Re: [Flightgear-devel] multikey: vi-like commands in fgfs (II)
* gerard robin -- Wednesday 01 October 2008: An other remark/question , how could we activate the turn to wind and elevator up/down with that keyboard feature. Today i have it, included into my naval Aircraft which is the wrong way , i would be better to have it within FG out of any Aircraft. cat engage and launch are probably better on regular keys. Often you need to press the L-key several times until you get locked. A multikey thingy wouldn't work well for that. And the launch is probably also too important for multikey. Carrier into wind or elevator up/down would be easy to implement. We just need a sane place for it. m. - This SF.Net email is sponsored by the Moblin Your Move Developer's challenge Build the coolest Linux based applications with Moblin SDK win great prizes Grand prize is a trip for two to an Open Source event anywhere in the world http://moblin-contest.org/redirect.php?banner_id=100url=/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] multikey: vi-like commands in fgfs (II)
Hi, It seems that x and A are already added. Quick work Melchior. anyway, I added commands for Autopilot Route Manager. Available commands are: araAirport ID[EMAIL PROTECTED] (ft)] : append waypoint arc : clear waypoints ardindex : delete waypoint at index (index should be 1 or more. index = 0 is treated as 1) ariindexAirport ID[EMAIL PROTECTED] (ft)] : insert waypoint at index arp : delete the first waypoint (pop). Note that clearing waypoint does not disable autopilot (heading and pitch/altitude hold). Thus, you probably want to disable autopilot by :ah/ and :ap/ commands. Maybe I should make a multikey package for those who use a binary package no later than Nasal update in SimGear (in late September), probably with a brief instruction manual. Best, On Thu, Oct 2, 2008 at 7:33 PM, Melchior FRANZ [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: * Erik Hofman -- Thursday 02 October 2008: Would it be feasible to reserve the 'a' for aircraft specific and 'x' for experimental features? 'x' for experimental seems fine. 'a' for aircraft is a problem, as I think we should keep using that for the autopilot. There are a lot of autopilot settings and they should be quickly accessible. I'd rather use 'A' for aircraft. Generally, aircraft should try to put their extensions in the appropriate groups (r for radio, etc), anyway, so there are probably not many functions that really need a separate group. (??) m. - This SF.Net email is sponsored by the Moblin Your Move Developer's challenge Build the coolest Linux based applications with Moblin SDK win great prizes Grand prize is a trip for two to an Open Source event anywhere in the world http://moblin-contest.org/redirect.php?banner_id=100url=/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel - This SF.Net email is sponsored by the Moblin Your Move Developer's challenge Build the coolest Linux based applications with Moblin SDK win great prizes Grand prize is a trip for two to an Open Source event anywhere in the world http://moblin-contest.org/redirect.php?banner_id=100url=/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] multikey: vi-like commands in fgfs (II)
Hi,
I really like the way you guys have created the vi-like commands, btw in
the initial multikey I've made there was an little idea that I find
very useful: it automagically stops after 5 seconds of inactivity
(useful with no-exit/ tags). So I added it again, here's the cvs diff:
Index: multikey.nas
===
RCS file: /var/cvs/FlightGear-0.9/data/Nasal/multikey.nas,v
retrieving revision 1.9
diff -r1.9 multikey.nas
5a6
var timers = 0;
31a33,36
var auto_stop = func {
timers -= 1;
if (!timers and dialog.isopen) stop();
}
33a39,40
settimer(auto_stop, 5);
timers += 1;
btw, I began to play with the new system, adapting the old key-handler
system with this new one, thanks for that.
