Re: [Finale] TAN: String divisi
Hi Robert, Outside is the principal player, and that part appears on top. Chuck On Mar 2, 2005, at 9:35 AM, Robert Patterson wrote: I have an question for the general wisdom of the list. When a string section uses inside/outside divisi, I understand that this implies it is a 2-part divisi where each half is played by a player on each stand. What I don't know is, does the inside or the outside part appear on top in the part? And which is the section principal player: inside or outside? ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale Chuck Israels 230 North Garden Terrace Bellingham, WA 98225-5836 phone (360) 671-3402 fax (360) 676-6055 www.chuckisraels.com ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] TAN: String divisi
From the inside/outside terminology, I had inferred that this was probably the case. What about situations where the string section rearranges so that the 2nd violins face the 1st violins? Do the 2nd violins reverse their usual orientation or do they maintain it? In this situation is the outside actually sitting on the inside or the outside? -Original Message- From: Owain Sutton [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, March 2, 2005 05:50 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], finale@shsu.edu Subject: Re: [Finale] TAN: String divisi Outside = top part Principal = outside Also, the inside player is responsible for page turns, which can have a bearing on their positioning. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] TAN: String divisi
This is generally true. However, sometimes the outside player must turn. I recently completed engraving a work with divisi throughout. At one point the outside players had a rest while the inside were playing. At that point it is necessary for outside to turn. I think the same thing happens in Holst's St. Paul Suite, although in that place it may have been a peculiar situation where inside/outside were exchanged for rhythmic security. Guy Hayden - Original Message - From: Owain Sutton [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; finale@shsu.edu Sent: Wednesday, March 02, 2005 12:50 PM Subject: Re: [Finale] TAN: String divisi Outside = top part Principal = outside Also, the inside player is responsible for page turns, which can have a bearing on their positioning. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] TAN: String divisi
Robert Patterson wrote: From the inside/outside terminology, I had inferred that this was probably the case. What about situations where the string section rearranges so that the 2nd violins face the 1st violins? Do the 2nd violins reverse their usual orientation or do they maintain it? In this situation is the outside actually sitting on the inside or the outside? Yes, they reverse, so the principle is where the cello principal would normally be. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] TAN: String divisi
Guy Hayden wrote: This is generally true. However, sometimes the outside player must turn. I recently completed engraving a work with divisi throughout. At one point the outside players had a rest while the inside were playing. At that point it is necessary for outside to turn. I think the same thing happens in Holst's St. Paul Suite, although in that place it may have been a peculiar situation where inside/outside were exchanged for rhythmic security. Yes, fair enough, there's exceptions. One piece which takes this to an extreme is Roy Harris's third symphony, which has a long arpeggio-based passage with both violin sections divided into fours. The music's very cleverly composed laid out to ensure that the page turns across the eight individual lines are evenly staggered, with the parts that need to drop out being covered elsewhere. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] TAN: String divisi
At 5:35 PM + 3/2/05, Robert Patterson wrote: I have an question for the general wisdom of the list. When a string section uses inside/outside divisi, I understand that this implies it is a 2-part divisi where each half is played by a player on each stand. What I don't know is, does the inside or the outside part appear on top in the part? And which is the section principal player: inside or outside? In standard orchestral seating (1st and 2nd violins together stage right) the concertmaster and principal 2nd are on the outside (the rightmost) chair. Cello and viola principals are on the outside (the leftmost) chair. Principal bass is generally farthest downstage. Outside always takes the top in a 2-part divisi, inside the bottom. It's all automatic. Anything more divided than that, the principal player in each section makes the determination of who plays what. John -- John Susie Howell Virginia Tech Department of Music Blacksburg, Virginia, U.S.A 24061-0240 Vox (540) 231-8411 Fax (540) 231-5034 (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]) http://www.music.vt.edu/faculty/howell/howell.html ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] TAN: String divisi
At 6:17 PM + 3/2/05, Robert Patterson wrote: From the inside/outside terminology, I had inferred that this was probably the case. What about situations where the string section rearranges so that the 2nd violins face the 1st violins? Do the 2nd violins reverse their usual orientation or do they maintain it? In this situation is the outside actually sitting on the inside or the outside? Outside still means outside--closest to the audience. Yes, the 2nds would reverse their seating, and so would whoever is placed next to the 1sts. John -- John Susie Howell Virginia Tech Department of Music Blacksburg, Virginia, U.S.A 24061-0240 Vox (540) 231-8411 Fax (540) 231-5034 (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]) http://www.music.vt.edu/faculty/howell/howell.html ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] TAN: String divisi
Perhaps this is an Early Music thing, but I have played in orchestras, where the 2nds (on the right side) chose to have the principal on the inside. But it's not common practice. Johannes John Howell wrote: At 6:17 PM + 3/2/05, Robert Patterson wrote: From the inside/outside terminology, I had inferred that this was probably the case. What about situations where the string section rearranges so that the 2nd violins face the 1st violins? Do the 2nd violins reverse their usual orientation or do they maintain it? In this situation is the outside actually sitting on the inside or the outside? Outside still means outside--closest to the audience. Yes, the 2nds would reverse their seating, and so would whoever is placed next to the 1sts. John -- http://www.musikmanufaktur.com http://www.camerata-berolinensis.de ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
