FLUXLIST: Dung beetles (was: Prank Phone Call Performances)
Well ann, thanks for that lovely scenario; but what i was suggesting was not that anyone had a responsibility to hear anyone out but that it could in the long term provide a good deal of inspiration and could end up being worth the time. I by no means asserted that anyone should get raped in order to see what they come up with during the endeavor, and I think the tone of your response was absurdly confrontational. (I'm not sure if calling for my rape is a violation of the fluxlist code of conduct, by the way.) My post merely suggestive that, on the thread of transgression, that that which we automatically censor, ignore, delete, can oftentimes be dealt with in a creative manner, rather than to simply ignore, delete, or censor it. You will note that my post dealt exclusively with the value of threats and hang ups and though acknowledging obscenity did not attempt to carry on about its glorious virtue. But now perhaps I should. One person pornography is another persons beautiful documentation of decay; I suggest to everyone on the list the film "Henry Fool" to see what happens when things are treated as filth on account of not understanding them Look at Burroughs, Kerouac, Neil Cassidy, Allen Ginsberg. The beats took obscenity to a whole new level of art; perhaps the deterioration of the values in america and the world will now form a new obscenity that of which fluxlist will deem incapable of transmission and censor, censure and moderate. While in fact I didn't even see the offending post and doubt it was such an attempt at art, what would have happened if it was? Look a little closer at the pile of dung, my friends, one never knows how glorious the beetles inside it will be colored. ann klefstad wrote:
Re: FLUXLIST: Dung beetles (was: Prank Phone Call Performances)
I called for no violence directed at you; I asked you to imagine such an event, as you seemed perhaps deficient in empathy. If you didn't see the post in question it may be difficult for you to speak of it accurately. It was very similar to an obscene phone call (which is not a prank phone call--your equating the two was the reason for me to share my experience--which was not a rape, but a battle.) You have been offended by my recounting of a story that occurred in my own life. You offend as easily, then, as anyone. This recounting was meant to bring home to whoever read it the fact that obscenity as threat reads differently to people who live under that threat every day than it does to people who do not live under that threat. That is all it is meant to do. It's no accusation. Re-read it, and I think you'll see that. Events are real; they have consequences. One's reaction to any meaningful construction is colored by the events one habitually experiences. This is the relation of art and life. Kathy Acker's treatments of obscenity might interest you; they hold more interest for me than the rather stale patriarchal guilt/desire of, say, Miller.
FLUXLIST: Re: travesty trial transgression
last words little lists bit players mean nothing to anyone /:b
Re: FLUXLIST: Trial by e-jury (Ann's good faith)
social disintegration and simmering discontent
human kind's self-alienation as an aesthetic pleasure of the first
order: in the cynical 00's melancholy itself becomes a kind of
commodity
The 12hr-ISBN-JPEG Project since 1994
+ + + serial ftp://ftp.eskimo.com/u/b/bbrace
+ + + eccentricftp://ftp.netcom.com/pub/bb/bbrace
+ + + continuous ftp://ftp.teleport.com/users/bbrace
+ + +hypermodern ftp://ftp.rdrop.com/pub/users/bbrace
+ + +imagery ftp://ftp.pacifier.com/pub/users/bbrace
News://alt.binaries.pictures.12hr ://a.b.p.fine-art.misc
Mailing-list: [EMAIL PROTECTED] / subscribe 12hr-isbn-jpeg
Reverse Solidus: http://www.teleport.com/~bbrace/bbrace.html
http://bbrace.laughingsquid.net
{ brad brace }[EMAIL PROTECTED] ~finger for pgp
FLUXLIST: Re: FLUXLIST-digest V1 #357
i'm trying to make artworks out of my feces by trying to eat different kinds of foods and drinking some edible coloringsany suggestions what other kinds of food that i might eat to produce such a very interesting effect on my feces. -champoy hate __ Do You Yahoo!? Get Yahoo! Mail - Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/
Re: FLUXLIST: Dung beetles (was: Prank Phone Call Performances)
