Re: Attention ports committers

2011-01-22 Thread Eygene Ryabinkin 
Joeb, good day.

Wed, Jan 19, 2011 at 11:59:24AM -0500, joeb wrote:
 Eygene Ryabinkin you sure missed the point of my post.  Your
 forensic investigation of my port is far outside the review of the
 make file to commit the port.

That is my personal opinion as if I would wrote the port myself and
will then critically review it.  If I am committing something, I am
trying to make it as good as I can, at least in the majority of cases.

 Scrubbing through your email content I only see you voicing your
 personal preferences without any makefile statement errors, which
 would make the Makefile invalid. This is a very simple Makefile so
 lets not make a mountain out of a molehill.

Do you realize that not every valid Makefile will be perfectly
maintainable?  That's like a program that does the current work, but
if you'll look at it in the perspective of maintaining it and making
further modifications, it poses some challenges, because, in our case,
many standard constructs aren't used and substitute for the homebrew
ones.

Almost all my comments were related to the constructs that can be
substituted by the standard FreeBSD port makefile ones.  And users
of the ports expect the standard behaviour from the ports, so native
constructs are almost always better than the ones written by hand,
just because they
 a. provide the standard behaviour now;
 b. will provide it later even if the behaviour will be redefined
or extended; no one should rewrite the Makefile or, in the
worst case, it should be only lightly touched.
And using standard constructs you'll get this basically for free:
that's good, isn't it?

 The port description is within the max size and is very
 detailed on purpose. I plan to keep it that way.

Porter's Handbook,
  http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en/books/porters-handbook/book.html#AEN89
asks the pkg-descr to be concise, so if you really want the
detailed description, you should justify it.  And not just because
it is long to my taste, but because the standard rules are saying
it too.

While I must confess that we have even 154-line pkg-descr file in the
current tree (sysutils/dirdiff and it just copies the README/INSTALL,
the thing that the handbook warns about), you can glance at the
statistics
{{{
Ports Lines
   1  154L
   1  65L
   1  57L
   1  56L
   1  53L
   2  52L
   1  50L
   1  48L
   2  47L
   3  46L
   3  45L
   1  43L
   1  42L
   1  41L
   1  39L
   3  38L
   4  37L
   2  36L
   1  35L
   3  34L
   4  33L
   4  32L
   8  31L
   5  30L
   5  29L
  10  28L
  17  27L
  18  26L
  20  25L
 214  24L
 208  23L
 226  22L
 237  21L
 248  20L
 305  19L
 274  18L
 338  17L
 395  16L
 424  15L
 561  14L
 592  13L
 777  12L
 851  11L
1076  10L
1252  9L
1467  8L
1839  7L
2251  6L
2427  5L
2521  4L
2464  3L
 242  2L
 267  1L
}}}
and get a feeling of how the length distibution looks like.
Everything that is longer than 24 lines has negligible contribution,
something like  0.2%.

 The whole point of the post is that I am not a port Makefile coder.
 I wrote a script for jails and it has taken longer to get the
 Makefile correct then the coding of the original qjail script.

May I ask, had you read the Porter's Handbook before you had started
creating your Makefile or you had adopted some other port sources?
I have a gut feeling that the latter case was in action.

 If the install of the RC_SUBR script can be done in a more reliable
 way then what I need is the Makefile statements to perform this
 action so I can update the port (shar) file with them.

 The goal here is to get this port committed, not waste time trying
 to teach me the secret internal details of port makefiles
 construction.

If you want to produce the good FreeBSD port, then you'll need to
know some internals.  Becides, they aren't real internals, most
of stuff I am saying about the Makefile is written in the Porter's
Handbook:
  http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en/books/porters-handbook/book.html
Nothing I am telling about the port is the Real Arcane Stuff (TM).


You can freely skip the part of my review that touches the code
of the qjail and its manual pages; I just wanted to share some
experience that I thought would be handy for you and, perhaps,
other people.

My goal was to create the compact port that will be almost
perfect ;))

With all respect.
-- 
Eygene Ryabinkin,,,^..^,,,
[ Life's unfair - but root password helps!   | codelabs.ru ]
[ 82FE 06BC D497 C0DE 49EC  4FF0 16AF 9EAE 8152 ECFB | freebsd.org ]


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Re: Attention ports committers

2011-01-22 Thread Sahil Tandon 
On Sat, 2011-01-22 at 22:18:49 +0300, Eygene Ryabinkin wrote:

 If I am committing something, I am trying to make it as good as I can

This is exactly how it should be!

