Re: [Foundation-l] South Korean Government's regulations on real name for Internet

[Nathan]

They also noted that Korean users who wanted to upload content and make
comments could alter their user preferences to state residency in a country
other than South Korea. I'm not sure how this will help them if the KCC
expects IP filtering, but... If declaring national origin was possible in
preferences, and we were to become subject to this rule in some way, we
could go the same route by unofficially advising users with accounts to note
non-Korean residency.

~Nathan
___
foundation-l mailing list
foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l

Re: [Foundation-l] South Korean Government's regulations on real name for Internet

[Kalan]

On Mon, Apr 13, 2009 at 22:11, Milos Rancic  wrote:
> So, probably, the option is to do the same and to find some open (or
> not so open) proxies for Koreans who are willing to edit.
That’d be extremely stupid if we are actually not required to do so
(which is quite likely). So I suggest waiting for the news first.

— Kalan

___
foundation-l mailing list
foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l

Re: [Foundation-l] South Korean Government's regulations on real name for Internet

[Milos Rancic]

Youtube blocked uploading and registering by Korean users [1].

So, probably, the option is to do the same and to find some open (or
not so open) proxies for Koreans who are willing to edit.

[1] - 
http://googlesystem.blogspot.com/2009/04/youtube-korea-respects-privacy.html

___
foundation-l mailing list
foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l

Re: [Foundation-l] South Korean Government's regulations on real name for Internet

[Nemo_bis]

Mike Godwin, 12/04/2009 14:35:
> 1) We're watching S. Korea closely to determine whether their new "real
> name" policy will affect our projects.

Thank you.
Gabriella Carlucci, a showgirl and deputy (pretty similar works here in 
Italy, especially according to our prime minister), has proposed a 
similar law even in Italy...

Nemo

___
foundation-l mailing list
foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l

Re: [Foundation-l] South Korean Government's regulations on real name for Internet

[Mike Godwin]

Geoffrey Plourde writes:

>
> While I may not be a lawyer, I believe that this system is a paper tiger.
> It is simply impossible for them to enforce it for many reasons.
>
> 1. It is impossible for us to determine which users are from South Korea
> 2. It would be a privacy violation to deliver names and numbers of non
> Koreans to the Korean government to be vetted for criminal purposes
> 3. There exists no means by which they can enforce this law upon the
> Foundation.


I think this is all basically correct, but would add that the limitations on
the amount of user data we keep now (see our Privacy Policy) mean that even
South Koreans have a lot of (effective) protection from government attempts
to extract "real name" information from Wikimedia databases. (I'll note that
edit histories, however, may have IP numbers that help identify particular
users to anyone who bothers to look -- this is perhaps a good reason for
South Koreans to use logins if they are going to edit.)


> That being said, I urge the Foundation to check system architecture and
> work towards placing all personal information databases in a country with
> real protections, like the United States. This will prevent any future
> problems of this nature.


Again, we don't have much in the way of personal information databases, but
what little we do have is based in the United States.

In general, I want folks in the Community to know:

1) We're watching S. Korea closely to determine whether their new "real
name" policy will affect our projects.

2) We would not change our privacy policy -- which limits the extent to
which it's possible in every case to identify particular users -- as a
result of such developments in S. Korea or anywhere else.

3) South Korea has little or no ability to impose any "real name"
identifying rules on us, not least because of our lack of a significant
organizational or economic presence there.

4) We don't currently anticipate anything precisely parallel to the blocking
issue in the UK some months ago.  There is no sign yet that the S. Korean
government will take steps that would result in changes to S. Koreans'
ability to access our projects. True, what few steps they could take
unilaterally might limit South Koreans' access to our projects in some
indiscriminate way, but even in that extreme case it wouldn't result in our
changing our Privacy Policy.


--Mike
___
foundation-l mailing list
foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l

Re: [Foundation-l] South Korean Government's regulations on real name for Internet

[Geoffrey Plourde]

While I may not be a lawyer, I believe that this system is a paper tiger. It is 
simply impossible for them to enforce it for many reasons. 

