Re: [Flightgear-devel] Landcover-DB Mapserver update
On Sunday 23 April 2006 01:31, Curtis L. Olson wrote: Quick question. How hard (or would it be possible) to create a version of this tool that would run locally and use a local copy of the TerraGear work directory instead of the raw vmap0 or shapefile ... something that a person could use locally if they wanted to debug a scenery land cover anomaly and figure out where the strangeness is coming from? Well if you want to be able to view the TerraGear work directory on the fly you'd need to write some file format drivers and stick them in gdal or something like that and then set up the whole Apache, Mapserver, PHP, gdal environment. It would be much easier and quicker to just write a converter to dump the TG work data to shapefile or gml format and load it in a GIS app like QGIS or OpenEV. Paul --- Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, security? Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your job easier Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache Geronimo http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnkkid=120709bid=263057dat=121642 ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Landcover-DB Mapserver update
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Martin Spott schrieb: Please enjoy the latest update to the Landcover Mapserver and the underlying database. Visit: http://mapserver.flightgear.org/ I just had a quick look at Munich (EDDM). Activating all layers it looks like that the most important stuff is included. (My hometown Holzkirchen is missing, but I could clearly identify where it should be located as the railway interscetions are there...) What I've seen is that there are only two road types. I think this could be limiting in the future. (As line data can dramatically increase the triangle count it might be necessary to switch off the smallest visible roads.) So, what about having those TerraGear-Layer types: roads_freeway (a big, multilane highway, like a German Autobahn) roads_class1road (a state road, like a German Bundesstrasse) roads_class2road (a provincial road, like a German Landstrasse) roads_class3road (a local road or a simple street in a town) roads_track(not used for regular traffic, mostly access roads for farming) roads_walkingtrack (ok, that's getting excessive...) If we are increasing the type count, perhaps one step further might make sense: roads_freeway4lane roads_freeway6lane roads_freeway8lane (for Germany that should be engouh...) This allows a more detailed vectorisation of the data. A current benefit could be, that the different road types generate different line widths. And even if the texures are the same in the beginning, it allows a selection of the relevant types for scenery generation (e.g. if we'd have roads_track data it still might be too much for current CPU/GPUs). CU, Christian -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.0 (MingW32) iD8DBQFES1IalhWtxOxWNFcRAg8cAJ49EXsjVNNGwzl9dXI6ygSd1zmAeACfYdQr +sFpad0ZEZPjt0Edpp7AQYM= =w3BV -END PGP SIGNATURE- --- Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, security? Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your job easier Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache Geronimo http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnkkid=120709bid=263057dat=121642 ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Landcover-DB Mapserver update
Paul Surgeon wrote: On Sunday 23 April 2006 00:17, Martin Spott wrote: Please enjoy the latest update to the Landcover Mapserver and the underlying database. Visit: http://mapserver.flightgear.org/ Looks excellent Martin! Thanks ! I feel a major drwback is that the airports don't have their ICAO codes attached to the circles. This appears to be part of the group of features that need special handling The scalebar seems to be broken though. Ah, I totally forgot about that one - the current definition of the scalebars is almost the only part that is taken from the sample. I'll see if I get that fixed after breakfast - I think the reason for the brokenness is a UNITS mismatch between the actual layers and the scalebars. Thanks, Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are ! -- --- Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, security? Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your job easier Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache Geronimo http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnkkid=120709bid=263057dat=121642 ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Landcover-DB Mapserver update