regards
seb
-
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] multikey: vi-like commands in fgfs (II)
Would it be feasible to reserve the 'a' for aircraft specific and 'x' for experimental features? Erik - This SF.Net email is sponsored by the Moblin Your Move Developer's challenge Build the coolest Linux based applications with Moblin SDK win great prizes Grand prize is a trip for two to an Open Source event anywhere in the world http://moblin-contest.org/redirect.php?banner_id=100url=/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] multikey: vi-like commands in fgfs (II)
* Erik Hofman -- Thursday 02 October 2008: Would it be feasible to reserve the 'a' for aircraft specific and 'x' for experimental features? 'x' for experimental seems fine. 'a' for aircraft is a problem, as I think we should keep using that for the autopilot. There are a lot of autopilot settings and they should be quickly accessible. I'd rather use 'A' for aircraft. Generally, aircraft should try to put their extensions in the appropriate groups (r for radio, etc), anyway, so there are probably not many functions that really need a separate group. (??) m. - This SF.Net email is sponsored by the Moblin Your Move Developer's challenge Build the coolest Linux based applications with Moblin SDK win great prizes Grand prize is a trip for two to an Open Source event anywhere in the world http://moblin-contest.org/redirect.php?banner_id=100url=/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] multikey: vi-like commands in fgfs (II)
On mercredi 01 octobre 2008, Melchior FRANZ wrote: * gerard robin -- Wednesday 01 October 2008: we will now need a multi help map behind the keyboard :) . :-P I have planned to offer a list of options per level on request (TAB key). But I also expect that people quickly memorize the few combinations that they are interested in and just ignore the rest. I for one will probably not remember :Ewst for environment-weather-scenario-thunderstorm. The reason why such things are even there is that Tat configured some functions which our blind users might want. Our dialogs are hard to handle for them. In adition to your proposal, could you add the Tacan Setting like you offer about Radio Settings Sure. The current config is just a start. It should demonstrate the system and encourage developers to discuss the most efficient key scheme. All sections are still very basic, there's a lot missing in the whole radio section. We'll also want an 'i' (instrumentation) section etc. m. PS: please not full-quotes Sorry I send that message again, because i guess it has been lost === Ouups , was coming from the vacuum space :) About that new Keyboard feature, I wonder if we ( aeronaval friends) won't get some adventage to open a specific mapping which contains the old Carrier input KEYS, and so, won't overlap with the orthers aircrafts which could want the same specific keys O,o C L F,f I remember in the past, having fought about these specific keys , since they where requested for some other features. An other remark/question , how could we activate the turn to wind and elevator up/down with that keyboard feature. Today i have it, included into my naval Aircraft which is the wrong way , i would be better to have it within FG out of any Aircraft. Regards -- Gérard http://pagesperso-orange.fr/GRTux/ J'ai décidé d'être heureux parce que c'est bon pour la santé. Voltaire - This SF.Net email is sponsored by the Moblin Your Move Developer's challenge Build the coolest Linux based applications with Moblin SDK win great prizes Grand prize is a trip for two to an Open Source event anywhere in the world http://moblin-contest.org/redirect.php?banner_id=100url=/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] multikey: vi-like commands in fgfs (II)
* gerard robin -- Thursday 02 October 2008: Sorry I send that message again, because i guess it has been lost No, it didn't get lost. And I have replied to it, but like my first message about multikey it never made it to the list. Will probably come later. Here's my response again: * gerard robin -- Wednesday 01 October 2008: An other remark/question , how could we activate the turn to wind and elevator up/down with that keyboard feature. Today i have it, included into my naval Aircraft which is the wrong way , i would be better to have it within FG out of any Aircraft. cat engage and launch are probably better on regular keys. Often you need to press the L-key several times until you get locked. A multikey thingy wouldn't work well for that. And the launch is probably also too important for multikey. Carrier into wind or elevator up/down would be easy to implement. We just need a sane place for it. m. - This SF.Net email is sponsored by the Moblin Your Move Developer's challenge Build the coolest Linux based applications with Moblin SDK win great prizes Grand prize is a trip for two to an Open Source event anywhere in the world http://moblin-contest.org/redirect.php?banner_id=100url=/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] multikey: vi-like commands in fgfs (II)
