Mif Wash FYI [was Re: Table that won't sort correctly: wash-up]

[Chris Despopoulos]

What MIF wash actually does is simply ignore any garbage in the file.  MIF is 
pretty much a text representation of the binary format.  But MIF interpretation 
is loose, so if there's any garbage in there, saving as MIF *might* write the 
garbage out, but it will certainly not read it.  In this case, there most 
likely was something else in that string that caused it to break into two MIF 
string statements.  However, it was a character that the MIF interpreter 
doesn't understand.  So writing out to MIF triggers two string statements, but 
the cause of the string break doesn't make it into the MIF file.  Then on read, 
since there's nothing there to warrant two strings, the interpreter turns it 
into a single string.  


A couple of words of caution.  First, while MIF washing is absolutely safe, 
it's possible to manually create MIF that will crash Maker.  If you create 
anchored frames out of order, or tables with bad structure, look out.  I only 
say this if you're tempted to generate MIF from a database, or do something 
similar.  MIF is awesome, and pretty darned safe.  But you do have to take care 
in some instances.  


Second, this problem apparently occurred by opening Word in Maker???  Something 
like that.  There are many problems with Word to Maker.  You should not copy 
directly from Word into Maker...  Especially tables.  If you copy a table, then 
the font information gets stored in the Maker table format.  Once there, you 
can only get rid of it via MIF edits...  It's legal MIF, so MIF washing doesn't 
help.  The result can be mysterious Font Not Found messages.  You do everything 
possible via the GUI to get rid of that font, but it's still there.  Even the 
FDK (or now ExtendScript) has no access to that, so there's no way to find the 
font and get rid of it.  Your ONLY option is to open the file in MIF, search 
for the font, and delete it.  I generally copy/paste into a non-MS text editor, 
then copy from that and paste into Maker, then 
reformat if necessary.  For tables, I get comma separated text out of 
Word. ___


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Re: Mif Wash FYI [was Re: Table that won't sort correctly: wash-up]

[Steve Rickaby]

At 00:44 -0800 10/12/12, Chris Despopoulos wrote:

Second, this problem apparently occurred by opening Word in Maker???  
Something like that.  There are many problems with Word to Maker.  You should 
not copy directly from Word into Maker...  Especially tables.  If you copy a 
table,

I did not go into details, but I wrote the Word docs to RTF, then imported that 
into FrameMaker. That's been my standard procedure for years; I'd never 
copy/paste from Word into Frame. Your insights are helpful, though.

Frame purging Word 'dirt' while writing to MIF makes sense.

-- 
Steve
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Re: Mif Wash FYI [was Re: Table that won't sort correctly: wash-up]

[Stuart Rogers]

On 10/12/2012 3:44 AM, Chris Despopoulos wrote:

What MIF wash actually does is simply ignore any garbage in the file.
MIF is pretty much a text representation of the binary format. But MIF
interpretation is loose, so if there's any garbage in there, saving as
MIF *might* write the garbage out, but it will certainly not read it.
In this case, there most likely was something else in that string that
caused it to break into two MIF string statements.  However, it was a
character that the MIF interpreter doesn't understand.  So writing out
to MIF triggers two string statements, but the cause of the string break
doesn't make it into the MIF file.  Then on read, since there's nothing
there to warrant two strings, the interpreter turns it into a single
string.



Steve,

Sounds like you might be able to identify the mystery character by 
opening the Word/RTF source file in a hex editor.  It would satisfy 
curiosity, if nothing else!


s.

--
Stuart Rogers
Technical Communicator
Phoenix Geophysics Limited
3781 Victoria Park Avenue, Unit 3
Toronto, ON, Canada  M1W 3K5
+1 (416) 491-7340 x 325

http://www.phoenix-geophysics.com
___


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Re: Mif Wash FYI [was Re: Table that won't sort correctly: wash-up]

[Steve Rickaby]

At 11:01 -0500 10/12/12, Stuart Rogers wrote:

Sounds like you might be able to identify the mystery character by opening the 
Word/RTF source file in a hex editor.  It would satisfy curiosity, if nothing 
else!