1. It is impossible for us to determine which users are from South Korea
2. It would be a privacy violation to deliver names and numbers of non Koreans 
to the Korean government to be vetted for criminal purposes
3. There exists no means by which they can enforce this law upon the 
Foundation. 

That being said, I urge the Foundation to check system architecture and work 
towards placing all personal information databases in a country with real 
protections, like the United States. This will prevent any future problems of 
this nature.





From: Lars Aronsson 
To: Wikimedia Foundation Mailing List 
Sent: Saturday, April 11, 2009 4:45:37 AM
Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] South Korean Government's regulations on real name 
for Internet

RYU Cheol wrote:

> If we have to abide by, they will mention us on their list which 
> will be posted on their web site.

So in theory, this could happen to the English language Wikipedia 
(if enough many Koreans use it), not only the Korean language 
Wikipedia?  Of course the English language Wikipedia has many 
anonymous and pseudonymous users.  So how would the Korean 
authorities know which ones are Koreans and need to identify?


-- 
  Lars Aronsson (l...@aronsson.se)
  Aronsson Datateknik - http://aronsson.se

___
foundation-l mailing list
foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l



  
___
foundation-l mailing list
foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l

Re: [Foundation-l] South Korean Government's regulations on real name for Internet

[David Gerard]

2009/4/10 RYU Cheol :

> Here we have, http://ko.wikipedia.org/User:Ryuch/realname
> I qouted the names in the announcement of Communication Commission.
> It includes Yahoo and Microsoft as well as Google.
> Yahoo and Microsoft submitted to the law.


And YouTube said "what? ahahaha no."
http://www.koreatimes.co.kr/www/news/biz/2009/04/123_42862.html


- d.

___
foundation-l mailing list
foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l

Re: [Foundation-l] South Korean Government's regulations on real name for Internet

[Mark Williamson]

For that matter, how would they know which people at ko.wp are Korean citizens?

Mark


2009/4/11 Lars Aronsson :
> RYU Cheol wrote:
>
>> If we have to abide by, they will mention us on their list which
>> will be posted on their web site.
>
> So in theory, this could happen to the English language Wikipedia
> (if enough many Koreans use it), not only the Korean language
> Wikipedia?  Of course the English language Wikipedia has many
> anonymous and pseudonymous users.  So how would the Korean
> authorities know which ones are Koreans and need to identify?
>
>
> --
>  Lars Aronsson (l...@aronsson.se)
>  Aronsson Datateknik - http://aronsson.se
>
> ___
> foundation-l mailing list
> foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
>

___
foundation-l mailing list
foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l

Re: [Foundation-l] South Korean Government's regulations on real name for Internet

[Lars Aronsson]

RYU Cheol wrote:

> If we have to abide by, they will mention us on their list which 
> will be posted on their web site.

So in theory, this could happen to the English language Wikipedia 
(if enough many Koreans use it), not only the Korean language 
Wikipedia?  Of course the English language Wikipedia has many 
anonymous and pseudonymous users.  So how would the Korean 
authorities know which ones are Koreans and need to identify?


-- 
  Lars Aronsson (l...@aronsson.se)
  Aronsson Datateknik - http://aronsson.se

___
foundation-l mailing list
foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l

Re: [Foundation-l] South Korean Government's regulations on real name for Internet

[Chen Minqi]

On Fri, Apr 10, 2009 at 11:24 PM, RYU Cheol  wrote:
>They already presented the list of this year. They will collect data
>for the average number of visitors per 3 months  in the end of every>year.

Which means that we still have more than half a year to clear our doubt and,
if the law affects us, to make a decision?
___
foundation-l mailing list
foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l

Re: [Foundation-l] South Korean Government's regulations on real name for Internet

[RYU Cheol]

Here we have, http://ko.wikipedia.org/User:Ryuch/realname
I qouted the names in the announcement of Communication Commission.

It includes Yahoo and Microsoft as well as Google.
Yahoo and Microsoft submitted to the law.

