're somehow predisposed to awaken so highly, it just doesn't happen. Some yogis have noted TMers--esp. TM-Sidhi practitioners have blocks in their nervous system (actually their pranic bodies) that can prevent such full awakening. Rounding continuously for decades in a laya can't be a good thing. But if you've ever met the sickly Purusha's of the TMO and the resultant distorted personality types, one does start to wonder how healthy it is. Some of these guys looks like they were vampirized for years. It's also probably why TM doesn't make the brain very coherent at all like as is seen in deep meditation/samadhi.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, tertonzeno [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --Precisely, Edg! IMO some misconceptions regarding Samadhi have crept into our history of what the experience is all about, due to some statements of Ramakrishna (1836-1886) regarding going into Samadhi - in which he was temporarily oblivious to the outer world, but had an inner awareness of Pure Consciousness coupled with (perhaps) some memories of inner visions. To a degree, MMY has made some headway in setting the record straight; along with Buddhism as a whole. There's a difference between loss of consciousness (blacking out) and cessation of mental and sensory activity while still maintaining alertness. Physiologically, this is due to how our brains work: there are several main components to most mental activity: sensory input, thalamic meditation and cortical activity. Sensory input comes in and the thalamus may pass that activity to the rest of the brain for further processing and accept recycled input from the rest of the brain which is merged with the raw sensory input for further processing. Some scientists think this last (the cortico-thalamic loop) is what we call mental activity or thinking. during the waking state: sense input comes in and is passed to the brain and recycled. during dreaming: sense input is reduced or eliminated but the brain remains alert and the thalamus accepts internal signals and passes them back into the brain during deep sleep: sense input is reduced or eliminated and the brain is not alert and the thalamus doesn't accept internal signals during samadhi: sense input is reduced or eliminated, the brain is alert, but the thalamus doesn't accept internal signals, so the brain is left doing what it always in all forms of activity--even deep sleep: optimize connections between its various cells and parts. The above is very idealized, but it gives you a feel for the main differences between forms of awareness in the brain. Note that the brain is still alert during samadhi, but there is neither thinking nor dreaming nor outside awareness, merely alert-mode optimization activity without any external processing. This restful alertness is the alpha wave. When huge chunks (mostly frontal lobe IIRC) of the brain are in this mode, Self awareness manifests. When this mode becomes the default idle mode of the brain, even during waking, dreaming and sleeping, we call it Cosmic Consciousness --our awareness returns to Self even in the midst of activity. Lawson
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
That's why I practice a school of village tantra. It is simple because people in villages didn't get expensive educations. For the modern person in our complex society the simpler these things are taught the better. I think many of the extrapolations which are complex appeal to people who worship complexity because it makes them feel secure. Larry wrote: you're making this way too complicated, simplify, simplify, there's nothing to this --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mar 11, 2008, at 5:33 PM, endlessrainintoapapercup wrote: Some yogis have noted TMers--esp. TM-Sidhi practitioners have blocks in their nervous system (actually their pranic bodies) that can prevent such full awakening. What exactly causes these alleged blocks? Imbalanced kundalini risings which take non-culminating routes. Several people with vajra-nadi risings that I've spoken to. They believe sidhi cultivation has a lot to do with it. See http://www.kundalinicare.com/aboutkundalini3.html These people--a swami from the Saraswati order and his American lineholder--have spent a lot of time helping old TMers, including some higher-ups who skidaddled the TMO years ago. They also come to Fairfield from what I see every now and again. One letter from one of MMY's old close students, Earl Kaplan, is in the FFL archives. He seems to feel it was deliberate, but who knows?
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, tertonzeno tertonzeno@ wrote: --Precisely, Edg! IMO some misconceptions regarding Samadhi have crept into our history of what the experience is all about, due to some statements of Ramakrishna (1836-1886) regarding going into Samadhi - in which he was temporarily oblivious to the outer world, but had an inner awareness of Pure Consciousness coupled with (perhaps) some memories of inner visions. To a degree, MMY has made some headway in setting the record straight; along with Buddhism as a whole. There's a difference between loss of consciousness (blacking out) and cessation of mental and sensory activity while still maintaining alertness. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, tertonzeno tertonzeno@ wrote: --Precisely, Edg! IMO some misconceptions regarding Samadhi have crept into our history of what the experience is all about, due to some statements of Ramakrishna (1836-1886) regarding going into Samadhi - in which he was temporarily oblivious to the outer world, but had an inner awareness of Pure Consciousness coupled with (perhaps) some memories of inner visions. To a degree, MMY has made some headway in setting the record straight; along with Buddhism as a whole. There's a difference between loss of consciousness (blacking out) and cessation of mental and sensory activity while still maintaining alertness. About ten years ago, I was playing basketball. Instead of having a single pole that held up the hoop in the park where we played, the hoop was held by two poles descending down like an inverted V. I was driving up for a lay up and caught my head dead on into one of the descending poles and went completely unconscious for what seemed like at least five seconds. What I remember clearly was the experience of not being unconscious, having a gap of awareness normally associated with being knocked out, but instead being perfectly aware of That, nothing but pure awareness and then coming back into waking state. The thing I realized from that experience was, that the integration of Being is so natural over years of meditating. A person will not know how much Being has been integrated into their waking experience until they are confronted with a contrast or what we believe is the normal experience of unconsciousness. I suppose death would be the ultimate judge if this were true or not.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
