RE: FreeBSD telnetd and Microsoft Internet Explorer
>-Original Message- >From: Peter Clutton [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] >Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2005 3:16 AM >To: Ted Mittelstaedt >Cc: Stevan Tiefert; freebsd-questions@freebsd.org >Subject: Re: FreeBSD telnetd and Microsoft Internet Explorer > > >On 12/3/05, Ted Mittelstaedt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> >> Whoah whoah whoah >> >> Guys, I have several 5.4 servers. >> >> Hitting them with IE 6.0.2800.1106 ftp client I >> get NO PROBLEMS seeing dot files. I DO NOT see >> the behavior that the OP claims. NOR do I see the >> behavior that you guys are claiming either of IE's >> FTP client being bad. Nor do I see this behavior >> on a 6.0 FreeBSD server. >> >> I respectfully submit that both you and the OP are >> off your rockers. You guys, probably because you don't >> know how to setup Windows properly. (which is understandable) >> The OP probably because he doesen't know how to setup FreeBSD >> properly, plus has borked some settting in his IE. Note >> he hasn't posted the IE version. Note he hasn't setup a >> test login on his FTP server and invited anyone to try it >> and see if they are getting the same problem. Can you >> say "Troll bait"? I knew you could. >> >> AND YES, I did try a few FTP sites on that URL. No problem >> with any of them. >> >> AND NO I do not recommend IE as a FTP client either. And I >> respectfully submit that a recommendation against IE from >> someone who must apparently know how to set it up properly >> should IMHO carry more weight than one from someone who >> apparently doesen't know how to set it up properly. >> >> If you think IE's FTP client is so bad then post a few sites >> and I'll go to them and put up some screen captures of my IE. >> Go ahead, prove I'm wrong. I'd like to see it crash. >> I dare you. > >The reason it works for you is because you manually set the ftp type >setting of IE. I do happen to know how to set up IE and alot of other >network related setting in WIndows. > Actually Peter, I don't even know where the manual setting of IE is for ftp. I'm surprised that there is one, and am glad to hear it, could you tell me where it is, exactly? >When these are not set (as they do not absolutely-have-to-be with >other clients) it crashes. The fact that just because you haven't >bothered about that setting, or PASV etc, doesn't mean the client >should crash. Under the default setup on IE, nearly every one of those >sites crashes IE. Now of course it makes sense that if these settings >haven't been set, that you might get an error message and have to set >things right, but not to crash the application every single time >without a clue as to what went wrong. > That's not my experience with IE 6 Please post these default settings that crash stuff, I'll check my browser and see if they are set that way. >Now of course I could take screen shots and get these sites to work >aswell, believe me it's not some advanced windows knowledge that >you're claiming ownership to here, but if you leave the settings on >defualt, it crashes the browser. That isn't my experience. I will say my Windows installs are straight off the MS Select CD's perhaps the defaults on OEM setups are set stupidly? > Plain old run of the mill, office and >home environment set up, it crashes the application. Even microfts own >ftp site. No, sorry, not happened with IE 6. >Oppose this to Firefox's ftp implementatoin which works "out >of the box", and gives you an error if you need to change something. I never disputed Firefox. It's a good brower I use it under FreeBSD. >Of course everything crashes, let's not be silly, but to crash >categorically every time unless you've set it the way it should be, is >an immature piece of software. > I agree with this, but I'm not seeing this behavior with IE. >On top of these are problems with standards implementations, in the >same way that the IE html engine doesn't render in accordance with the >standards (I can tell you this after having worked full time in web >design and php/mysql, and the joy you get when you see the way things >should look, according to standard html and xhtml and css texts, in >other browsers, but never in IE.) No question that IE isn't compliant. But every web designer knows that it's the majority browser so railing about it, while cartharic, doesen't change the fact that your going to have to write to it's rendering stupidity for your customers. Perhaps if more web designers submitted bug reports to Microsoft they might actually fix some things? >But in the end it's just the fact >that it's crashed in it's default setting in every Windows release >I've used. > Not my experience. Ted ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
