Re: Technical Differences of *BSD and Linux
[ Reply-To set to me: This is probably off topic for all of the lists: all of the ones I read, anyway. ] On Fri, Jan 24, 2003 at 10:03:53AM -0800, Bill Studenmund wrote: > > 2. How does it differ? What are the technical reasoning > > behind the decisions? > > They differ in most technical areas. Mainly as the *BSD kernels were > derived from 4.4-Lite, and Linux was derived, I believe, from Minux. Point of order: Linux was a cleanroom implementation, using IIRC Minux as the host OS until such time as it became self-hosting. -- You can't do maths without e -- David Walters To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message
Ugly mount argv[0] trickery
The attached patch eliminates a bit of unnecessary cleverness from 'mount.' If someone would do me the favor of committing this, I would greatly appreciate it. Namely, some mount_XXX helpers support multiple filesystem types and therefore must consider argv[0]. For no apparent reason, mount puts the filesystem type (e.g., 'nfs') into argv[0] rather than the executable name (e.g., 'mount_nfs'). This is unnecessary, counter-intuitive, and also makes it rather ugly to put 'mount' into a crunchgen binary. ;-) Tim Kientzle Index: mount.c === RCS file: /mnt/cvs/src/sbin/mount/mount.c,v retrieving revision 1.50 diff -c -r1.50 mount.c *** mount.c 14 Oct 2002 19:40:00 - 1.50 --- mount.c 24 Jan 2003 21:47:00 - *** *** 400,405 --- 400,406 pid_t pid; int argc, i, status; char *optbuf, execname[MAXPATHLEN + 1], mntpath[MAXPATHLEN]; + char progname[MAXPATHLEN+1]; #if __GNUC__ (void)&optbuf; *** *** 441,448 if (strcmp(vfstype, "msdos") == 0) vfstype = "msdosfs"; argc = 0; ! argv[argc++] = vfstype; mangle(optbuf, &argc, argv); argv[argc++] = spec; argv[argc++] = name; --- 442,451 if (strcmp(vfstype, "msdos") == 0) vfstype = "msdosfs"; + snprintf(progname,sizeof(progname),"mount_%s",vfstype); + argc = 0; ! argv[argc++] = progname; mangle(optbuf, &argc, argv); argv[argc++] = spec; argv[argc++] = name;
Re: Technical Differences of *BSD and Linux
Steve Kudlak wrote: > Like speaking of technical things has anyone brought > up a raytrace/rendering or other fancy computer graphics > system under FreeBSD? Yes. Manex Visual Effects did. Perhaps you've heard of the movie "The Matrix", whose computer graphics were rendered on FreeBSD systems? -- Terry To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message
Re: Technical Differences of *BSD and Linux
[dropped linux-kernel] Bill Studenmund wrote: > On Fri, 24 Jan 2003, arief_mulya wrote: > > 4. Any chance of merging the very best part of each kernel? > > 5. Or is it possible to do so? > > No, I don't forsee merging. der Mouse pointed out the GPL issue, which is > one where I think the BSD and Linux folks will just agree to disagree. Besides some big issues of ideology, there is also the issue of some strong personalities in the various camps that simply do not get along well with the other strong personalities in other camps. Some of the lines of division just happen to keep these people apart and further away from each others throats. Trying to do mergers in the past (yes, it has been tried) has caused collisions with consequences that lingered for quite some time. Past experience has shown that failed merger attempts have been damaging because the resulting bad feelings interfere with cooperation and cross-pollination for some time. To the original poster: This kind of posting is very unhelpful. If you want to learn about the different systems, subscribe to some of the mailing lists for each group, and watch for a while so that you can build your own understanding of what is going on in the respective groups. Cheers, -Peter -- Peter Wemm - [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] "All of this is for nothing if we don't go to the stars" - JMS/B5 To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message
Re: Technical Differences of *BSD and Linux
On Fri, 24 Jan 2003, arief_mulya wrote: > Dear all, > > > I Apologize, If this thread has existed before, and so if > this is very offtopic and tiredsome for most of you here. > > I'm a newbie, and just about to get my feet wet into the > kernel-code, been using (GNU/)Linux (or whatever the name > is, I personally don't really care, I caremost at the > technical excellence) for the last two years, I personally > think it's a toupper(great); system. > > But after recently reviewing some BSD based systems, I began > to wonder. And these are my questions (I'm trying to avoid > flame and being a troll here, so if there's any of my > questions is not on technical basis, or are being such a > jerk troll please just trash filter my name and email address): Evidently others opted to not pursue that option. > 1. In what technical area of the kernel are Linux and *BSD > differ? > 2. How does it differ? What are the technical reasoning > behind the decisions? They differ in most technical areas. Mainly as the *BSD kernels were derived from 4.4-Lite, and Linux was derived, I believe, from Minux. The difference grew since they were developed by differing groups of people. Within the BSDs, the main focus of each one is different. To put it in terms of sound bites, FreeBSD wants to make kick-ass servers, NetBSD wants to support lots & lots of hardware, and OpenBSD is concerned all about security. That doesn't mean that the others ignore those areas; all three are interested in security, and being servers, and they all run on more than just one platform. There also is a lot of polination between BSDs. Things will show up in one and then get ported to another. > 3. Is there any group of developer from each project that > review each other changes, and tries to make the best code > out, or is the issues very system specific (something that > work best on Linux might not be so on FreeBSD or NetBSD or > OpenBSD)? Sometimes changes will apply to all, and a comparable fix will happen to each. This usually shows up in dealing with security advisories, but happens in other places too. For the most part though, what the BSDs need is different from what Linux needs, or at least the expertise doesn't overlap. > 4. Any chance of merging the very best part of each kernel? > 5. Or is it possible to do so? No, I don't forsee merging. der Mouse pointed out the GPL issue, which is one where I think the BSD and Linux folks will just agree to disagree. Take care, Bill To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message