--Cheol


2009/4/11 Nathan :
> 2009/4/10 Puzzlet Chung 
>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> This year, 153 domains are obligated to provide "personal
>> identification management," all of them are websites for either
>> commercial company or public broadcasting service.
>>
>>
>>
> Do you mean that there is a list of entities that come under the law? Can
> you link to the list, and is it official?
>
> Nathan
> ___
> foundation-l mailing list
> foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
>

___
foundation-l mailing list
foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l

Re: [Foundation-l] South Korean Government's regulations on real name for Internet

[Nathan]

2009/4/10 Puzzlet Chung 

>
>
>
>
> This year, 153 domains are obligated to provide "personal
> identification management," all of them are websites for either
> commercial company or public broadcasting service.
>
>
>
Do you mean that there is a list of entities that come under the law? Can
you link to the list, and is it official?

Nathan
___
foundation-l mailing list
foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l

Re: [Foundation-l] South Korean Government's regulations on real name for Internet

[Puzzlet Chung]

On Fri, Apr 10, 2009 at 9:29 PM, Tim Starling  wrote:
> Tim Starling wrote:
>> RYU Cheol wrote:
>>> We have some servers in Seoul, Korea, which are donated by Yahoo,
>>> right? (I'm not sure, let me know) Then it's a web site in South
>>> Korea.
>>
>> Those servers are no longer being used to serve the website, they're
>> just being used for a few miscellaneous tasks. We're planning to move
>> all remaining operations in Korea to Florida, and to return the
>> servers to Yahoo. These plans can be hurried up if it's necessary for
>> legal reasons.
>>
>> Is there an English translation of the law in question, available on
>> the web?
>
> Answering my own question:
>
> http://www.worldlii.org/int/other/PrivLRes/2005/2.html
>
> Article 55 appears to be relevant:
>
> (1) The Minister of Information and Communication may request the
> information and communications service providers, etc. (in this
> Article, including any person falling under a case where the
> provisions of Article 58 apply mutatis mutandis) to submit related
> goods and documents, etc., if it is necessary to enforce this Act.
>
> From Article 2:
>
>  3. "Information and communications service providers" shall mean the
> operators of telecommunications as prescribed in Article 2 (1) 1 of
> the Telecommunications Business Act and other persons who provide
> information or intermediate information services for profit utilizing
> the services rendered by the telecommunications service providers;
>
> From the Telecommunications Business Act:
> 
>
>  1.the term "telecommunications business operator" means a person who
> provides telecommunications service with holding the relevant license
> or making a registration or report under this Act"
>
> Article 58:
>
> (1) The provisions of Articles 22 through 32 shall apply mutatis
> mutandis where any person prescribed by the Presidential Decree, from
> among other persons than the information and communications service
> provider, who provides goods or services, collects, utilizes or
> provides the personal information of customers of his/her goods or
> services. In this case, the "information and communications service
> provider" and the "information and communications service providers,
> etc." shall be deemed the "providers of goods or services," and the
> "user" shall be deemed the "customer of goods or services," respectively.
>
>
> So I guess the question is then, whether Wikimedia is prescribed by
> the Presidential Decree. Google would qualify under the definition in
> article 2, since they are for-profit. We would need to come under
> article 58 if we were to be subject to this legislation.
>
> In any case, there are the usual difficulties of international
> jurisdiction, as amply demonstrated by the court cases against us in
> Germany. Unlike Google, Wikimedia would have the option of ignoring
> any decision by the Korean courts. But the government could easily
> retaliate by DNS poisoning if it came to that.
>
> -- Tim Starling
>
>
> ___
> foundation-l mailing list
> foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
>

The law translated there is outdated as it had been amended nine times
from then. The article under question is now Article 44-5, and it goes
like follows: (I'm not good at translating legal documents)

(1) In order to install and operate bullet-in board, Any person
provided for in the following Subparagraphs shall manage to provide
methods and processes to identify the users of that bullet-in board.
(called "personal identification management")
1. The national government, local governments, public services,
[similar kind of entities] as provided in [law titles].
2. Information and communications service providers, whose information
and communications service it provides has the daily users over 100
thousands, and is under the provisions as prescribed by the
Presidential Decree.

