Mounting raw disk backup file.
HI, I had a drive fail recently, it was working fine until I rebooted. After that the partition map was corrupt and I can't mount either partition on the disk. So I made a copy of the whole disk using dd to an old USB drive. There were several IO errors while dd was copying the disk, so I think the disk is starting to go. I can probably fix the partition table using testdisk, but now that I've got this image file I'd rather work with that instead of the physical disk. I've read the Handbook section on using mdconfig, but that assumes the image file is of a filesystem, not a whole disk. I think I've found instructions for how to do it on linux, but if there's a way to mount it on FreeBSD I'd rather do that. So, any suggestions? Here's what file says about the file: mnavarre@pcbsd-1810] /# file /mnt/ada1_backup /mnt/ada1_backup: x86 boot sector; partition 1: ID=0xa5, active, starthead 1, startsector 63, 167766732 sectors; partition 2: ID=0xa5, starthead 254, startsector 167766795, 144809910 sectors, code offset 0x3c, BSD disklabel And just for grins, what fdisk says about the actual disk: mnavarre@pcbsd-1810] /# fdisk ada1 *** Working on device /dev/ada1 *** parameters extracted from in-core disklabel are: cylinders=310098 heads=16 sectors/track=63 (1008 blks/cyl) Figures below won't work with BIOS for partitions not in cyl 1 parameters to be used for BIOS calculations are: cylinders=310098 heads=16 sectors/track=63 (1008 blks/cyl) Media sector size is 512 Warning: BIOS sector numbering starts with sector 1 Information from DOS bootblock is: The data for partition 1 is: sysid 165 (0xa5),(FreeBSD/NetBSD/386BSD) start 63, size 167766732 (81917 Meg), flag 80 (active) beg: cyl 0/ head 1/ sector 1; end: cyl 1023/ head 254/ sector 63 The data for partition 2 is: sysid 165 (0xa5),(FreeBSD/NetBSD/386BSD) start 167766795, size 144809910 (70707 Meg), flag 80 (active) beg: cyl 1023/ head 255/ sector 63; end: cyl 1023/ head 254/ sector 63 The data for partition 3 is: UNUSED The data for partition 4 is: UNUSED Thanks, Matt Navarre ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Mounting raw disk backup file.
On Sun, Aug 5, 2012 at 11:12 PM, Matthew Navarre navarre.matt...@gmail.comwrote: I had a drive fail recently, it was working fine until I rebooted. After that the partition map was corrupt and I can't mount either partition on the disk. So I made a copy of the whole disk using dd to an old USB drive. There were several IO errors while dd was copying the disk, so I think the disk is starting to go. I can probably fix the partition table using testdisk, but now that I've got this image file I'd rather work with that instead of the physical disk. I've read the Handbook section on using mdconfig, but that assumes the image file is of a filesystem, not a whole disk. I think I've found instructions for how to do it on linux, but if there's a way to mount it on FreeBSD I'd rather do that. So, any suggestions? Here's what file says about the file: mnavarre@pcbsd-1810] /# file /mnt/ada1_backup /mnt/ada1_backup: x86 boot sector; partition 1: ID=0xa5, active, starthead 1, startsector 63, 167766732 sectors; partition 2: ID=0xa5, starthead 254, startsector 167766795, 144809910 sectors, code offset 0x3c, BSD disklabel Why did you put it in /mnt? That's customarily used for mounting fileystems. Move it ;-) mdconfig -a -t vnode -f /new-path/ada1_backup note the device that's created (probably md0) you can then operate on /dev/md0 as if it were a disk. In particular, you might want to fix the partition map, the label info, etc. You can then fsck the filesystem (presumably something like /dev/md0s1a or /dev/md0a etc). You'll probably need to tell fsck that it's ufs (i.e. fsck -t ufs /dev/md0a ) you can then mount the fs (mount -t ufs /dev/md0a /mnt ) - M ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Mounting raw disk backup file.