In a message dated 06/27/2000 2:49:10 AM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Look at Burroughs, Kerouac, Neil Cassidy, Allen Ginsberg. The beats took obscenity to a whole new level of art; perhaps the deterioration of the values in america and the world will now form a new obscenity that of which fluxlist will deem incapable of transmission and censor, censure and moderate. While in fact I didn't even see the offending post and doubt it was such an attempt at art, what would have happened if it was? Eryk, I didn't see Ann's post as dissing you at all, I think she was just saying prank phone calls don't seem as artistically interesting to women who've experienced the violence and hatred aimed at them. I don't think she was calling for your rape either, just asking that you -- who seemingly do have a large and wonderful capacity for imagination -- imagine what it would feel like to actually be the target of such violence and hatred . . . in order to see another side to it. Think of the attack on the women recently in Central Park. Or the women in Bangladesh who have acid thrown on them by men whom they've rejected. I like your prank phone call performance, even though whenever I *69 someone, I always get a message that says that number is not available for that service. The Beats have always been a force in my poetic lineage, since my teachers, mentors and poetry scene were deeply connected to some of them, but when it comes to sexuality, I had to look elsewhere, as it was mostly either an anti-female or female exclusionary sexuality the Beats you mention champion. Look at Burroughs with his hatred of all things female: "Women are two-holed freaks with poison juices." And Kerouac. Myself and many other women I know read On The Road and were awe struck, heavily identifying with the male leads and suddenly realizing only the males were on the road and the chicks were pit stops. And Ginsberg himself, whom I actually respect for a lot of things, saying he could never remember the names of women. (He did remember my name, and published me in a collection he edited at the end of his life--published posthumusly-- of political poems for The Nation.) Barg
Re: FLUXLIST: H.Flynt:Brend:www
High! On Mon, 26 Jun 2000, Patricia wrote: Help Voila: AGAINST "PARTICIPATION": A Total Critique of Culture Henry Flynt (c) 1994 Henry A. Flynt, Jr. in lieu of Part IV, Chapter 11 "Brend," chapter from From "Culture" to Brend Consider the whole of your life, what you already do, all your doings. Now please exclude everything which is naturally physiologically necessary (or harmful), such as breathing and sleeping (or breaking an arm). For what remains, exclude everything which is for the satisfaction of a social demand, a very large area which includes foremost your job, but also care of children, being polite, voting, your haircut, and much else. From what remains, exclude everything which is an agency, a "means" -- another very large area which overlaps with others to be excluded. From what remains, exclude everything which involves competition. In what remains, concentrate on everything done entirely because you just like it as you do it. (...) http://www.henryflynt.org/aesthetics/brend.html Hugh! aa
Re: FLUXLIST: Trial by e-jury (Ann's good faith)
In a message dated 06/27/2000 5:05:25 AM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: in the cynical 00's melancholy itself becomes a kind of commodity I think it's now officially been term the 0-dec. (oh-dec) for 00 decade. So that would read, " . . . in the cynical 0-dec . . ."
Re: FLUXLIST: Re: travesty trial transgression
In a message dated 06/27/2000 4:12:39 AM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: last words little lists bit players mean nothing to anyone Brace yourself for Brad's chomping at the bit players . . .
Re: FLUXLIST: Re: trial [freedom from transgression]
In a message dated 06/27/2000 1:09:49 AM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: . Making sex beautiful, that's trangressive. In other words, letting transgression be beside the point, neither courted nor avoided, and pursuing, with avidity, what one loves. Defending, with avidity, what one loves. Yes! And even BEING ABLE to love avidly . . . love, instead of craving or being addicted to, or merely longing for . . . Love coming from a psychological richness rather than a psychological hunger and desperateness.