On Sunday 23 April 2006 12:38, Martin Spott wrote: Paul Surgeon wrote: On Sunday 23 April 2006 00:17, Martin Spott wrote: Please enjoy the latest update to the Landcover Mapserver and the underlying database. Visit: http://mapserver.flightgear.org/ Looks excellent Martin! Thanks ! I feel a major drwback is that the airports don't have their ICAO codes attached to the circles. This appears to be part of the group of features that need special handling Ok, I'm assuming you're pulling the airport data out of the DB. I used a shapefile but the properties should be set the same in the Mapscript. The LABELITEM property is the column name. One thing you may want to do is use a dot with a ring for symbols. It makes it easy to see the symbol on top of any color. Light ring around dark dot or dark ring around a light dot. Example : http://www.freeimagelibrary.com/images/Surge/map1.png LAYER NAME Airports DATA Airports STATUS OFF TYPE POINT UNITSDD LABELMAXSCALE 1000 LABELITEMNAME TOLERANCE 3 CLASS NAME Airports STYLE SYMBOL cities-symbol COLOR100 120 255 OUTLINECOLOR 255 255 255 END LABEL COLOR 0 0 0 OUTLINECOLOR 255 255 255 TYPE BITMAP SIZE MEDIUM ANTIALIAS TRUE POSITION UR PARTIALS FALSE MINDISTANCE 300 BUFFER 4 END END END Paul --- Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, security? Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your job easier Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache Geronimo http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnkkid=120709bid=263057dat=121642 ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Landcover-DB Mapserver update
Christian Mayer wrote: What I've seen is that there are only two road types. I think this could be limiting in the future. (As line data can dramatically increase the triangle count it might be necessary to switch off the smallest visible roads.) Yep, this a tribute we're currently paying to conformance with the 'historic' schema in TerraGear. The two protagonists in the area of handmade landcover data, Ingrid/Ralf on one and Thomas (Foerster) on the other side, favour different approaches in the handling of line data. Both produce favourable results, as you know. This is why a more modern approach is not yet ready (and beause of time contraints ). On one hand you can simply stick to an idea in the sort of what you proposed by defining five or six categories of roads and stuff everything into that schema. This makes it easy for everyone who aims at _handling_ that data. The same applies to any sort of water flows. Certainly such a schema wouldn't be hardcoded in software but instead we'd use a template file - here's a smple of what Ralf uses: # Typnummern für Liniendaten ## # Art Typnummer Quelle NameAreaType Breite l 10 strassen AutobahnFreeway 14m l 11 strassen Schnellstrasse Freeway 10m l 12 strassen HauptstrasseFreeway 6m l 13 strassen NebenstrasseRoad 5m l 14 strassen Nebenstr_schmal Road 4m [...] This template file would be located at a central repository, preferrably in a database table, and everyone dealing with landcover data (necessarily including users of TerraGear !!!) could/should load the content of the template into his favourite software. If something breaks, we all know that we have to shoot the maintainer of the template :-) Such an approach has several advantageous side effects, as you could easily attach some eye-candy to each class. For example you could make good estimates on what colour a river is supposed to have. You could assign a central reserve to every road of 11 m and more. One day you could even estimate how many AI-cars would drive down a little by-road. _But_ this is probably not the best approach for the group of those who _create_ and _use_ the data. This is especially true for rivers but for roads as well. If you stuff everything into a fixed schema of different widths you are supposed to loose many interesting details. Variable line width is the key here - but you are at risk to loose structural or logical information that might be very valuable next year as Terra-/FlightGear develop. Nonwithstanding a common, central template would be necessary in case you use variable line widths, the discussion is just about in which pattern to store the details/attributes. I see an analogy to the way airport layouts are being defined. There has been a schema that did the job for a while, thousands of hours of workforce have been poured into this to create taxiway layouts for a significant number of airports that please your eye. Now, after the discussion already lasts for several years, people can't avoid facing the fact that the schema doesn't match the needs because it is incapable of reproducing the logical layout of an airfield (except the main runways) and major parts of the eye-candy in the taxiway layouts have to be redone once people have agreed on a modern schema. I wouldn't want to make such a mistake with a new landcover data schema and I'm happy for proposals that help closing the gap and are mature enough to stand real-world use. I would like to dispel the assumption that we, especially Ralf, Thomas and I have been deedless in terms of this topic, it's just that a long-term solution is somewhat tricky. Aaaah, I intended to post such an 'essay' to this list so many times, but never did so. Sunday morning before breakfast is definitely the best time for such an undertaking, Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are ! -- --- Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, security? Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your job easier Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache Geronimo http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnkkid0709bid3057dat1642 ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Landcover-DB Mapserver update
