Re: [fpc-pascal] libQT4Pas - Why it is needed?
Do other languages like python use the plain c interface, or C++? how about something like ruby, lua, objective C, php .. AFAIK, Lua uses automatically generated plain C binding. When I looked at it, the binding generator consisted of the following parts: 1) A C++-based program to parse C++ source and extract required information as XML; 2) A Lua program to build plain C binding based on this XML 3) A CMake scripts to manage building of the above parts and generated binding itself. The corresponding source code is hosted here: https://github.com/mkottman/lqt ___ fpc-pascal maillist - fpc-pascal@lists.freepascal.org http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
Re: [fpc-pascal] libQT4Pas - Why it is needed?
On Wednesday 01 of February 2012 21:02:38 Vladimir Zhirov wrote: Do other languages like python use the plain c interface, or C++? how about something like ruby, lua, objective C, php .. AFAIK, Lua uses automatically generated plain C binding. When I looked at it, the binding generator consisted of the following parts: 1) A C++-based program to parse C++ source and extract required information as XML; 2) A Lua program to build plain C binding based on this XML 3) A CMake scripts to manage building of the above parts and generated binding itself. Wow, that's something ! :) Few years ago in age of Kylix 3 Andreas Hausladen builded C bindings for Qt3 via doxygen which created xml files and then small app builded bindings from that xml files - even virtual methods overriding was supported. So if someone have enough doxygen knowledge it is possible to create automatic C bindings with some efforts. zeljko ___ fpc-pascal maillist - fpc-pascal@lists.freepascal.org http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
Re: [fpc-pascal] libQT4Pas - Why it is needed?
On 1/30/2012 03:26, zeljko wrote: On Monday 30 of January 2012 08:35:23 waldo kitty wrote: i may have easily misunderstood the OP's post... i tend to read in literan english format... ie: if you say eggs are round, that is where i base my response unless it is very obvious that there is something else to consider which i point out ; I think that this question was pretty clear: Do other languages like python use the plain c interface, or C++? i understood that to mean when interfacing with dlls or similar :? ___ fpc-pascal maillist - fpc-pascal@lists.freepascal.org http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
Re: [fpc-pascal] libQT4Pas - Why it is needed?
On Sun, 29 Jan 2012, Krzysztof wrote: Just as I thought - it is object class thing. So if FPC does not (fully) support directly calling external C++ libraries there are plans to support it? This will be great There are no plans to support it, since every C++ compiler uses it's own (incompatible) format, and G++ changes it format regularly, so I was given to understand. Michael. ___ fpc-pascal maillist - fpc-pascal@lists.freepascal.org http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
Re: [fpc-pascal] libQT4Pas - Why it is needed?
On Monday 30 of January 2012 08:35:23 waldo kitty wrote: i may have easily misunderstood the OP's post... i tend to read in literan english format... ie: if you say eggs are round, that is where i base my response unless it is very obvious that there is something else to consider which i point out ; I think that this question was pretty clear: Do other languages like python use the plain c interface, or C++? zeljko ___ fpc-pascal maillist - fpc-pascal@lists.freepascal.org http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
Re: [fpc-pascal] libQT4Pas - Why it is needed?
waldo kitty wrote: On 1/29/2012 17:38, Lars wrote: Do other languages like python use the plain c interface, or C++? how about something like ruby, lua, objective C, php .. :( i don't nderstand why one would want to apply interpreted script languages, al la BASIC, to today's tasks... sure, these are neat and more modern but they are still interpreted scripting languages :( Eh, I meant how does ruby, lua, objective c, and similar tools bind the C++ api. Do they use an automatic tool that converts QT C++ objects to procedural? or by hand, someone converts the objects to procedures and structs? Or do they use the c++ objects directly to python objects.. ___ fpc-pascal maillist - fpc-pascal@lists.freepascal.org http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
Re: [fpc-pascal] libQT4Pas - Why it is needed?