"Bullet-in board" is defined as "computer program or technical device
with which users can publish code, text, voice, sound, or video on the
public using the web, regardless of the name," and "information and
communications service" and its "provider" are defined exactly same as
the older law.


And the Article 30 of the corresponding Presidential Decree states the
criteria as follows:

1. Those who are "under the provisions as prescribed by the
Presidential Decree" stated in the Article 44-5 (1) 2 shall mean the
information and communications service provider whose average users
had been above 100 thousands, during the last three month of the
preceding year.
2. Korea Communications Commission shall publicly announce the subject
to the Article 44-5 Paragraph 1, and the due for the preparatory and
executive process for the personal identification management as
prescribed in the Article, by posting on the internet website.


This year, 153 doma

Re: [Foundation-l] South Korean Government's regulations on real name for Internet

[Ting Chen]

Hello Cheol,

first of all, we are all very concerned about this issue and we are 
still sorting things out. So more informations especially from you in 
the country would be of great value.

To your question at first: According to the comScore data ( 
http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Stu/comScore ) the Korean Wikipedia 
had in February 2009 more than 1.1 million visitors. I suppose most of 
them come from South Korea, so, yes, we have quite certain more than 
100,000 visitors from South Korea.

My understanding about Google and YouTube is that they decided to close 
down their subsidiary in South Korea. There are two things that I don't 
understand at the moment: First, as far as I know companies that are 
based in South Korea or have subsidiaries there have to obey the law. 
But how is it with companies outside of South Korea? Is it in the text 
of the law that website of such companies could be blocked? The second 
thing that I don't quite understand until now is that it seems they had 
submitted the law but have decided not to enforce it. Is that the 
situation at the moment? (This is in so far confusing for me as it says 
that the gouvernment itself doesn't obey or doesn't expect its citizen 
to obey the law of the country, which put the total legal system in 
question.)

A rough translation of the law (or the critical part of it) would be 
helpful for us to judge the situation.

Though the reason for your mail is not happy I am happy that you 
contacted us here. The korean community is until now very very 
underpresented here and the prospect to have a chapter there one day is 
very exciting.

Ting

RYU Cheol wrote:
> I'm not sure what you mean by no business in South Korea.
> The foundation is in Florida, so you don't need to abide by the law of
> United Kingdom?
>
> But I'm an contributing editor of Wikipedia residing in South Korea
> and some of ko.wp editors  are preparing to establish South Korea
> chapter to promote Free Culture Movement. South Korean editors have to
> abide by the regulations of Korean government.
>
>  I want to know if we have visitors more than 100,000 from South Korea or not?
>
> -Cheol
>
> 2009/4/9 Nathan :
>   
>> Assuming it isn't an April Fool's joke, the fact remains that the Wikimedia
>> Foundation is not bound to abide by the laws of South Korea. Google had
>> business there, presumably, while the Foundation does not.
>>
>> Nathan
>> ___
>> foundation-l mailing list
>> foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
>> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
>>
>> 
>
> ___
> foundation-l mailing list
> foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
>   


-- 
Ting

Ting's Blog: http://wingphilopp.blogspot.com/


___
foundation-l mailing list
foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l

Re: [Foundation-l] South Korean Government's regulations on real name for Internet

[Geoffrey Plourde]

So we need to speed the process up. 





From: RYU Cheol 
To: Wikimedia Foundation Mailing List 
Sent: Friday, April 10, 2009 8:24:03 AM
Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] South Korean Government's regulations on real name 
for Internet

Don't hurry up. They announce the services which have to submit the
law every year.
They already presented the list of this year. They will collect data
for the average number of visitors per 3 months  in the end of every
year.
If we have to abide by, they will mention us on their list which will
be posted on their web site.
The more influence Wikipedia makes, the more possibility for us to be
on the list would increase.

