[filmscanners] RE: Re:24bit vs more
Rob, One of the problems with raw scans of negative film is that they are unreversed and do not have the orange masking removed, which is one of the reasons that most people use the scanner software to do this prior to sending the output to an image editor. Typically, by calling the scanner software into play, the file gets converted to 24 bit so that the scanner software can perform the functions. This is why I also do not send raw scanner data (high bit or otherwise) from the scanner directly to an image editor when working with negative color film stock. Instead, I send a reversed and mask removed 24-bit image file to the image editor using the default scanner set points (unless they are way out of wack for the image) and tonal curves, where I do a more refined set of enhancement and correction adjustments to the set points and tonal curves with respect to my working file. For my purposes, I call the data I export to the image editor in such cases a "low bit raw file;" but it is not what is technically considered a raw file. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Rob Geraghty Sent: Monday, September 15, 2003 4:30 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [filmscanners] Re:24bit vs more "Austin Franklin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > You should either get raw data from the scanner, or do the setpoints/tonal > curves "correctly" in the scanner software. Keep in mind, every time you > re-do setpoints/tonal curves, you are degrading the data. It's just a fact > of how setpoints/tonal curves work. What the significance of that > degradation is, will vary greatly, so it may not be *that* bad...but why do > things twice when you can do them right the first time? Are you saying this applies when using Vuescan - especially with negs? Or are you assuming the sort of interface that Nikonscan provides? > > Getting the *right* 24 > > bits can sometimes better be done with an image editing program than the > > scanner's interface. > I understand that some scanner software is lacking, and that is where you > simply should get raw data from the scanner, and learn how to do a better > job of setpoints and tonal curves in PS. OK, then I think we agree? Other than what you mean by "raw data". I wouldn't ever attempt to use an editor (I don't own PS by the way) to do what Vuescan does to go from the raw scanner output from a neg to produce a positive image. Rob Unsubscribe by mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], with 'unsubscribe filmscanners' or 'unsubscribe filmscanners_digest' (as appropriate) in the message title or body Unsubscribe by mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], with 'unsubscribe filmscanners' or 'unsubscribe filmscanners_digest' (as appropriate) in the message title or body
[filmscanners] RE: Re:24bit vs more
Hi Robert, >save scanner corrected TIF (16 bit) ..."scanner corrected...16 bit"... Does your scanner allow setpoints and correction to high bit data? What scanner is it? This is not a property of the software, but of the scanner hardware/firmware. > Can I assume that the RAW scan is just that, > it will always be the same w.r.t a particular > scanner and this negative, forgiving minor > variations, but will vary on the scanning software. It shouldn't vary with the scanning software. Each different scanner may handle raw data differently, and of course, will give you different data based on the exposure time, the A/D, characteristics of the CCD, so it won't really be exactly the same. Some may be quite close, but some may be quite different. Regards, Austin Unsubscribe by mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], with 'unsubscribe filmscanners' or 'unsubscribe filmscanners_digest' (as appropriate) in the message title or body
[filmscanners] Re: Re:24bit vs more
> Typically, when you get high bit data from the scanner, it's raw data. Raw > data specifically means the setpoints have not been set, or the tonal curves > applied. Having left the 8/16 hobbyhorse, but Im interested in the whole RAW data thing. My workflow for a neg roll is thus: (using Vuescan): scan neg profile (the vuescan film profile) loop scan frame save RAW data save scanner corrected TIF (16 bit) correct in Photoshop as required save PNg/JPG/small files for general viewing I archive the RAW files as Ive learnt (early in my scanning days) that Vuescans colour models improve over time, and I can get significant differences ... well, to me at least, with a review of particularly difficult frames. Can I assume that the RAW scan is just that, it will always be the same w.r.t a particular scanner and this negative, forgiving minor variations, but will vary on the scanning software. bert -- Linux - reaches the parts that other beers fail to reach. Unsubscribe by mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], with 'unsubscribe filmscanners' or 'unsubscribe filmscanners_digest' (as appropriate) in the message title or body
[filmscanners] RE: Re:24bit vs more
Hi Rob, > > You should either get raw data from the scanner, or do the > setpoints/tonal > > curves "correctly" in the scanner software. Keep in mind, > every time you > > re-do setpoints/tonal curves, you are degrading the data. It's just a > fact > > of how setpoints/tonal curves work. What the significance of that > > degradation is, will vary greatly, so it may not be *that* bad...but why > do > > things twice when you can do them right the first time? > > Are you saying this applies when using Vuescan - especially with negs? That is probably how every filmscanner that you or I would use, works... The issue is the software (and possibly hardware), and how it allows you to control this...but if you can get 8 bit data, it's got to have it's setpoints set and tonal curves applied. Some scanners do the setpoints automatically in the scanner. Some use "profiles" to apply the tonal curves... > Or > are you assuming the sort of interface that Nikonscan provides? I'm not assuming any specific interface... > > > Getting the *right* 24 > > > bits can sometimes better be done with an image editing > program than the > > > scanner's interface. > > I understand that some scanner software is lacking, and that is > where you > > simply should get raw data from the scanner, and learn how to > do a better > > job of setpoints and tonal curves in PS. > > OK, then I think we agree? Other than what you mean by "raw data". Typically, when you get high bit data from the scanner, it's raw data. Raw data specifically means the setpoints have not been set, or the tonal curves applied. What do you think raw data means? Regards, Austin Unsubscribe by mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], with 'unsubscribe filmscanners' or 'unsubscribe filmscanners_digest' (as appropriate) in the message title or body
