Re: [Finale] [OT] keyboard and mouse dying / suggestions for new devices?
On 7 Apr 2011 at 21:51, Darcy James Argue wrote: The difference with the Apple Magic Trackpad vs. a conventional mouse is that you never have to move your wrist at all -- only your fingers. Again, if you're using a conventional mouse correctly, you don't move the hand, either -- you rotate the wrist and flex the fingers to have full range of motion of the mouse. Of course, you've got to have your mouse settings set correctly to do this -- if you have them set to require too much travel, you end up having to move you hand on the desk. Set properly, the wrist rests on the desk and stays entirely stationary. 15 years ago, I was training DOS users how to use the mouse for the first time, as they switched to Windows, and this was one of the basic principles I had to show them, as it isn't obvious to those who haven't used the mouse before. -- David W. Fentonhttp://dfenton.com David Fenton Associates http://dfenton.com/DFA/ ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] [OT] keyboard and mouse dying / suggestions for new devices?
Hi David, That may have been true for the earliest Windows displays, which would have been, what, 640x480 pixels? But I don't know how you'd cover a modern display (1950x1080 pixels and above) with a conventional mouse without having to move your wrist forward and back a little when moving the cursor large vertical distances, unless you set your tracking speed so high that fine adjustments are impossible. And of course, multi-montior setups require even more motion. Another advantage to the trackpad is that if you reach the edge of the surface and still need more motion, you can just pick up your finger (instead of having to pick up the mouse). Cheers, - DJA - WEB: http://www.secretsocietymusic.org On 7 Apr 2011, at 10:00 PM, David W. Fenton wrote: On 7 Apr 2011 at 21:51, Darcy James Argue wrote: The difference with the Apple Magic Trackpad vs. a conventional mouse is that you never have to move your wrist at all -- only your fingers. Again, if you're using a conventional mouse correctly, you don't move the hand, either -- you rotate the wrist and flex the fingers to have full range of motion of the mouse. Of course, you've got to have your mouse settings set correctly to do this -- if you have them set to require too much travel, you end up having to move you hand on the desk. Set properly, the wrist rests on the desk and stays entirely stationary. 15 years ago, I was training DOS users how to use the mouse for the first time, as they switched to Windows, and this was one of the basic principles I had to show them, as it isn't obvious to those who haven't used the mouse before. -- David W. Fentonhttp://dfenton.com David Fenton Associates http://dfenton.com/DFA/ ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] [OT] keyboard and mouse dying / suggestions for new devices?
On 8 Apr 2011 at 11:39, Darcy James Argue wrote: That may have been true for the earliest Windows displays, which would have been, what, 640x480 pixels? But I don't know how you'd cover a modern display (1950x1080 pixels and above) with a conventional mouse without having to move your wrist forward and back a little when moving the cursor large vertical distances, unless you set your tracking speed so high that fine adjustments are impossible. And of course, multi-montior setups require even more motion. I'm using it just exactly that way with two monitors, total resolution of 2390 x 768, and it's no problem. My mouse lives in an area of the desk that's little more than 3 x 5. Perhaps this is one of those Windows/Mac differences, in that I find the default settings for the mouse on Macs to be incredibly slow and difficult and requiring an awful lot of movement of the mouse. At least, that's the case with every Mac I ever recall sitting down at. I know perfectly well that Mac users find their hardware-based mouse more responsive and controllable than Windows' software-based mouse, but I always feel like I'm controlling the Mac through molasses. I suspect that if I had a Mac myself I could set the cursor acceleration and other settings to match my preferences, but has been my experience that the Mac users whose computers I have used do not make those adjustments (or for some reason prefer slow response). -- David W. Fentonhttp://dfenton.com David Fenton Associates http://dfenton.com/DFA/ ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] [OT] keyboard and mouse dying / suggestions for new devices?
