Re: Buying recommendation for silent router/fileserver
Finally got around to it, kern/182818. Thanks for the encouragement. On 10/12/12 11:14, Adam McDougall wrote: I did not, but I put it on my list to try to accomplish. On 10/11/12 13:41, Adrian Chadd wrote: Did you ever file a PR for the slow SATA behaviour? Adrian On 11 October 2012 09:52, Adam McDougall mcdou...@egr.msu.edu wrote: Be wary of the Soekris net6501, I bought three of the 1.6Ghz net6501-70 model which has an Atom E-680 cpu (E series) and it compiles more than twice as slow as a 1.6Ghz Atom N270 in an older netbook. Someone else running Linux reported similar CPU slowness. As far as practical network throughput, I could only get 100Mbit/sec with a simple HTTP download of a file full of zeros, and OpenVPN could only push about 25Mbit/sec. As a practical example of the CPU slowness, it takes about 1.5 minutes to compile pkg on the N270 netbook and 5 minutes on the 6501 (around 4.5 if I use -j2). A kernel compile took an hour. Unfortunately I had no idea this CPU (possibly implementation?) was so slow before I purchased it, and I could scarcely find evidence of it on google after hours of searching when I had already discovered the issue. I was hoping to find some comparative benchmarks between various Atom series but manufacturers generally don't do that. Additionally, the total AHCI SATA write speed on the net6501 (in BSD only?) has a strange 20MB/sec limitation but reads can go over 100MB/sec. If I write to one disk I get 20MB/sec, if I write to both SATA disks I get 10MB/sec each. Write is equally slow on a SSD. Both someone running OpenBSD and I running FreeBSD reported the same symptoms to the soekris-tech mailing list and received no useful replies towards getting that problem solved. I tested the write speed briefly with Linux and it did not appear to have the 20MB/sec limitation. I did confirm it was using MSI(-X?) with boot -v. I think this hardware would need to fall into Alexander Motin's hands to get anywhere with debugging the SATA speed issue. Since it seems fine in Linux, maybe some day it can be fixed in BSD but I have no clue how that limitation could happen. The disks I tested with are fine in normal computers. ___ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org ___ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Buying recommendation for silent router/fileserver
On 12.10.2012 13:12, Rainer Duffner wrote: Does FreeNAS do VLANs? I am not sure if it is available on the graphical interface, but you can get a rootshell to leave the confines of the gui. mata ne, Hendrik signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature
Re: Buying recommendation for silent router/fileserver
On Sat, Oct 13, 2012 at 3:55 AM, Hendrik Hasenbein hhase...@techfak.uni-bielefeld.de wrote: On 12.10.2012 13:12, Rainer Duffner wrote: Does FreeNAS do VLANs? I am not sure if it is available on the graphical interface, but you can get a rootshell to leave the confines of the gui. It is, but if you go to the CLI then you need to go editing SQLite databases or hacking bourne shell code to make things persist across reboots ;)... -Garrett ___ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Buying recommendation for silent router/fileserver
On 10/11/12 07:54, Ulrich Spörlein wrote: Hey guys, I need to replace an aging Pentium IV system that has been serving as my router, access point, file- and mediaserver for quite some time now. The replacement should have: - amd64 CPU (for ZFS, obviously) - 2x GigE (igress, egress interfaces) - some form of wlan interface (I currently use an Atheros based PCI card) - eSATA for attaching a backup disk where I stream ZFS snapshots to - serial port is always nice, for when I mess up an upgrade - fan-less if possible So far, this here seems to fit the bill perfectly http://www.fit-pc.com/web/fit-pc/intensepc/ but pricing seems to defy any reality. It does not state directly which chipsets are used for Wifi and Ethernet, the block diagram claims Ethernet chips to be Intel 82579 and RTL8111D, but I don't trust that fully. For Wifi I can always fall back to sticking in a supported USB stick, although that's kinda hacky. So how well is networking going to be supported by FreeBSD? Should I just bite the bullet and find out? Cheers, Uli ___ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org http://www.intel.com/p/en_US/embedded/designcenter/tools/seed-board-program Might be an option...not sure if you mind a discontinued processor. Matt ___ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Buying recommendation for silent router/fileserver
11.10.2012 17:54, Ulrich Spörlein wrote: Hey guys, I need to replace an aging Pentium IV system that has been serving as my router, access point, file- and mediaserver for quite some time now. The replacement should have: - amd64 CPU (for ZFS, obviously) - 2x GigE (igress, egress interfaces) - some form of wlan interface (I currently use an Atheros based PCI card) - eSATA for attaching a backup disk where I stream ZFS snapshots to - serial port is always nice, for when I mess up an upgrade - fan-less if possible So far, this here seems to fit the bill perfectly http://www.fit-pc.com/web/fit-pc/intensepc/ but pricing seems to defy any reality. It does not state directly which chipsets are used for Wifi and Ethernet, the block diagram claims Ethernet chips to be Intel 82579 and RTL8111D, but I don't trust that fully. For Wifi I can always fall back to sticking in a supported USB stick, although that's kinda hacky. So how well is networking going to be supported by FreeBSD? Should I just bite the bullet and find out? Why not trying to look at cheap barebones or desktop PC's? http://www.silentpcreview.com/Sapphire_Edge_HD3 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16856119070 They are cheaper, hold much better processors for ZFS and can be upgraded with extra GigE/eSATA interfaces by USB3. -- Sphinx of black quartz, judge my vow. ___ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Buying recommendation for silent router/fileserver