What TM teacher training course did you graduate from? Bhairitu wrote: Biarritz spring 1976. Now that I answered your question please tell which one you graduated from? Is this some kind of trick question? If you had you would have heard the lecture on advanced techniques and the talk about the difference between the first and advanced. I got my first advanced technique from Satyanand and my second advanced technique from the Marshy himself. No mention of any bija mantra angles. I was taught the A of E techniques in 1975 on one of the first siddhi courses in Austin. The A of E techniques were only taught on 3 or 4 courses and then they were replaced by the TM-Sidhis. The A of E techniques were supposed to bring on the siddhis. They involve putting your attention systematically on different parts of the body and then on different parts of the world and finally on the universe. They are preceeded by fast pranayama. I've heard many talks about advanced techniques in Austin in 1976, at the TM-Sidhi Center. There was no mention of any bija mantra angles. There was no mention of any angles at my first introductory TM lecture by Jerry Jarvis in 1965 at SIMS in Westwood. I've heard dozens of TM introductory lectures since then and in none of them was a bija mantra angle mentioned. There's no difference between the TM lecture I heard and the ones that any other student hears. There is nothing in the TM checking notes about any angles. Many teachers when asked about advanced techniques usually paraphrase from these lectures. You obviously aren't a teacher but like to pose as a TM expert which is very difficult to do unless you attended the TTCs According to Vaj, this amounts to next to nothing! Face it, all you get in advanced techniques are a few Sankrit words to add to your mantra - some fertilizer, that's it. No new bija mantras, no angles. especially the later ones which were longer and more information provided (and for those who attended the quick early TTCs they got more info on their AofE courses). Are you suggesting that you are a TM teacher of Advanced Techniques? A Minister or a Governor? In TM you get only one single bija mantra. In advanced techniques you get fertilizer words to add before and after your bija mantra. There are no mantras or bijas in the TM-Sidhi Program. True about Willytex, however, I did notice much of what he said seemed genuine and checked out accurately in my book, with the exceptions I notedhe had an incredible amount of info. and trivia, he may be extraordinary in this respect! - Willaim G. Murphy, Governor of the Age of Enlightenment
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
Go take a look at the bubble diagram again. Yes I was a Governor. You still haven't answered my other question. Why? And you didn't clearly state you were not a teacher. Why? Are you a coward? Is that what happens to beings living under bridges? Richard J. Williams wrote: What TM teacher training course did you graduate from? Bhairitu wrote: Biarritz spring 1976. Now that I answered your question please tell which one you graduated from? Is this some kind of trick question? If you had you would have heard the lecture on advanced techniques and the talk about the difference between the first and advanced. I got my first advanced technique from Satyanand and my second advanced technique from the Marshy himself. No mention of any bija mantra angles. I was taught the A of E techniques in 1975 on one of the first siddhi courses in Austin. The A of E techniques were only taught on 3 or 4 courses and then they were replaced by the TM-Sidhis. The A of E techniques were supposed to bring on the siddhis. They involve putting your attention systematically on different parts of the body and then on different parts of the world and finally on the universe. They are preceeded by fast pranayama. I've heard many talks about advanced techniques in Austin in 1976, at the TM-Sidhi Center. There was no mention of any bija mantra angles. There was no mention of any angles at my first introductory TM lecture by Jerry Jarvis in 1965 at SIMS in Westwood. I've heard dozens of TM introductory lectures since then and in none of them was a bija mantra angle mentioned. There's no difference between the TM lecture I heard and the ones that any other student hears. There is nothing in the TM checking notes about any angles. Many teachers when asked about advanced techniques usually paraphrase from these lectures. You obviously aren't a teacher but like to pose as a TM expert which is very difficult to do unless you attended the TTCs According to Vaj, this amounts to next to nothing! Face it, all you get in advanced techniques are a few Sankrit words to add to your mantra - some fertilizer, that's it. No new bija mantras, no angles. especially the later ones which were longer and more information provided (and for those who attended the quick early TTCs they got more info on their AofE courses). Are you suggesting that you are a TM teacher of Advanced Techniques? A Minister or a Governor? In TM you get only one single bija mantra. In advanced techniques you get fertilizer words to add before and after your bija mantra. There are no mantras or bijas in the TM-Sidhi Program. True about Willytex, however, I did notice much of what he said seemed genuine and checked out accurately in my book, with the exceptions I notedhe had an incredible amount of info. and trivia, he may be extraordinary in this respect! - Willaim G. Murphy, Governor of the Age of Enlightenment