On Sun, 5 Aug 2012 23:12:48 -0700, Matthew Navarre wrote: I can probably fix the partition table using testdisk, but now that I've got this image file I'd rather work with that instead of the physical disk. I've read the Handbook section on using mdconfig, but that assumes the image file is of a filesystem, not a whole disk. I think I've found instructions for how to do it on linux, but if there's a way to mount it on FreeBSD I'd rather do that. It depends on _what_ your disk image (typically created by a dd-like utility to make a 1:1 copy of a whole disk) contains. If there are several slices and partitions, each of them can be accessed like it was a physical disk. Let's assume you have /home/you/ada1.dd which is the copy of your former /dev/ada1 disk. You do: # mdconfig -a -t vnode -u 0 -f /home/you/ada1.dd This results in a file /dev/md0 as well as any partitional qualifier specials that might correspond to the disk the copy has been taken from. You can check that with # fdisk /dev/md0 and it should print the same partition table as for the real disk. Now you can access and mount from that disk image, e. g. # mount -t ufs -o ro /dev/md0s1a /mnt as this maybe is the root file system of the 1st slice. Note the use of -o ro in this case. If you have had partitioned your system, you can add those partitions into a fully accessible /mnt tree for that system disk, e. g. # mount -t ufs -o ro /dev/md0s1d /mnt/tmp # mount -t ufs -o ro /dev/md0s1e /mnt/var # mount -t ufs -o ro /dev/md0s1f /mnt/usr # mount -t ufs -o ro /dev/md0s1g /mnt/home Note that unmounting must happen in the reversed order. If there was another file system, e. g. for sharing with Windows stuff, it's also possible to mount it: # mount -t msdosfs -o ro /dev/md0s2 /mnt/win Of course you can access all slices and partitions independently. That should be the best approach for recovering data. -- Polytropon Magdeburg, Germany Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0 Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ... ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Introducing new ports - best practises
Hello, at the moment I am working on porting the Tryton business solution and later GNU Health is planned. Tryton is made up of small modules (Python Eggs), each of them providing data models and business logic for a particular business domain - e.g. product management, invoicing, crm, sales... . The modules depend on each other in some ways. What is the proposed way to get this modules into the Ports Collection? Should I submit a PR for each single module or it is reasonable to create one PR for a bunch of new ports of the same category when they belong logically together? Thanks, Matthias -- Matthias Petermann matth...@d2ux.net ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Mounting raw disk backup file.
On Sun, Aug 5, 2012 at 11:28 PM, Michael Sierchio ku...@tenebras.comwrote: On Sun, Aug 5, 2012 at 11:12 PM, Matthew Navarre navarre.matt...@gmail.com wrote: Here's what file says about the file: mnavarre@pcbsd-1810] /# file /mnt/ada1_backup /mnt/ada1_backup: x86 boot sector; partition 1: ID=0xa5, active, starthead 1, startsector 63, 167766732 sectors; partition 2: ID=0xa5, starthead 254, startsector 167766795, 144809910 sectors, code offset 0x3c, BSD disklabel Why did you put it in /mnt? That's customarily used for mounting fileystems. Move it ;-) Heh, the BSD drive with the backup file in on /mnt, the mdconfig node is md1. mdconfig -a -t vnode -f /new-path/ada1_backup note the device that's created (probably md0) you can then operate on /dev/md0 as if it were a disk. In particular, you might want to fix the partition map, the label info, etc. You can then fsck the filesystem (presumably something like /dev/md0s1a or /dev/md0a etc). You'll probably need to tell fsck that it's ufs (i.e. fsck -t ufs /dev/md0a ) you can then mount the fs (mount -t ufs /dev/md0a /mnt ) Thanks, didn't realize that I could use that device node to operate on it like a block device. Of course, the fact that mdconfig makes the system think a file is a block device should have been a clue ;) Now I just need to get the partitions and disklabel figured out. - M OK, MCN ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Introducing new ports - best practises
On 06/08/2012 08:10, Matthias Petermann wrote: at the moment I am working on porting the Tryton business solution and later GNU Health is planned. Tryton is made up of small modules (Python Eggs), each of them providing data models and business logic for a particular business domain - e.g. product management, invoicing, crm, sales... . The modules depend on each other in some ways. What is the proposed way to get this modules into the Ports Collection? Should I submit a PR for each single module or it is reasonable to create one PR for a bunch of new ports of the same category when they belong logically together? First of all, this is prime material for the freebsd-po...@freebsd.org list, where you'll get an audience of most of the people that work on such things in FreeBSD. I'd also like to point you at #bsdports on the EFNet IRC network: if you want your work to be reviewed before you submit it, or are just looking for some quick answers to any questions you may have, that's a good place to ask. To answer the question: historically the rule of thumb has been one PR for each new port, and note in the body of the PR any dependencies on other PRs. Putting several ports into one PR is not a complete no-no, but usually you'ld need some special justification. Something like a pair od ports with a master-slave relationship perhaps. Cheers, Matthew -- Dr Matthew J Seaman MA, D.Phil. 7 Priory Courtyard Flat 3 PGP: http://www.infracaninophile.co.uk/pgpkey Ramsgate JID: matt...@infracaninophile.co.uk Kent, CT11 9PW signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature
Re: Mounting raw disk backup file.