--Cheol

2009/4/10 Tim Starling :
> RYU Cheol wrote:
>> We have some servers in Seoul, Korea, which are donated by Yahoo,
>> right? (I'm not sure, let me know) Then it's a web site in South
>> Korea.
>
> Those servers are no longer being used to serve the website, they're
> just being used for a few miscellaneous tasks. We're planning to move
> all remaining operations in Korea to Florida, and to return the
> servers to Yahoo. These plans can be hurried up if it's necessary for
> legal reasons.
>
> Is there an English translation of the law in question, available on
> the web?
>
> -- Tim Starling
>
>
> ___
> foundation-l mailing list
> foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
>

___
foundation-l mailing list
foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l



  
___
foundation-l mailing list
foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l

Re: [Foundation-l] South Korean Government's regulations on real name for Internet

[RYU Cheol]

Don't hurry up. They announce the services which have to submit the
law every year.
They already presented the list of this year. They will collect data
for the average number of visitors per 3 months  in the end of every
year.
If we have to abide by, they will mention us on their list which will
be posted on their web site.
The more influence Wikipedia makes, the more possibility for us to be
on the list would increase.

--Cheol

2009/4/10 Tim Starling :
> RYU Cheol wrote:
>> We have some servers in Seoul, Korea, which are donated by Yahoo,
>> right? (I'm not sure, let me know) Then it's a web site in South
>> Korea.
>
> Those servers are no longer being used to serve the website, they're
> just being used for a few miscellaneous tasks. We're planning to move
> all remaining operations in Korea to Florida, and to return the
> servers to Yahoo. These plans can be hurried up if it's necessary for
> legal reasons.
>
> Is there an English translation of the law in question, available on
> the web?
>
> -- Tim Starling
>
>
> ___
> foundation-l mailing list
> foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
>

___
foundation-l mailing list
foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l

Re: [Foundation-l] South Korean Government's regulations on real name for Internet

[Tim Starling]

Tim Starling wrote:
> RYU Cheol wrote:
>> We have some servers in Seoul, Korea, which are donated by Yahoo,
>> right? (I'm not sure, let me know) Then it's a web site in South
>> Korea.
> 
> Those servers are no longer being used to serve the website, they're
> just being used for a few miscellaneous tasks. We're planning to move
> all remaining operations in Korea to Florida, and to return the
> servers to Yahoo. These plans can be hurried up if it's necessary for
> legal reasons.
> 
> Is there an English translation of the law in question, available on
> the web?

Answering my own question:

http://www.worldlii.org/int/other/PrivLRes/2005/2.html

Article 55 appears to be relevant:

(1) The Minister of Information and Communication may request the
information and communications service providers, etc. (in this
Article, including any person falling under a case where the
provisions of Article 58 apply mutatis mutandis) to submit related
goods and documents, etc., if it is necessary to enforce this Act.

>From Article 2:

 3. "Information and communications service providers" shall mean the
operators of telecommunications as prescribed in Article 2 (1) 1 of
the Telecommunications Business Act and other persons who provide
information or intermediate information services for profit utilizing
the services rendered by the telecommunications service providers;

>From the Telecommunications Business Act:


 1.the term "telecommunications business operator" means a person who
provides telecommunications service with holding the relevant license
or making a registration or report under this Act"

Article 58:

(1) The provisions of Articles 22 through 32 shall apply mutatis
mutandis where any person prescribed by the Presidential Decree, from
among other persons than the information and communications service
provider, who provides goods or services, collects, utilizes or
provides the personal information of customers of his/her goods or
services. In this case, the "information and communications service
provider" and the "information and communications service providers,
etc." shall be deemed the "providers of goods or services," and the
"user" shall be deemed the "customer of goods or services," respectively.


So I guess the question is then, whether Wikimedia is prescribed by
the Presidential Decree. Google would qualify under the definition in
article 2, since they are for-profit. We would need to come under
article 58 if we were to be subject to this legislation.

In any case, there are the usual difficulties of international
jurisdiction, as amply demonstrated by the court cases against us in
Germany. Unlike Google, Wikimedia would have the option of ignoring
any decision by the Korean courts. But the government could easily
retaliate by DNS poisoning if it came to that.

