Re: [Freedos-user] Request for developers... (fwd)

[Matej Horvat]

What is most needed is to compile DOS Arachne as 32bit


Potential starting point:
https://web.archive.org/web/20150215203536/http://www.drdosprojects.de/index.cgi/other.htm


and to give it HTTPS capability via WATT32 & OpenSSL


Or LibreSSL:
https://github.com/markjolesen/openbsd


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Re: [Freedos-user] Video complains that DOS should not be maintained

[Deposite Pirate]

On Wed, 29 Dec 2021 00:33:01 +0100
Liam Proven  wrote:

> On Tue, 28 Dec 2021 at 23:23, Deposite Pirate 
> Fascinating! Thank you very much. I learned something this evening.
> :-)
> 

No problem. If you poke around this website you'll also learn that
earlier IBM were also behind a few utilities shipped with DOS such as
TREE, ASSIGN, FDISK and fixed disk support in FORMAT, SYS, CHKDSK and
some other DOS utilities, internationalized keyboard support.

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Re: [Freedos-user] FreeDOS 1.3 RC5 error when installing

[Pyros]

So try 1.2 and see if that works and if so cool

On Tue, Dec 28, 2021, 1:46 AM Jerome Shidel,  wrote:

>
>
> On Dec 27, 2021, at 9:19 PM, Pyros  wrote:
>
> http://www.bttr-software.de/forum/img/uploaded/image24.jpg
>
> while installing freedos 1.3 rc5 i get the error that you see in the
> image. Now this is not your modern pc it's from the win 98/me days as it
> does have isa slots and has an SB16 with attached wave blaster. It is a
> pentium machine if that helps.
>
>
> 
>  Virus-free.
> www.avg.com
> 
> ___
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> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-user
>
>
> I have seen a similar issue when installing to netbook using the USB
> stick. There was no problem installing FreeDOS 1.2 on that machine using
> USB. Very little (if anything) has changed in those areas of the installer
> since 1.2. However, many things the installer relies upon have been
> updated. For example, Kernel, FreeCOM, Drivers, FDISK, etc. have all been
> updated. With these issues only seem to be occurring on real hardware, it
> will take a little time to narrow down the cause either resolve the issue
> and/or notify the appropriate developers.
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Re: [Freedos-user] Jemmex and Semware editor

[Jim Hall]

On Fri, Dec 24, 2021 at 9:30 PM  wrote:
> I have the Semware Editor, big brother to Qedit.
>
> I can use it fine under MS-DOS with EMM386.EXE, but, when I try to use it 
> under FreeDOS with the default config, I get something like this:
>
> JemmEx: exception 06 occured at CS:EIP=:0707, ERRC=
> SS:ESP=2C74:00D9 EBP=000B EFL=00023082 CR0=8011 CR2=
> EAX=0EFF EBX=2AB3 ECX=0002 EDX=00D9 ESI=001B EDI=8FCD
> DS=00D9 ES=02C1 FS=02C1 GS=C5C2 [CS:IP]=C5 E8 EA 04 F4 00 70 00
> Press ESC to abort program
>
> I can use option 4 on boot-up and it’ll work.
>
> If anyone wants to play with the testdrive, which also exhibits this 
> behavior, you can download it at:
>
> https://semware.com/files/testdrive/tsedos25.zip
>
> I don’t mind rebooting to use it, but, it would be nice if it worked with the 
> out-of-the-box config.


I think we need a little more information here. I downloaded this zip
file and ran it in my test VM (QEMU running FreeDOS 1.3 RC5) and it
works fine for me, using any FreeDOS boot configuration (boot menu
item) with or without JEMMEX.

Are you trying to run this on "bare metal" hardware? Or in a virtual
machine? Which version of FreeDOS are you using? (We recently released
FreeDOS 1.3 RC5.)


Jim


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Re: [Freedos-user] Message delivered

[Jim Hall]

On Mon, Dec 27, 2021 at 7:29 PM Jose Senna  wrote:
>
>  My message appeared on the list afer all.
>  I shall thank Jim Hall and the others at
> Sourceforge who solved this problem.
>


I'd love to take credit for this, but I didn't do anything here.

Most likely, the SourceForge email list server has spam checking that
"misfired" and incorrectly blocked your previous email(s).

Or maybe you tried to send an attachment? The email list server will
reject emails that are too big (in kb size) so this means an email
with an attachment will probably get rejected unless the attachment is
*very* small. :-)

Jim


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Re: [Freedos-user] Video complains that DOS should not be mantained

[Jim Hall]

On Mon, Dec 27, 2021 at 6:28 PM Jose Senna  wrote:
>
> Liam Proven said:
> > There were DOS email and chat and FTP
> > clients; that stuff's fairly easy.
>
> Were is the right word. Most email
> servers nowadays require TLS, which
> is not available in DOS email clients.
> There are few remaining FTP servers,
> and I cannot tell how many also need
> TLS.