Re: FreeBSD telnetd and Microsoft Internet Explorer
On 12/3/05, Ted Mittelstaedt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Whoah whoah whoah > > Guys, I have several 5.4 servers. > > Hitting them with IE 6.0.2800.1106 ftp client I > get NO PROBLEMS seeing dot files. I DO NOT see > the behavior that the OP claims. NOR do I see the > behavior that you guys are claiming either of IE's > FTP client being bad. Nor do I see this behavior > on a 6.0 FreeBSD server. > > I respectfully submit that both you and the OP are > off your rockers. You guys, probably because you don't > know how to setup Windows properly. (which is understandable) > The OP probably because he doesen't know how to setup FreeBSD > properly, plus has borked some settting in his IE. Note > he hasn't posted the IE version. Note he hasn't setup a > test login on his FTP server and invited anyone to try it > and see if they are getting the same problem. Can you > say "Troll bait"? I knew you could. > > AND YES, I did try a few FTP sites on that URL. No problem > with any of them. > > AND NO I do not recommend IE as a FTP client either. And I > respectfully submit that a recommendation against IE from > someone who must apparently know how to set it up properly > should IMHO carry more weight than one from someone who > apparently doesen't know how to set it up properly. > > If you think IE's FTP client is so bad then post a few sites > and I'll go to them and put up some screen captures of my IE. > Go ahead, prove I'm wrong. I'd like to see it crash. > I dare you. The reason it works for you is because you manually set the ftp type setting of IE. I do happen to know how to set up IE and alot of other network related setting in WIndows. When these are not set (as they do not absolutely-have-to-be with other clients) it crashes. The fact that just because you haven't bothered about that setting, or PASV etc, doesn't mean the client should crash. Under the default setup on IE, nearly every one of those sites crashes IE. Now of course it makes sense that if these settings haven't been set, that you might get an error message and have to set things right, but not to crash the application every single time without a clue as to what went wrong. Now of course I could take screen shots and get these sites to work aswell, believe me it's not some advanced windows knowledge that you're claiming ownership to here, but if you leave the settings on defualt, it crashes the browser. Plain old run of the mill, office and home environment set up, it crashes the application. Even microfts own ftp site. Oppose this to Firefox's ftp implementatoin which works "out of the box", and gives you an error if you need to change something. Of course everything crashes, let's not be silly, but to crash categorically every time unless you've set it the way it should be, is an immature piece of software. On top of these are problems with standards implementations, in the same way that the IE html engine doesn't render in accordance with the standards (I can tell you this after having worked full time in web design and php/mysql, and the joy you get when you see the way things should look, according to standard html and xhtml and css texts, in other browsers, but never in IE.) But in the end it's just the fact that it's crashed in it's default setting in every Windows release I've used. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
RE: FreeBSD telnetd and Microsoft Internet Explorer
Whoah whoah whoah Guys, I have several 5.4 servers. Hitting them with IE 6.0.2800.1106 ftp client I get NO PROBLEMS seeing dot files. I DO NOT see the behavior that the OP claims. NOR do I see the behavior that you guys are claiming either of IE's FTP client being bad. Nor do I see this behavior on a 6.0 FreeBSD server. I respectfully submit that both you and the OP are off your rockers. You guys, probably because you don't know how to setup Windows properly. (which is understandable) The OP probably because he doesen't know how to setup FreeBSD properly, plus has borked some settting in his IE. Note he hasn't posted the IE version. Note he hasn't setup a test login on his FTP server and invited anyone to try it and see if they are getting the same problem. Can you say "Troll bait"? I knew you could. AND YES, I did try a few FTP sites on that URL. No problem with any of them. AND NO I do not recommend IE as a FTP client either. And I respectfully submit that a recommendation against IE from someone who must apparently know how to set it up properly should IMHO carry more weight than one from someone who apparently doesen't know how to set it up properly. If you think IE's FTP client is so bad then post a few sites and I'll go to them and put up some screen captures of my IE. Go ahead, prove I'm wrong. I'd like to see it crash. I dare you. And Stevan, STFU