On 8-Apr-11, at 8-Apr-11 1:10 PM, David W. Fenton wrote: On 8 Apr 2011 at 11:39, Darcy James Argue wrote: That may have been true for the earliest Windows displays, which would have been, what, 640x480 pixels? But I don't know how you'd cover a modern display (1950x1080 pixels and above) with a conventional mouse without having to move your wrist forward and back a little when moving the cursor large vertical distances, unless you set your tracking speed so high that fine adjustments are impossible. And of course, multi-montior setups require even more motion. I'm using it just exactly that way with two monitors, total resolution of 2390 x 768, and it's no problem. My mouse lives in an area of the desk that's little more than 3 x 5. Perhaps this is one of those Windows/Mac differences, in that I find the default settings for the mouse on Macs to be incredibly slow and difficult and requiring an awful lot of movement of the mouse. At least, that's the case with every Mac I ever recall sitting down at. I know perfectly well that Mac users find their hardware-based mouse more responsive and controllable than Windows' software-based mouse, but I always feel like I'm controlling the Mac through molasses. I suspect that if I had a Mac myself I could set the cursor acceleration and other settings to match my preferences, but has been my experience that the Mac users whose computers I have used do not make those adjustments (or for some reason prefer slow response). -- David W. Fenton I don't know (I don't remember now) if it came with my Logictech software for my mouse or if it's the Mac control panel settings, but I have my mouse set so that if I move it fast it leaps across the monitor, and if I move it slow, it moves only a little bit for fine adjustments. I have a giant monitor with a second smaller monitor beside it and don't have much problem negotiating the real estate. Christopher ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
RE: SPAM LOW: Re: [Finale] [OT] keyboard and mouse dying / suggestions for new devices?
I also like the Magic Trackpad--all the good reasons that Darcy lists. I also like Apple's **wired** keyboard which includes a number pad. It has a very good tactile response to your fingers even though it looks flat and like it has toy keys. They keys are much more substantial than they appear. (at risk of being immodest, I was a business teacher in a former life and type 90 to 100 words a minute on a not so good day.) George Brooke -Original Message- From: finale-boun...@shsu.edu [mailto:finale-boun...@shsu.edu] On Behalf Of Darcy James Argue Sent: Wednesday, April 06, 2011 8:43 PM To: finale@shsu.edu Subject: SPAM LOW: Re: [Finale] [OT] keyboard and mouse dying / suggestions for new devices? I really love Apple's Magic Trackpad -- wireless, nice big glass surface, inertial scrolling in both directions, multi-touch gesture support, and *much* less wrist strain since I only need to move my fingers (instead of pushing a lump of plastic around all day). When I have to go back to a traditional mouse I hate it. I always liked the idea of trackballs (for similar reasons) but in practice never found one that worked for me. The Magic Trackpad turned out to be the perfect solution, for my own needs at least. Cheers, - DJA - WEB: http://www.secretsocietymusic.org On 7 Apr 2011, at 4:31 AM, SN jef chippewa wrote: (currently using a macbook pro) my devices seem to be both kacking out on me at the same time, so it looks like i will soon be in the market for new ones. am quite happy wth what i have at present, but am up for hearing about different setups as well. i am currently packing a: 1) macally iKey USB extended keyboard (was about 80 bucks i think) with 5' cable and numpad - big and loud but love the tactile quality of this baby and the larger layout, which i find nicer and easier to use than smaller models http://lowendmac.com/usb/ikey.shtml - sometimes seems to intermittently hold keys (actually i only notice this in finale when using metatools...) and now randomly stops working entirely, but waiting or rebooting solves this prob 2) logitech M-BA47 ergonomic mouse (also cost something above 50 bucks as i recall) with individually programmable L/R buttons, scroll wheel (3rd button) and thumb button http://www.tcocd.de/Pictures/Peripheral/Logitech/mba47.shtml - i have to press and hold the L button hard for it to work now (serious PITA when dragging items, they get released too soon) and seems to have a prob either with the cabling or plug, as it freezes sometimes (i clean the rollers and mousepad regularly, this is not the prob), and shaking the cable usually makes it work again... i really don't mind *not* having wireless, i unplug everything from the dumbputer when i need to be mobile and recently travelled a month without really needing it (well, no finale work in that time :-) ). and i generally don't like apple's external devices... any suggestions appreciated. PS as i finish this message they are working again properly... grr. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] [OT] keyboard and mouse dying / suggestions for new devices?