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, suziezuzie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig LEnglish5@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, tertonzeno tertonzeno@ wrote: --Precisely, Edg! IMO some misconceptions regarding Samadhi have crept into our history of what the experience is all about, due to some statements of Ramakrishna (1836-1886) regarding going into Samadhi - in which he was temporarily oblivious to the outer world, but had an inner awareness of Pure Consciousness coupled with (perhaps) some memories of inner visions. To a degree, MMY has made some headway in setting the record straight; along with Buddhism as a whole. There's a difference between loss of consciousness (blacking out) and cessation of mental and sensory activity while still maintaining alertness. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig LEnglish5@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, tertonzeno tertonzeno@ wrote: --Precisely, Edg! IMO some misconceptions regarding Samadhi have crept into our history of what the experience is all about, due to some statements of Ramakrishna (1836-1886) regarding going into Samadhi - in which he was temporarily oblivious to the outer world, but had an inner awareness of Pure Consciousness coupled with (perhaps) some memories of inner visions. To a degree, MMY has made some headway in setting the record straight; along with Buddhism as a whole. There's a difference between loss of consciousness (blacking out) and cessation of mental and sensory activity while still maintaining alertness. About ten years ago, I was playing basketball. Instead of having a single pole that held up the hoop in the park where we played, the hoop was held by two poles descending down like an inverted V. I was driving up for a lay up and caught my head dead on into one of the descending poles and went completely unconscious for what seemed like at least five seconds. What I remember clearly was the experience of not being unconscious, having a gap of awareness normally associated with being knocked out, but instead being perfectly aware of That, nothing but pure awareness and then coming back into waking state. Thats interesting. I've often wondered about that. I seldom if ever lose Self while asleep any more, but I haven't been knocked unconscious since I started TM practice. The thing I realized from that experience was, that the integration of Being is so natural over years of meditating. A person will not know how much Being has been integrated into their waking experience until they are confronted with a contrast or what we believe is the normal experience of unconsciousness. I suppose death would be the ultimate judge if this were true or not. How would you know, either way? Lawson
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
On Mar 11, 2008, at 12:56 AM, endlessrainintoapapercup wrote: I don't know what type of experience you are talking about, matrixmonitor...I'm only addressing the issue of conscious transcendence. If transcendence isn't conscious, how can anyone say with any certainty that it exists? My words about deeper states of meditative absorption were not intended to reflect TM-teach. I was just acknowledging that the experience I described, of pure consciousness beyond form, is just the beginning of culturing deeper and deeper meditative states. TM may not acknowledge them, but other meditation traditions do. My original question was simply whether TM produces conscious transcendence for others, as it doesn't seem to do so for me. Until you're centered and fully transcended at the level of the makara-bindu and open the eye of knowledge, the third eye as the TM puja mentions, most TMers will just languish in a laya-samadhi. The techniques to actually awaken awareness there aren't taught in TM, so unless you're somehow predisposed to awaken so highly, it just doesn't happen. Some yogis have noted TMers--esp. TM-Sidhi practitioners have blocks in their nervous system (actually their pranic bodies) that can prevent such full awakening. Rounding continuously for decades in a laya can't be a good thing. But if you've ever met the sickly Purusha's of the TMO and the resultant distorted personality types, one does start to wonder how healthy it is. Some of these guys looks like they were vampirized for years. It's also probably why TM doesn't make the brain very coherent at all like as is seen in deep meditation/samadhi.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mar 11, 2008, at 12:56 AM, endlessrainintoapapercup wrote: I don't know what type of experience you are talking about, matrixmonitor...I'm only addressing the issue of conscious transcendence. If transcendence isn't conscious, how can anyone say with any certainty that it exists? My words about deeper states of meditative absorption were not intended to reflect TM-teach. I was just acknowledging that the experience I described, of pure consciousness beyond form, is just the beginning of culturing deeper and deeper meditative states. TM may not acknowledge them, but other meditation traditions do. My original question was simply whether TM produces conscious transcendence for others, as it doesn't seem to do so for me. Until you're centered and fully transcended at the level of the makara-bindu and open the eye of knowledge, the third eye as the TM puja mentions, most TMers will just languish in a laya-samadhi. The techniques to actually awaken awareness there aren't taught in TM, so unless you're somehow predisposed to awaken so highly, it just doesn't happen. Some yogis have noted TMers--esp. TM-Sidhi practitioners have blocks in their nervous system (actually their pranic bodies) that can prevent such full awakening. Rounding continuously for decades in a laya can't be a good thing. But if you've ever met the sickly Purusha's of the TMO and the resultant distorted personality types, one does start to wonder how healthy it is. Some of these guys looks like they were vampirized for years. It's also probably why TM doesn't make the brain very coherent at all like as is seen in deep meditation/samadhi. Many TM'ers tend to 'black out' as we use to call it, their nervous systems are too crude to reflect pure consciousness, hence all of the nodding off, (notice about 1/3 of the Rajas even nod off when you see them meditate on MOU channels). All of that 'dullness' must be removed before conscious transcending is possible, surely Judy at some point a TM'er should become increasingly *consciously* aware of his own blissful nature, while meditatingSamadhi. Even MMY said long courses are necessary to reach CC (You could meditate a million years and NOT reach CC *unless* you come to these courses, Fuiggi). So if you just want a little centering and good rest leading to better health then just do 2X20, butif you want Samadhi we're talking more intense programs. TM is Yoga lite for modernity!