until your willing to post a test login on this allegedly bad FreeBSD system of yours. Ted >-Original Message- >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Peter Clutton >Sent: Thursday, December 01, 2005 4:26 AM >To: Stevan Tiefert >Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org >Subject: Re: FreeBSD telnetd and Microsoft Internet Explorer > > >On 12/1/05, Stevan Tiefert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> Am Donnerstag, 1. Dezember 2005 06:37 schrieb Peter Clutton: >> Thanks for your off-topic message... You helped very well to solve a >> problem. :-( > >Well actually I did help solve the problem, because the problem is >most likely your client. It is impossible for anyone to look at what >else could be causing problems, when your particular client in known >to have very major problems. It's not that it's windows, we help here >alot to connect the two, but the ftp client in particular, just plain >out doesn't work. > > >>There are many ftp-sites >> where IE can access them without problems. > >I beg to differ, and so would anybody else who uses ftp on a regular >basis. Do what i did today on my Win2k machine with IE and firefox and >go to the site http://www.ftp-sites.org/ >Find a locale near you, and go down the first 20 (or 100 if you have >time) on the list and tell me how many work with IE and how many with >Firefox. I got a 20 - 0 in favor of Firefox. In all cases i had to >ctr-alt-del the IE because it failed. I mean it just isn't normal or >acceptable for software to completely crash that often. > >Here's another one i had to ctl-alt-del for IE: ftp://ftp.windows.com > . Works great out of Firefox! Pretty funny really. > >The point is you are asking us in our free time to chase a wild goose, >because you're using a known broken ftp implementation. Someone might >be more inclined if you suggested just about any other ftp client. >___ >freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list >http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions >To unsubscribe, send any mail to >"[EMAIL PROTECTED]" > >-- >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG Free Edition. >Version: 7.1.362 / Virus Database: 267.13.10/190 - Release >Date: 12/1/2005 > ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
Re: FreeBSD telnetd and Microsoft Internet Explorer
On 12/1/05, Stevan Tiefert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Am Donnerstag, 1. Dezember 2005 06:37 schrieb Peter Clutton: > Thanks for your off-topic message... You helped very well to solve a > problem. :-( Well actually I did help solve the problem, because the problem is most likely your client. It is impossible for anyone to look at what else could be causing problems, when your particular client in known to have very major problems. It's not that it's windows, we help here alot to connect the two, but the ftp client in particular, just plain out doesn't work. >There are many ftp-sites > where IE can access them without problems. I beg to differ, and so would anybody else who uses ftp on a regular basis. Do what i did today on my Win2k machine with IE and firefox and go to the site http://www.ftp-sites.org/ Find a locale near you, and go down the first 20 (or 100 if you have time) on the list and tell me how many work with IE and how many with Firefox. I got a 20 - 0 in favor of Firefox. In all cases i had to ctr-alt-del the IE because it failed. I mean it just isn't normal or acceptable for software to completely crash that often. Here's another one i had to ctl-alt-del for IE: ftp://ftp.windows.com . Works great out of Firefox! Pretty funny really. The point is you are asking us in our free time to chase a wild goose, because you're using a known broken ftp implementation. Someone might be more inclined if you suggested just about any other ftp client. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
Re: FreeBSD telnetd and Microsoft Internet Explorer
On 2005-12-01 09:51, Stevan Tiefert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Am Donnerstag, 1. Dezember 2005 06:37 schrieb Peter Clutton: > 8< > ... funny things... > 8< > > Thanks for your off-topic message... You helped very well to solve a > problem. :-( > Now everybody knows where the problem is, or not? There are many > ftp-sites where IE can access them without problems. But not ftpd from > FreeBSD 5.4 in this special case... In a way, you could say that it's the FTP server's fault, but only if you have very good reasons to support that IE's ftp client mode is perfectly fine (which it isn't, but this is my personal opinion, of course). > Question again, why? Because the parsing of FTP server's output for "dir" commands, that show the listing of files in a directory, is implemented entirely on the client side, and in this case it's horribly broken. > Is that a special problem oft ftpd? No. I've wasted many hours trying to access FTP sites that don't run FreeBSD too, when I was forced to use IE as my "interface". > I think it seems to be an IE-problem, but what is happening > between IE and ftpd causing this problem? 1. IE's ftp-client asks for a directory listing. 2. The ftp server provides one. 3. IE's ftp-client side tries to parse the listing. 4. It fails. As you said... it's an IE problem :) ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