Felipe Monteiro de Carvalho wrote: On Sun, Jan 29, 2012 at 11:38 PM, Lars nore...@z505.com wrote: Do other languages like python use the plain c interface, or C++? how about something like ruby, lua, objective C, php .. No idea, but Python, ruby, lua and php do not generate real programs but instead are just scripts which run in a interpreter, which is immensely different from a real program. Real Programmers... When you use pascal to build web programs you use templates, right.. so you are interpreting templates. When you read an INI file you are interpreting the INI file. Some pascals, safe ones, are interpreted. Like Oberon, or UCSD Pascal. When you parse an Edit.Text and check it to make sure there is not some user error on input, you are interpreting things. Compiled programs are not fully compiled, they always contain some run time interpretation. When you use regexes they are interpreted. When you use wildcards in search boxes they are interpreted. From my testing, CGI programs that are compiled binaries, are actually SlowER than PHP programs. I am no fan of PHP , but it is pretty fast. A more close comparison to Pascal might be asking what Fortran, Cobol, Ada or other similar compiled languages do, and I think that all of those would need a C interface. True, but still interesting to know if Python objects are somehow compatible with C++ objects, as a kind of academic exersise.. how do they do it? Possibly they just bind to procedural API, but it would be cool if they somehow did it more effectively. I also mentioned Objective C in my request but I have no idea if objective c even has a QT binding.. I know very well Java due to Android work, which cannot bind to anything directly. It requires a special format using plain procedures in a special way, so it is like a C interface, or a plan Pascal procedural interface. It is called JNI and it will never accept C++ That's good information and adds to the knowledge.. of how they do it. Cool. ___ fpc-pascal maillist - fpc-pascal@lists.freepascal.org http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
Re: [fpc-pascal] libQT4Pas - Why it is needed?
Am 30.01.2012 07:53 schrieb zeljko zel...@holobit.net: On Sunday 29 of January 2012 22:16:45 Krzysztof wrote: Just as I thought - it is object class thing. So if FPC does not (fully) support directly calling external C++ libraries there are plans to support it? This will be great Maybe it is possible (or will be possible) to use C++ class, but I don't see light at the end of tunnel for eg override virtual routine from such C++ class which is possible by C interface or howto attach callback (event) from pascal to C++. So if it isn't possible then what's the point with C++ support ? The C++ support in the compiler isn't advanced enough to even remotely think about that yet. Regards, Sven ___ fpc-pascal maillist - fpc-pascal@lists.freepascal.org http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
Re: [fpc-pascal] libQT4Pas - Why it is needed?
On Monday 30 of January 2012 11:51:10 Den Jean wrote: On Monday 30 January 2012 09:28:00 michael.vancann...@wisa.be wrote: There are no plans to support it, since every C++ compiler uses it's own (incompatible) format, and G++ changes it format regularly, so I was given to understand. even with support for calling c++ methods, the many inlined functions are still an issue Yes, there's only one thing which can put some light over it, and that is if qt nokia decides to create pure C bindings as separate packages (dlls) for qt libs .. but it won't happen so long live libQt4Pas zeljko ___ fpc-pascal maillist - fpc-pascal@lists.freepascal.org http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
RE : [fpc-pascal] libQT4Pas - Why it is needed?
Eh, I meant how does ruby, lua, objective c, and similar tools bind the C++ api. Do they use an automatic tool that converts QT C++ objects to procedural? or by hand, someone converts the objects to procedures and structs? Or do they use the c++ objects directly to python objects.. The smoke wrapper http://techbase.kde.org/Development/Languages/Smoke is used by a lot of these languages. See also http://lists.trolltech.com/qt-interest/2006-08/thread00721-0.html. Smoke is actually a tool that generates runtime wrappers for c++ libraries. It supports virtual methods, multiple inheritance etc. Ludo ___ fpc-pascal maillist - fpc-pascal@lists.freepascal.org http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
Re: RE : [fpc-pascal] libQT4Pas - Why it is needed?
On Monday 30 of January 2012 14:27:10 Ludo Brands wrote: Eh, I meant how does ruby, lua, objective c, and similar tools bind the C++ api. Do they use an automatic tool that converts QT C++ objects to procedural? or by hand, someone converts the objects to procedures and structs? Or do they use the c++ objects directly to python objects.. The smoke wrapper http://techbase.kde.org/Development/Languages/Smoke is used by a lot of these languages. See also http://lists.trolltech.com/qt-interest/2006-08/thread00721-0.html. Smoke is actually a tool that generates runtime wrappers for c++ libraries. It supports virtual methods, multiple inheritance etc. Yes there's smoke but that's all... no docs - exactly nothing. I've tried to dig into and try to get out how to create simplest wrapper, lost 3-4 hours with result = 0. zeljko ___ fpc-pascal maillist - fpc-pascal@lists.freepascal.org http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
Re: [fpc-pascal] libQT4Pas - Why it is needed?