 My goal was to create the compact port that will be almost
 perfect ;))

Thanks for refusing to commit rubbish into the tree, and gracefully
dealing with an unnecessarily hostile response to your useful feedback.

Your patience is incredible. :)

-- 
Sahil Tandon sa...@freebsd.org
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RE: Attention ports committers

2011-01-19 Thread joeb 


-Original Message-
From: r...@codelabs.ru [mailto:r...@codelabs.ru]On Behalf Of Eygene Ryabinkin
Sent: Friday, January 14, 2011 4:46 PM
To: joeb
Cc: po...@freebsd.org
Subject: Re: Attention ports committers

Good day.

Fri, Jan 14, 2011 at 01:18:52PM -0500, joeb wrote:
 I would like to draw the attention of a ports committer to port

 http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/query-pr.cgi?pr=ports/148777

 If it needs further work please provide feedback.

A couple of things about the port:
 - you can just use plain SF instead of a long to type
   ${MASTER_SITE_SOURCEFORGE}; moreover, plain SF/${PORTNAME}
   and no MASTER_SITE_SUBDIR will work too and save you
   one more line;
 - share/examples/qjail in the pkg-plist is better spelled
   as %%EXAMPLESDIR_REL%%; and its ${PREFIX}/share/examples/qjail
   in the Makefile should really be ${EXAMPLESDIR}; also
   you can consider using PORTEXAMPLES to use port's procedures
   to install the examples and to avoid installing them when
   NOPORTEXAMPLES is set;
 - it is better to remove the commented DISTFILES, since
   it is not needed thus just adds the visual clutter;
 - pkg-descr is a way too chatty (in my taste); it can be
   definitely stripped down to provide the idea about
   what qjail is and the whole text can be put to the
   project's Web site;
 - you can put your rc.d script into USE_RC_SUBR inside
   the Makefile; just put your scripts into WRKDIR during
   the build phase; this will enable your port to survive
   any modifications to the process of installation of
   the rc.d scripts, because they will be handled by the
   ports subsystem;
 - pkg-message can be stripped down as well: first line
   looks redundant, since people already know why they
   had installed the port; the other two lines, perhaps,
   can be condensed into Read qjail-intro(8) for to get
   started.  The said manual page has reference to the
   qjail(8), so people will know what to do after reading
   the introduction.

And please, please, please, try to put your shar(1) archive somewhere
to the Web and add the link to the PR: mail over gnats if not
uuencoded properly makes attachments with partial quoted-printable
stuff left, so download of, for example,
  http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/query-pr.cgi?prp=148777-3-sharn=/shar-3.sh
will give a non-working shar(1) archive for starters and when '=0A='
will be removed, one will need to dance with the QP '=' characters,
newlines and alike.


May I also add, your software's manual pages can be improved:
 - don't insert empty lines into the groff files, use the
   lone dot if you want the visual separator inside the
   groff sources;
 - use standard macros like .Pa, .Xr, .Nm, .Qq and others
   instead of doing bold font, quoting and other stuff by hand;
 - avoid unneeded usage of the bold attribute; for example,
   qjail-intro(8) needs no bold for the 4th generation,
   user friendliness and other stuff;
 - start each sentense inside the manual source from the
   new line: this will provide two spaces between sentences
   in the formatted manual pages and will ease the diffs
   between revisions of the makefile (for you and other
   developers of the qjail, because this way changes in the
   manual pages will show up in the diff output only inside
   their own sentenses; they won't have the parts of other
   sentences in the + and - lines and that's good);
 - you have many trailing spaces; whilst they typically do
   not harm, why to keep them?


And for the qjail scripts themselves:
 - currently qjail is a single block with no subroutines;
   it _may_ be better to split it into logical parts,
   because it will be easier to read, navigate and understand
   for Other People (TM) ;))
 - perhaps you'll be able to use exit codes from sysexits(3).
 - what does jail2 rc.d script?  It terribly reminds me
   /etc/rc.d/jail and diffing the two one finds mostly
   cosmetic differences.  So, what's the point of having
   jail2 at all?


