Re: [Flashcoders] OT: Internet Explorer 8
Yeh, you've got to explicitly say exactly what browsers/OS's you'll be targetting, then you can rest easy. Otherwise the natural assumption is that you'll keep the site working as well as when it was delivered! 2009/2/3 Vayu Robins v...@vayu.dk Hi flashcoders, I just finished a website for a client and the client writes back and says that one of her friends has IE8 and that the website is not displaying correctly. The website is displaying correctly in IE6 and IE7. I was first surprised to hear that IE8 was released, but I later found out that its a Release Candidate 1, which I presume is a sort of a Beta version. Does anybody have any comments on this? Should I download the IE8 version and find the problem? I am on a mac, using Parallels Desktop, Windows XP. I am worried that I wont be able to test for IE7 and IE6 afterwards, that IE8 will remove them. Is it fair of client to ask me test for IE8 when it isn't officially released yet? Furthermore, what is this Microsoft is releasing now? I thought IE8 was suppose to get better and be easier to develop for and follow web standards more like Firefox, Safari and others. The amount of additional work needed for IE6 + IE7 is plenty, now we have to IE8 as well... Vayu ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders
Re: [Flashcoders] OT: Internet Explorer 8
download ietester http://www.my-debugbar.com/wiki/IETester/HomePage works well for me; yet, if you set your work to display in compatability mode in ie8 things should work almost the same. http://blogs.msdn.com/chkoenig/archive/2008/08/28/ie8-standards-mode-and-ie7-compatibility-mode.aspx mike donnelly wrote: Yeh, you've got to explicitly say exactly what browsers/OS's you'll be targetting, then you can rest easy. Otherwise the natural assumption is that you'll keep the site working as well as when it was delivered! 2009/2/3 Vayu Robins v...@vayu.dk Hi flashcoders, I just finished a website for a client and the client writes back and says that one of her friends has IE8 and that the website is not displaying correctly. The website is displaying correctly in IE6 and IE7. I was first surprised to hear that IE8 was released, but I later found out that its a Release Candidate 1, which I presume is a sort of a Beta version. Does anybody have any comments on this? Should I download the IE8 version and find the problem? I am on a mac, using Parallels Desktop, Windows XP. I am worried that I wont be able to test for IE7 and IE6 afterwards, that IE8 will remove them. Is it fair of client to ask me test for IE8 when it isn't officially released yet? Furthermore, what is this Microsoft is releasing now? I thought IE8 was suppose to get better and be easier to develop for and follow web standards more like Firefox, Safari and others. The amount of additional work needed for IE6 + IE7 is plenty, now we have to IE8 as well... Vayu ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders
Re: [Flashcoders] OT: Internet Explorer 8
Regarding being able to test in older versions of IE (since you can't run parallel versions). I used this program for a little while: http://www.my-debugbar.com/wiki/IETester/HomePage I think they actually use the real rendering engine via OLE but it has its flaws as well. It's been a year or so since I've done that kind of work and thus since I've used the product but give it a shot. Looks like they included IE8 beta 2.. -jonathan P.S. My gmail client is broken in IE8 beta as I type this, so if it's bad enough for Google, it's bad enough for your client! (Oh, wait, Gmail claims it's still in beta itself) On Tue, Feb 3, 2009 at 11:55 PM, Vayu Robins v...@vayu.dk wrote: Thanks for all the good feedback on this! :-) On 2/3/09 8:25 PM, John Dowdell jdowd...@adobe.com wrote: Vayu Robins wrote, when finding that an existing HTML site was reported to not render correctly in this week's IE8 release candidate: Does anybody have any comments on this? Should I download the IE8 version and find the problem? I am on a mac, using Parallels Desktop, Windows XP. I've heard other reports of newer HTML clients not supporting existing websites, but I haven't tracked the pre-release details. Best resource I know of for user-experience changes is the IE team's own weblog: http://blogs.msdn.com/ie/ That said, it may be a client/developer contractual agreement about which browsers to test against. If they specified IE6 and IE7 for the Microsoft-branded browsers, then it doesn't seem quite fair to suddenly add another version (particularly a pre-release) to that matrix. But if the required clientside runtimes were not specified in the original contract, then that could make things stickier... it sounds like they accepted the project, then wanted to make changes after the project was finished. Tricky problem! :( jd ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders -- -jonathan howe ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders
Re: [Flashcoders] OT: Internet Explorer 8
I use: http://browsershots.org/ To quickly check rendering in different browsers. On Wed, Feb 4, 2009 at 8:39 AM, jonathan howe jonathangh...@gmail.comwrote: Regarding being able to test in older versions of IE (since you can't run parallel versions). I used this program for a little while: http://www.my-debugbar.com/wiki/IETester/HomePage I think they actually use the real rendering engine via OLE but it has its flaws as well. It's been a year or so since I've done that kind of work and thus since I've used the product but give it a shot. Looks like they included IE8 beta 2.. -jonathan P.S. My gmail client is broken in IE8 beta as I type this, so if it's bad enough for Google, it's bad enough for your client! (Oh, wait, Gmail claims it's still in beta itself) On Tue, Feb 3, 2009 at 11:55 PM, Vayu Robins v...@vayu.dk wrote: Thanks for all the good feedback on this! :-) On 2/3/09 8:25 PM, John Dowdell jdowd...@adobe.com wrote: Vayu Robins wrote, when finding that an existing HTML site was reported to not render correctly in this week's IE8 release candidate: Does anybody have any comments on this? Should I download the IE8 version and find the problem? I am on a mac, using Parallels Desktop, Windows XP. I've heard other reports of newer HTML clients not supporting existing websites, but I haven't tracked the pre-release details. Best resource I know of for user-experience changes is the IE team's own weblog: http://blogs.msdn.com/ie/ That said, it may be a client/developer contractual agreement about which browsers to test against. If they specified IE6 and IE7 for the Microsoft-branded browsers, then it doesn't seem quite fair to suddenly add another version (particularly a pre-release) to that matrix. But if the required clientside runtimes were not specified in the original contract, then that could make things stickier... it sounds like they accepted the project, then wanted to make changes after the project was finished. Tricky problem! :( jd ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders -- -jonathan howe ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders -- Cheers, Nate http://blog.natebeck.net ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders
[Flashcoders] OT: Internet Explorer 8
Hi flashcoders, I just finished a website for a client and the client writes back and says that one of her friends has IE8 and that the website is not displaying correctly. The website is displaying correctly in IE6 and IE7. I was first surprised to hear that IE8 was released, but I later found out that its a Release Candidate 1, which I presume is a sort of a Beta version. Does anybody have any comments on this? Should I download the IE8 version and find the problem? I am on a mac, using Parallels Desktop, Windows XP. I am worried that I wont be able to test for IE7 and IE6 afterwards, that IE8 will remove them. Is it fair of client to ask me test for IE8 when it isn't officially released yet? Furthermore, what is this Microsoft is releasing now? I thought IE8 was suppose to get better and be easier to develop for and follow web standards more like Firefox, Safari and others. The amount of additional work needed for IE6 + IE7 is plenty, now we have to IE8 as well... Vayu ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders
RE: [Flashcoders] OT: Internet Explorer 8
Is it fair of client to ask me test for IE8 when it isn't officially released yet? No. There are any number of bugs that could be in pre-release versions. Plus, your contract with the client should have explicitly stated the browser vendor and version(s) you would build for. They can't expect you to forever be forward compatible. I would push back. And as a side note, ask if the IE8 person has the right Flash player version installed. Jason Merrill Bank of America Instructional Technology Media · Learning Performance Solutions LLD Interested in Flash Platform technologies? Join the Bank of America Flash Platform Community Interested in innovative ideas in Learning? Check out the Innovative Learning Blog and subscribe. ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders
Re: [Flashcoders] OT: Internet Explorer 8