On Mon, Aug 6, 2012 at 12:08 AM, Polytropon free...@edvax.de wrote: On Sun, 5 Aug 2012 23:12:48 -0700, Matthew Navarre wrote: I can probably fix the partition table using testdisk, but now that I've got this image file I'd rather work with that instead of the physical disk. I've read the Handbook section on using mdconfig, but that assumes the image file is of a filesystem, not a whole disk. I think I've found instructions for how to do it on linux, but if there's a way to mount it on FreeBSD I'd rather do that. It depends on _what_ your disk image (typically created by a dd-like utility to make a 1:1 copy of a whole disk) contains. If there are several slices and partitions, each of them can be accessed like it was a physical disk. Let's assume you have /home/you/ada1.dd which is the copy of your former /dev/ada1 disk. You do: # mdconfig -a -t vnode -u 0 -f /home/you/ada1.dd This results in a file /dev/md0 as well as any partitional qualifier specials that might correspond to the disk the copy has been taken from. You can check that with Yep. Unfortunately the partition table and disklable are screwed, so md1s(1,2) don't appear in dev. Same with ada1, which is the physical disk. The drive has two primary partitions, both of which had a single UFS file system on them. So now I just need to figure out how to fix the partition table and the disklabel and I should be golden getting the data out. That drive is getting replaced, though. # fdisk /dev/md0 and it should print the same partition table as for the real disk. here's the fdisk output for /dev/ada1, which is the real drive: mnavarre@pcbsd-1810] /# fdisk ada1 *** Working on device /dev/ada1 *** parameters extracted from in-core disklabel are: cylinders=310098 heads=16 sectors/track=63 (1008 blks/cyl) Figures below won't work with BIOS for partitions not in cyl 1 parameters to be used for BIOS calculations are: cylinders=310098 heads=16 sectors/track=63 (1008 blks/cyl) Media sector size is 512 Warning: BIOS sector numbering starts with sector 1 Information from DOS bootblock is: The data for partition 1 is: sysid 165 (0xa5),(FreeBSD/NetBSD/386BSD) start 63, size 167766732 (81917 Meg), flag 80 (active) beg: cyl 0/ head 1/ sector 1; end: cyl 1023/ head 254/ sector 63 The data for partition 2 is: sysid 165 (0xa5),(FreeBSD/NetBSD/386BSD) start 167766795, size 144809910 (70707 Meg), flag 80 (active) beg: cyl 1023/ head 255/ sector 63; end: cyl 1023/ head 254/ sector 63 The data for partition 3 is: UNUSED The data for partition 4 is: UNUSED Now, the first partition looks sane (size is right, geometry looks right). The second partition, however, looks a bit wrong, since it ends before it starts, but the size is right. And now I've gone and screwed up the disk image file. So, it's math and manpages from here. OK, MCN ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Partnership query
On 06/08/2012 09:15, Yoanna Savova wrote: By way of brief introduction, my name is Yoanna Savova, part of the CloudSigma team. We are interested in becoming your partners. We see there are many hardware and software vendors enlisted on your site who offer a FreeBSD product. Hence, I am interested to fin out how we can do this. Shall we have a call this week? Hi, Yoanna, Thank you very much for your interest in FreeBSD. I think it would make an excellent addition to your cloud server OS offering. However, one thing that might not be immediately obvious: the FreeBSD organization is not a commercial entity. We're a bunch of volunteers who build and maintain this operating system in our spare time. Partnering as such doesn't really fit with the way we work. Of course, you are very welcome to *use* FreeBSD and offer it as an option on your website. You can just do that without needing to ask anyone. Should you, or your technical team need any assistance with that, then feel free to ask on this or any of the more specific mailing lists or IRC channels: it's free, and you will generally get a pretty fast and accurate response, but that cannot be guaranteed contractually. If you do make FreeBSD part of your portfolio, then of course the project will be glad to add links to your company site on the Hardware and Software Vendors pages. As it says on the site, simply fill out this PR form: http://www.freebsd.org/send-pr.html with a HTML format paragraph of text describing your FreeBSD related services in the description field, set the category to 'www' and class to 'change-request', and add appropriate contact details. (Most of the other fields in that form can be left empty as they are irrelevant to your particular request.) The website should be updated with your details in due course. About the closest thing there is to a company supporting FreeBSD at the moment is the FreeBSD Foundation: it would probably be worth your while enquiring with them about how your company can benefit from supporting and being seen to support the FreeBSD project. http://www.freebsdfoundation.org/contact.shtml Cheers, Matthew -- Dr Matthew J Seaman MA, D.Phil. PGP: http://www.infracaninophile.co.uk/pgpkey signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature
Re: Mounting raw disk backup file.