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
On Mar 11, 2008, at 9:01 AM, BillyG. wrote: TM is Yoga lite for modernity! Less filling.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, BillyG. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: snip All of that 'dullness' must be removed before conscious transcending is possible, surely Judy at some point a TM'er should become increasingly *consciously* aware of his own blissful nature, while meditatingSamadhi. Could you please quote the comment of mine you're responding to, BillyG? Because I can't recall making one to which what you say above would be at all relevant.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: FWIW, it is not the goal of TM practice to seek a transcendence experience or states of meditative absorption, according to MMY... Perhaps this is out of context..fWIW.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
Bhairitu wrote: In the intro lecture we even described these dips or the vertical descent. There's no mention of a angle of the mantra in a TM introductory lecture. Did you make that up? If so then you were not teaching TM. And yes as almost everyone has experienced even the single bijas allow for some deep sustained meditation over time. You only get one mantra in TM instruction. There are no advanced technique bija mantras. The added phrases in advanced techniques, such as Shree and Namah, are just Sanskrit words, not bija mantras. The mystic syllable OM is not considered to be a bija mantra.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
On Mar 11, 2008, at 10:13 AM, Richard J. Williams wrote: The mystic syllable OM is not considered to be a bija mantra. Tantric bija dictionaries all contain om, including it's bijoddhara (it's construction and meaning).
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, endlessrainintoapapercup [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I don't know what type of experience you are talking about, matrixmonitor...I'm only addressing the issue of conscious transcendence. If transcendence isn't conscious, how can anyone say with any certainty that it exists? My words about deeper states of meditative absorption were not intended to reflect TM-teach. I was just acknowledging that the experience I described, of pure consciousness beyond form, is just the beginning of culturing deeper and deeper meditative states. TM may not acknowledge them, but other meditation traditions do. My original question was simply whether TM produces conscious transcendence for others, as it doesn't seem to do so for me. I tend to agree with Tom who said the emphasis is on activity. Having said that, my experiences with TM since 1975 continue to live up to the name of transcendental meditation. And the mantra still works. There is no end to transcending, so its not like there is some finite state that I have reached and it just stops there. It feels very much like a miner, mining for gold; blast out some rock and go further, go deeper- and the mine is infinitely deep. Conscious transcendence seems like a bit of a trap. I am mostly aware of what I am experiencing when I meditate, thought there are times when I am unconscious too. To be conscious the entire time means we are defining our experience at every step of the way. Unless we are the Divine Mother, this would not be possible to do, and at the same time transcend. If we are conscious of our experience the entire time, we are experiencing from a platform of consciousness, which by definition means we are no longer expanding the consciousness. Such experiences may be gratifying and rewarding, but they are much slower in gaining enlightenment than is TM. I think many appreciate the mindfulness meditations because they are safe and understood and comprehensible. That is OK, but is antithetical to the goal of enlightenment. It is good there are choices though, for those who wish to expand their awareness, though ensure that it remains theirs, however illusory this idea is.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
That vampired look I have determined comes from squeezing the eyes shut for many hours a day which gives a person bruises under their eyes (dark circles) and also from the lack of sunlight. I used to look like that from rounding. Most people do at some point. - Original Message - From: Vaj To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, March 11, 2008 7:26 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience On Mar 11, 2008, at 12:56 AM, endlessrainintoapapercup wrote: I don't know what type of experience you are talking about, matrixmonitor...I'm only addressing the issue of conscious transcendence. If transcendence isn't conscious, how can anyone say with any certainty that it exists? My words about deeper states of meditative absorption were not intended to reflect TM-teach. I was just acknowledging that the experience I described, of pure consciousness beyond form, is just the beginning of culturing deeper and deeper meditative states. TM may not acknowledge them, but other meditation traditions do. My original question was simply whether TM produces conscious transcendence for others, as it doesn't seem to do so for me. Until you're centered and fully transcended at the level of the makara-bindu and open the eye of knowledge, the third eye as the TM puja mentions, most TMers will just languish in a laya-samadhi. The techniques to actually awaken awareness there aren't taught in TM, so unless you're somehow predisposed to awaken so highly, it just doesn't happen. Some yogis have noted TMers--esp. TM-Sidhi practitioners have blocks in their nervous system (actually their pranic bodies) that can prevent such full awakening. Rounding continuously for decades in a laya can't be a good thing. But if you've ever met the sickly Purusha's of the TMO and the resultant distorted personality types, one does start to wonder how healthy it is. Some of these guys looks like they were vampirized for years. It's also probably why TM doesn't make the brain very coherent at all like as is seen in deep meditation/samadhi.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