Send them this link and inform them that you don't support browsers with little to no penetration. http://www.w3schools.com/browsers/browsers_stats.asp But at the same time, offer to do the debugging for an additional charge. You're really relegated to what ever was in your contract. If you didn't explicitly outline which browsers you'd be optimizing for you may be stuck debugging it for free if the client is really unreasonable. I've always used a standalone version of IE6 but I can't say if there's a viable IE7 standalone. On Tue, Feb 3, 2009 at 11:16 AM, Vayu Robins v...@vayu.dk wrote: Hi flashcoders, I just finished a website for a client and the client writes back and says that one of her friends has IE8 and that the website is not displaying correctly. The website is displaying correctly in IE6 and IE7. I was first surprised to hear that IE8 was released, but I later found out that its a Release Candidate 1, which I presume is a sort of a Beta version. Does anybody have any comments on this? Should I download the IE8 version and find the problem? I am on a mac, using Parallels Desktop, Windows XP. I am worried that I wont be able to test for IE7 and IE6 afterwards, that IE8 will remove them. Is it fair of client to ask me test for IE8 when it isn't officially released yet? Furthermore, what is this Microsoft is releasing now? I thought IE8 was suppose to get better and be easier to develop for and follow web standards more like Firefox, Safari and others. The amount of additional work needed for IE6 + IE7 is plenty, now we have to IE8 as well... Vayu ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders -- --Joel Stransky stranskydesign.com ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders
Re: [Flashcoders] OT: Internet Explorer 8
Thanks for your input Jason. I know this is a flash forum, but the website I have created for this client is without flash, so flash player version is not relevant in this case. On 2/3/09 5:31 PM, Merrill, Jason jason.merr...@bankofamerica.com wrote: Is it fair of client to ask me test for IE8 when it isn't officially released yet? No. There are any number of bugs that could be in pre-release versions. Plus, your contract with the client should have explicitly stated the browser vendor and version(s) you would build for. They can't expect you to forever be forward compatible. I would push back. And as a side note, ask if the IE8 person has the right Flash player version installed. Jason Merrill Bank of America Instructional Technology Media · Learning Performance Solutions LLD Interested in Flash Platform technologies? Join the Bank of America Flash Platform Community Interested in innovative ideas in Learning? Check out the Innovative Learning Blog and subscribe. ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders
Re: [Flashcoders] OT: Internet Explorer 8
wrong list then.. - Original Message - From: Vayu Robins v...@vayu.dk To: Flash Coders List flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 2009 5:44 PM Subject: Re: [Flashcoders] OT: Internet Explorer 8 Thanks for your input Jason. I know this is a flash forum, but the website I have created for this client is without flash, so flash player version is not relevant in this case. ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders
Re: [Flashcoders] OT: Internet Explorer 8
Agree with Jason. Requiring an app to work on beta software is unrealistic. For all we know that person uses a 64bit version, for which there is no flash player at all. regards, Muzak - Original Message - From: Merrill, Jason jason.merr...@bankofamerica.com To: Flash Coders List flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 2009 5:31 PM Subject: RE: [Flashcoders] OT: Internet Explorer 8 Is it fair of client to ask me test for IE8 when it isn't officially released yet? No. There are any number of bugs that could be in pre-release versions. Plus, your contract with the client should have explicitly stated the browser vendor and version(s) you would build for. They can't expect you to forever be forward compatible. I would push back. And as a side note, ask if the IE8 person has the right Flash player version installed. Jason Merrill ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders
Re: [Flashcoders] OT: Internet Explorer 8