On Thu, 2012-10-11 at 17:05:46 +0200, Rainer Duffner wrote: Am Thu, 11 Oct 2012 16:54:53 +0200 schrieb Ulrich Spörlein u...@freebsd.org: Hey guys, I need to replace an aging Pentium IV system that has been serving as my router, access point, file- and mediaserver for quite some time now. The replacement should have: - amd64 CPU (for ZFS, obviously) - 2x GigE (igress, egress interfaces) - some form of wlan interface (I currently use an Atheros based PCI card) - eSATA for attaching a backup disk where I stream ZFS snapshots to - serial port is always nice, for when I mess up an upgrade - fan-less if possible So far, this here seems to fit the bill perfectly http://www.fit-pc.com/web/fit-pc/intensepc/ but pricing seems to defy any reality. It does not state directly which chipsets are used for Wifi and Ethernet, the block diagram claims Ethernet chips to be Intel 82579 and RTL8111D, but I don't trust that fully. For Wifi I can always fall back to sticking in a supported USB stick, although that's kinda hacky. So how well is networking going to be supported by FreeBSD? Should I just bite the bullet and find out? What about the HP ProLiant N40L ? It's not fanless, of course - but it's IMO more suited for a server-type system than anything else in that price-range. I don't have one (I have no need for anything beyond what an AlIX-system can do) - but if I would need a home-server, I'd buy a N40L (it can boot from USB and you can thus boot FreeNAS from it) Interesting one, with only one GigE port though, both PCIe slots would need to be populated to get a second Ethernet and a Wifi port ... Hmmm Uli ___ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Buying recommendation for silent router/fileserver
On Fri, 2012-10-12 at 10:48:22 +0300, Volodymyr Kostyrko wrote: 11.10.2012 17:54, Ulrich Spörlein wrote: Hey guys, I need to replace an aging Pentium IV system that has been serving as my router, access point, file- and mediaserver for quite some time now. The replacement should have: - amd64 CPU (for ZFS, obviously) - 2x GigE (igress, egress interfaces) - some form of wlan interface (I currently use an Atheros based PCI card) - eSATA for attaching a backup disk where I stream ZFS snapshots to - serial port is always nice, for when I mess up an upgrade - fan-less if possible So far, this here seems to fit the bill perfectly http://www.fit-pc.com/web/fit-pc/intensepc/ but pricing seems to defy any reality. It does not state directly which chipsets are used for Wifi and Ethernet, the block diagram claims Ethernet chips to be Intel 82579 and RTL8111D, but I don't trust that fully. For Wifi I can always fall back to sticking in a supported USB stick, although that's kinda hacky. So how well is networking going to be supported by FreeBSD? Should I just bite the bullet and find out? Why not trying to look at cheap barebones or desktop PC's? http://www.silentpcreview.com/Sapphire_Edge_HD3 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16856119070 They are cheaper, hold much better processors for ZFS and can be upgraded with extra GigE/eSATA interfaces by USB3. I'm not looking forward to attaching both a Wifi USB dongle and another Ethernet one. :( Btw, eSATA is supposed to simply show up as another SATA port in FreeBSD, right? No special driver supported needed for that one? That 4 year warranty option on the IntensePC really looks nice ... I'll shoot them an email to see if the MiniPCI wifi card is supposed to be replaceable by an Atheros based one (I lost track of all the a/b/g/n a while ago, especially which antennae have to go with those ...) Cheers, Uli ___ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Buying recommendation for silent router/fileserver
On Fri, Oct 12, 2012 at 10:58 AM, Ulrich Spörlein u...@freebsd.org wrote: Btw, eSATA is supposed to simply show up as another SATA port in FreeBSD, right? No special driver supported needed for that one? Yep, I have an eSATA hard drive dock, drop the drive in and it is instantly recognised. The eSATA port in my case comes from Intel ICH10, and uses ahci(4). Cheers Tom ___ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Buying recommendation for silent router/fileserver