Question about Magic Track Pad For my architectural work, as well as for all graphic and music programs, I agree, and have used the Turbo Mouse for many years, and currently use a wireless version. The greatest benefit to me, besides economy of movement, is that it supports all of the weight of my hand very restful. My question about the Magic Track Pad is that this might be lost. My laptop pad is not nearly as easy. Can anybody please speak to this? On Apr 6, 2011, at 9:56 PM, Richard Huggins wrote: i vote for MacAlly kb... wonderful feel .. for mouse I vote for the Kensington turbo trackball- very programmable and smooth movement Sent from my iPhone timothy.price timothy.pr...@valley.net ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
RE: SPAM LOW: Re: [Finale] [OT] keyboard and mouse dying / suggestions for new devices?
Darcy wrote: I really love Apple's Magic Trackpad Do you use any third party software to enable other features, or do you use it straight up with Apple's control panel? I've read about some other programs that broaden what the Magic Trackpad can do, though I wonder if I'd be able to remember all of the those gestures, etc. Andrew Levin ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] [OT] keyboard and mouse dying / suggestions for new devices?
You don't rest your hand on the trackpad itself, you rest it on the desk in front of the trackpad. I use a gel wrist rest, which is very comfortable. Cheers, - DJA - WEB: http://www.secretsocietymusic.org On 7 Apr 2011, at 11:15 AM, timothy.price wrote: Question about Magic Track Pad For my architectural work, as well as for all graphic and music programs, I agree, and have used the Turbo Mouse for many years, and currently use a wireless version. The greatest benefit to me, besides economy of movement, is that it supports all of the weight of my hand very restful. My question about the Magic Track Pad is that this might be lost. My laptop pad is not nearly as easy. Can anybody please speak to this? On Apr 6, 2011, at 9:56 PM, Richard Huggins wrote: i vote for MacAlly kb... wonderful feel .. for mouse I vote for the Kensington turbo trackball- very programmable and smooth movement Sent from my iPhone timothy.price timothy.pr...@valley.net ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] [OT] keyboard and mouse dying / suggestions for new devices?
On 7 Apr 2011 at 19:04, Darcy James Argue wrote: You don't rest your hand on the trackpad itself, you rest it on the desk in front of the trackpad. I use a gel wrist rest, which is very comfortable. If you're using a conventional mouse properly, you're doing exactly the same thing. -- David W. Fentonhttp://dfenton.com David Fenton Associates http://dfenton.com/DFA/ ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] [OT] keyboard and mouse dying / suggestions for new devices?
Right -- the wrist rest I have is actually part of a 2-piece mouse pad I already owned. The difference with the Apple Magic Trackpad vs. a conventional mouse is that you never have to move your wrist at all -- only your fingers. And you can just glide them over the glass surface -- you don't have to rotate a physical object, as with a trackball. (The surface is still clickable, though, which for me is key. I'm not a fan of tap to click -- I do want a tactile response when clicking.) Cheers, - DJA - WEB: http://www.secretsocietymusic.org On 7 Apr 2011, at 8:46 PM, David W. Fenton wrote: On 7 Apr 2011 at 19:04, Darcy James Argue wrote: You don't rest your hand on the trackpad itself, you rest it on the desk in front of the trackpad. I use a gel wrist rest, which is very comfortable. If you're using a conventional mouse properly, you're doing exactly the same thing. -- David W. Fentonhttp://dfenton.com David Fenton Associates http://dfenton.com/DFA/ ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] [OT] keyboard and mouse dying / suggestions for new devices?