Re: FLUXLIST: Re: trial [freedom from transgression]
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: If manditory transgression is written into the job description of a particular group of individuals (artists), and if this is depended upon by another group(s) of people (art enthusiasts) for amusement and/ or reassurance, then how can those who wish to be 'truly' transgressive (within the sign/ language of 'art') act out anything more than a grotesque caricature of culturally reproduced expectations about their role (as artists)? . . . . . in relation to the above I always think of Crow's line that the Avant-garde is (in its oppositional, transgressive position) nothing more than the research and development arm of late capitalism. Owen
Re: FLUXLIST: Re: trial [freedom from transgression]
Thank you Owen for a good point, the one of Crow's. In her essay "Composition as Explanation" Gertrude Stein relates how art, new art, is just a step ahead of what rapidly becomes familiar, not only in commerical but also military terms, objects, actions. She recounts walking with Picasso thrugh the streets of war time Paris (First World War) and seeing camouflaged tanks-- "we have already done that" Picasso says--in reference to Cubism. Likewise Marinetti's Futurist Manifesto (1909) and other manifestos, works and actions of Italian Futurism preceded their appearnce as military forms, actions--deaths--in the First World War. Avant-garde itself of course, is a military term. --dave baptiste chirot On Mon, 26 Jun 2000, Owen Smith wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: If manditory transgression is written into the job description of a particular group of individuals (artists), and if this is depended upon by another group(s) of people (art enthusiasts) for amusement and/ or reassurance, then how can those who wish to be 'truly' transgressive (within the sign/ language of 'art') act out anything more than a grotesque caricature of culturally reproduced expectations about their role (as artists)? . . . . . in relation to the above I always think of Crow's line that the Avant-garde is (in its oppositional, transgressive position) nothing more than the research and development arm of late capitalism. Owen
FLUXLIST: Phone Call Performances, Dung Beetles and the rest
The specifics aside, not to say that these concerns are not important, but another point has been missed and that is that the phone is an interesting medium for performances and interactive works. There was a show a few years ago in which anyone could call in and leave a message and then the visitors could listen to the messages on one of 20 or so message machines and all of the messages were printed out and hung on the walls as a kind of archive. Owen
Re: FLUXLIST: Phone Call Performances, Dung Beetles and the rest
Also, in the 1920's, El Lissitsky had the idea of creating works by "phoning them in"--phoning in the instructions for their making to the person or persons who would make the work according to the caller's specifications. --dbchirot On Tue, 27 Jun 2000, Owen Smith wrote: The specifics aside, not to say that these concerns are not important, but another point has been missed and that is that the phone is an interesting medium for performances and interactive works. There was a show a few years ago in which anyone could call in and leave a message and then the visitors could listen to the messages on one of 20 or so message machines and all of the messages were printed out and hung on the walls as a kind of archive. Owen
FLUXLIST: Obscene phone calls ....
Men do occasionally receive obscene phone calls. It is rare, but it happens. When I lived in New York, I got an obscene phone call late one night. I experienced the same anxiety and discomfort my woman friends reported on experiencing an unknown stranger muttering half-audible obscenities in my ear. For me, the sense of violation came more from the surprise and the sense that an unknown stranger was entering my private world than from the specific words. -- Ken --
Re: FLUXLIST: Trial by e-jury (Ann's good faith)
On Tue, 27 Jun 2000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 06/27/2000 5:05:25 AM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: in the cynical 00's melancholy itself becomes a kind of commodity I think it's now officially been term the 0-dec. (oh-dec) for 00 decade. So that would read, " . . . in the cynical 0-dec . . ." http://bbrace.laughingsquid.net/isbn3-0map.html not in my book /:b
Re: FLUXLIST: Re: travesty trial transgression
my solution to brad brace: DELETE!