Sorry for a long letter and slightly mentorish tone: meant
no offense, just wanted to improve the stuff.
--
Eygene Ryabinkin,,,^..^,,,
[ Life's unfair - but root password helps!   | codelabs.ru ]
[ 82FE 06BC D497 C0DE 49EC  4FF0 16AF 9EAE 8152 ECFB | freebsd.org ]


WOW  Eygene Ryabinkin you sure missed the point of my post.
Your forensic investigation of my port is far outside the review of the make
file to commit the port.
So lets get back on task.
Scrubbing through your email content I only see you voicing your personal
preferences without any makefile statement errors, which would make the
Makefile invalid. This is a very simple Makefile so lets not make a mountain
out of a molehill. The port description is within the max size and is very
detailed on purpose. I plan to keep it that way.
The whole point of the post is that I am not a port Makefile coder. I wrote
a script for jails and it has taken longer to get the Makefile correct then
the coding of the original qjail

Re: Attention ports committers

2011-01-15 Thread perryh 
Eygene Ryabinkin r...@freebsd.org wrote:

 And please, please, please, try to put your shar(1) archive
 somewhere to the Web and add the link to the PR: mail over
 gnats if not uuencoded properly makes attachments with partial
 quoted-printable stuff left ...

Sounds as if Sec. 3.6 of the Porter's Handbook needs a revision
(unless the version packaged for 8.1-RELEASE is out of date in
that area.)
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Re: Attention ports committers

2011-01-15 Thread Eygene Ryabinkin 
Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 02:05:40AM -0800, per...@pluto.rain.com wrote:
 Eygene Ryabinkin r...@freebsd.org wrote:
 
  And please, please, please, try to put your shar(1) archive
  somewhere to the Web and add the link to the PR: mail over
  gnats if not uuencoded properly makes attachments with partial
  quoted-printable stuff left ...
 
 Sounds as if Sec. 3.6 of the Porter's Handbook needs a revision

Sorry, I should have been more precise: the shar(1) archive from the
original submission is just fine, because it was sent by the send-pr.

But the shar(1) archives from the followups resulted from the fixes of
the port content were sent by the ordinary mailer as attachments and
were attachments were encoded as quoted-printable.  query-pr.cgi
currently is not good at handling them and giving away unencoded content
in all cases.  I have plans to improve query-pr.cgi, but not instantly.
-- 
Eygene Ryabinkin,,,^..^,,,
[ Life's unfair - but root password helps!   | codelabs.ru ]
[ 82FE 06BC D497 C0DE 49EC  4FF0 16AF 9EAE 8152 ECFB | freebsd.org ]


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Attention ports committers

2011-01-14 Thread joeb 
I would like to draw the attention of a ports committer to port 

http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/query-pr.cgi?pr=ports/148777

If it needs further work please provide feedback.


Thanks for your attention to commit this port.

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Re: Attention ports committers

2011-01-14 Thread Chuck Swiger 
On Jan 14, 2011, at 10:18 AM, joeb wrote:
 I would like to draw the attention of a ports committer to port 
 
 http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/query-pr.cgi?pr=ports/148777
 
 If it needs further work please provide feedback.

Have you addressed the problems mentioned by Chris Rees utis...@gmail.com yet?

A port submission which doesn't follow the requirements in the Porter's 
Handbook most likely isn't going to be added

Regards,
-- 
-Chuck

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Re: Attention ports committers

2011-01-14 Thread Eygene Ryabinkin 
Good day.

Fri, Jan 14, 2011 at 01:18:52PM -0500, joeb wrote:
 I would like to draw the attention of a ports committer to port 
 
 http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/query-pr.cgi?pr=ports/148777
 
 If it needs further work please provide feedback.

A couple of things about the port:
 - you can just use plain SF instead of a long to type
   ${MASTER_SITE_SOURCEFORGE}; moreover, plain SF/${PORTNAME}
   and no MASTER_SITE_SUBDIR will work too and save you
   one more line;
 - share/examples/qjail in the pkg-plist is better spelled
   as %%EXAMPLESDIR_REL%%; and its ${PREFIX}/share/examples/qjail
   in the Makefile should really be ${EXAMPLESDIR}; also
   you can consider using PORTEXAMPLES to use port's procedures
   to install the examples and to avoid installing them when
   NOPORTEXAMPLES is set;
 - it is better to remove the commented DISTFILES, since
   it is not needed thus just adds the visual clutter;
 - pkg-descr is a way too chatty (in my taste); it can be
   definitely stripped down to provide the idea about
   what qjail is and the whole text can be put to the
   project's Web site;
 - you can put your rc.d script into USE_RC_SUBR inside
   the Makefile; just put your scripts into WRKDIR during
   the build phase; this will enable your port to survive
   any modifications to the process of installation of
   the rc.d scripts, because they will be handled by the
   ports subsystem;
 - pkg-message can be stripped down as well: first line
   looks redundant, since people already know why they
   had installed the port; the other two lines, perhaps,
   can be condensed into Read qjail-intro(8) for to get
   started.  The said manual page has reference to the
   qjail(8), so people will know what to do after reading
   the introduction.