The mystic syllable OM is not considered to be a bija mantra. Vaj wrote: Tantric bija dictionaries all contain om, including it's bijoddhara (it's construction and meaning). Apparently the mystic syllable OM has no meaning - it's not a word found in any standard Sanskrit lexicon. According to Swami Ageananda Bharati, the monosyllable 'OM', which is often seen in books and expressed in the popular imagination, is a mantra by courtesy only. The works you cited were composed in the 18th century, so they are not considered to be authoritative. Bijas are seed syllables - they are esoteric, not the common knowledge contained in dictionaries. Works cited: The Tantric Tradition by Swami Ageananda Bharati Rider, 1965 Read more: Subject: A Common Sound in Indian Cities Author: Willytex Newsgroups: alt.meditation.transcendental Date: Sat, Dec 13 2003 http://tinyurl.com/378df9 Subject: Phat! Author: Willytex Newsgroups: alt.meditation.transcendental Date: Fri, Aug 15 2003 http://tinyurl.com/3aygz7 Subject: TM Identification Author: Willytex Newsgroups: alt.meditation.transcendental From: Sat, Dec 13 2003 http://tinyurl.com/2c8o9w
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
On Mar 11, 2008, at 11:36 AM, Vaj wrote: Many of the tantric dictionaries are quite ancient, Not mine, Vaj. I've got the new and updated Merriam-Webster Tantric Dictionary, Expanded Edition. You mean you don't?! like the Vijanighantu of Bhairava Rishi for example Oh, that's so BC. Sal
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
On Mar 11, 2008, at 12:03 PM, Richard J. Williams wrote: The mystic syllable OM is not considered to be a bija mantra. Vaj wrote: Tantric bija dictionaries all contain om, including it's bijoddhara (it's construction and meaning). Apparently the mystic syllable OM has no meaning - it's not a word found in any standard Sanskrit lexicon. According to Swami Ageananda Bharati, the monosyllable 'OM', which is often seen in books and expressed in the popular imagination, is a mantra by courtesy only. The works you cited were composed in the 18th century, so they are not considered to be authoritative. Bijas are seed syllables - they are esoteric, not the common knowledge contained in dictionaries. Many of the tantric dictionaries are quite ancient, like the Vijanighantu of Bhairava Rishi for example and represent old oral lines. Some like the Mantrarthabhidhana were actually parts of old tantras.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
On Mar 11, 2008, at 12:47 PM, Sal Sunshine wrote: On Mar 11, 2008, at 11:36 AM, Vaj wrote: Many of the tantric dictionaries are quite ancient, Not mine, Vaj. I've got the new and updated Merriam-Webster Tantric Dictionary, Expanded Edition. You mean you don't?! like the Vijanighantu of Bhairava Rishi for example Oh, that's so BC. Call me old fashioned!
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
Refresh our minds here Richard. What TM teacher training course did you graduate from? What year was it? Richard J. Williams wrote: Bhairitu wrote: In the intro lecture we even described these dips or the vertical descent. There's no mention of a angle of the mantra in a TM introductory lecture. Did you make that up? If so then you were not teaching TM. And yes as almost everyone has experienced even the single bijas allow for some deep sustained meditation over time. You only get one mantra in TM instruction. There are no advanced technique bija mantras. The added phrases in advanced techniques, such as Shree and Namah, are just Sanskrit words, not bija mantras. The mystic syllable OM is not considered to be a bija mantra.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
On Mar 11, 2008, at 2:42 PM, Marek Reavis wrote: Classic, Sal, but now I have to wipe the soda off my screen. Warn me next time. Got it--thanks, Marek. One of the perils of posting here.:) Sal
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
Classic, Sal, but now I have to wipe the soda off my screen. Warn me next time. Marek ** --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mar 11, 2008, at 11:36 AM, Vaj wrote: Many of the tantric dictionaries are quite ancient, Not mine, Vaj. I've got the new and updated Merriam-Webster Tantric Dictionary, Expanded Edition. You mean you don't?! like the Vijanighantu of Bhairava Rishi for example Oh, that's so BC. Sal
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
Kirk said: Some yogis have noted TMers--esp. TM-Sidhi practitioners have blocks in their nervous system (actually their pranic bodies) that can prevent such full awakening. What exactly causes these alleged blocks? --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Kirk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: That vampired look I have determined comes from squeezing the eyes shut for many hours a day which gives a person bruises under their eyes (dark circles) and also from the lack of sunlight. I used to look like that from rounding. Most people do at some point. - Original Message - From: Vaj To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, March 11, 2008 7:26 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience On Mar 11, 2008, at 12:56 AM, endlessrainintoapapercup wrote: I don't know what type of experience you are talking about, matrixmonitor...I'm only addressing the issue of conscious transcendence. If transcendence isn't conscious, how can anyone say with any certainty that it exists? My words about deeper states of meditative absorption were not intended to reflect TM-teach. I was just acknowledging that the experience I described, of pure consciousness beyond form, is just the beginning of culturing deeper and deeper meditative states. TM may not acknowledge them, but other meditation traditions do. My original question was simply whether TM produces conscious transcendence for others, as it doesn't seem to do so for me. Until you're centered and fully transcended at the level of the makara-bindu and open the eye of knowledge, the third eye as the TM puja mentions, most TMers will just languish in a laya-samadhi. The techniques to actually awaken awareness there aren't taught in TM, so unless you're somehow predisposed to awaken so highly, it just doesn't happen. Some yogis have noted TMers--esp. TM-Sidhi practitioners have blocks in their nervous system (actually their pranic bodies) that can prevent such full awakening. Rounding continuously for decades in a laya can't be a good thing. But if you've ever met the sickly Purusha's of the TMO and the resultant distorted personality types, one does start to wonder how healthy it is. Some of these guys looks like they were vampirized for years. It's also probably why TM doesn't make the brain very coherent at all like as is seen in deep meditation/samadhi.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