That's why I made sure you can access the FreeDOS website from
http://www.freedos.org/ and https://www.freedos.org

If you're using a DOS web browser, I don't think any DOS web browser
can manage today's SSL, so you need http instead of https.

But the links from freedos.org to other websites mostly use https, I
think. Because not everyone wants to set up both http and https for a
website.


Jim


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Re: [Freedos-user] Request for developers... (fwd)

[Jim Hall]

Thanks. I've also added this to the news item on the FreeDOS website.


Jim


On Tue, Dec 28, 2021 at 4:40 PM Karen Lewellen  wrote:
>
> Sharing the below, in case anyone here has an interest.
>
>
>
> -- Forwarded message --
> Date: Tue, 28 Dec 2021 12:01:57 -0500
> From: Glenn McCorkle 
> Reply-To: LifeRaft 
> To: LifeRaft 
> Cc: arac...@freelists.org, internetin...@frelists.org,
> Subject: +[SurvPC] Request for developers...
>
> To: any and all C/C++ programmers out there...
>
> This is a request to take-up further development of DOS Arachne.
>
> What is most needed is to compile DOS Arachne as 32bit
> and to give it HTTPS capability via WATT32 & OpenSSL
>
> The source code may be downloaded from http://glennmcc.org/
>
> --
> Glenn McCorkle


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Re: [Freedos-user] Video complains that DOS should not be maintained

[Liam Proven]

On Tue, 28 Dec 2021 at 23:23, Deposite Pirate  wrote:
> >
> > If you know differently, please share some evidence, because I'd
> > really like to know.
> >
>
> https://www.os2museum.com/wp/dos/dos-3-3/
>
> "A much less obvious but no less significant change was that unlike all
> previous versions, DOS 3.3 development was done solely at IBM.
> Microsoft was busy working on OS/2 (not yet under that name) and the
> OS/2 development team included many core DOS developers, such as Mark
> Zbikowski."

Fascinating! Thank you very much. I learned something this evening. :-)

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[Freedos-user] Request for developers... (fwd)

[Karen Lewellen]

Sharing the below, in case anyone here has an interest.



-- Forwarded message --
Date: Tue, 28 Dec 2021 12:01:57 -0500
From: Glenn McCorkle 
Reply-To: LifeRaft 
To: LifeRaft 
Cc: arac...@freelists.org, internetin...@frelists.org, 
Subject: +[SurvPC] Request for developers...


To: any and all C/C++ programmers out there...

This is a request to take-up further development of DOS Arachne.

What is most needed is to compile DOS Arachne as 32bit
and to give it HTTPS capability via WATT32 & OpenSSL

The source code may be downloaded from http://glennmcc.org/

--
Glenn McCorkle



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Re: [Freedos-user] Video complains that DOS should not be maintained

[Deposite Pirate]

On Tue, 28 Dec 2021 19:56:26 +0100
Liam Proven  wrote:

> On Tue, 28 Dec 2021 at 19:45, Deposite Pirate
>  wrote:
> >
> > It's not up to Microsoft to release MS/PC-DOS > 2.x. IBM did the
> > bulk of the work on "MS" DOS for a while after 2.x and they would
> > have to have IBM's permission to even think about releasing it.
> 
> With the exception of the versions released _after_ MS stopped
> developing, offering or selling DOS as a standalone product (i.e. PC
> DOS 6.3, 7.0, 2000 and 7.1) then the *only* version of MS-DOS mainly
> developed by IBM was MS-DOS 4.0x.
> 
> If you know differently, please share some evidence, because I'd
> really like to know.
> 

https://www.os2museum.com/wp/dos/dos-3-3/

"A much less obvious but no less significant change was that unlike all
previous versions, DOS 3.3 development was done solely at IBM.
Microsoft was busy working on OS/2 (not yet under that name) and the
OS/2 development team included many core DOS developers, such as Mark
Zbikowski."

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Re: [Freedos-user] Video complains that DOS should not be maintained

[Liam Proven]

On Tue, 28 Dec 2021 at 19:45, Deposite Pirate  wrote:
>
> It's not up to Microsoft to release MS/PC-DOS > 2.x. IBM did the bulk of
> the work on "MS" DOS for a while after 2.x and they would have to
> have IBM's permission to even think about releasing it.

With the exception of the versions released _after_ MS stopped
developing, offering or selling DOS as a standalone product (i.e. PC
DOS 6.3, 7.0, 2000 and 7.1) then the *only* version of MS-DOS mainly
developed by IBM was MS-DOS 4.0x.