On 01/30/12 02:19, Graeme Geldenhuys wrote:
On 29 January 2012 16:31, Jonas Maebe wrote:
GTK offers a plain C interface. QT only offers a C++ interface. FPC does not
(fully) support directly calling external C++ libraries. LibQT4Pas offers a
plain C interface to QT for use by FPC.
Can one statically bind the LibQt4Pas into a FPC program, thus not
require to ship an external libqt4pas DLL/SO? If possible, that might
solve the original posters problem.
It seems to me that you could compile qt4pas.c (or what ever the source
file(s) of libqt4pas.so is) into a qt4pas.o and just link them
statically with {$link qt4pas.o} which then would leave out the
requirement for libqt4pas.so to be distributed with any program using
the qt interface. The gpl? license may or may not make that possible though.
Regards,
Andrew
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Re: [fpc-pascal] libQT4Pas - Why it is needed?
It seems to me that you could compile qt4pas.c (or what ever the source
file(s) of libqt4pas.so is) into a qt4pas.o and just link them
statically with {$link qt4pas.o} which then would leave out the
requirement for libqt4pas.so to be distributed with any program using
the qt interface. The gpl? license may or may not make that possible though.
Regards,
Andrew
This sounds interesting
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Re: [fpc-pascal] libQT4Pas - Why it is needed?
On Monday 30 January 2012 23:08:36 Krzysztof wrote: the qt interface. The gpl? license may or may not make that possible the binding and Qt are LGPL ___ fpc-pascal maillist - fpc-pascal@lists.freepascal.org http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
Re: [fpc-pascal] libQT4Pas - Why it is needed?
On Monday 30 of January 2012 20:17:22 Andrew Haines wrote:
On 01/30/12 02:19, Graeme Geldenhuys wrote:
On 29 January 2012 16:31, Jonas Maebe wrote:
GTK offers a plain C interface. QT only offers a C++ interface. FPC does
not (fully) support directly calling external C++ libraries. LibQT4Pas
offers a plain C interface to QT for use by FPC.
Can one statically bind the LibQt4Pas into a FPC program, thus not
require to ship an external libqt4pas DLL/SO? If possible, that might
solve the original posters problem.
It seems to me that you could compile qt4pas.c (or what ever the source
file(s) of libqt4pas.so is) into a qt4pas.o and just link them
statically with {$link qt4pas.o} which then would leave out the
requirement for libqt4pas.so to be distributed with any program using
the qt interface. The gpl? license may or may not make that possible
though.
hm..this looks pretty interesting. Have you tried that ?
zeljko
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Re: [fpc-pascal] libQT4Pas - Why it is needed?
On 29 Jan 2012, at 15:29, Krzysztof wrote: But why when I build application on KDE interface I need some external libQT4Pas to run it and my friend need it too (he have KDE so all QT librarys too)? There is no libGTK4Pas so why exists layer libQT4Pas? What is difference between GTK and QT librarys? GTK offers a plain C interface. QT only offers a C++ interface. FPC does not (fully) support directly calling external C++ libraries. LibQT4Pas offers a plain C interface to QT for use by FPC. Jonas___ fpc-pascal maillist - fpc-pascal@lists.freepascal.org http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
Re: [fpc-pascal] libQT4Pas - Why it is needed?
On Sun, 29 Jan 2012, Krzysztof wrote: Hi, I am wondering. If I build application for linux using gtk2 widgetset for GNOME (or XFCE etc.) and send this program to my friend, then he can run it without any external librarys (of course if he have gnome too), this same thing on windows. But why when I build application on KDE interface I need some external libQT4Pas to run it and my friend need it too (he have KDE so all QT librarys too)? There is no libGTK4Pas so why exists layer libQT4Pas? What is difference between GTK and QT librarys? GTK has a procedural C interface, it is exposed in the GTK libraries. The FPC compiler understands this interface. Qt is written in C++, and exposes C++ classes in the Qt libraries. The FPC compiler does not know how to handle C++ classes. Therefor, a 'procedural' interface to the C++ needs to be made, and this is libQT4Pas. It is generated by a GCC. Michael. ___ fpc-pascal maillist - fpc-pascal@lists.freepascal.org http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
Re: [fpc-pascal] libQT4Pas - Why it is needed?
