[Freedos-user] New FreeDOSers Monthly Reminder
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Re: [Freedos-user] ECHO vs @ECHO
Hi Bret, > On Feb 28, 2022, at 6:42 PM, Bret Johnson wrote: > > This to me seems like a solution that could actually do what I'm wanting to > accomplish. I may experiment with that and see what happens. As you note, > there may be compatibility issues with some DOS versions (V8 power tools may > not work with older versions of DOS). As for compatibility, I was just referring to the “piped one-liner”. 99% of the code in the V8Power Tools talks directly to hardware or the the BIOS. The exceptions being things like loading resource (translation files), performing stdout/in (file handles, not FCBs), looking up environment variables and termination. Other than program terminate, none of that would be used in the two line “vgotoxy up + vecho /n /e” combo. So, it would definitely be good down to a very low version of DOS. I need to dig out the books to see if it would work in DOS 2.00 (exit code + PSP structure). :-) Jerome ___ Freedos-user mailing list Freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-user
Re: [Freedos-user] Looking for easy to follow instructions on how to connect to Samba share
On Mon, Feb 28, 2022 at 8:41 PM Sean Warner wrote: > > Not sure if you saw my more recent post... I now have a version of FreeDOS > 1.2 with the NIC and MS Client installed and working. I went with v1.2 > because after some googling I read that 1.2 is more stable than 1.3 for > network sharing and things. Maybe that is not true anymore? > > At my work I use a DOS application. It is "installed" onto a network share on > a file server and by mapping this share as a network drive I and my > colleagues are able to run that DOS application in Windows 7 32-bit which we > are still using as our daily driver OSs on our work laptops. > > My IT dept wants to upgrade the OS of that file server and our laptops to Win > 10. So I am trying to find a new way to host that DOS applciation and make it > available to the two or three people who still use it, sometimes > simultaneously. > My idea is to have Win 10 on my laptop and use Virtualbox to run FreeDOS > which would run this DOS application which would again need to be located on > a network share... or such is my understanding... in order that more than one > person can use it potentially at the same time as others using it or maybe > when no one else is around and their computers are turned off. I think you are making this far more complicated than it needs to be. Right now, you can access the DOS application and run it from a drive which is mapped as a network share. If the company upgrades the server OS on the machine mapped as a share, why would that change the mapping, or the ability to access the network share and the DOS application that lives on it? When you run it now, you are loading it from the network and running it locally. How many must use it simultaneously is irrelevant. You are each running a local copy of the application, that happens to be run from a network server instead of being loaded from a local drive. You are using 32 bit Win7 because it still supports NTVDM, which provides enough of the DOS environment to load and run a 18 bit DOS application. Microsoft removed the ability to run 16 bit applications in 64 bit Windows, so if you need to do that you need a VM of some sort to run them in. One possibility is a 32 bit build of Win10. Those do exist, and will still run 16 bit apps using NTVDM, but it isn't the direction I would go,. What happens if you need to run a 54 bit Windows application? These days, the preferred method of running 16 bit DOS applications on bit Windows is to use a VM, but it doesn't require VirtuaBox or the like. What most folks here do is run DOSBox or vDOS Plus. DOSBox is a VM designed to allow gamers to run DOS games on things that aren't DOS PCs. It provides enough of a DOS environment to run the games. and provides emulation for various graphics and sound functions that aren't available on things like PCs that don't have a Creative Labs Sound Blaster ISA card to provide the audio for games written to use it, or a specidfic supported video card for EGA/VGA modes.. DOSBox is cross platform. I used an ARM port to run several DOS apps on an Android tablet using an ARM Cortex 7 CPU. (I had to find one that passed Ctrl-key combos to the running app, as a WordStar style editor was one of the things I wanted to use.) If your application is pure character mode, you can use a fork of DOSBox called vDOS Plus. vDOS Plus only runs on x86 architecture, but that's not an issue for you. It's specifically intended to run character mode applications like editors and spreadsheets, and drops the specialized video and sound support.. I use it here to run the old VDE editor, a WordStar clone that originated under CP/M and was ported to DOS, as well as some character mode games ported from Unix like Larn and VMS Empire. I run them from a shortcut. The shortcut runs vDOS Plus, but starts it in the directory where the DOS program is stored. Local config files in the directory do the setup to run the program. Exit the program and I'm back in Windows. And for that matter, I don't see the need to host the DOS application your folks use on a network server. Does it ever *change*? Is there a reason you and your coworkers can't each have a local copy you run from your own PC, without needing to access a network share? You likely want a master copy on a network share as a backup, but I see no need to load and run if across the network. Tere may be specific things about the DOS app that will be problematic herfe, but right now it sounds like you are way overthinking the problem. __ Dennis ___ Freedos-user mailing list Freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-user