I had a drive fail recently, it was working fine until I rebooted. After that the partition map was corrupt and I can't mount either partition on the disk. So I made a copy of the whole disk using dd to an old USB drive. There were several IO errors while dd was copying the disk, so I think the disk is starting to go. did you use conv=sync,noerror. if not your backup is quite corrupted if errors were uncorrectable. So, any suggestions? repair partition table, use mdconfig and then you will get /dev/md0 /dev/md0s1... as with real drive ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Wine-fbsd64 updated to 1.5.10 (32bit Wine for 64bit FreeBSD)
Hi, Packages [1] for wine-fbsd64-1.5.10 have been uploaded to mediafire [2]. The packages for FreeBSD 10 use the pkgng [3] format. There are many reports that wine does not work with a clang compiled world (help in fixing this problem is appreciated as it affects quite a few users). The patch [4] for nVidia users is now included in the package and is run on installation (if the relevant files are accessible). Please read the installation messages for further information. Regards, David [1] MD5 (wine-1.5.x-freebsd8/wine-fbsd64-1.5.10,1.tbz) = cb4bf5e3247ae60e5869241b6db80edf MD5 (wine-1.5.x-freebsd9/wine-fbsd64-1.5.10,1.txz) = bbe24a80cb14c4a0c0acf3f259298137 MD5 (wine-1.5.x-freebsd10/wine-fbsd64-1.5.10,1.txz) = 76f0832e95c107cb1d4ac1eacacb2d6a [2] http://www.mediafire.com/wine_fbsd64 [3] http://wiki.freebsd.org/pkgng [4] The patch is located at /usr/local/share/wine/patch-nvidia.sh signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Re: Mounting raw disk backup file.
On Mon, Aug 6, 2012 at 2:55 AM, Wojciech Puchar woj...@wojtek.tensor.gdynia.pl wrote: I had a drive fail recently, it was working fine until I rebooted. After that the partition map was corrupt and I can't mount either partition on the disk. So I made a copy of the whole disk using dd to an old USB drive. There were several IO errors while dd was copying the disk, so I think the disk is starting to go. did you use conv=sync,noerror. if not your backup is quite corrupted if errors were uncorrectable. Yep, did that, so I'll lose some data, but that partition is mostly media and some old MacOS (7/8/9) software, so it'd suck to lose it but wouldn't be catastrophic. The first partition on the disk is more important. The ironic thing is that the drives I was going to transfer this data onto and the external hard drive that was going to be hold the backups are on their way. Murphy strikes when you least expect it. So, any suggestions? repair partition table, use mdconfig and then you will get /dev/md0 /dev/md0s1... as with real drive Yep, it's currently the whole repair partition table bit that's giving me problems. Unfortunately, PC disk geometry is not my forte. I'm hoping I can find my log book from the system this drive was transfered from, which should have both the partition map and the alternate superblocks written down. My wife probably put it somewhere safe ;) OK, MCN ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: boinc_gui missing after portupgrade
Thanks for your help Robert it is working again, odd how it has to be started form /var/db/boinc ! also noticed that boinc_cmd has changed it name to boinccmd and as for boincmgr, I found that you need to run boinccmd from the /var/db/boinc folder as well, to do a manual update regards, David Whytcross - Original Message - From: Robert Huff roberth...@rcn.com To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2012 4:08 AM Subject: boinc_gui missing after portupgrade Robert Huff writes: I am now missing boinc_gui from /usr/local/bin any ideas as to how to get it back ? I believe the literal answer is downgrade. :-( The more useful answer is it has been replaced by 'boincmgr'. hich, unfortunately, does not seem to pick up project/task information from the previous version. Further information: It does pick up the current porject/task information if you start it in the boinc directory (e.g. /var/db/boinc). Robert Huff ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Partnership query
Hi Mathew, Thank you very much for the explanations and support! We do provide FreeBSD so I have filled in and submitted the form. I will be waiting for an e-mail from your side as stated. Thank you! Regards, Yoanna Savova CloudSigma On 6 August 2012 12:35, Matthew Seaman matt...@freebsd.org wrote: On 06/08/2012 09:15, Yoanna Savova wrote: By way of brief introduction, my name is Yoanna Savova, part of the CloudSigma team. We are interested in becoming your partners. We see there are many hardware and software vendors enlisted on your site who offer a FreeBSD product. Hence, I am interested to fin out how we can do this. Shall we have a call this week? Hi, Yoanna, Thank you very much for your interest in FreeBSD. I think it would make an excellent addition to your cloud server OS offering. However, one thing that might not be immediately obvious: the FreeBSD organization is not a commercial entity. We're a bunch of volunteers who build and maintain this operating system in our spare time. Partnering as such doesn't really fit with the way we work. Of course, you are very welcome to *use* FreeBSD and offer it as an option