Melchior FRANZ wrote: * Erik Hofman -- Thursday 02 October 2008: Would it be feasible to reserve the 'a' for aircraft specific and 'x' for experimental features? 'x' for experimental seems fine. 'a' for aircraft is a problem, as I think we should keep using that for the autopilot. There are a lot of autopilot settings and they should be quickly accessible. I'd rather use 'A' for aircraft. Generally, aircraft should try to put Good point, seems fine to me. their extensions in the appropriate groups (r for radio, etc), anyway, so there are probably not many functions that really need a separate group. (??) Probably not many but people are inventive enough to design something we haven't thought of :) Erik - This SF.Net email is sponsored by the Moblin Your Move Developer's challenge Build the coolest Linux based applications with Moblin SDK win great prizes Grand prize is a trip for two to an Open Source event anywhere in the world http://moblin-contest.org/redirect.php?banner_id=100url=/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] multikey: vi-like commands in fgfs (II)
In adition to your proposal, could you add the Tacan Setting like you offer about Radio Settings Sure. The current config is just a start. It should demonstrate the system and encourage developers to discuss the most efficient key scheme. All sections are still very basic, there's a lot missing in the whole radio section. We'll also want an 'i' (instrumentation) section etc. m. nice to see that tacan was added, just something's wrong: x and y have to be replaced by X and Y in the lines: scriptsettacan(arg[0], X)/script scriptsettacan(arg[0], Y)/script my 2 cents, jano. - This SF.Net email is sponsored by the Moblin Your Move Developer's challenge Build the coolest Linux based applications with Moblin SDK win great prizes Grand prize is a trip for two to an Open Source event anywhere in the world http://moblin-contest.org/redirect.php?banner_id=100url=/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] multikey: vi-like commands in fgfs (II)
Hi, On Fri, Oct 3, 2008 at 2:22 AM, jean pellotier [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: nice to see that tacan was added, just something's wrong: x and y have to be replaced by X and Y in the lines: scriptsettacan(arg[0], X)/script scriptsettacan(arg[0], Y)/script my 2 cents, jano. fixed and committed. I didn't change the key names, so you type :rt028x and 028X is set. Which do you guys prefer, :rt028X/Y or :rt028x/y? I prefer the latter though. Tat - This SF.Net email is sponsored by the Moblin Your Move Developer's challenge Build the coolest Linux based applications with Moblin SDK win great prizes Grand prize is a trip for two to an Open Source event anywhere in the world http://moblin-contest.org/redirect.php?banner_id=100url=/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] multikey: vi-like commands in fgfs (II)
* Tatsuhiro Nishioka -- Thursday 02 October 2008: I didn't change the key names, so you type :rt028x and 028X is set. Which do you guys prefer, :rt028X/Y or :rt028x/y? I prefer the latter though. Lower case letters were intended and approved by the TACAN man on irc. I just didn't realize that the TACAN instrument didn't digest the lower case variants. Why would anyone prefer Shift-x to x?! What does it buy you exactly, to type two keys instead of one? The problem at the moment is, that the string matcher is a crude scanf implementation. If we get regex at some time, we can make it more intelligent. (Yes, using %s for the letter would also have worked, but then you woudn't get a red warning on error. m. - This SF.Net email is sponsored by the Moblin Your Move Developer's challenge Build the coolest Linux based applications with Moblin SDK win great prizes Grand prize is a trip for two to an Open Source event anywhere in the world http://moblin-contest.org/redirect.php?banner_id=100url=/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] multikey: vi-like commands in fgfs (II)
* Melchior FRANZ -- Thursday 02 October 2008: * Tatsuhiro Nishioka -- Thursday 02 October 2008: I didn't change the key names, so you type :rt028x and 028X is set. Oh, and thanks for fixing that. m. PS: sf.net mail seems to be broken. Only every other of my mails seems to get through. And those that do come twice. This is therefore my last message to the mailing lists until sf.net recovers. Bye. - This SF.Net email is sponsored by the Moblin Your Move Developer's challenge Build the coolest Linux based applications with Moblin SDK win great prizes Grand prize is a trip for two to an Open Source event anywhere in the world http://moblin-contest.org/redirect.php?banner_id=100url=/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] multikey: vi-like commands in fgfs (II)