carol starr
taos, new mexico, usa
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Tue, 27 Jun 2000, { brad brace } wrote:
last words
little lists
bit players
mean nothing
to anyone
/:b
Re: FLUXLIST: Dung beetles (was: Prank Phone Call Performances)
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 06/27/2000 3:00:20 AM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Kathy Acker's treatments of obscenity might interest you; they hold more interest for me than the rather stale patriarchal guilt/desire of, say, Miller. I think it was Foucault who pointed out that pornography arises with along with sexual repression. Before that you get eroticism. How can we reclaim the erotic? Interesting you should say that--Acker was interesting for me in her moment because she claimed the right for women to be obscene, but unfortunately that right isn't very enjoyable. And yes, I think that eroticism--that is, fun sex w/o punishment and guilt--is highly revolutionary, and probably always will be as long as property and the selling of one's time for money alienates people from their own bodies and those of the people they love. I'm currently working on a long series of tar paintings (asphaltum on plywood) of forest-as-field (that is, not pictorialized but the complex visual field of the forest as you walk through it--I take slides, project them, do rough drawings from this, and then kind of carve the drawings out of the ply with the blacks) that are now beginning to incorporate forest elementals. They're erotic figures, male and female, with these leafy heads. They're depicted on 2 ft by 8ft sheets of ply--tall and narrow--the other work is on panels ranging from 4 ft by 8 ft to 12 ft by 8 ft. All freestanding, doublesided. Makes a sort of maze. What's interesting to me is that all these figures are unconscious--that is, sleeping, whatever. They all are sort of flung down. That's how they occur, it's not really a conscious choice. Also interesting is that they are not --how to say-- offering themselves as erotic, they are erotic incidentally. It seems to make some difference. Encountered on their own terms, they are not objectified. Imagining a sexual world in which women are not hated and punished is not easy, but it is becoming increasingly possible. Young writers (have you read "In the Drink"?) are doing, without a lot of fanfare, works in which women do live broadly physical lives (not only do they have sex without being thrown under trains, they also fart, get indigestion, and eat things in nonpathological ways.) I have hope, and am having much fun doing this figurative work right now. AK
Re: FLUXLIST: Re: FLUXLIST-digest V1 #357
last winter the mice ate my paint sticks and had multicolour feces so you might try that. gosh, i should have made an art piece out of it but i just threw it away and killed the mice. carol starr taos, new mexico, usa [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Tue, 27 Jun 2000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 06/27/2000 5:37:53 AM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: i'm trying to make artworks out of my feces by trying to eat different kinds of foods and drinking some edible coloringsany suggestions what other kinds of food that i might eat to produce such a very interesting effect on my feces. Beets for color. Liquid bentonite for texture.
Re: FLUXLIST: Re: trial [freedom from transgression]
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 06/27/2000 1:09:49 AM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: . Making sex beautiful, that's trangressive. In other words, letting transgression be beside the point, neither courted nor avoided, and pursuing, with avidity, what one loves. Defending, with avidity, what one loves. Yes! And even BEING ABLE to love avidly . . . love, instead of craving or being addicted to, or merely longing for . . . Love coming from a psychological richness rather than a psychological hunger and desperateness. Yes! arriving at it.
Re: FLUXLIST: Re: FLUXLIST-digest V1 #357
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 06/27/2000 5:37:53 AM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: i'm trying to make artworks out of my feces by trying to eat different kinds of foods and drinking some edible coloringsany suggestions what other kinds of food that i might eat to produce such a very interesting effect on my feces. Beets for color. Liquid bentonite for texture. I have heard that an exclusive diet of Kaopectate will have you shitting porcelain turds inside of a week. But I must say I've never tried it.