Just as I thought - it is object class thing. So if FPC does not (fully) support directly calling external C++ libraries there are plans to support it? This will be great 2012/1/29 Michael Van Canneyt mich...@freepascal.org: On Sun, 29 Jan 2012, Krzysztof wrote: Hi, I am wondering. If I build application for linux using gtk2 widgetset for GNOME (or XFCE etc.) and send this program to my friend, then he can run it without any external librarys (of course if he have gnome too), this same thing on windows. But why when I build application on KDE interface I need some external libQT4Pas to run it and my friend need it too (he have KDE so all QT librarys too)? There is no libGTK4Pas so why exists layer libQT4Pas? What is difference between GTK and QT librarys? GTK has a procedural C interface, it is exposed in the GTK libraries. The FPC compiler understands this interface. Qt is written in C++, and exposes C++ classes in the Qt libraries. The FPC compiler does not know how to handle C++ classes. Therefor, a 'procedural' interface to the C++ needs to be made, and this is libQT4Pas. It is generated by a GCC. Michael. ___ fpc-pascal maillist - fpc-pascal@lists.freepascal.org http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal ___ fpc-pascal maillist - fpc-pascal@lists.freepascal.org http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
Re: [fpc-pascal] libQT4Pas - Why it is needed?
Do other languages like python use the plain c interface, or C++? how about something like ruby, lua, objective C, php .. Krzysztof wrote: Just as I thought - it is object class thing. So if FPC does not (fully) support directly calling external C++ libraries there are plans to support it? This will be great 2012/1/29 Michael Van Canneyt mich...@freepascal.org: On Sun, 29 Jan 2012, Krzysztof wrote: Hi, I am wondering. If I build application for linux using gtk2 widgetset for GNOME (or XFCE etc.) and send this program to my friend, then he can run it without any external librarys (of course if he have gnome too), this same thing on windows. But why when I build application on KDE interface I need some external libQT4Pas to run it and my friend need it too (he have KDE so all QT librarys too)? There is no libGTK4Pas so why exists layer libQT4Pas? What is difference between GTK and QT librarys? GTK has a procedural C interface, it is exposed in the GTK libraries. The FPC compiler understands this interface. Qt is written in C++, and exposes C++ classes in the Qt libraries. The FPC compiler does not know how to handle C++ classes. Therefor, a 'procedural' interface to the C++ needs to be made, and this is libQT4Pas. It is generated by a GCC. Michael. ___ fpc-pascal maillist - fpc-pascal@lists.freepascal.org http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal ___ fpc-pascal maillist - fpc-pascal@lists.freepascal.org http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal ___ fpc-pascal maillist - fpc-pascal@lists.freepascal.org http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
Re: [fpc-pascal] libQT4Pas - Why it is needed?
On 1/29/2012 17:38, Lars wrote: Do other languages like python use the plain c interface, or C++? how about something like ruby, lua, objective C, php .. :( i don't nderstand why one would want to apply interpreted script languages, al la BASIC, to today's tasks... sure, these are neat and more modern but they are still interpreted scripting languages :( Krzysztof wrote: Just as I thought - it is object class thing. So if FPC does not (fully) support directly calling external C++ libraries there are plans to support it? This will be great 2012/1/29 Michael Van Canneytmich...@freepascal.org: On Sun, 29 Jan 2012, Krzysztof wrote: Hi, I am wondering. If I build application for linux using gtk2 widgetset for GNOME (or XFCE etc.) and send this program to my friend, then he can run it without any external librarys (of course if he have gnome too), this same thing on windows. But why when I build application on KDE interface I need some external libQT4Pas to run it and my friend need it too (he have KDE so all QT librarys too)? There is no libGTK4Pas so why exists layer libQT4Pas? What is difference between GTK and QT librarys? GTK has a procedural C interface, it is exposed in the GTK libraries. The FPC compiler understands this interface. Qt is written in C++, and exposes C++ classes in the Qt libraries. The FPC compiler does not know how to handle C++ classes. Therefor, a 'procedural' interface to the C++ needs to be made, and this is libQT4Pas. It is generated by a GCC. Michael. ___ fpc-pascal maillist - fpc-pascal@lists.freepascal.org http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal ___ fpc-pascal maillist - fpc-pascal@lists.freepascal.org http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal ___ fpc-pascal maillist - fpc-pascal@lists.freepascal.org http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal ___ fpc-pascal maillist - fpc-pascal@lists.freepascal.org http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
Re: [fpc-pascal] libQT4Pas - Why it is needed?