on your website. You can just do that without needing to ask anyone. Should you, or your technical team need any assistance with that, then feel free to ask on this or any of the more specific mailing lists or IRC channels: it's free, and you will generally get a pretty fast and accurate response, but that cannot be guaranteed contractually. If you do make FreeBSD part of your portfolio, then of course the project will be glad to add links to your company site on the Hardware and Software Vendors pages. As it says on the site, simply fill out this PR form: http://www.freebsd.org/send-pr.html with a HTML format paragraph of text describing your FreeBSD related services in the description field, set the category to 'www' and class to 'change-request', and add appropriate contact details. (Most of the other fields in that form can be left empty as they are irrelevant to your particular request.) The website should be updated with your details in due course. About the closest thing there is to a company supporting FreeBSD at the moment is the FreeBSD Foundation: it would probably be worth your while enquiring with them about how your company can benefit from supporting and being seen to support the FreeBSD project. http://www.freebsdfoundation.org/contact.shtml Cheers, Matthew -- Dr Matthew J Seaman MA, D.Phil. PGP: http://www.infracaninophile.co.uk/pgpkey ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Patent hit - MS goes after Linux - FreeBSD ?
On Sun, 5 Aug 2012 21:43:21 -0300 Mario Lobo articulated: On Sun, 5 Aug 2012 09:33:20 -0400 Jerry je...@seibercom.net wrote: On Sun, 5 Aug 2012 08:48:56 -0400 Robert Huff articulated: [Snip] The socialists still feel they are entitled to something for nothing. Jerry; Forgive me for barging in like this but to me, what your sentence describes is just plain good old greedy people. Patents provided the perfect LEGAL way for these very people to make theirs, an idea that they didn't think of or had the gift/talent to create, as a quickie for profit. The result: Now the long patent arm reaches fruit, seeds and DNA. This means that I can't create a Graviola juice drink (local Brazilian fruit) because a Japanese guy patented the fruit !! How ridiculous did we allowed this to get? Yes you can. You are stating a commonly held incorrect belief. You can always request a license from the patient holder. No one, well no one interested in monetary compensation would patient anything unless they were: ⁽¹⁾ Intended to use the patents in such a way that they would directly profit from it ⁽²⁾ Intended to lease the patent rights or outright sell the patent. Patients protect hard working people who may work years, maybe half their life to come up with a killer idea only to have a douche bag come along and use it sans payments. Interestingly enough, you seem to equate an entity, individual, group or corporation that want to profit off of their work and investment as greedy. I call them entitled. With that said, feel free to develop some great idea and then give it away for nothing. No one, certainly not me, is going to stop you. -- Jerry ♔ Disclaimer: off-list followups get on-list replies or get ignored. Please do not ignore the Reply-To header. __ ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Patent hit - MS goes after Linux - FreeBSD ?
On Mon, 6 Aug 2012 08:16:38 -0400 Jerry je...@seibercom.net wrote: On Sun, 5 Aug 2012 21:43:21 -0300 Mario Lobo articulated: On Sun, 5 Aug 2012 09:33:20 -0400 Jerry je...@seibercom.net wrote: On Sun, 5 Aug 2012 08:48:56 -0400 Robert Huff articulated: [Snip] The socialists still feel they are entitled to something for nothing. Jerry; Forgive me for barging in like this but to me, what your sentence describes is just plain good old greedy people. Patents provided the perfect LEGAL way for these very people to make theirs, an idea that they didn't think of or had the gift/talent to create, as a quickie for profit. The result: Now the long patent arm reaches fruit, seeds and DNA. This means that I can't create a Graviola juice drink (local Brazilian fruit) because a Japanese guy patented the fruit !! How ridiculous did we allowed this to get? Yes you can. You are stating a commonly held incorrect belief. You can always request a license from the patient holder. No one, well no one interested in monetary compensation would patient anything unless they were: ⁽¹⁾ Intended to use the patents in such a way that they would directly profit from it ⁽²⁾ Intended to lease the patent rights or outright sell the patent. Patients protect hard working people who may work years, maybe half their life to come up with a killer idea only to have a douche bag come along and use it sans payments. Interestingly enough, you seem to equate an entity, individual, group or corporation that want to profit off of their work and investment as greedy. I call them entitled. With that said, feel free to develop some great idea and then give it away for nothing. No one, certainly not me, is going to stop you. Discussion moved off-list. -- Mario Lobo http://www.mallavoodoo.com.br FreeBSD since 2.2.8 [not Pro-Audio YET!!] (99% winblows FREE) ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Patent hit - MS goes after Linux - FreeBSD ?