On 12.10.2012 11:03, Ulrich Spörlein wrote: On Thu, 2012-10-11 at 17:05:46 +0200, Rainer Duffner wrote: Am Thu, 11 Oct 2012 16:54:53 +0200 schrieb Ulrich Spörlein u...@freebsd.org: Hey guys, I need to replace an aging Pentium IV system that has been serving as my router, access point, file- and mediaserver for quite some time now. The replacement should have: - amd64 CPU (for ZFS, obviously) - 2x GigE (igress, egress interfaces) - some form of wlan interface (I currently use an Atheros based PCI card) - eSATA for attaching a backup disk where I stream ZFS snapshots to - serial port is always nice, for when I mess up an upgrade - fan-less if possible So far, this here seems to fit the bill perfectly http://www.fit-pc.com/web/fit-pc/intensepc/ but pricing seems to defy any reality. It does not state directly which chipsets are used for Wifi and Ethernet, the block diagram claims Ethernet chips to be Intel 82579 and RTL8111D, but I don't trust that fully. For Wifi I can always fall back to sticking in a supported USB stick, although that's kinda hacky. So how well is networking going to be supported by FreeBSD? Should I just bite the bullet and find out? What about the HP ProLiant N40L ? It's not fanless, of course - but it's IMO more suited for a server-type system than anything else in that price-range. It has a big fan which doesn't generate much noise. It is also decent looking in case you need to integrate it into a living room. I don't have one (I have no need for anything beyond what an AlIX-system can do) - but if I would need a home-server, I'd buy a N40L (it can boot from USB and you can thus boot FreeNAS from it) Interesting one, with only one GigE port though, both PCIe slots would need to be populated to get a second Ethernet and a Wifi port ... I don't think that would be a drawback unless you want to cramp in a second SSD (or more) into the 5.25 slot. Maybe there is a wireless/wired combo card, but I havent found one. The USB boot + SSD (zfs cache) + 4 disks is a nice storage solution. mata ne, Hendrik signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature
Re: Buying recommendation for silent router/fileserver
Am Fri, 12 Oct 2012 11:03:10 +0200 schrieb Ulrich Spörlein u...@freebsd.org: Interesting one, with only one GigE port though, both PCIe slots would need to be populated to get a second Ethernet and a Wifi port ... As said, it would be better to use a 2nd system (ALIX only uses 5-10W or so) for WIFI (and even then, the pfSense folk recommends using a dedicated AP on OPT1 to handle the WIFI-stuff) - unless you want it to act as a client only. Then an USB-stick should do, right? Or one of the WLAN-bridges for 40€ Does FreeNAS do VLANs? Then, you'd only need a VLAN-capable switch and one NIC would be enough. I don't think the machine could saturate 2 GBIT-ports anyway... ___ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Buying recommendation for silent router/fileserver
On Fri, 2012-10-12 at 13:03:23 +0200, Hendrik Hasenbein wrote: On 12.10.2012 11:03, Ulrich Spörlein wrote: On Thu, 2012-10-11 at 17:05:46 +0200, Rainer Duffner wrote: Am Thu, 11 Oct 2012 16:54:53 +0200 schrieb Ulrich Spörlein u...@freebsd.org: Hey guys, I need to replace an aging Pentium IV system that has been serving as my router, access point, file- and mediaserver for quite some time now. The replacement should have: - amd64 CPU (for ZFS, obviously) - 2x GigE (igress, egress interfaces) - some form of wlan interface (I currently use an Atheros based PCI card) - eSATA for attaching a backup disk where I stream ZFS snapshots to - serial port is always nice, for when I mess up an upgrade - fan-less if possible So far, this here seems to fit the bill perfectly http://www.fit-pc.com/web/fit-pc/intensepc/ but pricing seems to defy any reality. It does not state directly which chipsets are used for Wifi and Ethernet, the block diagram claims Ethernet chips to be Intel 82579 and RTL8111D, but I don't trust that fully. For Wifi I can always fall back to sticking in a supported USB stick, although that's kinda hacky. So how well is networking going to be supported by FreeBSD? Should I just bite the bullet and find out? What about the HP ProLiant N40L ? It's not fanless, of course - but it's IMO more suited for a server-type system than anything else in that price-range. It has a big fan which doesn't generate much noise. It is also decent looking in case you need to integrate it into a living room. For longevity, I'd have a bit more confidence if this was an IvyBridge system ... Now that FreeBSD somewhat supports the Intel HD graphics, I might even slap on XBMC. And yes, living room + low noise is key, aka Wife Acceptance Factor (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wife_acceptance_factor) I don't have one (I have no need for anything beyond what an AlIX-system can do) - but if I would need a home-server, I'd buy a N40L (it can boot from USB and you can thus boot FreeNAS from it) Interesting one, with only one GigE port though, both PCIe slots would need to be populated to get a second Ethernet and a Wifi port ... I don't think that would be a drawback unless you want to cramp in a second SSD (or more) into the 5.25 slot. Maybe there is a wireless/wired combo card, but I havent found one. The USB boot + SSD (zfs cache) + 4 disks is a nice storage solution. Yeah, I was aiming for a 32GB SSD, with 8-16GB as UFS2 to boot from and hold all the software, 16GB as ZIL or L2ARC or whatever it is called and have an external 2TiB HDD (eSATA) for the GELI+ZFS volume. Another 2TiB HDD (USB, usually detached/powered down, running ZFS with compression and dedup) already exists and is receiving the ZFS snapshots from the current 1TiB (ATA, internal) disk of the Pentium 4 system. Cheers, Uli ___ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Buying recommendation for silent router/fileserver