I didn't say that shit. I don't believe it either. But I also don't believe that TMers are very enlightened. Look around. On the other hand, the enlightened can be enlightened sleepetators, enlightened dogshit cleaneruppers,and enlightened twirps as we see here all the time. Enlightenment is overrated. At the very least it should be conscious volition to be what one is without regret. Maybe you and other blackouters like blacking out. Sounds fun to me. I have never been able to lose consciousness ever through any means, except for that one Mardi-Gras where I woke up and I was walking sideways down the street and hours had gone by. Alcohol is very not enlightening. It was the Vaj Genie who sayeth thusly. He is like very fractal Bro, don't get him started. - Original Message - From: endlessrainintoapapercup [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, March 11, 2008 4:33 PM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience Kirk said: Some yogis have noted TMers--esp. TM-Sidhi practitioners have blocks in their nervous system (actually their pranic bodies) that can prevent such full awakening. What exactly causes these alleged blocks? --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Kirk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: That vampired look I have determined comes from squeezing the eyes shut for many hours a day which gives a person bruises under their eyes (dark circles) and also from the lack of sunlight. I used to look like that from rounding. Most people do at some point. - Original Message - From: Vaj To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, March 11, 2008 7:26 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience On Mar 11, 2008, at 12:56 AM, endlessrainintoapapercup wrote: I don't know what type of experience you are talking about, matrixmonitor...I'm only addressing the issue of conscious transcendence. If transcendence isn't conscious, how can anyone say with any certainty that it exists? My words about deeper states of meditative absorption were not intended to reflect TM-teach. I was just acknowledging that the experience I described, of pure consciousness beyond form, is just the beginning of culturing deeper and deeper meditative states. TM may not acknowledge them, but other meditation traditions do. My original question was simply whether TM produces conscious transcendence for others, as it doesn't seem to do so for me. Until you're centered and fully transcended at the level of the makara-bindu and open the eye of knowledge, the third eye as the TM puja mentions, most TMers will just languish in a laya-samadhi. The techniques to actually awaken awareness there aren't taught in TM, so unless you're somehow predisposed to awaken so highly, it just doesn't happen. Some yogis have noted TMers--esp. TM-Sidhi practitioners have blocks in their nervous system (actually their pranic bodies) that can prevent such full awakening. Rounding continuously for decades in a laya can't be a good thing. But if you've ever met the sickly Purusha's of the TMO and the resultant distorted personality types, one does start to wonder how healthy it is. Some of these guys looks like they were vampirized for years. It's also probably why TM doesn't make the brain very coherent at all like as is seen in deep meditation/samadhi. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
On Mar 11, 2008, at 5:33 PM, endlessrainintoapapercup wrote: Some yogis have noted TMers--esp. TM-Sidhi practitioners have blocks in their nervous system (actually their pranic bodies) that can prevent such full awakening. What exactly causes these alleged blocks? Imbalanced kundalini risings which take non-culminating routes. Several people with vajra-nadi risings that I've spoken to. They believe sidhi cultivation has a lot to do with it. See http://www.kundalinicare.com/aboutkundalini3.html These people--a swami from the Saraswati order and his American lineholder--have spent a lot of time helping old TMers, including some higher-ups who skidaddled the TMO years ago. They also come to Fairfield from what I see every now and again. One letter from one of MMY's old close students, Earl Kaplan, is in the FFL archives. He seems to feel it was deliberate, but who knows?
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
Sorry, Kirk. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Kirk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I didn't say that shit. I don't believe it either. But I also don't believe that TMers are very enlightened. Look around. On the other hand, the enlightened can be enlightened sleepetators, enlightened dogshit cleaneruppers,and enlightened twirps as we see here all the time. Enlightenment is overrated. At the very least it should be conscious volition to be what one is without regret. Maybe you and other blackouters like blacking out. Sounds fun to me. I have never been able to lose consciousness ever through any means, except for that one Mardi-Gras where I woke up and I was walking sideways down the street and hours had gone by. Alcohol is very not enlightening. It was the Vaj Genie who sayeth thusly. He is like very fractal Bro, don't get him started. - Original Message - From: endlessrainintoapapercup [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, March 11, 2008 4:33 PM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience Kirk said: Some yogis have noted TMers--esp. TM-Sidhi practitioners have blocks in their nervous system (actually their pranic bodies) that can prevent such full awakening. What exactly causes these alleged blocks? --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Kirk kirk_bernhardt@ wrote: That vampired look I have determined comes from squeezing the eyes shut for many hours a day which gives a person bruises under their eyes (dark circles) and also from the lack of sunlight. I used to look like that from rounding. Most people do at some point. - Original Message - From: Vaj To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, March 11, 2008 7:26 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience On Mar 11, 2008, at 12:56 AM, endlessrainintoapapercup wrote: I don't know what type of experience you are talking about, matrixmonitor...I'm only addressing the issue of conscious transcendence. If transcendence isn't conscious, how can anyone say with any certainty that it exists? My words about deeper states of meditative absorption were not intended to reflect TM-teach. I was just acknowledging that the experience I described, of pure consciousness beyond form, is just the beginning of culturing deeper and deeper meditative states. TM may not acknowledge them, but other meditation traditions do. My original question was simply whether TM produces conscious transcendence for others, as it doesn't seem to do so for me. Until you're centered and fully transcended at the level of the makara-bindu and open the eye of knowledge, the third eye as the TM puja mentions, most TMers will just languish in a laya-samadhi. The techniques to actually awaken awareness there aren't taught in TM, so unless you're somehow predisposed to awaken so highly, it just doesn't happen. Some yogis have noted TMers--esp. TM-Sidhi practitioners have blocks in their nervous system (actually their pranic bodies) that can prevent such full awakening. Rounding continuously for decades in a laya can't be a good thing. But if you've ever met the sickly Purusha's of the TMO and the resultant distorted personality types, one does start to wonder how healthy it is. Some of these guys looks like they were vampirized for years. It's also probably why TM doesn't make the brain very coherent at all like as is seen in deep meditation/samadhi. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