On Sun, Aug 05, 2012 at 12:25:31PM -0400, Robert Huff wrote: Jerry writes: I agree up to the point about financial incentive. For myself, I like making money. I don't apologize for that. Most engineers, software / hardware designers also enjoy receiving a monetary reward for their hard work. Simple giving away our hard work, sweat and time to some socialist just because they feel they have the right to the hard work of others is repulsive. Would you call Jeff Bezos (CEO of Amazon) a socialist? Some years ago, he was giving an interview and was asked Jeff, Amazon has applied for a patent for the One-Click system. If Amazon had known before it started there was no chance of receiving a patent - would it have created One-Click anyway? [While I'm paraphasing, the essential content is preserved.] There was a long pause, during which you could tell Bezos understood _precisely_ what the real question was ... ... and (to his credit) answered Yes. The programmers got paid. Amazon gets paid in the form of more expedient processing and (presumably) more sales due to ease of check-out. Why, as a society, should we deny other innovators the ability to use that technology to develop - hopefully - even better stuff? Patents don't encourage innovation. They primarily do three things: 1. They direct innovative effort away from non-patentable things and toward patentable things, even when the patentable things are less actually innovative or useful. 2. They favor large corporations with the resources to pursue patent litigation and build gigantic patent portfolios, thus creating hurdles for smaller business endeavors to become successful. 3. They encourage more time and resources to be spent on patent filing than on actual research and development. 4. They support a specialized lawyer class, which naturally evolves into an entire industry of patent trolling. 5. They make small organizations and individuals afraid to innovate because they fear they might run afoul of patents, and make large organizations waste a bunch of time and money buying other companies just for their patent portfolios so they have more ammunition with which to defend themselves against other patent-holders in a kind of mutually assured destruction arms race deterrence scheme. I guess three wasn't enough to list the major negatives of the patent system. I could come up with more, given a little time. Ultimately, the patent system is in many ways the opposite of a free market. In fact, the socialistic labor theory of value is a much more effective basis for justifying a patent system than any concepts of economic schools of thought more oriented toward free market capitalism, because patents are designed to protect a labor resources investment in the patentable invention, rather than any kind of actual proprietary investment. -- Chad Perrin [ original content licensed OWL: http://owl.apotheon.org ] ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Patent hit - MS goes after Linux - FreeBSD ?
On Mon, 6 Aug 2012 08:16:38 -0400 Jerry je...@seibercom.net wrote: Yes you can. You are stating a commonly held incorrect belief. You can always request a license from the patient holder. No one, well no one interested in monetary compensation would patient anything unless they were: ⁽¹⁾ Intended to use the patents in such a way that they would directly profit from it ⁽²⁾ Intended to lease the patent rights or outright sell the patent. [3] Want to prevent anyone else from using it to break into their market. -- Steve O'Hara-Smith | Directable Mirror Arrays C:WIN | A better way to focus the sun The computer obeys and wins.|licences available see You lose and Bill collects. |http://www.sohara.org/ ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Patent hit - MS goes after Linux - FreeBSD ?
On Sat, Aug 04, 2012 at 07:57:34AM +0200, Wojciech Puchar wrote: Do lawyers not use the law to their clients' advatage -- often abusing it -- just because they're wrong in the final analysis? seems you never worked long with lawyers, or you are lucky and have really fair one. If the word fair can be used for lawyers at all. Most often they just want court cases to have work. I'm not sure you understood what I said, because what *you* said here seems irrelevant to what I said. -- Chad Perrin [ original content licensed OWL: http://owl.apotheon.org ] ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Patent hit - MS goes after Linux - FreeBSD ?
