OK, anything nice I said in the past about the Flash 9 Preview - I take it back. We can't even generate basic components like a TextArea in the Preview. I would have thought that with the availability of the Flex SDK you could tap into the flex components...but no go on that, either. Quite annoying...
see http://www.zeuslabs.us/archives/78/can-flash-9-preview-compile-the-flex-framework/ --- In flexcoders@yahoogroups.com, "Kirk Marple" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > ah, very interesting... i heard "drag/drop" and assumed you were talking > about user actions within the application. > > thanks for the TT reference - that looks like it might be money well-spent. > if i don't get to Max, then that looks like a good bet. > > from everybody's valuable replies, it sure seems like we could proceed with > the F9 preview, and pick and choose pieces to build there, and do the shell > and the rest of it in Flex. if that's the case, then i think we're going > to be good to go. > > as an aside, we're looking for one or two part-time Flex/Flash devs to help > with our project. if anybody's available right now (via telecommuting), > please shoot me an email at jobs (at) agnostic-media.com. > > thanks, > Kirk > > _____ > > From: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On > Behalf Of fuad_kamal > Sent: Friday, October 06, 2006 9:20 AM > To: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [flexcoders] Re: Flex 2 limitations vs. raw Flash 8 Prof? > > > > In the F9 preview, if you open the components window, whatever is ther > e is grayed out - so there is no way to utilize prebuilt components in > F9 except via code. The help window/documentation window is > completely empty. Basically the F9 preview is the F8 shell, with > support for AS3 code. On the up side, they were helpful enough to > have the compiler in F9 display warnings particular to AS2 -> AS3 > conversion issues. I would caution against building an entire RIA in > F9 preview; better to stick with flex and use F9 for visually > building individual components that require use of the timeline - you > can then utilize the compiled swf's in Flex. There is also no such > thing as MXML in F9. > > In Flex 2 you can drag and drop components from a component window, > you can create them in mxml or you could instatiate them via AS3. > Keep in mind also that all the components in Flex can be skinned, so > look & feel should not be an issue. You can also easily create new > components or extend existing ones. > > You mentioned that your developer is from a Flash MX background. I > found that most of the Flex developers seem to be former Java > programmers; developing in Flex is a totally different paradigm than > in Flash. I also haven't met a Java programmer yet that didn't find > the Flash IDE to be "opaque" to them. Don't dismay, though - I also > came from a Flash environment and had no trouble jumping into a > massive flex project...but there was a bit of ramp up time. If your > developer is strong in OOP he should have no problem in Flex. You > might also consider the Total Training video on Flex 2, it's darn > cheap and I never saw a TT video (including the one on Flex) that > wasn't extremely comprehensive, and frankly I think their material is > beyond compare. > > -fuad > > --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com> ups.com, > "Kirk Marple" <kirk-public@> wrote: > > > > hi Fuad, > > > > can you dive more into your comment about "Outside of pure code though, > > there's no drag 'n drop > > functionality in the F9 preview like we have in Flex..."? > > > > i'm curious what the limitation is there that you're describing. > > > > we have a definite need for drag/drop functionality, so i'm worried that > > this might affect us. > > > > thanks, > > Kirk > > > > _____ > > > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com> ups.com > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com> ups.com] > On > > Behalf Of fuad_kamal > > Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 11:16 AM > > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com> ups.com > > Subject: [flexcoders] Re: Flex 2 limitations vs. raw Flash 8 Prof? > > > > > > > > One addenum to that - in theory you can access the same component > > architecture in the Flash 9 preview as you can in Flex - from your AS3 > > code. Outside of pure code though, there's no drag 'n drop > > functionality in the F9 preview like we have in Flex...but I think > > that's just a preview issue; even the help/doc files are empty in the > > preview. It certainly is MUCH easier coding AS3 in Flex 2 than the > > preview, hopefully that gap will lessen with the release version. > > Anyway you can also write your AS3 code from within Flex2 and then > > make use of those AS files from F9 preview... > > > > --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com> > ups.com, > > "greg h" <flexsavvy@> wrote: > > > > > > Kirk, > > > > > > I am going to reply in this one email to your two earlier posts. > > > > > > You started off your first post with "we're looking to move our > > > ASP.NET<http://asp.net/>based application suite to Flash". > > > So I assume that your team has no deep competency with either Flex or > > > Flash. Is this correct? > > > > > > For developing RIAs, I suggest you make Flex 2 your default choice > > with a > > > side investigation of how to use Flash 9 (or for now Flash 8 Pro > > with the Flash > > > Pro 9 ActionScript 3.0 > > > Preview<http://labs. > > <http://labs. <http://labs.adobe.com/technologies/flash9as3preview/> > adobe.com/technologies/flash9as3preview/> > > adobe.com/technologies/flash9as3preview/> > > > ). > > > > > > There are a number of points of comparison between Flex and Flash. > When > > > developing RIAs one that is very relevant is the choice between > > using the > > > prebuilt component framework in Flex 2 vs building your own > > components in > > > Flash 8 or 9. > > > > > > Also, the whole development process is very different. Will you be > > having > > > your ASP.NET <http://asp.net/> developers cross training? If so Flex 2 > > > likely will prove to be more familiar and easier for them to come > up to > > > speed on quickly. Flash authoring, on the other hand, uses > > paradigms that > > > likely are unfamiliar to more traditional developers such as is > > taught in > > > university computer science programs. For a quick sense of how Flash > > > development may look to traditional coders, in this following > > article see the > > > section under the heading: "We Call This 'The Timeline.' No, Wait, > Come > > > Back!" > > > www.adobe.com/devnet/flex/articles/flash_perspective.html > > > > > > Regarding "video-heavy applications" I see no inherent advantage of > > Flash > > > over Flex (or vice versa). > > > > > > One potential disadvantage of Flex 2 is that it is ActionScript 3 > > only. But > > > this is only a disadvantage if you have existing Flash ActionScript 2 > > > components, because as Robert hinted in his post at run time AS3 > and AS2 > > > components are limited in their ability to talk to each other. > > Aside from > > > that, however, the advantages of AS3 over AS2 are enormous. > > > > > > Regarding the specific issue you stated that "we couldn't mix Flex > > running > > > AS3 with scripted movies with AS2", that is only partly true. As of > > Flash > > > Player 9 (FP9), there are two Actionscript Virtual Machines (AVM). AS3 > > > pcode runs in FP9's new AVM2, and the pcode from AS2 and earlier > run in > > > AVM1. At runtime, code can be running in both AVM1 and AVM2 at the > same > > > time, but they can not pass values directly between the AVMs. > > Though they > > > can pass values through external APIs (in his post Robert mentioned > > > localconnection). So, though you CAN "mix Flex running AS3 with > > scripted > > > movies with AS2", there are limitations. Thus this is one case > > where shops > > > with legacy AVM1 code may have an incentive to convert their legacy > > code to > > > AS3. For a great walkthrough of what is new with FP9, AS3 and the AVM2 > > > check out this presentation by Gary Grossman, lead developer on the > > Flash > > > Player team and an Adobe Senior Scientist. > > > http://seminars. <http://seminars. > <http://seminars.breezecentral.com/p64058844/> breezecentral.com/p64058844/> > > breezecentral.com/p64058844/ > > > > > > On another issue, your posts are the first I have heard anyone raising > > > concerns about "one of the issues brought up to me was how to get > > the nice > > > cinematic feel w/ scripted animations, etc. in Flex." Whether you > > author in > > > Flash or Flex it all compiles down to the same pcode. It really is > just > > > dependent on the skills of your developers. Furthermore, as Nick > > said in > > > his reply, "You should use both." And "it's not an either/or > > situation." I > > > actually would love it if you could have your source on this concern > > post > > > back on this thread with more details. The broad community of "Flash > > > Platform" developers continue to grapple with how get the most out > > of the > > > vast and amazing tools that Adobe has given us :-) > > > > > > Should you want to solicit comments that may favor Flash more over > > Flex, > > > you might also want to put your post up over on the Flashcoders list: > > > http://chattyfig. > > <http://chattyfig. > <http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders> > figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders> > > figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders > > > > > > Should you want to solicit comments from Flash/Flex video > > specialists, you > > > might also want to put your post up over on the FlashMedia list: > > > > > http://www.flashcom <http://www.flashcom > <http://www.flashcomguru.com/flashmedialist/> guru.com/flashmedialist/> > > guru.com/flashmedialist/<http://chattyfig. > > <http://chattyfig. > <http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders> > figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders> > > figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders> > > > > > > And by the way, can you spare 3 days later this month? If so you > > really > > > should come to > > MAX<http://www.adobe. > > <http://www.adobe. > <http://www.adobe.com/events/max/agenda/by_track.html#rias> > com/events/max/agenda/by_track.html#rias> > > com/events/max/agenda/by_track.html#rias>! > > > It will be the ideal forum for you to hammer out a definitive plan of > > > action. The Flex 2 team will be there in force. The Flash team will be > > > there in force. And a large part of the community developing in > > both will > > > be there too. > > > > > > Just to give you a flavor, here are 4 sessions that seem pretty on > > point to > > > your requirement: > > > > > > - Flex for Flash Designers: How Flex and Flash Work > > > Together<http://www.adobe. > > <http://www.adobe. <http://www.adobe.com/events/max/sessions/cd208w.html> > com/events/max/sessions/cd208w.html> > > com/events/max/sessions/cd208w.html>. > > > A variation of this session is already available streaming on the > > net here: > > > > > www2.sys-con.com/webinararchive.cfm?registered=on&pid=wc_rwf6_s06warden > > > > > > With the presenter's notes here: > > > www.jessewarden.com/archives/2006/09/flex_seminar_pr.html > > > - Best Practices for Developing Flash > > > Applications<http://www.adobe. > > <http://www.adobe. <http://www.adobe.com/events/max/sessions/wd211w.html> > com/events/max/sessions/wd211w.html> > > com/events/max/sessions/wd211w.html>by > > > the author of the Flash MX 2004 V2 MediaPlayback component. Three > > > months > > > ago the presenter published an article on Guidelines for Flash > > > application > > development<http://www.adobe. > > <http://www.adobe. > <http://www.adobe.com/devnet/flash/articles/ria_dev_guidelines.html> > com/devnet/flash/articles/ria_dev_guidelines.html> > > com/devnet/flash/articles/ria_dev_guidelines.html> > > > - Mixing Web Video with Live Broadcast TV: Flex and Flash Media > > Server > > > Teamed up for the Ultimate Engaging Experience > > > <http://www.adobe. > <http://www.adobe. <http://www.adobe.com/events/max/sessions/vs110w.html> > com/events/max/sessions/vs110w.html> > > com/events/max/sessions/vs110w.html> > > > - Leveraging Flex 2 and Flash Player 9 for Truly Cinematic > > Experiences > > > <http://www.adobe. > <http://www.adobe. <http://www.adobe.com/events/max/sessions/ri210w.html> > com/events/max/sessions/ri210w.html> > > com/events/max/sessions/ri210w.html> > > > > > > > > > Regardless what you decide, please do post back to this list and let > > us know > > > what you decided (and maybe even why :-) > > > > > > hth, > > > > > > g > > > > > > > > > On 10/4/06, Kirk Marple <kirk-public@> wrote: > > > > > > > > interesting... one of the issues brought up to me was how to get the > > > > nice cinematic feel w/ scripted animations, etc. in Flex. > > > > > > > > i was told that only simple looping animations were possible > > because we > > > > couldn't mix Flex running AS3 with scripted movies with AS2. > > > > > > > > maybe the new AS3 preview will solve that, since we could script > > > > animations using AS3 in regular Flash 8 Professional. > > > > > > > > am i totally off-base here in what i've been told? > > > > > > > > thanks, > > > > Kirk > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > *From:* [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com> > > ups.com > > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com> > ups.com] > > *On > > > > Behalf Of *Nick Collins > > > > *Sent:* Wednesday, October 04, 2006 1:58 PM > > > > *To:* [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com> > ups.com > > > > *Subject:* Re: [flexcoders] Re: Flex 2 limitations vs. raw Flash 8 > > Prof? > > > > > > > > The fact of the matter is that it's not an either/or situation. You > > > > should use both. For the logic and coding you definitely want to > > be using > > > > Flex with SVN for obvious reasons, and for building the skins of > > the UI > > > > components to create the "cinematic experience" you want to be > > using Flash. > > > > > > > > On 10/4/06, Renaun Erickson <renaun@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > A big one for me is Developer workflow. Try sharing FLA's > > between a > > > > > couple of developers. Using MXML and AS with CVS/SVN you can get > > tons > > > > > of work done with out working about who has the latest file. > Granted > > > > > you could do this with Flash 8 professional and external AS > > files but > > > > > that is also messy in its own right. > > > > > > > > > > Renaun > > > > > > > > > > --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com> > > ups.com > > <flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com>, "Kirk > > > > > Marple" <kirk-public@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > we're looking to move our ASP.NET based application suite to > > Flash, > > > > > and have > > > > > > been investigating the use of Flex 2 vs. just straight Flash 8 > > Pro. > > > > > > > > > > > > can anyone provide any feedback on what limitations you've > > seen when > > > > > > developing an RIA in Flex 2 vs. just straight Flash 8? > > > > > > > > > > > > we're trying to evaluate the pros/cons on going one way vs > > another. > > > > > > > > > > > > specifically, we like the Flex 2 layout capabilities and the > > ability > > > > > to > > > > > > easily deal with XML and REST web services, but we seem to be > > > > > constrained by > > > > > > the lack of scripted animations (from what i've heard) and > ability > > > > > to have a > > > > > > "cinematic" look/feel compared to Flash 8. also, it's > video-heavy > > > > > > application and need the ability to do dynamic video > assembly and > > > > > playback. > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks for any input! > > > > > > Kirk > > > > > > > > > > > > -~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~ > > > > > > Kirk Marple > > > > > > Chief Software Architect, VP of Engineering > > > > > > Agnostic Media, Inc. > > > > > > e: kirk@ > > > > > > w: www.agnostic-media.com < http://www.agnostic > > <http://www.agnostic <http://www.agnostic-media.com/> -media.com/> > -media.com/> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- Flexcoders Mailing List FAQ: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/files/flexcodersFAQ.txt Search Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com Yahoo! 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