On mercredi 01 octobre 2008, Melchior FRANZ wrote: As you may have noticed, I have a few times committed stuff to files called multikey in the last days. (Couldn't come up with something better sounding :-). I also posted to the list about it two and a half days ago, but this message didn't make it to the list yet. I expect that it will come in a few days or weeks, but in the meantime, here's an update: In a discussion about a desirable keyboard reorganization, John D. suggested vi-like keyboard commands that consist of more than one stroke: http://www.mail-archive.com/flightgear-devel%40lists.sourceforge.net/msg133 56.html contains link to http://www.av8n.com/fly/fgfs/keys.txt This is now implemented as a pure Nasal solution with XML config in $FG_ROOT/Input/Keyboard/multikey.xml. I've used some of John's key combinations for testing purposes, and Tat has filled in a lot more. The config file looks like keyboard.xml, only that key entries can be nested. Like in vi, command sequences are always started with the ':'-key. After that there comes a key for the command group (a - autopilot, e - engines, f - flight, r - radio, etc.), Examples: :rc1f123.456 : frequency ||| |||_#1 || ||_comm | |_radio : :aht200 : |||_true || ||_heading | |_autopilot : :e2m - enter number or use CurUp/CurDn : |||_mixture || ||_2 | |_engine : :4 --- execute Nasal-Console tab #4 The config is far from complete. Tat and I would like people to test the system and to help making the combinations intuitive and efficient. Patches are, of course, welcome. Here's a list of the currently available commands (courtesy of Tat, updated by me): # AutoPilot: ## Velocity Control avtvalue Enables speed hold with throttle at value knots avpvalue Enables speed hold with pitch trim at value knots av/ Disables speed hold ## Heading Control ahbvalue Enables heading bug hold aiming to value degree ahtvalue Enables True heading hold aiming to value degree ahw Enables Wing level hold ahn Enables Nav1 hold ah/ Disables Heading control ## Pitch / Altitude Control (altitude stuff should probably use a, not p) apvvalue Sets vertical speed to value fpm appvalue Holds Pitch at value degree apovalue Holds AoA at value degree apavalue Holds Altitude at value feet apgvalue Holds AGL at value feet apn Holds Nav1 glide-slope ap/ Disable Pitch / Altitude control # Engine Controls (for all selected engines, or a particular engine) emvalue or up/dnSets mixture to value (0.0 to 1.0) epvalue or up/dnSets propeller-pitch to value (0.0 to 1.0) etvalue or up/dnSets throttle to value (0.0 to 1.0) evaluemval or u/d Same as above, but only for one engine (:e3m0) evaluepval or u/d evaluetval or u/d # Flight Controls (trim values also changable with cursor keys) favalue Adjusts aileron by value (-2.0 to +2.0) fatvalue Adjusts aileron trim by value (-2.0 to +2.0) fatleft/right Adjusts aileron trim continuously fevalue Adjusts elevator by value (-2.0 to +2.0) fetvalue Adjusts elevator trim to value (-2.0 to +2.0); positive value nakes nose down) fetup/downAdjusts elevator trim continuously ; up arrow makes nose down frvalue Adjusts rudder to value (-2.0 to +2.0) frtleft/right Adjusts rudder trim continuously fia Initializes all trims (FIXME: more proper name...) # Radio Settings rafvalue Sets ADF frequency to value rc1/2fvalue Sets Comm0/1 frequency to value rc1/2tToggles Comm0/1 selected / standby rn1/2fvalue Sets Nav1/2 frequency to value rn1/2tToggles Nav0/1 selected / standby # Nasal Console digit Execute code from the Nasal-Console dialog's tab value # Environment ## Time Settings Etc Sets time to real clock time Etn Sets time to noon ## Weather Scenario EwsfSets weather scenario to Fair weather EwsmSets weather scenario to METAR (real weather fetch) EwsnSets weather scenario to none EwstSets weather scenario to Thunderstorm # View direction (just for demonstration purposes, will be removed) vleft/right/up/down Changes view direction m. Thanks for it, which will be very usefull, though, we will now need a multi help map behind the keyboard :) . I dream to a specific FG keyboard, whose the keys are not letter but FG function written on it. In adition to your proposal, could you add the Tacan Setting like you offer about Radio Settings Cheers -- Gérard
Re: [Flightgear-devel] multikey: vi-like commands in fgfs (II)