-- Tim Starling


___
foundation-l mailing list
foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l

Re: [Foundation-l] South Korean Government's regulations on real name for Internet

[Tim Starling]

RYU Cheol wrote:
> We have some servers in Seoul, Korea, which are donated by Yahoo,
> right? (I'm not sure, let me know) Then it's a web site in South
> Korea.

Those servers are no longer being used to serve the website, they're
just being used for a few miscellaneous tasks. We're planning to move
all remaining operations in Korea to Florida, and to return the
servers to Yahoo. These plans can be hurried up if it's necessary for
legal reasons.

Is there an English translation of the law in question, available on
the web?

-- Tim Starling


___
foundation-l mailing list
foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l

Re: [Foundation-l] South Korean Government's regulations on real name for Internet

[Puzzlet Chung]

On Fri, Apr 10, 2009 at 1:25 PM, Kalan  wrote:
>
> If a similar law would be adopted in one of the Western countries,
> mass campaigns and protests would be inevitable. Perhaps we should
> expect something like this from Koreans as well?
>
> — Kalan
>

There is a protest of course, including an ongoing suit in the
Constitutional Court to judge the unconstitutionality of the law.

Still millions of people here are supporting the law, since they
attribute the cause of the recent suicides of celebrities to the
dishonoring gossips about them spreading around in the internet, and
they believe that the obligating people's own personal identifications
to websites would help to prevent any immorality.

-- [[ko:User:PuzzletChung]]

___
foundation-l mailing list
foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l

Re: [Foundation-l] South Korean Government's regulations on real name for Internet

[Kalan]

On Fri, Apr 10, 2009 at 10:24, RYU Cheol  wrote:
> I suggest we make a voice against South Korean government,  'cause I
> don't want to say good bye to you all.

If a similar law would be adopted in one of the Western countries,
mass campaigns and protests would be inevitable. Perhaps we should
expect something like this from Koreans as well?

— Kalan

___
foundation-l mailing list
foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l

Re: [Foundation-l] South Korean Government's regulations on real name for Internet

[RYU Cheol]

Of course, we can decide to follow or not, and I hope we decide not to.

I want you to be informed that we have the risk to be blocked from
South Korea and we could loose editors from South Korea.

I suggest we make a voice against South Korean government,  'cause I
don't want to say good bye to you all.

--Cheol

2009/4/10 Mark Williamson :
> No, in most cases we don't have to abide by the law tof the United Kingdom.
>
> There are hundreds of countries in the world, each with their own
> different laws, some seemingly quite draconian when it comes to what
> content is allowed. Imagine, in North Korea the things we say about
> Kim Jong-il are probably illegal, but we don't have to follow their
> law because our website is based in... Florida.
>
> Mark
>
> 2009/4/9 RYU Cheol :
>> I'm not sure what you mean by no business in South Korea.
>> The foundation is in Florida, so you don't need to abide by the law of
>> United Kingdom?
>>
>> But I'm an contributing editor of Wikipedia residing in South Korea
>> and some of ko.wp editors  are preparing to establish South Korea
>> chapter to promote Free Culture Movement. South Korean editors have to
>> abide by the regulations of Korean government.
>>
>>  I want to know if we have visitors more than 100,000 from South Korea or 
>> not?
>>
>> -Cheol
>>
>> 2009/4/9 Nathan :
>>> Assuming it isn't an April Fool's joke, the fact remains that the Wikimedia
>>> Foundation is not bound to abide by the laws of South Korea. Google had
>>> business there, presumably, while the Foundation does not.
>>>
>>> Nathan
>>> ___
>>> foundation-l mailing list
>>> foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
>>> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
>>>
>>
>> ___
>> foundation-l mailing list
>> foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
>> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
>>
>
> ___
> foundation-l mailing list
> foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
>

___
foundation-l mailing list
foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l

Re: [Foundation-l] South Korean Government's regulations on real name for Internet

[Mark Williamson]

No, in most cases we don't have to abide by the law tof the United Kingdom.

There are hundreds of countries in the world, each with their own
different laws, some seemingly quite draconian when it comes to what
content is allowed. Imagine, in North Korea the things we say about
Kim Jong-il are probably illegal, but we don't have to follow their
law because our website is based in... Florida.