On Mon, 6 Aug 2012 18:37:17 +0100 Steve O'Hara-Smith articulated: On Mon, 6 Aug 2012 08:16:38 -0400 Jerry je...@seibercom.net wrote: Yes you can. You are stating a commonly held incorrect belief. You can always request a license from the patient holder. No one, well no one interested in monetary compensation would patient anything unless they were: ⁽¹⁾ Intended to use the patents in such a way that they would directly profit from it ⁽²⁾ Intended to lease the patent rights or outright sell the patent. [3] Want to prevent anyone else from using it to break into their market. That would be inclusive in my 1st. reason I listed. -- Jerry ♔ Disclaimer: off-list followups get on-list replies or get ignored. Please do not ignore the Reply-To header. __ ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Patent hit - MS goes after Linux - FreeBSD ?
On Mon, Aug 6, 2012 at 5:37 PM, Steve O'Hara-Smith st...@sohara.org wrote: On Mon, 6 Aug 2012 08:16:38 -0400 Jerry je...@seibercom.net wrote: Yes you can. You are stating a commonly held incorrect belief. You can always request a license from the patient holder. No one, well no one interested in monetary compensation would patient anything unless they were: ⁽¹⁾ Intended to use the patents in such a way that they would directly profit from it ⁽²⁾ Intended to lease the patent rights or outright sell the patent. [3] Want to prevent anyone else from using it to break into their market. Yes, but this comes with a trade-off. Patents are for a LIMITED time. And in exchange for getting that temporary monopoly, you have to publish the details of your invention. The idea was not just to provide a monetary incentive for innovation, but to ensure that those innovations became public knowledge. In the absence of patents, companies tend to resort to trade secrets -- keeping the details of their innovations hidden. This can result in lost technologies when a particular company goes under and takes its trade secrets with it. Now, it's reasonable to argue that in some fields the duration of that limited monopoly is too long, given how quickly technology advances, but that doesn't mean the concept isn't sound. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Patent hit - MS goes after Linux - FreeBSD ?
On Mon, 6 Aug 2012 19:08:19 +, David Brodbeck wrote: Now, it's reasonable to argue that in some fields the duration of that limited monopoly is too long, given how quickly technology advances, but that doesn't mean the concept isn't sound. It's also debatable if one of today's most prominent use of patents is fair: I tell you! I have patents! You are infringing! I'm not gonna tell you which patents about what, but I'll sue all your users! Of course, if such a claim enters a court, it might be verified or discarded (because it's just a claim, nothing applicable). In order not to risk a lawsuit, it seems that spreading FUD is often the more profitable way of using patents: I told you! I have patents! But if you pay me $$$, maybe I won't sue you and your users. Maybe... but now PAY!!! -- Polytropon Magdeburg, Germany Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0 Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ... ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Patent hit - MS goes after Linux - FreeBSD ?
On Sun, Aug 05, 2012 at 09:33:20AM -0400, Jerry wrote: On Sun, 5 Aug 2012 08:48:56 -0400 Robert Huff articulated: Patents are - or should be - the means, not the end. The end is encourage people to create new stuff; the means of encouragement is to give them exclusive rights for a limited time. As long as the idea gets out there, we should be indifferent as to whether they make money. I agree up to the point about financial incentive. For myself, I like making money. I don't apologize for that. Most engineers, software / hardware designers also enjoy receiving a monetary reward for their hard work. Simple giving away our hard work, sweat and time to some socialist just because they feel they have the right to the hard work of others is repulsive. I'm okay with that statement. If a monetary reward were removed from the equation, we would probably still be using an abacus in the dark. Cockamamie nonsense -- or, if you prefer, [citation needed]. While we certainly should be indifferent to the financial incentive and monetary reward someone receives; in all too many cases that is just not so. The socialists still feel they are entitled to something for nothing. . . . which need not have *anything* at all to do with a discussion of whether a system of patents is a good or bad idea. -- Chad Perrin [ original content licensed OWL: http://owl.apotheon.org ] ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Patent hit - MS goes after Linux - FreeBSD ?