I have to give out a long bwahaha at this website. Bwahaha (again even!) Nevermind. People believe what they believe. But Kundalini - Ma and myself, we think they're full of it, don't we darling, yehi.. Sa sa But really, so much lore, so little practical value. But then people go live at Ganga-jis feet too. So go figure. Given the amount of TM meditators since the fifties, they have gone on to just about form or make up part of every other cult on the planet. - Original Message - From: Vaj To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, March 11, 2008 4:56 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience On Mar 11, 2008, at 5:33 PM, endlessrainintoapapercup wrote: Some yogis have noted TMers--esp. TM-Sidhi practitioners have blocks in their nervous system (actually their pranic bodies) that can prevent such full awakening. What exactly causes these alleged blocks? Imbalanced kundalini risings which take non-culminating routes. Several people with vajra-nadi risings that I've spoken to. They believe sidhi cultivation has a lot to do with it. See http://www.kundalinicare.com/aboutkundalini3.html These people--a swami from the Saraswati order and his American lineholder--have spent a lot of time helping old TMers, including some higher-ups who skidaddled the TMO years ago. They also come to Fairfield from what I see every now and again. One letter from one of MMY's old close students, Earl Kaplan, is in the FFL archives. He seems to feel it was deliberate, but who knows?
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
you're making this way too complicated, simplify, simplify, there's nothing to this --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mar 11, 2008, at 5:33 PM, endlessrainintoapapercup wrote: Some yogis have noted TMers--esp. TM-Sidhi practitioners have blocks in their nervous system (actually their pranic bodies) that can prevent such full awakening. What exactly causes these alleged blocks? Imbalanced kundalini risings which take non-culminating routes. Several people with vajra-nadi risings that I've spoken to. They believe sidhi cultivation has a lot to do with it. See http://www.kundalinicare.com/aboutkundalini3.html These people--a swami from the Saraswati order and his American lineholder--have spent a lot of time helping old TMers, including some higher-ups who skidaddled the TMO years ago. They also come to Fairfield from what I see every now and again. One letter from one of MMY's old close students, Earl Kaplan, is in the FFL archives. He seems to feel it was deliberate, but who knows?
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Nice site Vaj-Just a few items the TMorg doesn't have the slightest idea about, how pathetic!! (the TM org) See http://www.kundalinicare.com/aboutkundalini3.html On Mar 11, 2008, at 5:33 PM, endlessrainintoapapercup wrote: Some yogis have noted TMers--esp. TM-Sidhi practitioners have blocks in their nervous system (actually their pranic bodies) that can prevent such full awakening. What exactly causes these alleged blocks? Imbalanced kundalini risings which take non-culminating routes. Several people with vajra-nadi risings that I've spoken to. They believe sidhi cultivation has a lot to do with it. See http://www.kundalinicare.com/aboutkundalini3.html These people--a swami from the Saraswati order and his American lineholder--have spent a lot of time helping old TMers, including some higher-ups who skidaddled the TMO years ago. They also come to Fairfield from what I see every now and again. One letter from one of MMY's old close students, Earl Kaplan, is in the FFL archives. He seems to feel it was deliberate, but who knows?
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
On Mar 11, 2008, at 5:40 PM, Kirk wrote: He is like very fractal Bro, don't get him started. Oh no no no. Ain't going down that slippery slope again. I already contacted Mr. E and would simply take it offlist.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
On Mar 11, 2008, at 6:13 PM, Larry wrote: you're making this way too complicated, simplify, simplify, there's nothing to this Really, you shouldn't be telling me, as I am not one of the people who went through this. Some did suffer pain for years or decades. I did have a rather excellent time with the TMSP...but when I was done, I knew it was done. Just walked away and never went back.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
On Mar 11, 2008, at 6:23 PM, BillyG. wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Nice site Vaj-Just a few items the TMorg doesn't have the slightest idea about, how pathetic!! (the TM org) Seem like nice people. They facilitate any one, any path without bias which is very rare these days, although they are from the same tradition as dear SBS.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mar 11, 2008, at 5:33 PM, endlessrainintoapapercup wrote: Some yogis have noted TMers--esp. TM-Sidhi practitioners have blocks in their nervous system (actually their pranic bodies) that can prevent such full awakening. What exactly causes these alleged blocks? Imbalanced kundalini risings which take non-culminating routes. Several people with vajra-nadi risings that I've spoken to. They believe sidhi cultivation has a lot to do with it. See http://www.kundalinicare.com/aboutkundalini3.html These people--a swami from the Saraswati order and his American lineholder--have spent a lot of time helping old TMers, including some higher-ups who skidaddled the TMO years ago. They also come to Fairfield from what I see every now and again. One letter from one of MMY's old close students, Earl Kaplan, is in the FFL archives. He seems to feel it was deliberate, but who knows? the website looks like a great way to make a buck off gullible spritual seekers. anything to prolong the process of enlightenment or more importantly put the answers in someone else's hands, save our own, eh Vaj? do you get a cut of the proceeds or free courses or something?