Re: [Freedos-user] Looking for easy to follow instructions on how to connect to Samba share
Thanks Liam, Not sure if you saw my more recent post... I now have a version of FreeDOS 1.2 with the NIC and MS Client installed and working. I went with v1.2 because after some googling I read that 1.2 is more stable than 1.3 for network sharing and things. Maybe that is not true anymore? At my work I use a DOS application. It is "installed" onto a network share on a file server and by mapping this share as a network drive I and my colleagues are able to run that DOS application in Windows 7 32- bit which we are still using as our daily driver OSs on our work laptops. My IT dept wants to upgrade the OS of that file server and our laptops to Win 10. So I am trying to find a new way to host that DOS applciation and make it available to the two or three people who still use it, sometimes simultaneously. My idea is to have Win 10 on my laptop and use Virtualbox to run FreeDOS which would run this DOS application which would again need to be located on a network share... or such is my understanding... in order that more than one person can use it potentially at the same time as others using it or maybe when no one else is around and their computers are turned off. That's why I want to set up MS client and make it a Samba client to whatever PC the DOS application will reside on. If necessary it could be a small form factor PC running Win 7 32-bit that is isolated from the company network but exists only to host the DOS application and network with the few Win 10 laptops running FreeDOS in a VM that will connect to it to run that DOS application. I don't so much like your idea about using Win 98 or any other Microsoft OS that is no longer supported and we are not supposed to even be using anymore. Not so much for security reaons but for legal and licensing purposes. FreeDOS only seems to support SMBv1 with all it's gaping security holes but at least FreeDOS is free and my understanding is that I could use it even in a workplace without having to worry about licensing. I'm happy to be corrected if I'm wrong about that. I tried vDOS and DOSBOX but neither with work with my DOS applciation. It needs to be able to be run by more than one person at the same time, it needs to print to LPT ports and a potential showstopper... it needs a USB dongle to activate a licence to give it full funtionality. This is working with the USB key connected to a machine running Win 7 32-bit which then runs the DOS applciaion. But I'm not sure if this will work at all by replacing Win 7 with FreeDOS running in a VM and not bare metal. At the moment I still have not managed to get FreeDOS client to NET USE connect to a share on Win 10. I made a user account and pwd in Win 10 the same as the user in FreeDOS. I enabled SMBv1 and LANMAN in the Win 10 local security policy. It's still not connecting. I will try see if it connects to a share on a linux OS. Shame FreeDOS does not let you specify a different username in the net use command. If you have other suggestions about what I could try or entirely different approaches I should consider please let me know! Sean On Mon, 2022-02-28 at 11:46 +0100, Liam Proven wrote: > On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 at 19:54, Sean Warner > wrote: > > > > I installed FreeDOS 1.2 today in Virtualbox on Win 10. > > Why the out-of-date version? 1.3 is out now. It's usually a good plan > to use the latest version. > > > I am trying to mount a Samba Share that is on another machine in my > > LAN as a network drive in FreeDOS using commands like net share and > > net use. > > That is going to be very complicated. Why do you want to do it from > DOS? > > For instance, could you install Win98 in your VM, use its built-in > networking to get the files you want, and then just boot the VM into > DOS mode? > > > > I am following several guides I googled including this one from > > wiki.samba.org: > > > > https://wiki.samba.org/index.php/Configuring_FreeDOS_to_Access_a_Samba_Share > > > > > > > > And also from this guide at virtualbox.org > > > > https://www.virtualbox.org/wiki/Sharing_files_with_DOS > > > > > > > > I’m not able to follow those instructions! I got the DSK3-1.EXE > > and DSK3-2.EXE files and used an FTP server in FreeDOS to > > transfer them into the FreeDOS OS but I don’t have any file called > > setup.exe ?? > > Have you unpacked the archives as the how-to guide says? > > Then changed into the relevant subdirectory to find the setup > program? > > > > > Do I need to install the NIC driver > > Yes. > > > and MS Client 3.0 > > Yes. > > > in order to get the net use command to work? > > Of course. Otherwise it's not there to use. > > > Because when I type net use in FreeDOS I get the error: Bad command > > or file name – “net”. I guess that program is not installed in my > > FreeDOS. Am I supposed to have a C:\NET directory? Because I don’t > > have one. I’m not why? I did a full install of FreeDOS. > > But you haven't installed the client yet. It's not there to work yet. >
Re: [Freedos-user] ECHO vs @ECHO