Thanks for all the feedback. Hmmm, Ive seen many discuss off topics in this forum, hence I wrote OT in subject line. I apologize if this is an irrelevant discussion for the list, but I thought maybe others here could get something out of it other than me. And this is a place of many experienced web developers, not just flashers... On 2/3/09 5:58 PM, Muzak p.ginnebe...@telenet.be wrote: wrong list then.. - Original Message - From: Vayu Robins v...@vayu.dk To: Flash Coders List flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 2009 5:44 PM Subject: Re: [Flashcoders] OT: Internet Explorer 8 Thanks for your input Jason. I know this is a flash forum, but the website I have created for this client is without flash, so flash player version is not relevant in this case. ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders
Re: [Flashcoders] OT: Internet Explorer 8
Vayu, I personally have no problem with this message being sent to this list, obviously I can only speak for myself though. I have run into a few similar situations, with IE 8 and Google Chrome, also IE 5 (yes, a client was still using IE 5)... Just educate the client as best as possible, you should not have to support alpha/beta browser releases, nor obsolete browsers. If the client has any sense at all, they will understand once you explain it to them. - Taka On Tue, Feb 3, 2009 at 10:59 AM, Vayu Robins v...@vayu.dk wrote: Thanks for all the feedback. Hmmm, Ive seen many discuss off topics in this forum, hence I wrote OT in subject line. I apologize if this is an irrelevant discussion for the list, but I thought maybe others here could get something out of it other than me. And this is a place of many experienced web developers, not just flashers... On 2/3/09 5:58 PM, Muzak p.ginnebe...@telenet.be wrote: wrong list then.. - Original Message - From: Vayu Robins v...@vayu.dk To: Flash Coders List flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 2009 5:44 PM Subject: Re: [Flashcoders] OT: Internet Explorer 8 Thanks for your input Jason. I know this is a flash forum, but the website I have created for this client is without flash, so flash player version is not relevant in this case. ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders
Re: [Flashcoders] OT: Internet Explorer 8
Vayu Robins wrote, when finding that an existing HTML site was reported to not render correctly in this week's IE8 release candidate: Does anybody have any comments on this? Should I download the IE8 version and find the problem? I am on a mac, using Parallels Desktop, Windows XP. I've heard other reports of newer HTML clients not supporting existing websites, but I haven't tracked the pre-release details. Best resource I know of for user-experience changes is the IE team's own weblog: http://blogs.msdn.com/ie/ That said, it may be a client/developer contractual agreement about which browsers to test against. If they specified IE6 and IE7 for the Microsoft-branded browsers, then it doesn't seem quite fair to suddenly add another version (particularly a pre-release) to that matrix. But if the required clientside runtimes were not specified in the original contract, then that could make things stickier... it sounds like they accepted the project, then wanted to make changes after the project was finished. Tricky problem! :( jd -- John Dowdell . Adobe Developer Support . San Francisco CA USA Weblog: http://weblogs.macromedia.com/jd Aggregator: http://weblogs.macromedia.com/mxna Technotes: http://www.macromedia.com/support/ Spam killed my private email -- public record is best, thanks. ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders
Re: [Flashcoders] OT: Internet Explorer 8
Thanks for all the good feedback on this! :-) On 2/3/09 8:25 PM, John Dowdell jdowd...@adobe.com wrote: Vayu Robins wrote, when finding that an existing HTML site was reported to not render correctly in this week's IE8 release candidate: Does anybody have any comments on this? Should I download the IE8 version and find the problem? I am on a mac, using Parallels Desktop, Windows XP. I've heard other reports of newer HTML clients not supporting existing websites, but I haven't tracked the pre-release details. Best resource I know of for user-experience changes is the IE team's own weblog: http://blogs.msdn.com/ie/ That said, it may be a client/developer contractual agreement about which browsers to test against. If they specified IE6 and IE7 for the Microsoft-branded browsers, then it doesn't seem quite fair to suddenly add another version (particularly a pre-release) to that matrix. But if the required clientside runtimes were not specified in the original contract, then that could make things stickier... it sounds like they accepted the project, then wanted to make changes after the project was finished. Tricky problem! :( jd ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders
