Re: [Faudiostream-users] demand-rate in faust?

2020-08-07 Thread Julius Smith 
That looks really nice!

- Julius

On Fri, Aug 7, 2020 at 12:31 PM Yann Orlarey  wrote:

> Hi Till,
>
> Thank you very much for your detailed answer. It's very helpful. On my
> side, I tried to formalize my ideas for an on-demand primitive. A
> description is available here:
> https://drive.google.com/file/d/1mEKkW3fKl9Ik8zsClxMzlMWKBjGl-teK/view?usp=sharing.
> This is still very partial and many aspects remain to be detailed...
>
> Yann
>
> *Yann Orlarey*
> Directeur scientifique/Scientific director
>
>
> orla...@grame.fr  T : +33 (0) 4 72 07 37 00
> GRAME - Centre national de création musicale
> 11 cours de Verdun Gensoul | 69002 Lyon
> www.grame.fr | facebook  | instagram
>  | twitter
> 
>
>
> Le mer. 5 août 2020 à 14:06, Till Bovermann  a écrit :
>
>> Dear Yann,
>>
>>
>> I can try...
>>
>> In SC, a demand-rate UGen graph is encapsuled into one of (currently)
>> three different UGens:
>>
>> Demand.ar/kr
>> Duty.ar/kr
>> TDuty.ar/kr
>>
>> Their functionality vary marginally (triggered execution/execution every
>> `dur` secs, etc.).
>>
>> Each of them has three slots:
>>
>> 1. update input — either a trigger (Demand) or a Demand-rate UGen /
>> scalar (duration, Duty/TDuty)
>> 2. reset input — if value passes from neg to pos, reset the value stream
>> to initial conditions
>> 3. value stream — a Demand-rate UGen graph
>>
>>
>> Demand-rate UGens are UGens that calculate their values every time they
>> are triggered to do so from the outside, read more elaborate descriptions
>> on this here:
>>
>> http://doc.sccode.org/Classes/Demand.html
>> and
>> http://doc.sccode.org/Classes/Duty.html
>>
>>
>> internally, the wrapper-UGens (Demand et al) implement the following
>> behavior:
>>
>> ```
>> if reset:
>> call `next(nan)` on Demand-UGen in demand chain, this makes it
>> reset.
>> else if call for next value:
>> calculate how many values are needed for the current block (N)
>> ask for N values from demand chain by providing
>> else:
>> keep last value (Demand/Duty), or 0 (TDemand)
>> ```
>>
>>
>> A demand-rate UGen with parameters in its param-slots does this if its
>> next function is called:
>>
>> ```
>> if numSamples == nan:
>> for each UGen in param-slots:
>> call `next(nan)`, this makes it reset.
>> reset myself
>> else:
>> for each UGen in param-slots:
>> call next(numSamples) and collect values in array
>> compute numSample output based on parameters
>> ```
>>
>> All relevant source code for the implementation is here:
>>
>>
>> https://github.com/supercollider/supercollider/blob/develop/server/plugins/DemandUGens.cpp
>>
>>
>> hope this helps and I did not make too many errors...
>> Till
>>
>> --
>> Till Bovermann
>>
>> https://tai-studio.org | http://lfsaw.de |
>> https://www.instagram.com/_lfsaw/
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> > On 2. Aug 2020, at 18:40, Yann Orlarey  wrote:
>> >
>> > Hi Till,
>> >
>> > Thanks for the offer! Could you explain in a few words how demand-rate
>> works in supercollider?
>> > Cheers
>> >
>> > Yann
>> >
>> > Yann Orlarey
>> > Directeur scientifique/Scientific director
>> >
>> >
>> > orla...@grame.fr T : +33 (0) 4 72 07 37 00
>> > GRAME - Centre national de création musicale
>> > 11 cours de Verdun Gensoul | 69002 Lyon
>> > www.grame.fr | facebook | instagram | twitter
>> >
>> >
>> > Le sam. 1 août 2020 à 18:29, Till Bovermann  a écrit :
>> > dear list, yann, james,
>> >
>> > this is exciting news indeed! i think, faust will substantially benefit
>> from an on-demand evaluation possibility. i am very happy to help with my
>> experiences as a long-term supercollider user and developer. it might be
>> interesting to look at the implementation of demand-rate ugens in sc3,
>> especially the possibility to reset pattern generating engines.
>> >
>> > all the best
>> > till
>> >
>> >> On 31. Jul 2020, at 21:40, Yann Orlarey  wrote:
>> >>
>> >> 
>> >> Hi,
>> >>
>> >> After these exchanges, I am quite convinced of the interest of having
>> on-demand computation in Faust!
>> >>
>> >> As I said in my previous email, it can't be the current control
>> primitive. It must actually be an operation on signal processors, not an
>> operation on signals. The challenge is to find a primitive that keeps the
>> simple and well-defined semantics of Faust.
>> >>
>> >> I started to think about this and sketched an `ondemand(P)` primitive
>> that transforms a P processor into an equivalent on-demand version with an
>> extra clock input.
>> >>
>> >> This is all very preliminary, but for those interested, my notes are
>> here https://photos.app.goo.gl/UTHpYfz5q1oe4CRV7, although I doubt it
>> would be understandable to anyone but me ;-)
>> >>
>> >> If you have specific use cases and examples to feed the reflection, it
>> would be helpful to us...
>> >>
>> >> Cheers
>> >>
>>

Re: [Faudiostream-users] demand-rate in faust?

2020-08-07 Thread Yann Orlarey 
Hi Till,

Thank you very much for your detailed answer. It's very helpful. On my
side, I tried to formalize my ideas for an on-demand primitive. A
description is available here:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1mEKkW3fKl9Ik8zsClxMzlMWKBjGl-teK/view?usp=sharing.
This is still very partial and many aspects remain to be detailed...

Yann

*Yann Orlarey*
Directeur scientifique/Scientific director


orla...@grame.fr  T : +33 (0) 4 72 07 37 00
GRAME - Centre national de création musicale
11 cours de Verdun Gensoul | 69002 Lyon
www.grame.fr | facebook  | instagram
 | twitter



Le mer. 5 août 2020 à 14:06, Till Bovermann  a écrit :

> Dear Yann,
>
>
> I can try...
>
> In SC, a demand-rate UGen graph is encapsuled into one of (currently)
> three different UGens:
>
> Demand.ar/kr
> Duty.ar/kr
> TDuty.ar/kr
>
> Their functionality vary marginally (triggered execution/execution every
> `dur` secs, etc.).
>
> Each of them has three slots:
>
> 1. update input — either a trigger (Demand) or a Demand-rate UGen / scalar
> (duration, Duty/TDuty)
> 2. reset input — if value passes from neg to pos, reset the value stream
> to initial conditions
> 3. value stream — a Demand-rate UGen graph
>
>
> Demand-rate UGens are UGens that calculate their values every time they
> are triggered to do so from the outside, read more elaborate descriptions
> on this here:
>
> http://doc.sccode.org/Classes/Demand.html
> and
> http://doc.sccode.org/Classes/Duty.html
>
>
> internally, the wrapper-UGens (Demand et al) implement the following
> behavior:
>
> ```
> if reset:
> call `next(nan)` on Demand-UGen in demand chain, this makes it
> reset.
> else if call for next value:
> calculate how many values are needed for the current block (N)
> ask for N values from demand chain by providing
> else:
> keep last value (Demand/Duty), or 0 (TDemand)
> ```
>
>
> A demand-rate UGen with parameters in its param-slots does this if its
> next function is called:
>
> ```
> if numSamples == nan:
> for each UGen in param-slots:
> call `next(nan)`, this makes it reset.
> reset myself
> else:
> for each UGen in param-slots:
> call next(numSamples) and collect values in array
> compute numSample output based on parameters
> ```
>
> All relevant source code for the implementation is here:
>
>
> https://github.com/supercollider/supercollider/blob/develop/server/plugins/DemandUGens.cpp
>
>
> hope this helps and I did not make too many errors...
> Till
>
> --
> Till Bovermann
>
> https://tai-studio.org | http://lfsaw.de |
> https://www.instagram.com/_lfsaw/
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On 2. Aug 2020, at 18:40, Yann Orlarey  wrote:
> >
> > Hi Till,
> >
> > Thanks for the offer! Could you explain in a few words how demand-rate
> works in supercollider?
> > Cheers
> >
> > Yann
> >
> > Yann Orlarey
> > Directeur scientifique/Scientific director
> >
> >
> > orla...@grame.fr T : +33 (0) 4 72 07 37 00
> > GRAME - Centre national de création musicale
> > 11 cours de Verdun Gensoul | 69002 Lyon
> > www.grame.fr | facebook | instagram | twitter
> >
> >
> > Le sam. 1 août 2020 à 18:29, Till Bovermann  a écrit :
> > dear list, yann, james,
> >
> > this is exciting news indeed! i think, faust will substantially benefit
> from an on-demand evaluation possibility. i am very happy to help with my
> experiences as a long-term supercollider user and developer. it might be
> interesting to look at the implementation of demand-rate ugens in sc3,
> especially the possibility to reset pattern generating engines.
> >
> > all the best
> > till
> >
> >> On 31. Jul 2020, at 21:40, Yann Orlarey  wrote:
> >>
> >> 
> >> Hi,
> >>
> >> After these exchanges, I am quite convinced of the interest of having
> on-demand computation in Faust!
> >>
> >> As I said in my previous email, it can't be the current control
> primitive. It must actually be an operation on signal processors, not an
> operation on signals. The challenge is to find a primitive that keeps the
> simple and well-defined semantics of Faust.
> >>
> >> I started to think about this and sketched an `ondemand(P)` primitive
> that transforms a P processor into an equivalent on-demand version with an
> extra clock input.
> >>
> >> This is all very preliminary, but for those interested, my notes are
> here https://photos.app.goo.gl/UTHpYfz5q1oe4CRV7, although I doubt it
> would be understandable to anyone but me ;-)
> >>
> >> If you have specific use cases and examples to feed the reflection, it
> would be helpful to us...
> >>
> >> Cheers
> >>
> >> Yann
> >>
> >> Yann Orlarey
> >> Directeur scientifique/Scientific director
> >>
> >>
> >> orla...@grame.fr T : +33 (0) 4 72 07 37 00
> >> GRAME - Centre national de création musicale
> >> 11 cours de Verdun Gensoul | 69002 Lyon
> >> www.grame.fr | facebook | instagram |