Hi, Great ! I propose a little update... When I press key :r (for exemple). In the window, FG could display the available letters. So the user can see the different choices. ++ |Radio | | r | | c : com... | | x : xxx| | y : yyy| ++ Regards, Nicolas Le mercredi 01 octobre 2008 à 12:30 +0200, Melchior FRANZ a écrit : * gerard robin -- Wednesday 01 October 2008: we will now need a multi help map behind the keyboard :) . :-P I have planned to offer a list of options per level on request (TAB key). But I also expect that people quickly memorize the few combinations that they are interested in and just ignore the rest. I for one will probably not remember :Ewst for environment-weather-scenario-thunderstorm. The reason why such things are even there is that Tat configured some functions which our blind users might want. Our dialogs are hard to handle for them. In adition to your proposal, could you add the Tacan Setting like you offer about Radio Settings Sure. The current config is just a start. It should demonstrate the system and encourage developers to discuss the most efficient key scheme. All sections are still very basic, there's a lot missing in the whole radio section. We'll also want an 'i' (instrumentation) section etc. m. PS: please not full-quotes - This SF.Net email is sponsored by the Moblin Your Move Developer's challenge Build the coolest Linux based applications with Moblin SDK win great prizes Grand prize is a trip for two to an Open Source event anywhere in the world http://moblin-contest.org/redirect.php?banner_id=100url=/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel - This SF.Net email is sponsored by the Moblin Your Move Developer's challenge Build the coolest Linux based applications with Moblin SDK win great prizes Grand prize is a trip for two to an Open Source event anywhere in the world http://moblin-contest.org/redirect.php?banner_id=100url=/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] multikey: vi-like commands in fgfs (II)
* Nicolas -- Wednesday 01 October 2008: In the window, FG could display the available letters. So the user can see the different choices. Yes, that's what I meant when I wrote | I have planned to offer a list of options per level on request | (TAB key). You can also use :? to get a list of commands dumped to the terminal. m. - This SF.Net email is sponsored by the Moblin Your Move Developer's challenge Build the coolest Linux based applications with Moblin SDK win great prizes Grand prize is a trip for two to an Open Source event anywhere in the world http://moblin-contest.org/redirect.php?banner_id=100url=/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] multikey: vi-like commands in fgfs (II)
On mercredi 01 octobre 2008, Melchior FRANZ wrote: * gerard robin -- Wednesday 01 October 2008: we will now need a multi help map behind the keyboard :) . :-P I have planned to offer a list of options per level on request (TAB key). But I also expect that people quickly memorize the few combinations that they are interested in and just ignore the rest. I for one will probably not remember :Ewst for environment-weather-scenario-thunderstorm. The reason why such things are even there is that Tat configured some functions which our blind users might want. Our dialogs are hard to handle for them. In adition to your proposal, could you add the Tacan Setting like you offer about Radio Settings Sure. The current config is just a start. It should demonstrate the system and encourage developers to discuss the most efficient key scheme. All sections are still very basic, there's a lot missing in the whole radio section. We'll also want an 'i' (instrumentation) section etc. m. PS: please not full-quotes Ouups , was coming from the vacuum space :) About that new Keyboard feature, I wonder if we ( aeronaval friends) won't get some adventage to open a specific mapping which contains the old Carrier input KEYS, and so, won't overlap with the orthers aircrafts which could want the same specific keys O,o C L F,f I remember in the past, having fought about these specific keys , since they where requested for some other features. An other remark/question , how could we activate the turn to wind and elevator up/down with that keyboard feature. Today i have it, included into my naval Aircraft which is the wrong way , i would be better to have it within FG out of any Aircraft. Regards -- Gérard http://pagesperso-orange.fr/GRTux/ J'ai décidé d'être heureux parce que c'est bon pour la santé. Voltaire - This SF.Net email is sponsored by the Moblin Your Move Developer's challenge Build the coolest Linux based applications with Moblin SDK win great prizes Grand prize is a trip for two to an Open Source event anywhere in the world http://moblin-contest.org/redirect.php?banner_id=100url=/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] multikey: vi-like commands in fgfs (II)
* Melchior FRANZ -- Wednesday 01 October 2008: I have planned to offer a list of options per level on request (TAB key). Done. Tab toggles a list of options. m. - This SF.Net email is sponsored by the Moblin Your Move Developer's challenge Build the coolest Linux based applications with Moblin SDK win great prizes Grand prize is a trip for two to an Open Source event anywhere in the world http://moblin-contest.org/redirect.php?banner_id=100url=/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