Paul Surgeon wrote: On Sunday 23 April 2006 12:38, Martin Spott wrote: Thanks ! I feel a major drwback is that the airports don't have their ICAO codes attached to the circles. This appears to be part of the group of features that need special handling Ok, I'm assuming you're pulling the airport data out of the DB. I used a shapefile but the properties should be set the same in the Mapscript. The LABELITEM property is the column name. One thing you may want to do is use a dot with a ring for symbols. It makes it easy to see the symbol on top of any color. Light ring around dark dot or dark ring around a light dot. Example : http://www.freeimagelibrary.com/images/Surge/map1.png [...] CLASS NAME Airports STYLE SYMBOL cities-symbol COLOR100 120 255 OUTLINECOLOR 255 255 255 END The screenshot looks promising, but I guess it does not show these yellow circles. When assigning '100 120 255' I get some blueish dots. BTW, how does your definition of the cities-symbol look ? The difficulty is that Mapserver has its own idea on how to query a PostGIS database. In fact for the airport locations I'm reading the runway locations from the 'apt.dat' file, I'm determining an 'average' location by weighing the runway lengths on airfields with more than one runway and finally I'm creating an OGC/PostGIS-conformant POINT geometry which is then being written to the DB. Reading the geometry from the DB is easy but the standard way for Mapserver to read from PostGIS isn't well suited to read columns with simple text that contains the ICAO identifier. This needs a hand crafted query for Mapserver and I was not in the mood to do this yesterday evening :-) Cheers, Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are ! -- --- Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, security? Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your job easier Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache Geronimo http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnkkid=120709bid=263057dat=121642 ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Landcover-DB Mapserver update
On Sunday 23 April 2006 14:36, Martin Spott wrote: The screenshot looks promising, but I guess it does not show these yellow circles. When assigning '100 120 255' I get some blueish dots. BTW, how does your definition of the cities-symbol look ? SYMBOL NAME cities-symbol TYPE ellipse FILLED true POINTS 8 8 END END Paul --- Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, security? Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your job easier Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache Geronimo http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnkkid=120709bid=263057dat=121642 ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Landcover-DB Mapserver update
Martin Spott wrote: Paul Surgeon wrote: On Sunday 23 April 2006 00:17, Martin Spott wrote: Please enjoy the latest update to the Landcover Mapserver and the underlying database. Visit: http://mapserver.flightgear.org/ [...] Thanks ! I feel a major drwback is that the airports don't have their ICAO codes attached to the circles. This appears to be part of the group of features that need special handling Got it, ICAO identifiery are being displayed, handling of outline colours is being worked on, Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are ! -- --- Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, security? Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your job easier Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache Geronimo http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnkkid=120709bid=263057dat=121642 ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Landcover-DB Mapserver update
Martin Spott wrote: Got it, ICAO identifiery are being displayed, handling of outline colours is being worked on, O.k., I consider this small step as finished. This was a nice task for refreshing my rusty Perl skills, starting to learn PHP and interfacing both with a PostGIS-DB, always trying to do it the right way (TM :-) Currently I don't know why the scalebars behave that strange, I'll look at this another day. I hope you will have fun investigating our current landcover data in the environment of your local airfield, Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are ! -- --- Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, security? Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your job easier Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache Geronimo http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnkkid=120709bid=263057dat=121642 ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
RE: [Flightgear-devel] Landcover-DB Mapserver update
Hi Martin, excellent a couple of other observations The ICAO selector doesn't like lower-case The land-cover seems to be offset to the coast line (in the case of NZWN to the south) on the positive...its a very intuative interface and shows how much work i've got to do to get even the significant landmarks in the right place. :-} Thanks again Martin for your efforts Regards Dene From: Martin Spott [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net To: flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: [Flightgear-devel] Landcover-DB Mapserver update Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2006 22:17:51 + (UTC) Please enjoy the latest update to the Landcover Mapserver and the underlying database. Visit: http://mapserver.flightgear.org/ enter the ICAO identifier of your favourite airfield and explore our landcover data. I _am_ aware of two drawbacks: 1.) There is a rounding error that leaves the location of your airfield eccentric in the map view, 2.) the exact location of the airfield is not being displayed in the map. I'll fix this ASAP. Regards, Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are ! -- --- Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, security? Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your job easier Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache Geronimo http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnkkid=120709bid=263057dat=121642 ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel _ Shop til you drop at XtraMSN Shopping http://shopping.xtramsn.co.nz/home/ --- Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, security? Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your job easier Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache Geronimo http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnkkid=120709bid=263057dat=121642 ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Landcover-DB Mapserver update
dene maxwell wrote: a couple of other observations The ICAO selector doesn't like lower-case Aaah, didn't think of that because I always use upper case for ICAO codes. The land-cover seems to be offset to the coast line (in the case of NZWN to the south) This is part of a well-known issue, has been discussed on this list and off-line for a long time and won't be changed just by setting up a Mapserver to visualize the data :-) Please look in the archives for an explanation, there has been a rather detailed discussion in Feb. or March. on the positive...its a very intuative interface [...] Thanks, I'm trying to get better every time I touch this ;-) Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are ! -- --- Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, security? Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your job easier Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache Geronimo http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnkkid=120709bid=263057dat=121642 ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Landcover-DB Mapserver update
Martin Spott wrote: Please enjoy the latest update to the Landcover Mapserver and the underlying database. Visit: http://mapserver.flightgear.org/ enter the ICAO identifier of your favourite airfield and explore our landcover data. I _am_ aware of two drawbacks: 1.) There is a rounding error that leaves the location of your airfield eccentric in the map view, 2.) the exact location of the airfield is not being displayed in the map. Hi Martin, Quick question. How hard (or would it be possible) to create a version of this tool that would run locally and use a local copy of the TerraGear work directory instead of the raw vmap0 or shapefile ... something that a person could use locally if they wanted to debug a scenery land cover anomaly and figure out where the strangeness is coming from? Either way, good stuff, thanks. Thanks, Curt. -- Curtis Olsonhttp://www.flightgear.org/~curt HumanFIRST Program http://www.humanfirst.umn.edu/ FlightGear Project http://www.flightgear.org Unique text:2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d --- Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, security? Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your job easier Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache Geronimo http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnkkid=120709bid=263057dat=121642 ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Landcover-DB Mapserver update
Hi Curt, Curtis L. Olson wrote: Martin Spott wrote: Please enjoy the latest update to the Landcover Mapserver and the underlying database. Visit: http://mapserver.flightgear.org/ [...] Quick question. How hard (or would it be possible) to create a version of this tool that would run locally and use a local copy of the TerraGear work directory instead of the raw vmap0 or shapefile ... something that a person could use locally if they wanted to debug a scenery land cover anomaly and figure out where the strangeness is coming from? This would be a really huge task. The Mapserver software indeed provides an interface to different well-known vector data sources but the TerraGear work directories definitely don't count as such. BTW, Mapserver is everything but a plug-and-play software. Even interfacing to such a well-known data source can result in time-consuming debug sessions, depending on what the source of your data is As we already discussed in the past, multiple anomalies stem from the way how different land cover features are represented in the different data sets. I have the hope that this Mapserver helps us to understand how things really look like in the 'raw' data. Either way, good stuff, thanks. I'm happy you like it. I'll try to improve it as time permits, Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are ! -- --- Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, security? Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your job easier Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache Geronimo http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnkkid=120709bid=263057dat=121642 ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