I did not, but I put it on my list to try to accomplish. On 10/11/12 13:41, Adrian Chadd wrote: Did you ever file a PR for the slow SATA behaviour? Adrian On 11 October 2012 09:52, Adam McDougall mcdou...@egr.msu.edu wrote: On 10/11/12 12:05, Gary Palmer wrote: On Thu, Oct 11, 2012 at 04:54:53PM +0200, Ulrich Sp??rlein wrote: Hey guys, I need to replace an aging Pentium IV system that has been serving as my router, access point, file- and mediaserver for quite some time now. The replacement should have: - amd64 CPU (for ZFS, obviously) - 2x GigE (igress, egress interfaces) - some form of wlan interface (I currently use an Atheros based PCI card) - eSATA for attaching a backup disk where I stream ZFS snapshots to - serial port is always nice, for when I mess up an upgrade - fan-less if possible So far, this here seems to fit the bill perfectly http://www.fit-pc.com/web/fit-pc/intensepc/ but pricing seems to defy any reality. It does not state directly which chipsets are used for Wifi and Ethernet, the block diagram claims Ethernet chips to be Intel 82579 and RTL8111D, but I don't trust that fully. For Wifi I can always fall back to sticking in a supported USB stick, although that's kinda hacky. So how well is networking going to be supported by FreeBSD? Should I just bite the bullet and find out? I'd recommend the Soekris net6501, but it's even more expensive than the intensepc (I suspect due to low hardware volumes but thats just a guess) http://soekris.com/products/net6501.html You also don't specify what kind of storage you need, which is obviously an important factor for a file/media server. Gary ___ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org Be wary of the Soekris net6501, I bought three of the 1.6Ghz net6501-70 model which has an Atom E-680 cpu (E series) and it compiles more than twice as slow as a 1.6Ghz Atom N270 in an older netbook. Someone else running Linux reported similar CPU slowness. As far as practical network throughput, I could only get 100Mbit/sec with a simple HTTP download of a file full of zeros, and OpenVPN could only push about 25Mbit/sec. As a practical example of the CPU slowness, it takes about 1.5 minutes to compile pkg on the N270 netbook and 5 minutes on the 6501 (around 4.5 if I use -j2). A kernel compile took an hour. Unfortunately I had no idea this CPU (possibly implementation?) was so slow before I purchased it, and I could scarcely find evidence of it on google after hours of searching when I had already discovered the issue. I was hoping to find some comparative benchmarks between various Atom series but manufacturers generally don't do that. Additionally, the total AHCI SATA write speed on the net6501 (in BSD only?) has a strange 20MB/sec limitation but reads can go over 100MB/sec. If I write to one disk I get 20MB/sec, if I write to both SATA disks I get 10MB/sec each. Write is equally slow on a SSD. Both someone running OpenBSD and I running FreeBSD reported the same symptoms to the soekris-tech mailing list and received no useful replies towards getting that problem solved. I tested the write speed briefly with Linux and it did not appear to have the 20MB/sec limitation. I did confirm it was using MSI(-X?) with boot -v. I think this hardware would need to fall into Alexander Motin's hands to get anywhere with debugging the SATA speed issue. Since it seems fine in Linux, maybe some day it can be fixed in BSD but I have no clue how that limitation could happen. The disks I tested with are fine in normal computers. ___ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org ___ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Buying recommendation for silent router/fileserver
Hi, I have a Supermicros X7SPA-HF-D525 running as a fileserver. Six SATA connectors on board and runs flawlessly with eight GiB Mem. On Thu, 11 Oct 2012, Ulrich Spörlein wrote: Date: Thu, 11 Oct 2012 16:54:53 +0200 From: Ulrich Spörlein u...@freebsd.org To: curr...@freebsd.org Subject: Buying recommendation for silent router/fileserver Hey guys, I need to replace an aging Pentium IV system that has been serving as my router, access point, file- and mediaserver for quite some time now. The replacement should have: - amd64 CPU (for ZFS, obviously) - 2x GigE (igress, egress interfaces) - some form of wlan interface (I currently use an Atheros based PCI card) - eSATA for attaching a backup disk where I stream ZFS snapshots to - serial port is always nice, for when I mess up an upgrade - fan-less if possible So far, this here seems to fit the bill perfectly http://www.fit-pc.com/web/fit-pc/intensepc/ but pricing seems to defy any reality. It does not state directly which chipsets are used for Wifi and Ethernet, the block diagram claims Ethernet chips to be Intel 82579 and RTL8111D, but I don't trust that fully. For Wifi I can always fall back to sticking in a supported USB stick, although that's kinda hacky. So how well is networking going to be supported by FreeBSD? Should I just bite the bullet and find out? Cheers, Uli ___ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org Bye/2 --- Michael Reifenberger mich...@reifenberger.com http://www.Reifenberger.com ___ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Buying recommendation for silent router/fileserver