And please, please, please, try to put your shar(1) archive somewhere
to the Web and add the link to the PR: mail over gnats if not
uuencoded properly makes attachments with partial quoted-printable
stuff left, so download of, for example,
  http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/query-pr.cgi?prp=148777-3-sharn=/shar-3.sh
will give a non-working shar(1) archive for starters and when '=0A='
will be removed, one will need to dance with the QP '=' characters,
newlines and alike.


May I also add, your software's manual pages can be improved:
 - don't insert empty lines into the groff files, use the
   lone dot if you want the visual separator inside the
   groff sources;
 - use standard macros like .Pa, .Xr, .Nm, .Qq and others
   instead of doing bold font, quoting and other stuff by hand;
 - avoid unneeded usage of the bold attribute; for example,
   qjail-intro(8) needs no bold for the 4th generation,
   user friendliness and other stuff;
 - start each sentense inside the manual source from the
   new line: this will provide two spaces between sentences
   in the formatted manual pages and will ease the diffs
   between revisions of the makefile (for you and other
   developers of the qjail, because this way changes in the
   manual pages will show up in the diff output only inside
   their own sentenses; they won't have the parts of other
   sentences in the + and - lines and that's good);
 - you have many trailing spaces; whilst they typically do
   not harm, why to keep them?


And for the qjail scripts themselves:
 - currently qjail is a single block with no subroutines;
   it _may_ be better to split it into logical parts,
   because it will be easier to read, navigate and understand
   for Other People (TM) ;))
 - perhaps you'll be able to use exit codes from sysexits(3).
 - what does jail2 rc.d script?  It terribly reminds me
   /etc/rc.d/jail and diffing the two one finds mostly
   cosmetic differences.  So, what's the point of having
   jail2 at all?


Sorry for a long letter and slightly mentorish tone: meant
no offense, just wanted to improve the stuff.
-- 
Eygene Ryabinkin,,,^..^,,,
[ Life's unfair - but root password helps!   | codelabs.ru ]
[ 82FE 06BC D497 C0DE 49EC  4FF0 16AF 9EAE 8152 ECFB | freebsd.org ]


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Re: Attention ports committers

2011-01-14 Thread Eygene Ryabinkin 
Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:46:02AM +0300, Eygene Ryabinkin wrote:
 A couple of things about the port:
[...]

Two more things.

There is INSTALL_MAN macros that should be used for manpage
installation.  Also, ${MANPREFIX}/man/man8/ is better spelled as
${MAN8PREFIX}/man/man8/ and you can use the following construct:
{{{
.for m in ${MAN8}
${INSTALL_MAN} ${WRKSRC}${m} ${MAN8PREFIX}/man/man8/${m}
.endfor
}}}
to automate the installation.

Perhaps, ${CAT} ${PKGMESSAGE} is better be silenced by writing
'@${CAT} ${PKGMESSAGE}'.
-- 
Eygene Ryabinkin,,,^..^,,,
[ Life's unfair - but root password helps!   | codelabs.ru ]
[ 82FE 06BC D497 C0DE 49EC  4FF0 16AF 9EAE 8152 ECFB | freebsd.org ]


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Re: Attention ports committers

2011-01-14 Thread Eygene Ryabinkin 
Fri, Jan 14, 2011 at 10:47:36AM -0800, Chuck Swiger wrote:
 Have you addressed the problems mentioned by Chris Rees
 utis...@gmail.com yet?

Almost all of them were addressed, as I can judge.  But I had
spotted some more nits ;)).
-- 
Eygene Ryabinkin,,,^..^,,,
[ Life's unfair - but root password helps!   | codelabs.ru ]
[ 82FE 06BC D497 C0DE 49EC  4FF0 16AF 9EAE 8152 ECFB | freebsd.org ]


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Re: Attention ports committers

2011-01-14 Thread Chuck Swiger 
On Jan 14, 2011, at 2:09 PM, Eygene Ryabinkin wrote:
 Almost all of them were addressed, as I can judge.  But I had spotted some 
 more nits ;)).

Thanks for the additional review.  :-)

Regards,
-- 
-Chuck

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