FLUXLIST: Re: stamps
hi PK, in today's nytimes.com wonderful, as i told kiku this morning, don't you love it? best, Carol :) :) :) CALGARY JOURNAL Topple the Queen! Enthrone Yourself on a Stamp For Canadians tired of airbrushed photos of the queen on their stamps, Canada Post suggests the 21st-century alternative: personalize your postage with a photo of the new baby or the loyal dog. http://www.nytimes.com/library/world/americas/062700canada-journal.html carol starr taos, new mexico, usa [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: FLUXLIST: Dung beetles (was: Prank Phone Call Performances)
Eryk wrote: Look at Burroughs, Kerouac, Neil Cassidy, Allen Ginsberg. The beats took obscenity to a whole new level of art I would say that only Burroughs worked with obscenity as any kind of concept and even then did he do more with obscenity than DeSade who predates him? Burroughs obscenity seems an accident of his literary concerns I don't think he's actually even that obscene although I remember when I first read Burroughs "The Naked Lunch" I was surprised by it for two reasons, firstly the explicit nature of the material, I was still a teenager when I read it and I'd never before read anything like it, secondly how boring the book was: I read half of it at first and then it was several months later before I finished it. In fact I think it's his worst/most boring book..I much prefer "Queer" or "Cities of the Red Night". For some reason the film of the Naked Lunch bores me too. I went to see it in the cinema when it came out and fell asleep during itthe cinema was half empty and even more empty by the end as people walked out. My second attempt to watch it was on video..again I fell asleep. I'm quite surprised as I can normally watch all manner of dreadful films without falling asleep. The fact is that the film itself seems extremely dull. In fact I secretly suspect that Burroughs' popularity was mostly due to his strange life rather than his fiction. BP mentions Burroughs hatred of women but I always think that's just an act. It was a good way to get attention and to appeal to the misogyny market(gay and straight), he only said most of this long after his marriages. He certainly cared for the two women he married(he seemed a better husband than Kerouac for example in temrs of commitment) and even if he did shoot the second one I am willing to believe it was an accident as most of the biographical data mentions. After all he had no reason to marry her yet he did and had children with her. BP wrote: And Kerouac. Myself and many other women I know read On The Road and were awe struck, heavily identifying with the male leads and suddenly realizing only the males were on the road and the chicks were pit stops. I enjoyed "On the Road" again as a teenager, so much so that I read a lot of other Kerouac as well as a couple of biographies. As soon as I read the biographies I could no longer take any of his books seriously. I know one should separate the artist and the man but when you find out that Kerouac in reality lived most of his life with his mother (despite 3 marriages) and was actually only "on the road" for his summer holidays it all seems a bit of a joke. Actually I found that most of the beats' work lost appeal for me after a while. I still like a few of Ginsberg's poems but once you've read the good ones and start reading the rest it's disappointing...esp. "Punks of Dawlish" which is a truly terrible poem. However I must admit that he was a great performer and seeing him read was a great moment in my life. I believe Burroughs has a more lasting appeal because of his ideas. Not the misogynistic rubbish but his ideas on the nature of society and addiction and his audio-visual work: The films made with Brion Gysin and Anthony Balch, and his own visual art (Gun Door and the works/book with Keith Haring) and audio recordings(from Call me Burroughs through Dead City Radio etc.). To make a point, since my wittering on should arguably come to some conclusion: For me Richard Brautigan is the only beat whose work is long lasting(i.e. it never seems to diminish with re-reading) and this is probably because he is not trying to shock. He wrote wonderful stories filled with imagination and great ideas. Anyway, I'll stop now as this post is too long considering it says so little of substance. cheers, Sol.
Re: FLUXLIST: Dung beetles (was: Prank Phone Call Performances)
I considered the "lacking empathy" remark a dis, by all means, and found it an unusually strong reaction to a discussion of the phone as a medium. But hey, I guess you can pull that off when you're a list owner. In my experience I have been the target of several prank phone calls, including and not limited to threats of local gang members, jealous former boyfriends of girls I was dating, and the random, useless drunken prank of a random number. The horror, for me, is interesting in that it does serve as an uncomfortable invasion of personal space- the most intimate of spaces, in fact, the ear. To me this proves that the intimacy of the telephone is a very delicate thing; and that which is delicate is a good source of inspiration. If it can provide horror, it should be able, as a medium, to provide bits of beauty as well. I have no idea what that had to do with me being a sociopath, but hey. -e. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Eryk, I didn't see Ann's post as dissing you at all, I think she was just saying prank phone calls don't seem as artistically interesting to women who've experienced the violence and hatred aimed at them. I don't think she was calling for your rape either, just asking that you -- who seemingly do have a large and wonderful capacity for imagination -- imagine what it would feel like to actually be the target of such violence and hatred . . .