On 10/11/2012 04:54 PM, Ulrich Spörlein wrote: Hey guys, I need to replace an aging Pentium IV system that has been serving as my router, access point, file- and mediaserver for quite some time now. The replacement should have: - amd64 CPU (for ZFS, obviously) - 2x GigE (igress, egress interfaces) - some form of wlan interface (I currently use an Atheros based PCI card) - eSATA for attaching a backup disk where I stream ZFS snapshots to - serial port is always nice, for when I mess up an upgrade - fan-less if possible So far, this here seems to fit the bill perfectly http://www.fit-pc.com/web/fit-pc/intensepc/ but pricing seems to defy any reality. It does not state directly which chipsets are used for Wifi and Ethernet, the block diagram claims Ethernet chips to be Intel 82579 and RTL8111D, but I don't trust that fully. For Wifi I can always fall back to sticking in a supported USB stick, although that's kinda hacky. So how well is networking going to be supported by FreeBSD? Should I just bite the bullet and find out? Cheers, Uli ___ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org Hi Uli, I have bought this one: http://www.mindfactory.de/product_info.php/info/775548 with 4GB RAM DDR3 on 1066Mhz, with additional 1Gb/s PCI Ethernetcard and using old but silent power supply. Pfsense is not yet running, because I am still testing, but I can tell so far that it has enough power to run the 3 ethX interfaces full speed (about 100MB/s each for like 2 days testing) with live debian USB. I am planning to run pfsense on it soon. I also tested how fast the cpu is and I must say that is not blazing fast, it is about 3 times slower than my laptop with 2x2,4 Ghz intell T8300, but it is low power ... Cheers, Asen ___ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Buying recommendation for silent router/fileserver
On Fri, 12 Oct 2012 13:51:06 +0200 Ulrich Spörlein u...@freebsd.org wrote: For longevity, I'd have a bit more confidence if this was an IvyBridge system ... Now that FreeBSD somewhat supports the Intel HD graphics, I might even slap on XBMC. And yes, living room + low noise is key, aka Wife Acceptance Factor (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wife_acceptance_factor) Fans are not evil. The trick is to use very big ones which run slowly and quiet. Have a look for: - big/normal but nice case (for air-flow reasons with the benefit of space for hard drives and you can change parts inside later at will without space problems), let your significant other chose it - bg CPU cooler (Scyte, Noctua, Thermalright, ...) - big CPU fan (12cm / 14cm... big ones can run slow and silent) - low power CPU - at leat one big case fan (12cm) - 40 EUR fan-less Nvidia card - 80 Plus Platinum PSU I have a system which is like this, big case with 5 harddisks and a ssd, a big case fan blowing on it (speed adjustable, but already with a very slow and quiet setting the disks don't heat up) in direction of the CPU, the fan of the CPU more or less not turning (the CPU coolers which come with big CPU fans have a temperature controlled fan most of the time), and a second big case fan sucking out the air on the top of the case. The fan of the PSU is also temperature controlled, and very quiet (in case the fan should turn at all). With this you can put inside whatever you want. For your use case maybe a Core i3/5 CPU with a low max-TDP (30-40W instead of the usual 95). Together with a fan-less NVidia GeForce GT 520 card (40 EUR) you can have plenty of horse power (for your envisioned use-case) but you don't hear it (except you put your ear directly beneath the case). Such a system may be not as flexible to hide as the one you talked about initially, but you have the possibility to upgrade easily and as necessary. Bye, Alexander. -- http://www.Leidinger.netAlexander @ Leidinger.net: PGP ID = B0063FE7 http://www.FreeBSD.org netchild @ FreeBSD.org : PGP ID = 72077137 ___ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Buying recommendation for silent router/fileserver
Hey guys, I need to replace an aging Pentium IV system that has been serving as my router, access point, file- and mediaserver for quite some time now. The replacement should have: - amd64 CPU (for ZFS, obviously) - 2x GigE (igress, egress interfaces) - some form of wlan interface (I currently use an Atheros based PCI card) - eSATA for attaching a backup disk where I stream ZFS snapshots to - serial port is always nice, for when I mess up an upgrade - fan-less if possible So far, this here seems to fit the bill perfectly http://www.fit-pc.com/web/fit-pc/intensepc/ but pricing seems to defy any reality. It does not state directly which chipsets are used for Wifi and Ethernet, the block diagram claims Ethernet chips to be Intel 82579 and RTL8111D, but I don't trust that fully. For Wifi I can always fall back to sticking in a supported USB stick, although that's kinda hacky. So how well is networking going to be supported by FreeBSD? Should I just bite the bullet and find out? Cheers, Uli ___ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Buying recommendation for silent router/fileserver