On Sunday 29 of January 2012 22:16:45 Krzysztof wrote: Just as I thought - it is object class thing. So if FPC does not (fully) support directly calling external C++ libraries there are plans to support it? This will be great Maybe it is possible (or will be possible) to use C++ class, but I don't see light at the end of tunnel for eg override virtual routine from such C++ class which is possible by C interface or howto attach callback (event) from pascal to C++. So if it isn't possible then what's the point with C++ support ? zeljko 2012/1/29 Michael Van Canneyt mich...@freepascal.org: On Sun, 29 Jan 2012, Krzysztof wrote: Hi, I am wondering. If I build application for linux using gtk2 widgetset for GNOME (or XFCE etc.) and send this program to my friend, then he can run it without any external librarys (of course if he have gnome too), this same thing on windows. But why when I build application on KDE interface I need some external libQT4Pas to run it and my friend need it too (he have KDE so all QT librarys too)? There is no libGTK4Pas so why exists layer libQT4Pas? What is difference between GTK and QT librarys? GTK has a procedural C interface, it is exposed in the GTK libraries. The FPC compiler understands this interface. Qt is written in C++, and exposes C++ classes in the Qt libraries. The FPC compiler does not know how to handle C++ classes. Therefor, a 'procedural' interface to the C++ needs to be made, and this is libQT4Pas. It is generated by a GCC. Michael. ___ fpc-pascal maillist - fpc-pascal@lists.freepascal.org http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal ___ fpc-pascal maillist - fpc-pascal@lists.freepascal.org http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal ___ fpc-pascal maillist - fpc-pascal@lists.freepascal.org http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
Re: [fpc-pascal] libQT4Pas - Why it is needed?
On Monday 30 of January 2012 03:28:45 waldo kitty wrote: On 1/29/2012 17:38, Lars wrote: Do other languages like python use the plain c interface, or C++? how about something like ruby, lua, objective C, php .. : :( i don't nderstand why one would want to apply interpreted script :languages, I've understand that he asks how python bindings works then ? Probably same way as our libQt4Pas. You cannot use Qt python without python bindings for qt - so no direct C++ usage. zeljko ___ fpc-pascal maillist - fpc-pascal@lists.freepascal.org http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
Re: [fpc-pascal] libQT4Pas - Why it is needed?
On Sun, Jan 29, 2012 at 11:38 PM, Lars nore...@z505.com wrote: Do other languages like python use the plain c interface, or C++? how about something like ruby, lua, objective C, php .. No idea, but Python, ruby, lua and php do not generate real programs but instead are just scripts which run in a interpreter, which is immensely different from a real program. A more close comparison to Pascal might be asking what Fortran, Cobol, Ada or other similar compiled languages do, and I think that all of those would need a C interface. I know very well Java due to Android work, which cannot bind to anything directly. It requires a special format using plain procedures in a special way, so it is like a C interface, or a plan Pascal procedural interface. It is called JNI and it will never accept C++ -- Felipe Monteiro de Carvalho ___ fpc-pascal maillist - fpc-pascal@lists.freepascal.org http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
Re: [fpc-pascal] libQT4Pas - Why it is needed?
On 29 January 2012 16:31, Jonas Maebe wrote: GTK offers a plain C interface. QT only offers a C++ interface. FPC does not (fully) support directly calling external C++ libraries. LibQT4Pas offers a plain C interface to QT for use by FPC. Can one statically bind the LibQt4Pas into a FPC program, thus not require to ship an external libqt4pas DLL/SO? If possible, that might solve the original posters problem. -- Regards, - Graeme - ___ fpGUI - a cross-platform Free Pascal GUI toolkit http://fpgui.sourceforge.net ___ fpc-pascal maillist - fpc-pascal@lists.freepascal.org http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
Re: [fpc-pascal] libQT4Pas - Why it is needed?
On 1/30/2012 01:55, zeljko wrote: On Monday 30 of January 2012 03:28:45 waldo kitty wrote: On 1/29/2012 17:38, Lars wrote: Do other languages like python use the plain c interface, or C++? how about something like ruby, lua, objective C, php .. : :( i don't nderstand why one would want to apply interpreted script :languages, I've understand that he asks how python bindings works then ? i may have easily misunderstood the OP's post... i tend to read in literan english format... ie: if you say eggs are round, that is where i base my response unless it is very obvious that there is something else to consider which i point out ; ___ fpc-pascal maillist - fpc-pascal@lists.freepascal.org http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