Re: FLUXLIST: Trial by e-jury (Ann's good faith)
On Tue, 27 Jun 2000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 06/27/2000 5:05:25 AM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: in the cynical 00's melancholy itself becomes a kind of commodity I think it's now officially been term the 0-dec. (oh-dec) for 00 decade. So that would read, " . . . in the cynical 0-dec . . ." http://bbrace.laughingsquid.net/isbn3-0map.html not in my book Definitely not your book . . . Chuck D's book.
Re: FLUXLIST: Dung beetles (was: Prank Phone Call Performances)
I have no idea what that had to do with me being a sociopath, but hey. Did someone call you a sociopath? Missed that, and certainly I don't think of you as a sociopath. But I do feel everyone is on a path of some sort. BP
FLUXLIST: [Fwd: SERVICE 2000]
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FLUXLIST: Transgressions
A single act... The other reaction would have been to let him in and bombard him with apropriate answers in personal mails. Offlist. Btw, I one forwarded something, that did offend people very much, at least it was said so, still cant really understand it, the date rape file. Couldnt we combine those two acts ? "Transgressions"... Trans what ? Which ? H. Btw history, mythbuilding: would like to know more about the foundation of fluxlist, and what did this mean ? Higgins on "Avant-Garde" etc. Btw, I saw Malgosia in comp.mail.pine. Artists in Cyberspacio. Would Malgosia had kicked him out ? I am shure not, or ? ;-) Like her elefant.
FLUXLIST: calling
allan kaprow's "calling" (1965) in the city, peole stand at street corners and wait. FOR EACH OF THEM: a car pulls up, someone calls out a name, the persons gets in, they drive off. during the trip, the person is wrapped in aluminium foil. the car is parked somewhere, is left there, locked; the silver person sitting motionless in the back seat. some one unlocks the car, drives off, the foil is removed from the person; he or she is wrapped in cloth into a laundry bag. the car stops, the person is dumped at a public garage and the car goes away. at the garage, a waiting auto starts up, the person is picked up from the concrete pavement, is hauled into the car, is taken to the information booth at gran central station. the person is propped up against it and left. the person calls out names. and hears the others brought there also call. they call out for sometime. then they work loose from their wrappings and leave the train station they telephone certain numbers. the phone rings and rings. finally it is answered, a name is asked for, and inmediately the other ends clicks off.
Re: FLUXLIST: Re: Conner Quote
I believe someone else posted this quotation. As for myself, I don't get it. Lined paper is a useful technology which I find helpful. I also find it helpful when people write from left to right, though thoughtful alternatives can be stimulating ;-) George wrote: If they give you lined paper, write the other way. Bruce Conner This is my favorite quote ever. I can't believe that you wrote it. I live by this quote. Thanks for letting me know it was Bruce Conner who said or wrote it. I remember it from the front page of "Fahrenheit 451" by Bradbary. Anyways, thanx again George, that made my night. ac Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com
FLUXLIST: botticelli's venus...