Am Thu, 11 Oct 2012 16:54:53 +0200 schrieb Ulrich Spörlein u...@freebsd.org: Hey guys, I need to replace an aging Pentium IV system that has been serving as my router, access point, file- and mediaserver for quite some time now. The replacement should have: - amd64 CPU (for ZFS, obviously) - 2x GigE (igress, egress interfaces) - some form of wlan interface (I currently use an Atheros based PCI card) - eSATA for attaching a backup disk where I stream ZFS snapshots to - serial port is always nice, for when I mess up an upgrade - fan-less if possible So far, this here seems to fit the bill perfectly http://www.fit-pc.com/web/fit-pc/intensepc/ but pricing seems to defy any reality. It does not state directly which chipsets are used for Wifi and Ethernet, the block diagram claims Ethernet chips to be Intel 82579 and RTL8111D, but I don't trust that fully. For Wifi I can always fall back to sticking in a supported USB stick, although that's kinda hacky. So how well is networking going to be supported by FreeBSD? Should I just bite the bullet and find out? What about the HP ProLiant N40L ? It's not fanless, of course - but it's IMO more suited for a server-type system than anything else in that price-range. I don't have one (I have no need for anything beyond what an AlIX-system can do) - but if I would need a home-server, I'd buy a N40L (it can boot from USB and you can thus boot FreeNAS from it) ___ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Buying recommendation for silent router/fileserver
On 11 Oct 2012, at 16:05, Rainer Duffner rai...@ultra-secure.de wrote: Am Thu, 11 Oct 2012 16:54:53 +0200 schrieb Ulrich Spörlein u...@freebsd.org: So how well is networking going to be supported by FreeBSD? Should I just bite the bullet and find out? What about the HP ProLiant N40L ? It's not fanless, of course - but it's IMO more suited for a server-type system than anything else in that price-range. I don't have one (I have no need for anything beyond what an AlIX-system can do) - but if I would need a home-server, I'd buy a N40L (it can boot from USB and you can thus boot FreeNAS from it) I've done both actually. I've got an N36L running FreeNAS, booting from USB and an alix system running pfsense. - Mark ___ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Buying recommendation for silent router/fileserver
On Thu, Oct 11, 2012 at 3:54 PM, Ulrich Spörlein u...@freebsd.org wrote: Hey guys, I need to replace an aging Pentium IV system that has been serving as my router, access point, file- and mediaserver for quite some time now. The replacement should have: - amd64 CPU (for ZFS, obviously) - 2x GigE (igress, egress interfaces) - some form of wlan interface (I currently use an Atheros based PCI card) … For Wifi I can always fall back to sticking in a supported USB stick, although that's kinda hacky. Are you planning to have the wifi act as an access point? Very few USB wlan devices support hostap mode; and those that do, don't support it very well. I've used a ural(4) stick in hostap before; any client that supports client power save, and that you can't disable power save on, will fall lose link as soon as it tries to enable power save. I don't know of any other wifi sticks that support hostap. Cheers Tom ___ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Buying recommendation for silent router/fileserver
On Thu, Oct 11, 2012 at 04:54:53PM +0200, Ulrich Sp??rlein wrote: Hey guys, I need to replace an aging Pentium IV system that has been serving as my router, access point, file- and mediaserver for quite some time now. The replacement should have: - amd64 CPU (for ZFS, obviously) - 2x GigE (igress, egress interfaces) - some form of wlan interface (I currently use an Atheros based PCI card) - eSATA for attaching a backup disk where I stream ZFS snapshots to - serial port is always nice, for when I mess up an upgrade - fan-less if possible So far, this here seems to fit the bill perfectly http://www.fit-pc.com/web/fit-pc/intensepc/ but pricing seems to defy any reality. It does not state directly which chipsets are used for Wifi and Ethernet, the block diagram claims Ethernet chips to be Intel 82579 and RTL8111D, but I don't trust that fully. For Wifi I can always fall back to sticking in a supported USB stick, although that's kinda hacky. So how well is networking going to be supported by FreeBSD? Should I just bite the bullet and find out? I'd recommend the Soekris net6501, but it's even more expensive than the intensepc (I suspect due to low hardware volumes but thats just a guess) http://soekris.com/products/net6501.html You also don't specify what kind of storage you need, which is obviously an important factor for a file/media server. Gary ___ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
RE: Buying recommendation for silent router/fileserver
-Original Message- From: owner-freebsd-curr...@freebsd.org [mailto:owner-freebsd- curr...@freebsd.org] On Behalf Of Ulrich Spörlein Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2012 10:55 AM To: curr...@freebsd.org Subject: Buying recommendation for silent router/fileserver Hey guys, I need to replace an aging Pentium IV system that has been serving as my router, access point, file- and mediaserver for quite some time now. The replacement should have: - amd64 CPU (for ZFS, obviously) - 2x GigE (igress, egress interfaces) - some form of wlan interface (I currently use an Atheros based PCI card) - eSATA for attaching a backup disk where I stream ZFS snapshots to - serial port is always nice, for when I mess up an upgrade - fan-less if possible So far, this here seems to fit the bill perfectly http://www.fit- pc.com/web/fit-pc/intensepc/ but pricing seems to defy any reality. It does not state directly which chipsets are used for Wifi and Ethernet, the block diagram claims Ethernet chips to be Intel 82579 and RTL8111D, but I don't trust that fully. For Wifi I can always fall back to sticking in a supported USB stick, although that's kinda hacky. So how well is networking going to be supported by FreeBSD? Should I just bite the bullet and find out? Cheers, Uli ___ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current- unsubscr...@freebsd.org Check out the pfSense recommended vendors for decent lists to start your search. Forums has links to other lesser known platforms to meet your requirements http://www.pfsense.org/index.php?option=com_contenttask=viewid=44Itemid=5 0 ___ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Buying recommendation for silent router/fileserver