Mark

2009/4/9 RYU Cheol :
> I'm not sure what you mean by no business in South Korea.
> The foundation is in Florida, so you don't need to abide by the law of
> United Kingdom?
>
> But I'm an contributing editor of Wikipedia residing in South Korea
> and some of ko.wp editors  are preparing to establish South Korea
> chapter to promote Free Culture Movement. South Korean editors have to
> abide by the regulations of Korean government.
>
>  I want to know if we have visitors more than 100,000 from South Korea or not?
>
> -Cheol
>
> 2009/4/9 Nathan :
>> Assuming it isn't an April Fool's joke, the fact remains that the Wikimedia
>> Foundation is not bound to abide by the laws of South Korea. Google had
>> business there, presumably, while the Foundation does not.
>>
>> Nathan
>> ___
>> foundation-l mailing list
>> foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
>> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
>>
>
> ___
> foundation-l mailing list
> foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
>

___
foundation-l mailing list
foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l

Re: [Foundation-l] South Korean Government's regulations on real name for Internet

[RYU Cheol]

We have some servers in Seoul, Korea, which are donated by Yahoo,
right? (I'm not sure, let me know) Then it's a web site in South
Korea.

--Cheol

2009/4/10 Techman224 :
> If this law includes websites hosted outside of South Korea, and
> there's enough people coming from there, we either have to do it, or
> risk being blocked.
>
> Techman224
>
> ___
> foundation-l mailing list
> foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
>

___
foundation-l mailing list
foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l

Re: [Foundation-l] South Korean Government's regulations on real name for Internet

[Techman224]

If this law includes websites hosted outside of South Korea, and  
there's enough people coming from there, we either have to do it, or  
risk being blocked.

Techman224

___
foundation-l mailing list
foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l

Re: [Foundation-l] South Korean Government's regulations on real name for Internet

[RYU Cheol]

I'm not sure what you mean by no business in South Korea.
The foundation is in Florida, so you don't need to abide by the law of
United Kingdom?

But I'm an contributing editor of Wikipedia residing in South Korea
and some of ko.wp editors  are preparing to establish South Korea
chapter to promote Free Culture Movement. South Korean editors have to
abide by the regulations of Korean government.

 I want to know if we have visitors more than 100,000 from South Korea or not?

-Cheol

2009/4/9 Nathan :
> Assuming it isn't an April Fool's joke, the fact remains that the Wikimedia
> Foundation is not bound to abide by the laws of South Korea. Google had
> business there, presumably, while the Foundation does not.
>
> Nathan
> ___
> foundation-l mailing list
> foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
>

___
foundation-l mailing list
foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l

Re: [Foundation-l] South Korean Government's regulations on real name for Internet

[Nathan]

Assuming it isn't an April Fool's joke, the fact remains that the Wikimedia
Foundation is not bound to abide by the laws of South Korea. Google had
business there, presumably, while the Foundation does not.

Nathan
___
foundation-l mailing list
foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l

Re: [Foundation-l] South Korean Government's regulations on real name for Internet

[RYU Cheol]

Until today they were considering to implement, but finally they
decided to abandon the business in South Korea. Nobody who set his
profile to South Korea cannot upload video and cannot comments on
Youtube. Now you got it?

-Cheol

2009/4/9 Michael Snow :
> RYU Cheol wrote:
>> Yap, it's silly. But it's happening in Korea.
>>
>> http://www.koreatimes.co.kr/www/news/biz/2009/04/123_42862.html
>>
> However, this story indicates that contrary to the earlier report,
> Google (specifically YouTube) is *not* implementing such a system. I
> don't know their reasons or what legal analysis was involved, and I
> hesitate to base my understanding of this law on translated news
> reports. But I can't imagine why we would try to block South Koreans
> from contributing, whether or not they comply with the requirements
> described.
>
> --Michael Snow
>
>
> ___
> foundation-l mailing list
> foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
>

___
foundation-l mailing list
foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l

Re: [Foundation-l] South Korean Government's regulations on real name for Internet

[Michael Snow]

RYU Cheol wrote:
> Yap, it's silly. But it's happening in Korea.
>
> http://www.koreatimes.co.kr/www/news/biz/2009/04/123_42862.html
>   
However, this story indicates that contrary to the earlier report, 
Google (specifically YouTube) is *not* implementing such a system. I 
don't know their reasons or what legal analysis was involved, and I 
hesitate to base my understanding of this law on translated news 
reports. But I can't imagine why we would try to block South Koreans 
from contributing, whether or not they comply with the requirements 
described.