On Mon, 6 Aug 2012 21:48:30 +0200 Polytropon articulated: On Mon, 6 Aug 2012 19:08:19 +, David Brodbeck wrote: Now, it's reasonable to argue that in some fields the duration of that limited monopoly is too long, given how quickly technology advances, but that doesn't mean the concept isn't sound. It's also debatable if one of today's most prominent use of patents is fair: I tell you! I have patents! You are infringing! I'm not gonna tell you which patents about what, but I'll sue all your users! Of course, if such a claim enters a court, it might be verified or discarded (because it's just a claim, nothing applicable). In order not to risk a lawsuit, it seems that spreading FUD is often the more profitable way of using patents: I told you! I have patents! But if you pay me $$$, maybe I won't sue you and your users. Maybe... but now PAY!!! How many verifiable (the key word here is verifiable) cases can you name where party A paid party B over an undisclosed patient solely on the bases that party B might institute legal action? -- Jerry ♔ Disclaimer: off-list followups get on-list replies or get ignored. Please do not ignore the Reply-To header. __ ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Problem with cvsup since 9.0-STABLE FreeBSD 9.0-STABLE #225 r229960M
TreeList failed: Error in /usr/local/etc/cvsup/sup/cvsroot-all/checkouts.cvs:RELENG_9: Bad header line. Delete it and try again. I deleted that above mentioned file before running cvsup. I've been using the configuration file for many years with no changes and don't normally check because it has never failed me. Any suggestions appreciated. ed My cvs-supfile contains: *default tag=RELENG_9 *default host=cvsup15.freebsd.org *default base=/usr/local/etc/cvsup *default prefix=/usr *default release=cvs *default delete use-rel-suffix src-all cvsroot-all ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Patent hit - MS goes after Linux - FreeBSD ?
On Mon, Aug 6, 2012 at 7:48 PM, Polytropon free...@edvax.de wrote: It's also debatable if one of today's most prominent use of patents is fair: I tell you! I have patents! You are infringing! I'm not gonna tell you which patents about what, but I'll sue all your users! Of course, if such a claim enters a court, it might be verified or discarded (because it's just a claim, nothing applicable). In order not to risk a lawsuit, it seems that spreading FUD is often the more profitable way of using patents: I told you! I have patents! But if you pay me $$$, maybe I won't sue you and your users. Maybe... but now PAY!!! The companies that do that are generally very large ones like Microsoft. Frankly I'm not sure if you can do much about that kind of behavior; a company of that size and wealth can always find plenty of ways to harass its enemies. Perhaps, to paraphrase Grover Norquist, we need to shrink corporations down until they're small enough that we can drown them in the bathtub. ;) ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Why can't I set my cpu type in kernel config ?
I am installing 8.3-RELEASE on an old 900mhz pentium laptop ... it's an i686 CPU. By default, GENERIC has HAMMER as the cpu, and that isn't working. So I tried both: cpu I586_CPU and: cpu I686_CPU (I also tried them both lowercase, like i686_cpu) But all of these fail: GENERIC: unknown option I586_CPU How can I set 586/686 (you're supposed to set both) in my kernel conf ? Thanks. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Why can't I set my cpu type in kernel config ?
make LINT vi LINT On Mon, Aug 6, 2012 at 4:53 PM, Jason Usher jushe...@yahoo.com wrote: I am installing 8.3-RELEASE on an old 900mhz pentium laptop ... it's an i686 CPU. By default, GENERIC has HAMMER as the cpu, and that isn't working. So I tried both: cpu I586_CPU and: cpu I686_CPU (I also tried them both lowercase, like i686_cpu) But all of these fail: GENERIC: unknown option I586_CPU How can I set 586/686 (you're supposed to set both) in my kernel conf ? You're sure it's an i686? Do you have the amd64 distribution, or i386? If the former, then in /usr/src/sys/amd64/conf... # make LINT # vi LINT cpu HAMMER and that's all she wrote. There are some 32-bit compatibility options: options COMPAT_FREEBSD32 options COMPAT_LINUX32 ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Why can't I set my cpu type in kernel config ?
On Mon, 6 Aug 2012 16:53:04 -0700 (PDT) Jason Usher wrote: I am installing 8.3-RELEASE on an old 900mhz pentium laptop ... it's an i686 CPU. By default, GENERIC has HAMMER as the cpu, and that isn't working. So I tried both: That's the amd64 (64-bit) GENERIC ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Why can't I set my cpu type in kernel config ?
On Tue, 7 Aug 2012, RW wrote: On Mon, 6 Aug 2012 16:53:04 -0700 (PDT) Jason Usher wrote: I am installing 8.3-RELEASE on an old 900mhz pentium laptop ... it's an i686 CPU. By default, GENERIC has HAMMER as the cpu, and that isn't working. So I tried both: That's the amd64 (64-bit) GENERIC Jason: It looks like you may have installed the 64-bit distribution on your 32-bit machine. Try fetching the distribution again (and re-burning the CD, or whatever your media was). This time get the i386 version. That's what you want for a Pentium. HTH. -- Chris Hill ch...@monochrome.org ** [ Busy Expunging / ] ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