On Thu, Oct 11, 2012 at 12:05:45PM -0400, Sean Cavanaugh wrote: -Original Message- From: owner-freebsd-curr...@freebsd.org [mailto:owner-freebsd- curr...@freebsd.org] On Behalf Of Ulrich Spörlein Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2012 10:55 AM To: curr...@freebsd.org Subject: Buying recommendation for silent router/fileserver Hey guys, I need to replace an aging Pentium IV system that has been serving as my router, access point, file- and mediaserver for quite some time now. The replacement should have: - amd64 CPU (for ZFS, obviously) - 2x GigE (igress, egress interfaces) - some form of wlan interface (I currently use an Atheros based PCI card) - eSATA for attaching a backup disk where I stream ZFS snapshots to - serial port is always nice, for when I mess up an upgrade - fan-less if possible So far, this here seems to fit the bill perfectly http://www.fit- pc.com/web/fit-pc/intensepc/ but pricing seems to defy any reality. It does not state directly which chipsets are used for Wifi and Ethernet, the block diagram claims Ethernet chips to be Intel 82579 and RTL8111D, but I don't trust that fully. For Wifi I can always fall back to sticking in a supported USB stick, although that's kinda hacky. So how well is networking going to be supported by FreeBSD? Should I just bite the bullet and find out? Cheers, Uli ___ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current- unsubscr...@freebsd.org Check out the pfSense recommended vendors for decent lists to start your search. Forums has links to other lesser known platforms to meet your requirements Regarding pfsense I'm quite happy with Firewall Alix 2D2 from http://www.osnet.eu/en/content/firewall-alix-2d2. I'm using at home and have been having no problems. They are one of the pfsense reccommended vendors. -- Guido Falsi m...@madpilot.net ___ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Buying recommendation for silent router/fileserver
On 10/11/12 12:05, Gary Palmer wrote: On Thu, Oct 11, 2012 at 04:54:53PM +0200, Ulrich Sp??rlein wrote: Hey guys, I need to replace an aging Pentium IV system that has been serving as my router, access point, file- and mediaserver for quite some time now. The replacement should have: - amd64 CPU (for ZFS, obviously) - 2x GigE (igress, egress interfaces) - some form of wlan interface (I currently use an Atheros based PCI card) - eSATA for attaching a backup disk where I stream ZFS snapshots to - serial port is always nice, for when I mess up an upgrade - fan-less if possible So far, this here seems to fit the bill perfectly http://www.fit-pc.com/web/fit-pc/intensepc/ but pricing seems to defy any reality. It does not state directly which chipsets are used for Wifi and Ethernet, the block diagram claims Ethernet chips to be Intel 82579 and RTL8111D, but I don't trust that fully. For Wifi I can always fall back to sticking in a supported USB stick, although that's kinda hacky. So how well is networking going to be supported by FreeBSD? Should I just bite the bullet and find out? I'd recommend the Soekris net6501, but it's even more expensive than the intensepc (I suspect due to low hardware volumes but thats just a guess) http://soekris.com/products/net6501.html You also don't specify what kind of storage you need, which is obviously an important factor for a file/media server. Gary ___ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org Be wary of the Soekris net6501, I bought three of the 1.6Ghz net6501-70 model which has an Atom E-680 cpu (E series) and it compiles more than twice as slow as a 1.6Ghz Atom N270 in an older netbook. Someone else running Linux reported similar CPU slowness. As far as practical network throughput, I could only get 100Mbit/sec with a simple HTTP download of a file full of zeros, and OpenVPN could only push about 25Mbit/sec. As a practical example of the CPU slowness, it takes about 1.5 minutes to compile pkg on the N270 netbook and 5 minutes on the 6501 (around 4.5 if I use -j2). A kernel compile took an hour. Unfortunately I had no idea this CPU (possibly implementation?) was so slow before I purchased it, and I could scarcely find evidence of it on google after hours of searching when I had already discovered the issue. I was hoping to find some comparative benchmarks between various Atom series but manufacturers generally don't do that. Additionally, the total AHCI SATA write speed on the net6501 (in BSD only?) has a strange 20MB/sec limitation but reads can go over 100MB/sec. If I write to one disk I get 20MB/sec, if I write to both SATA disks I get 10MB/sec each. Write is equally slow on a SSD. Both someone running OpenBSD and I running FreeBSD reported the same symptoms to the soekris-tech mailing list and received no useful replies towards getting that problem solved. I tested the write speed briefly with Linux and it did not appear to have the 20MB/sec limitation. I did confirm it was using MSI(-X?) with boot -v. I think this hardware would need to fall into Alexander Motin's hands to get anywhere with debugging the SATA speed issue. Since it seems fine in Linux, maybe some day it can be fixed in BSD but I have no clue how that limitation could happen. The disks I tested with are fine in normal computers. ___ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Buying recommendation for silent router/fileserver