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
On Mar 11, 2008, at 6:46 PM, sandiego108 wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mar 11, 2008, at 5:33 PM, endlessrainintoapapercup wrote: Some yogis have noted TMers--esp. TM-Sidhi practitioners have blocks in their nervous system (actually their pranic bodies) that can prevent such full awakening. What exactly causes these alleged blocks? Imbalanced kundalini risings which take non-culminating routes. Several people with vajra-nadi risings that I've spoken to. They believe sidhi cultivation has a lot to do with it. See http://www.kundalinicare.com/aboutkundalini3.html These people--a swami from the Saraswati order and his American lineholder--have spent a lot of time helping old TMers, including some higher-ups who skidaddled the TMO years ago. They also come to Fairfield from what I see every now and again. One letter from one of MMY's old close students, Earl Kaplan, is in the FFL archives. He seems to feel it was deliberate, but who knows? the website looks like a great way to make a buck off gullible spritual seekers. anything to prolong the process of enlightenment or more importantly put the answers in someone else's hands, save our own, eh Vaj? do you get a cut of the proceeds or free courses or something? It may not be for me (it may not be for you, but I would not ignore that which has helped or will help the suffering. It's just not in my nature to do so.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
the website looks like a great way to make a buck off gullible spritual seekers. anything to prolong the process of enlightenment or more importantly put the answers in someone else's hands, save our own, eh Vaj? do you get a cut of the proceeds or free courses or something? --Yeah, I mean, they might have good motivation, but throw money into the equation and that will always be questionable. I laughed hard because of all the varieties of kundalini. I mean, that's just patent bullshit. Either Kundalini is Ma - the Mother Adiparashakti, and She knows what to do, or else She doesn't and She's pointlessly confused, in which case there's no hope. The whole notion of controlling it is rather silly. Also all the mentions of higher powers and stuff is pretty far fetched. I mean, some siddhis happen, but mapping it out like it's a fait accompli is stupid. Finally, the ideas are old and have not been made into something palpable on modern pulses, so it's just basically another quaint Hindu con. Call me a cynic. But if I have problems with the power of awareness I put it back to awareness to deal with it. That's it! That's another way of saying just give up. That takes care of all blockages. Just give the fuck right up.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Kirk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: the website looks like a great way to make a buck off gullible spritual seekers. anything to prolong the process of enlightenment or more importantly put the answers in someone else's hands, save our own, eh Vaj? do you get a cut of the proceeds or free courses or something? --Yeah, I mean, they might have good motivation, but throw money into the equation and that will always be questionable. I laughed hard because of all the varieties of kundalini. I mean, that's just patent bullshit. Either Kundalini is Ma - the Mother Adiparashakti, and She knows what to do, or else She doesn't and She's pointlessly confused, in which case there's no hope. The whole notion of controlling it is rather silly. Also all the mentions of higher powers and stuff is pretty far fetched. I mean, some siddhis happen, but mapping it out like it's a fait accompli is stupid. Finally, the ideas are old and have not been made into something palpable on modern pulses, so it's just basically another quaint Hindu con. Call me a cynic. But if I have problems with the power of awareness I put it back to awareness to deal with it. That's it! That's another way of saying just give up. That takes care of all blockages. Just give the fuck right up. if I have problems with the power of awareness I put it back to awareness to deal with it. exactly-- no reason to go running off somewhere else, its *all* right here.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mar 11, 2008, at 6:46 PM, sandiego108 wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj vajranatha@ wrote: On Mar 11, 2008, at 5:33 PM, endlessrainintoapapercup wrote: Some yogis have noted TMers--esp. TM-Sidhi practitioners have blocks in their nervous system (actually their pranic bodies) that can prevent such full awakening. What exactly causes these alleged blocks? Imbalanced kundalini risings which take non-culminating routes. Several people with vajra-nadi risings that I've spoken to. They believe sidhi cultivation has a lot to do with it. See http://www.kundalinicare.com/aboutkundalini3.html These people--a swami from the Saraswati order and his American lineholder--have spent a lot of time helping old TMers, including some higher-ups who skidaddled the TMO years ago. They also come to Fairfield from what I see every now and again. One letter from one of MMY's old close students, Earl Kaplan, is in the FFL archives. He seems to feel it was deliberate, but who knows? the website looks like a great way to make a buck off gullible spritual seekers. anything to prolong the process of enlightenment or more importantly put the answers in someone else's hands, save our own, eh Vaj? do you get a cut of the proceeds or free courses or something? It may not be for me (it may not be for you, but I would not ignore that which has helped or will help the suffering. It's just not in my nature to do so. except those that are suffering that may benefit from TM...