Re: FreeBSD telnetd and Microsoft Internet Explorer
Am Donnerstag, 1. Dezember 2005 06:37 schrieb Peter Clutton: 8< ... funny things... 8< Thanks for your off-topic message... You helped very well to solve a problem. :-( Now everybody knows where the problem is, or not? There are many ftp-sites where IE can access them without problems. But not ftpd from FreeBSD 5.4 in this special case... Question again, why? Is that a special problem oft ftpd? I think it seems to be an IE-problem, but what is happening between IE and ftpd causing this problem? ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
Re: FreeBSD telnetd and Microsoft Internet Explorer
On 12/1/05, Giorgos Keramidas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On 2005-11-30 14:05, Stevan Tiefert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Internet Explorer is showing the filenames and time (of the ftpd) > > together as one filename?!? That means on ftpd: > > > > $ ls -al .login > > -rw-r--r-- 1 user user 248 29 Nov 14:39 .login > > > > and in IE I see the icon with filename "14:39 .login"!!! > > Too bad for IE's broken FTP client :P > > > Is there a workaround for that? > > Yes. Use a *REAL* ftp client and not that braindead Redmond crap :) That is completely true. Why anybody would use IE for ftp is baffling. Through every release of Windows, IE has been incapable of visiting 99% of FTP sites. In older versions of Windows it would crash the whole comp, and in recent releases you might get away with it crashing the browser. Very occasional is you have 15 minutes to spare, you might get to see the contents of the directory. For years i thought there must be something wrong with FTP in general, until one day, after failing to get to ftp.freebsd.org my life was changed by trying firefox. It opened in less than a second. Feel free to try it in IE right now, i just did, and after a good five minutes, it gave me an error. I was just relieved it didn't crash anything. I could drop a list of a random 50 popular ftp sites and you would get the same dichotomy of results, and you would be lucky if one in that 50 worked. Keep in mind this is on a Celeron 2.4Ghz 256MB ram, and like 10 megs worth of internet pipes coming into the place i work. I mean i don't make a habit of frothing at the mouth about Windows, but this is supposedly an FTP client, and it has _NEVER_ worked! Is everyone blind to this? How can anyone, even m$, call that a product? Having said that i do hope there is a solution for you if you need to use IE. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
Re: FreeBSD telnetd and Microsoft Internet Explorer
On 2005-11-30 14:05, Stevan Tiefert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hello list, > > on my machine there runs a telnetd started via inetd. It is not an > anonymous ftpd. When I access the directories of an user with Internet > Explorer I got strange outputs on my screen. The described szene is not > happening if I use the telnet on cmd.exe. > > Internet Explorer is showing the filenames and time (of the ftpd) > together as one filename?!? That means on ftpd: > > $ ls -al .login > -rw-r--r-- 1 user user 248 29 Nov 14:39 .login > > and in IE I see the icon with filename "14:39 .login"!!! Too bad for IE's broken FTP client :P > Is there a workaround for that? Yes. Use a *REAL* ftp client and not that braindead Redmond crap :) ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
FreeBSD telnetd and Microsoft Internet Explorer
Hello list, on my machine there runs a telnetd started via inetd. It is not an anonymous ftpd. When I access the directories of an user with Internet Explorer I got strange outputs on my screen. The described szene is not happening if I use the telnet on cmd.exe. Internet Explorer is showing the filenames and time (of the ftpd) together as one filename?!? That means on ftpd: $ ls -al .login -rw-r--r-- 1 user user 248 29 Nov 14:39 .login and in IE I see the icon with filename "14:39 .login"!!! Is there a workaround for that? Why is ftpd making such funny things? I can not read "14:39 .login" because IE says only file not found... With regards Stevan -- Why my wife is happy when I do a "make buildkernel" and a "make installkernel"? I have then a lot of time to do my housework :-( ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