On Apr 7, 2011, at 8:46 PM, David W. Fenton wrote: If you're using a conventional mouse properly Who on this list would think of using a conventional mouse improperly :-) timothy.price timothy.pr...@valley.net ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] [OT] keyboard and mouse dying / suggestions for new devices?
David W. Fenton wrote: If you're using a conventional mouse properly timothy.price replied: Who on this list would think of using a conventional mouse improperly :-) Perhaps the preacher who caught the mouse by the organ... -Randolph Peters ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
[Finale] [OT] keyboard and mouse dying / suggestions for new devices?
(currently using a macbook pro) my devices seem to be both kacking out on me at the same time, so it looks like i will soon be in the market for new ones. am quite happy wth what i have at present, but am up for hearing about different setups as well. i am currently packing a: 1) macally iKey USB extended keyboard (was about 80 bucks i think) with 5' cable and numpad - big and loud but love the tactile quality of this baby and the larger layout, which i find nicer and easier to use than smaller models http://lowendmac.com/usb/ikey.shtml - sometimes seems to intermittently hold keys (actually i only notice this in finale when using metatools...) and now randomly stops working entirely, but waiting or rebooting solves this prob 2) logitech M-BA47 ergonomic mouse (also cost something above 50 bucks as i recall) with individually programmable L/R buttons, scroll wheel (3rd button) and thumb button http://www.tcocd.de/Pictures/Peripheral/Logitech/mba47.shtml - i have to press and hold the L button hard for it to work now (serious PITA when dragging items, they get released too soon) and seems to have a prob either with the cabling or plug, as it freezes sometimes (i clean the rollers and mousepad regularly, this is not the prob), and shaking the cable usually makes it work again... i really don't mind *not* having wireless, i unplug everything from the dumbputer when i need to be mobile and recently travelled a month without really needing it (well, no finale work in that time :-) ). and i generally don't like apple's external devices... any suggestions appreciated. PS as i finish this message they are working again properly... grr. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] [OT] keyboard and mouse dying / suggestions for new devices?
I really love Apple's Magic Trackpad -- wireless, nice big glass surface, inertial scrolling in both directions, multi-touch gesture support, and *much* less wrist strain since I only need to move my fingers (instead of pushing a lump of plastic around all day). When I have to go back to a traditional mouse I hate it. I always liked the idea of trackballs (for similar reasons) but in practice never found one that worked for me. The Magic Trackpad turned out to be the perfect solution, for my own needs at least. Cheers, - DJA - WEB: http://www.secretsocietymusic.org On 7 Apr 2011, at 4:31 AM, SN jef chippewa wrote: (currently using a macbook pro) my devices seem to be both kacking out on me at the same time, so it looks like i will soon be in the market for new ones. am quite happy wth what i have at present, but am up for hearing about different setups as well. i am currently packing a: 1) macally iKey USB extended keyboard (was about 80 bucks i think) with 5' cable and numpad - big and loud but love the tactile quality of this baby and the larger layout, which i find nicer and easier to use than smaller models http://lowendmac.com/usb/ikey.shtml - sometimes seems to intermittently hold keys (actually i only notice this in finale when using metatools...) and now randomly stops working entirely, but waiting or rebooting solves this prob 2) logitech M-BA47 ergonomic mouse (also cost something above 50 bucks as i recall) with individually programmable L/R buttons, scroll wheel (3rd button) and thumb button http://www.tcocd.de/Pictures/Peripheral/Logitech/mba47.shtml - i have to press and hold the L button hard for it to work now (serious PITA when dragging items, they get released too soon) and seems to have a prob either with the cabling or plug, as it freezes sometimes (i clean the rollers and mousepad regularly, this is not the prob), and shaking the cable usually makes it work again... i really don't mind *not* having wireless, i unplug everything from the dumbputer when i need to be mobile and recently travelled a month without really needing it (well, no finale work in that time :-) ). and i generally don't like apple's external devices... any suggestions appreciated. PS as i finish this message they are working again properly... grr. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] [OT] keyboard and mouse dying / suggestions for new devices?