If you know differently, please share some evidence, because I'd
really like to know.

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Re: [Freedos-user] Video complains that DOS should not be mantained

[Liam Proven]

On Tue, 28 Dec 2021 at 01:27, Jose Senna  wrote:
>
> Were is the right word. Most email
> servers nowadays require TLS, which
> is not available in DOS email clients.

Ahh, that is a fair point. I hadn't thought about that.

> There are few remaining FTP servers,
> and I cannot tell how many also need
> TLS.

Not so sure about that. I know many FTP servers have gone, but those
that remain aren't encrypted or secured that I've seen. SFTP != FTP.

> I never used chat.

It has its uses. TBH what annoys me are companies that use chat in
place of email, because they don't know how to use email right.

Hint: https://useplaintext.email/

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Re: [Freedos-user] Video complains that DOS should not be maintained

[Deposite Pirate]

On Sun, 26 Dec 2021 22:27:26 +0100
Aitor Santamaría  wrote:
> I would dare say that even Bill Gates himself must have those sources
> somewhere in one harddrive of his own (for historical purposes). :)
> 
> Aitor

It's not up to Microsoft to release MS/PC-DOS > 2.x. IBM did the bulk of
the work on "MS" DOS for a while after 2.x and they would have to
have IBM's permission to even think about releasing it.

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Re: [Freedos-user] Video complains that DOS should not be maintained

[tom ehlert]

> If Microsoft did not do it, imagine how nice it would be that there
> were in FreeDOS an open source version of VMM32 with a good set of
> well written VxDs  (and that the very first thing it does after
> loading is NOT to find that KRNL386.EXE and run it). Of course,
> that's an outstanding challenge, I don't think anyone would do it :(

even assuming

a) we have a well written design of 'a good set of well written VxDs'

b) lots of highly qualified programmers that would turn this design
into well written code, thereby wasting many years of precious life
time

what exactly do you think would happen? there are no programs around
that would do anything useful with these wonderful VXDs. and now the
life time is really wasted ;)


the problem here is that a multitasking DOS (like OS/2 1.9) is much more work
by an order of magnitude, and nobody around FreeDOS is doing any reasonable
programming work (with the possible exception of Ercsan, and he is not
qualified).

can we please close this issue?




Tom



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Re: [Freedos-user] Video complains that DOS should not be maintained

[Jon Brase]

On 12/26/21 3:18 PM, Aitor Santamaría wrote:


My point here is, NT has indeed quite a bunch of more stable and 
better thought features of an operating system that was conceived in 
the late 80's rather in the late 70's (a better filesystem, more 
suitable to networks, and basically, a brand new Win32 API more 
suitable for writing stable applications), but I don't see 
multitasking as the feature that killed DOS.



It was the feature that killed DOS. It's not that DOS couldn't multitask 
(though that depends a bit on how you define multitasking), it's that it 
couldn't do so safely and fully back-compatibly. The first generation 
x86 processors that DOS originally ran on didn't have any features to 
allow the operating system to isolate applications from the hardware. So 
tons of applications opted to interact with the hardware directly, 
because that was often more performant. By the time that the 286 and 386 
added features that allowed robust multitasking, there were too many 
applications that interacted directly with the hardware, and by the time 
that features that would allow the OS to emulate hardware showed up in 
the 386, there were just too many different bits of hardware that the OS 
might need to emulate. So at that point, any DOS that wanted to 
multitask had to choose whether to maintain back-compatibility with 
applications that performed direct hardware access, at the cost of less 
completely isolating applications from each other, and from the OS, or 
whether to go for strict isolation, at the cost of back compatibility.


Jon Brase

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Re: [Freedos-user] FreeDOS 1.3 RC5 error when installing

[Jerome Shidel]

> On Dec 27, 2021, at 9:19 PM, Pyros  wrote:
> 
> http://www.bttr-software.de/forum/img/uploaded/image24.jpg 
> 
> 
> while installing freedos 1.3 rc5 i get the error that you see in the image. 
> Now this is not your modern pc it's from the win 98/me days as it does have 
> isa slots and has an SB16 with attached wave blaster. It is a pentium machine 
> if that helps.
> 
>  
> 
>  Virus-free. www.avg.com 
> 
>  
> ___
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I have seen a similar issue when installing to netbook using the USB stick. 
There was no problem installing FreeDOS 1.2 on that machine using USB. Very 
little (if anything) has changed in those areas of the installer since 1.2. 
However, many things the installer relies upon have been updated. For example, 
Kernel, FreeCOM, Drivers, FDISK, etc. have all been updated. With these issues 
only seem to be occurring on real hardware, it will take a little time to 
narrow down the cause either resolve the issue and/or notify the appropriate 
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