coats to shore on the half-shell. sexual love is a deep sea diving the timeless and elemental . g. wilson knight says, 'life rose from the sea. our bodies are there three parts water and our minds compacted of salty lusts.'27 woman's body reeks of the sea. ferenczi says, ' the genital secretion of the female among the higher mammals and in man. . . possesses a distinctly fishy odor (odor of herring brine), according to the description of all psycologists; this odor of the vagina comes from the same substance (trimethylamine) as the decomposition of fish gives rise to.' 28 raw clams, i am convinced , have a latently cunnilingual character that many find repugnant. eating a clam, fresh killed, barely dead, is a barbarous, amorous plunging into mother nature's cold salt sea." (apollo and dionysus, p.92 -sexual personae- camille paglia) pd: "shakti" with john mclaughlin's "a handful of beauty" on the background. lights on (off side) ...fish
Re: FLUXLIST: Re: FLUXLIST-digest V1 #357
Easy. Beet greens. /:b On Tue, 27 Jun 2000, CHAMPOY wrote: i'm trying to make artworks out of my feces by trying to eat different kinds of foods and drinking some edible coloringsany suggestions what other kinds of food that i might eat to produce such a very interesting effect on my feces.
Re: FLUXLIST: Dung beetles (was: Prank Phone Call Performances)
In a message dated 06/27/2000 10:30:46 AM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Kathy Acker's treatments of obscenity might interest you; they hold more interest for me than the rather stale patriarchal guilt/desire of, say, Miller. I think it was Foucault who pointed out that pornography arises with along with sexual repression. Before that you get eroticism. How can we reclaim the erotic? Interesting you should say that--Acker was interesting for me in her moment because she claimed the right for women to be obscene, but unfortunately that right isn't very enjoyable. And yes, I think that eroticism--that is, fun sex w/o punishment and guilt--is highly revolutionary, and probably always will be as long as property and the selling of one's time for money alienates people from their own bodies and those of the people they love. I was thinking of Foucault in relation to the Henry Miller thing. I like Acker okay, not my fave writer, but when she first came out I dug her a lot. Barg
FLUXLIST: Random act of shopping
There was this ballot box I put up for sale on eBay http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=348343143 and at least one person (you know who you are Patricia/PK Harris) wanted to know who the winning bidder was and why he/she bought it. Here's my original reply and the winning bidders own words on the subject: Date: Thu, 22 Jun 2000 23:41:50 -0400 From: allen bukoff [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: other people's sisters The person who bid the highest is a longtime friend of mine, Mary Tiegreen, and has not replied to my emails because, I think, she is now traveling overseas. Anyway, I have emailed her and asked her why the hell she bid on it. I really can't imagine why. Mary's a graphic designer, artist, author (most recent book, Let the big dog eat, co-authored with her husband, is about golf slang) but not a lot of interest in Fluxus. I also told her that she'd actually have to send me the money or eBay will throw us in jail just for having the appearance of shill bidding. We'll just have to wait until she returns to find out what she was thinking. Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 21:22:08 -0500 To: allen bukoff [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Random act of shopping We just got back from Europe so I haven't really addressed my wild and wacky move to buy the box full of stuff as yet. Just so you know, it was a bid from the heart, a random act of shopping, a sincere statement of support and interest, and a late night decision to just do a go girl thing. OK, it IS only a cardboard box with stuff in it, but it's art AND I was thinking of donating it to the Fluxus Indian Museum. AND it's probably not worth $46 right now but WHAT IS I ask you? A pair of shoes? A salad at Le Cirque? Are these worth more than the conceptual and lasting object you have created?!?!?! Is Mr. Gucci the only one who can create merchandise worthy of 46 buckaroos? Will we remember the limp salad we pushed around while we pretended to be interested in the conversation of our companion in some has-been restaurant more than this box filled with passionate sentiments? Doubtful. So YES! I paid $46 for this work and you can tell your Fluxus friends that next time they might want to reconsider their bidding style and maybe up the ante a bit in order to capture such a prize. I feel fortunate to be the owner of The Box, and will decide in the next six months where it should be exhibited. In the meantime, I remain Mary Tiegreen
Re: FLUXLIST: Re: FLUXLIST-digest V1 #357
BEETS CARROTS CORN