hm, that does really sound like a sexy option for me. i'm not big on batteries and wireless though. but will certainly check it out, i like it. i also never got the feel for a trackball, but have to admit i never actually used one in practice. my logitech mouse has been good to me. i found with trackballs i was having more difficulty in the precision of selecting handles in finale, but having done this with the trackpad, i suppose the magic TP would be fine for me. how long does a set of batteries hold out? I really love Apple's Magic Trackpad ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] [OT] keyboard and mouse dying / suggestions for new devices?
Hi Jef, I get 2-3 months of heavy use out of a pair of rechargeable AAs. Cheers, - DJA - WEB: http://www.secretsocietymusic.org On 7 Apr 2011, at 5:11 AM, SN jef chippewa wrote: hm, that does really sound like a sexy option for me. i'm not big on batteries and wireless though. but will certainly check it out, i like it. i also never got the feel for a trackball, but have to admit i never actually used one in practice. my logitech mouse has been good to me. i found with trackballs i was having more difficulty in the precision of selecting handles in finale, but having done this with the trackpad, i suppose the magic TP would be fine for me. how long does a set of batteries hold out? I really love Apple's Magic Trackpad ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] [OT] keyboard and mouse dying / suggestions for new devices?
i vote for MacAlly kb... wonderful feel .. for mouse I vote for the Kensington turbo trackball- very programmable and smooth movement Sent from my iPhone On Apr 7, 2011, at 3:31 AM, SN jef chippewa shirl...@newmusicnotation.com wrote: (currently using a macbook pro) my devices seem to be both kacking out on me at the same time, so it looks like i will soon be in the market for new ones. am quite happy wth what i have at present, but am up for hearing about different setups as well. i am currently packing a: 1) macally iKey USB extended keyboard (was about 80 bucks i think) with 5' cable and numpad - big and loud but love the tactile quality of this baby and the larger layout, which i find nicer and easier to use than smaller models http://lowendmac.com/usb/ikey.shtml - sometimes seems to intermittently hold keys (actually i only notice this in finale when using metatools...) and now randomly stops working entirely, but waiting or rebooting solves this prob 2) logitech M-BA47 ergonomic mouse (also cost something above 50 bucks as i recall) with individually programmable L/R buttons, scroll wheel (3rd button) and thumb button http://www.tcocd.de/Pictures/Peripheral/Logitech/mba47.shtml - i have to press and hold the L button hard for it to work now (serious PITA when dragging items, they get released too soon) and seems to have a prob either with the cabling or plug, as it freezes sometimes (i clean the rollers and mousepad regularly, this is not the prob), and shaking the cable usually makes it work again... i really don't mind *not* having wireless, i unplug everything from the dumbputer when i need to be mobile and recently travelled a month without really needing it (well, no finale work in that time :-) ). and i generally don't like apple's external devices... any suggestions appreciated. PS as i finish this message they are working again properly... grr. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] [OT] keyboard and mouse dying / suggestions for new devices?
On 6 Apr 2011 at 22:20, Darcy James Argue wrote: I get 2-3 months of heavy use out of a pair of rechargeable AAs. *blinks* Reading that again, I see its two A's and one S and not the other way around... -- David W. Fentonhttp://dfenton.com David Fenton Associates http://dfenton.com/DFA/ ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] [OT] keyboard and mouse dying / suggestions for new devices?
On Wed Apr 6, at WednesdayApr 6 11:34 PM, David W. Fenton wrote: On 6 Apr 2011 at 22:20, Darcy James Argue wrote: I get 2-3 months of heavy use out of a pair of rechargeable AAs. *blinks* Reading that again, I see its two A's and one S and not the other way around... BWAHH-HA-HA-HA! You made me spit tea all over my keyboard! Bad David! BAD David! Christopher ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