Did you ever file a PR for the slow SATA behaviour? Adrian On 11 October 2012 09:52, Adam McDougall mcdou...@egr.msu.edu wrote: On 10/11/12 12:05, Gary Palmer wrote: On Thu, Oct 11, 2012 at 04:54:53PM +0200, Ulrich Sp??rlein wrote: Hey guys, I need to replace an aging Pentium IV system that has been serving as my router, access point, file- and mediaserver for quite some time now. The replacement should have: - amd64 CPU (for ZFS, obviously) - 2x GigE (igress, egress interfaces) - some form of wlan interface (I currently use an Atheros based PCI card) - eSATA for attaching a backup disk where I stream ZFS snapshots to - serial port is always nice, for when I mess up an upgrade - fan-less if possible So far, this here seems to fit the bill perfectly http://www.fit-pc.com/web/fit-pc/intensepc/ but pricing seems to defy any reality. It does not state directly which chipsets are used for Wifi and Ethernet, the block diagram claims Ethernet chips to be Intel 82579 and RTL8111D, but I don't trust that fully. For Wifi I can always fall back to sticking in a supported USB stick, although that's kinda hacky. So how well is networking going to be supported by FreeBSD? Should I just bite the bullet and find out? I'd recommend the Soekris net6501, but it's even more expensive than the intensepc (I suspect due to low hardware volumes but thats just a guess) http://soekris.com/products/net6501.html You also don't specify what kind of storage you need, which is obviously an important factor for a file/media server. Gary ___ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org Be wary of the Soekris net6501, I bought three of the 1.6Ghz net6501-70 model which has an Atom E-680 cpu (E series) and it compiles more than twice as slow as a 1.6Ghz Atom N270 in an older netbook. Someone else running Linux reported similar CPU slowness. As far as practical network throughput, I could only get 100Mbit/sec with a simple HTTP download of a file full of zeros, and OpenVPN could only push about 25Mbit/sec. As a practical example of the CPU slowness, it takes about 1.5 minutes to compile pkg on the N270 netbook and 5 minutes on the 6501 (around 4.5 if I use -j2). A kernel compile took an hour. Unfortunately I had no idea this CPU (possibly implementation?) was so slow before I purchased it, and I could scarcely find evidence of it on google after hours of searching when I had already discovered the issue. I was hoping to find some comparative benchmarks between various Atom series but manufacturers generally don't do that. Additionally, the total AHCI SATA write speed on the net6501 (in BSD only?) has a strange 20MB/sec limitation but reads can go over 100MB/sec. If I write to one disk I get 20MB/sec, if I write to both SATA disks I get 10MB/sec each. Write is equally slow on a SSD. Both someone running OpenBSD and I running FreeBSD reported the same symptoms to the soekris-tech mailing list and received no useful replies towards getting that problem solved. I tested the write speed briefly with Linux and it did not appear to have the 20MB/sec limitation. I did confirm it was using MSI(-X?) with boot -v. I think this hardware would need to fall into Alexander Motin's hands to get anywhere with debugging the SATA speed issue. Since it seems fine in Linux, maybe some day it can be fixed in BSD but I have no clue how that limitation could happen. The disks I tested with are fine in normal computers. ___ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org ___ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Buying recommendation for silent router/fileserver
Am 11.10.2012 um 18:52 schrieb Adam McDougall mcdou...@egr.msu.edu: Be wary of the Soekris net6501, […] The Soekris, AFAIK, is an embedded platform. It doesn't surprise me the least that it's not good at I/O. That's the reason why I suggested the HP. At least, it does decent I/O, if you want to believe reports. I would really also recommend to separate the router and fileserver-functionality. AFAIK, the N40L supports Wake-on-LAN (and pfSense does, too), so you should be able to wake it up even without getting up from the couch ;-) I never really got warm with the Soekris-stuff - but then, I'm in Switzerland and PC-Engines was always very quick with shipping ;-) ___ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Buying recommendation for silent router/fileserver
On Thu, October 11, 2012 14:53, Rainer Duffner wrote: Am 11.10.2012 um 18:52 schrieb Adam McDougall mcdou...@egr.msu.edu: Be wary of the Soekris net6501, [ ] The Soekris, AFAIK, is an embedded platform. It doesn't surprise me the least that it's not good at I/O. I second that. Tried to use a 6501-70 as file server, and got myself a great deal of work to know in the end the box was not supposed to be used like that. An Intel atom mini itx board, powered by similar Atom CPU got faster results, but a huge margin. For me, the issue is with saturation bus related. I would not recommend using it, unless its a really small file server. matheus -- We will call you Cygnus, The God of balance you shall be A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text. Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posting_style ___ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