Great idea if I *had* a hex editor ;-)

-- 
Steve
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Re: Mif Wash FYI [was Re: Table that won't sort correctly: wash-up]

[Stuart Rogers]

On 10/12/2012 11:10 AM, Steve Rickaby wrote:

At 11:01 -0500 10/12/12, Stuart Rogers wrote:


Sounds like you might be able to identify the mystery character by opening the 
Word/RTF source file in a hex editor.  It would satisfy curiosity, if nothing 
else!


Great idea if I *had* a hex editor ;-)




I use http://mh-nexus.de/en/  (free).

s.

--
Stuart Rogers
Technical Communicator
Phoenix Geophysics Limited
3781 Victoria Park Avenue, Unit 3
Toronto, ON, Canada  M1W 3K5
+1 (416) 491-7340 x 325

http://www.phoenix-geophysics.com
___


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Re: Mif Wash FYI [was Re: Table that won't sort correctly: wash-up]

[Shmuel Wolfson]

Here's a good free Hex editor:
http://frhed.sourceforge.net/en/

Regards,
Shmuel Wolfson
Technical Writer
052-763-7133

On 10-Dec-12 6:10 PM, Steve Rickaby wrote:

At 11:01 -0500 10/12/12, Stuart Rogers wrote:


Sounds like you might be able to identify the mystery character by opening the 
Word/RTF source file in a hex editor.  It would satisfy curiosity, if nothing 
else!

Great idea if I *had* a hex editor ;-)



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Re: Mif Wash FYI [was Re: Table that won't sort correctly: wash-up]

[Steve Rickaby]

Thanks guys but I'm on a Mac. Ok, ok, I do *have* a Windoze box, I just hate 
using it

Will report back on mystery character when I get time.
-- 
Steve
___


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Mif Wash FYI [was Re: Table that won't sort correctly: wash-up]

[Chris Despopoulos]

What MIF wash actually does is simply ignore any garbage in the file.? MIF is 
pretty much a text representation of the binary format.? But MIF interpretation 
is loose, so if there's any garbage in there, saving as MIF *might* write the 
garbage out, but it will certainly not read it.? In this case, there most 
likely was something else in that string that caused it to break into two MIF 
string statements.? However, it was a character that the MIF interpreter 
doesn't understand.? So writing out to MIF triggers two string statements, but 
the cause of the string break doesn't make it into the MIF file.? Then on read, 
since there's nothing there to warrant two strings, the interpreter turns it 
into a single string.? 


A couple of words of caution.? First, while MIF washing is absolutely safe, 
it's possible to manually create MIF that will crash Maker.? If you create 
anchored frames out of order, or tables with bad structure, look out.? I only 
say this if you're tempted to generate MIF from a database, or do something 
similar.? MIF is awesome, and pretty darned safe.? But you do have to take care 
in some instances.? 


Second, this problem apparently occurred by opening Word in Maker Something 
like that.? There are many problems with Word to Maker.? You should not copy 
directly from Word into Maker...? Especially tables.? If you copy a table, then 
the font information gets stored in the Maker table format.? Once there, you 
can only get rid of it via MIF edits...? It's legal MIF, so MIF washing doesn't 
help.? The result can be mysterious Font Not Found messages.? You do everything 
possible via the GUI to get rid of that font, but it's still there.? Even the 
FDK (or now ExtendScript) has no access to that, so there's no way to find the 
font and get rid of it.? Your ONLY option is to open the file in MIF, search 
for the font, and delete it.? I generally copy/paste into a non-MS text editor, 
then copy from that and paste into Maker, then 
reformat if necessary.? For tables, I get comma separated text out of 
Word. 
-- next part --
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: 

Mif Wash FYI [was Re: Table that won't sort correctly: wash-up]

[Steve Rickaby]

At 00:44 -0800 10/12/12, Chris Despopoulos wrote:

>Second, this problem apparently occurred by opening Word in Maker???  
>Something like that.  There are many problems with Word to Maker.  You should 
>not copy directly from Word into Maker...  Especially tables.  If you copy a 
>table,

I did not go into details, but I wrote the Word docs to RTF, then imported that 
into FrameMaker. That's been my standard procedure for years; I'd never 
copy/paste from Word into Frame. Your insights are helpful, though.