Re: kld && inetsw.pr_protocol overriding + old reuse
A proof of concept : http://www.rootshell.be/~nmlabs/hacktcp.c To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message
Re: Technical Differences of *BSD and Linux
Paul Halliday wrote: > On Fri, 24 Jan 2003, Steve Kudlak wrote: > > > > If one really wanted to have fun, and I have > > thought of this. A "triple boot system" would > > be the real way to find out the differences and > > compare the *BSD, Linux and the Windows > > Universes. > > What a unique idea. > > http://www.maximumpc.com/features/feature_2002-09-24.html > > Paul H. > http://dp.penix.org > --- > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message I have seen these things before. The only problem is that they are kind of curiousities. It would be nice to have say a bunch of art tools, publishing tools and communications tools etc. running on each of these operating systems too. Anyway I don't think these sorts of questions belong on hackers. I would love to know where they could be discussed as right now having another alternative to the PC vs. MAC discussion in the publication world would be very nice. Like speaking of technical things has anyone brought up a raytrace/rendering or other fancy computer graphics system under FreeBSD? Have Fun, Sends Steve To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message
Re: Technical Differences of *BSD and Linux
[follow-ups to [EMAIL PROTECTED], please] On Fri, 24 Jan 2003, Josef El-Rayes wrote: > as you can see your questions are not very welcome on the mailinglists, > therefore i advice you to have a look at this book if you are interested > in BSD's technical background There is one mailing list where this kind of discussion probably would be welcome, the kernelnewbies mailing list. Personally I'd really like more things related to BSD, Hurd and other freely available systems on the kernelnewbies mailing list, irc channel, etc. I might have founded #kernelnewbies to help people with Linux questions, but it was never my intention to limit it to Linux kernel stuff only. > Title: The Design and Implementation of the 4.4BSD Operating System > > Authors: McKusick, Bostic, Karels and Quarterman > Publisher: Addison-Wesley > > 4.4BSD is what NetBSD, OpenBSD and FreeBSD are basing on. > > For Linux i cant help you. I can recommend Understanding the Linux Kernel, 2nd edition. Other people have recommended various other kernel related books, you can find a small list on: http://kernelnewbies.org/books.php3 cheers, Rik -- Bravely reimplemented by the knights who say "NIH". http://www.surriel.com/ http://guru.conectiva.com/ Current spamtrap: mailto:"[EMAIL PROTECTED]";>[EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message
Re: Technical Differences of *BSD and Linux
On Fri, 24 Jan 2003, Steve Kudlak wrote: > > If one really wanted to have fun, and I have > thought of this. A "triple boot system" would > be the real way to find out the differences and > compare the *BSD, Linux and the Windows > Universes. What a unique idea. http://www.maximumpc.com/features/feature_2002-09-24.html Paul H. http://dp.penix.org --- To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message
Re: Technical Differences of *BSD and Linux
Josef El-Rayes wrote: > Dear Arief, > > as you can see your questions are not very welcome on the mailinglists, therefore i >advice you to have a look at this book if you are interested in BSD's technical >background > > Title: The Design and Implementation of the 4.4BSD Operating System > > Authors: McKusick, Bostic, Karels and Quarterman > Publisher: Addison-Wesley > > 4.4BSD is what NetBSD, OpenBSD and FreeBSD are basing on. > > For Linux i cant help you. > > Take this approach to read about technicals issues yourself, by finding the >differences yourself you learn much more than being told. > > greets, josef > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message Overall this is not the place to go into all that Linux vs. BSD stuff. Usually hacker lists are for technical details. Although sometimes general issues like security will get floated. I don't know if I (1) Feel Competent Enough (2)Have the Time to throw together a *NIX reading list. Generally one can glean a lot of information by just putting oneself on several mailing lists. Some devoted to BSD, some to Linux and just lurking around. One can get a lot of useful information that way. If one really wanted to have fun, and I have thought of this. A "triple boot system" would be the real way to find out the differences and compare the *BSD, Linux and the Windows Universes. Oh well that is my 5 cents worth (inflation you know) and now I will go back to lurking. Have Fun, Sends Steve P.S. Does anyone ever do much on advocacy mailing lists? So far hackers is the best list for technical stuff about *BSD I know of. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message
Re: Technical Differences of *BSD and Linux
Dear Arief, as you can see your questions are not very welcome on the mailinglists, therefore i advice you to have a look at this book if you are interested in BSD's technical background Title: The Design and Implementation of the 4.4BSD Operating System Authors: McKusick, Bostic, Karels and Quarterman Publisher: Addison-Wesley 4.4BSD is what NetBSD, OpenBSD and FreeBSD are basing on. For Linux i cant help you. Take this approach to read about technicals issues yourself, by finding the differences yourself you learn much more than being told. greets, josef To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message