--Michael Snow


___
foundation-l mailing list
foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l

Re: [Foundation-l] South Korean Government's regulations on real name for Internet

[RYU Cheol]

Yap, it's silly. But it's happening in Korea.

http://www.koreatimes.co.kr/www/news/biz/2009/04/123_42862.html


2009/4/9 teun spaans :
> "oncurrently April 1 is when the amendment to South Korea’s Act on the
> Promotion of Information and Communications Network Utilization and User
> Protection will go into effect".
> That date smells ;-)
>
> On Thu, Apr 9, 2009 at 6:53 AM, RYU Cheol  wrote:
>
>> According to this post,
>>
>> http://briandeutsch.blogspot.com/2009/03/google-korea-youtube-korea-to-begin.html
>> ,
>>
>> "Google, the world’s largest Internet company, has finally submitted
>> to South Korea‘s unprecedented Internet regulations, including
>> agreeing to implement a “real name” system in which any South Korean
>> can post their contents only after they confirm their resident
>> registration number."
>>
>> Wikipedia have to response to this regulation.
>>
>> Any site which has more than 100,000 visitors for a day have to
>> implement real name system according to the regulation.
>> We have to check the number of visitors from South Korea. If we have
>> more than that, we have to decide if we will allow editing or not from
>> South Korea.
>>
>> It's a serious challenge for Wikipedia.
>>
>> -Cheol
>>
>> ___
>> foundation-l mailing list
>> foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
>> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
>>
> ___
> foundation-l mailing list
> foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
>

___
foundation-l mailing list
foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l

Re: [Foundation-l] South Korean Government's regulations on real name for Internet

[teun spaans]

"oncurrently April 1 is when the amendment to South Korea’s Act on the
Promotion of Information and Communications Network Utilization and User
Protection will go into effect".
That date smells ;-)

On Thu, Apr 9, 2009 at 6:53 AM, RYU Cheol  wrote:

> According to this post,
>
> http://briandeutsch.blogspot.com/2009/03/google-korea-youtube-korea-to-begin.html
> ,
>
> "Google, the world’s largest Internet company, has finally submitted
> to South Korea‘s unprecedented Internet regulations, including
> agreeing to implement a “real name” system in which any South Korean
> can post their contents only after they confirm their resident
> registration number."
>
> Wikipedia have to response to this regulation.
>
> Any site which has more than 100,000 visitors for a day have to
> implement real name system according to the regulation.
> We have to check the number of visitors from South Korea. If we have
> more than that, we have to decide if we will allow editing or not from
> South Korea.
>
> It's a serious challenge for Wikipedia.
>
> -Cheol
>
> ___
> foundation-l mailing list
> foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
>
___
foundation-l mailing list
foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l

[Foundation-l] South Korean Government's regulations on real name for Internet

[RYU Cheol]

According to this post,
http://briandeutsch.blogspot.com/2009/03/google-korea-youtube-korea-to-begin.html
,

"Google, the world’s largest Internet company, has finally submitted
to South Korea‘s unprecedented Internet regulations, including
agreeing to implement a “real name” system in which any South Korean
can post their contents only after they confirm their resident
registration number."

Wikipedia have to response to this regulation.

Any site which has more than 100,000 visitors for a day have to
implement real name system according to the regulation.
We have to check the number of visitors from South Korea. If we have
more than that, we have to decide if we will allow editing or not from
South Korea.

It's a serious challenge for Wikipedia.

-Cheol

___
foundation-l mailing list
foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l