Frame purging Word 'dirt' while writing to MIF makes sense.

-- 
Steve

Mif Wash FYI [was Re: Table that won't sort correctly: wash-up]

[Stuart Rogers]

On 10/12/2012 3:44 AM, Chris Despopoulos wrote:
> What MIF wash actually does is simply ignore any garbage in the file.
> MIF is pretty much a text representation of the binary format. But MIF
> interpretation is loose, so if there's any garbage in there, saving as
> MIF *might* write the garbage out, but it will certainly not read it.
> In this case, there most likely was something else in that string that
> caused it to break into two MIF string statements.  However, it was a
> character that the MIF interpreter doesn't understand.  So writing out
> to MIF triggers two string statements, but the cause of the string break
> doesn't make it into the MIF file.  Then on read, since there's nothing
> there to warrant two strings, the interpreter turns it into a single
> string.


Steve,

Sounds like you might be able to identify the mystery character by 
opening the Word/RTF source file in a hex editor.  It would satisfy 
curiosity, if nothing else!

s.

-- 
Stuart Rogers
Technical Communicator
Phoenix Geophysics Limited
3781 Victoria Park Avenue, Unit 3
Toronto, ON, Canada  M1W 3K5
+1 (416) 491-7340 x 325

http://www.phoenix-geophysics.com

Mif Wash FYI [was Re: Table that won't sort correctly: wash-up]

[Steve Rickaby]

At 11:01 -0500 10/12/12, Stuart Rogers wrote:

>Sounds like you might be able to identify the mystery character by opening the 
>Word/RTF source file in a hex editor.  It would satisfy curiosity, if nothing 
>else!

Great idea if I *had* a hex editor ;-)

-- 
Steve

Mif Wash FYI [was Re: Table that won't sort correctly: wash-up]

[Stuart Rogers]

On 10/12/2012 11:10 AM, Steve Rickaby wrote:
> At 11:01 -0500 10/12/12, Stuart Rogers wrote:
>
>> Sounds like you might be able to identify the mystery character by opening 
>> the Word/RTF source file in a hex editor.  It would satisfy curiosity, if 
>> nothing else!
>
> Great idea if I *had* a hex editor ;-)
>


I use http://mh-nexus.de/en/  (free).

s.

-- 
Stuart Rogers
Technical Communicator
Phoenix Geophysics Limited
3781 Victoria Park Avenue, Unit 3
Toronto, ON, Canada  M1W 3K5
+1 (416) 491-7340 x 325

http://www.phoenix-geophysics.com

Mif Wash FYI [was Re: Table that won't sort correctly: wash-up]

[Shmuel Wolfson]

Here's a good free Hex editor:
http://frhed.sourceforge.net/en/

Regards,
Shmuel Wolfson
Technical Writer
052-763-7133

On 10-Dec-12 6:10 PM, Steve Rickaby wrote:
> At 11:01 -0500 10/12/12, Stuart Rogers wrote:
>
>> Sounds like you might be able to identify the mystery character by opening 
>> the Word/RTF source file in a hex editor.  It would satisfy curiosity, if 
>> nothing else!
> Great idea if I *had* a hex editor ;-)
>

Mif Wash FYI [was Re: Table that won't sort correctly: wash-up]

[Steve Rickaby]

Thanks guys but I'm on a Mac. Ok, ok, I do *have* a Windoze box, I just hate 
using it

Will report back on mystery character when I get time.
-- 
Steve