Thanks everybody for the input! Lots of interesting suggestions/ideas. I think the proposed solutions generally fall into four categories: 1. Always use ECHO OFF without the @ and don't worry about it 2. Try to fix the problem before it happens 3. Just let the problem happen and "fix" the screen afterwords 4. Create distinct AUTOEXEC.BAT files for every situation and don't try to create a "master" version As far as I can tell, none of the suggestions will do #2 (at least not reliably in all cases). I think almost every suggestion that tries to do #2 just replaces the unwanted "ECHO OFF" on the screen with something else unwanted (like an "@ECHO OFF" or a "CTTY NUL" or an "IF ..."). I'll try to address my thoughts on all of them received thus far in this single response. * Mercury Thirteen: > Would it be feasible to throw together an "@ECHO.COM" application > which would manually execute a normal "ECHO OFF" line if the DOS > version is below 3.3 and simply terminate otherwise? The only caveat > to this is that I''m not 100% certain that a command executed from > within a .COM file from within a batch file like this would > work back "upstream" and turn ECHOes off for the rest of the > original batch file. I thought of this, but unfortunately it won't work. First of all, it needs to test for more than just the basic DOS version since things like DR-DOS and PTS-DOS (and even FreeDOS to a lesser degree) can get "weird" since they are not always as compatible as they should be. In addition, you would still see the "@ECHO OFF" line, so all you're doing is replacing "ECHO OFF" with an errant "@ECHO OFF" and would still need to issue a real ECHO OFF (without the "@") to actually turn ECHO OFF. An @ECHO.COM (or .EXE) file could be interesting, though, except it would actually need to legitimately tell the command/batch processor to turn ECHO OFF and I don't think there's a way to do that from inside an executable file. It would be nice if there were some INT 21h functions to manipulate the ECHO state (and perhaps also other things like determining if you are running from a command-line or batch file or being EXEC'd from another program, or determining the state of the CALL stack if being run from a batch file, or other similar things) but none of that exists. An executable file could manipulate the screen (similar to the V8 Power tools suggested below by Jerome) but since it can't actually manipulate the ECHO state it won't do any good. * Jose Senna: > I have not used any DOS for some months but, as far as I > remember, @ECHO OFF worked with DR-DOS 5. I don't have DR-DOS 5 installed. But I do have DR-DOS 6, 7, and 8 installed and the "@" trick does not work with any of those. It's conceivable it works with DR-DOS 5, but I really doubt it. * Jim Hall: > The simplest solution is to use ECHO OFF without the @ at the start > of your BAT file. That will work everywhere. If you don't like > seeing this line on the screen at boot, you could run CLS after > that. Running a CLS afterwords is sort of a "nuclear option" to fix a small problem. I normally want to see all the output of the various programs and CLS blows away everything, including things I want to see. Jerome's V8 power tools suggestion below I think is a better option than CLS since it only does a "selective cleaning", but it's definitely more complicated than a simple CLS. > I suppose another way to solve this is with a simple tool that > detects the DOS version. Unfortunately, this would not be a "simple" tool. I've never seen a tool that reliably detects all the different manufacturers and versions of DOS. If there's one out there, I've not seen it. > So your MKENV program would detect the DOS version and write a BAT > file that looks like: > > SET VENDOR=MS > SET MAJOR=5 > SET MINOR=0 That's what I do now (albeit manually) with the individual AUTOEXEC.BAT files (except I call the environment variables DOSMfg, DOSMajor, and DOSMinor), but same idea). > If you need AUTOEXEC to do different things depending on the DOS > version, you could carry the MKENV idea further by having a set of > "stubbed" AUTOEXEC files like AUTOEXEC\MS50.BAT, and so on for other > versions, that you could load as needed. But I'll leave that for > you. Again, that's basically what I'm doing now, except in the reverse order. I do the OS-specific stuff in a small AUTOEXEC.BAT file and the jump to the "master" or "common" AUTOEXEC.BAT file. Your suggestion is to try and create more levels of complication (more "levels" of batch files) instead of creating a "master" like I'm trying to do. The problem with that is when I want to make a "global" change to what I'm trying to do (like add or remove one more utility to all OS's while
[Freedos-user] KERNL86.SYS vs. KERNL86N.SYS
Hi, the differences seem to be: 1) Support for LFNs with KERNL86.SYS, because of kernel compatibility level 7.10 (vs. 6.22). 2) Support for FAT32 partitions with KERNL86.SYS. Anything else? Cheers, Robert -- +++ BTTR Software +++ Home page: https://www.bttr-software.de/ DOS ain't dead: https://www.bttr-software.de/forum/ ___ Freedos-user mailing list Freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-user
Re: [Freedos-user] Looking for easy to follow instructions on how to connect to Samba share
On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 at 19:54, Sean Warner wrote: > > I installed FreeDOS 1.2 today in Virtualbox on Win 10. Why the out-of-date version? 1.3 is out now. It's usually a good plan to use the latest version. > I am trying to mount a Samba Share that is on another machine in my LAN as a > network drive in FreeDOS using commands like net share and net use. That is going to be very complicated. Why do you want to do it from DOS? For instance, could you install Win98 in your VM, use its built-in networking to get the files you want, and then just boot the VM into DOS mode? > > I am following several guides I googled including this one from > wiki.samba.org: > > https://wiki.samba.org/index.php/Configuring_FreeDOS_to_Access_a_Samba_Share > > > > And also from this guide at virtualbox.org > > https://www.virtualbox.org/wiki/Sharing_files_with_DOS > > > > I’m not able to follow those instructions! I got the DSK3-1.EXE and > DSK3-2.EXE files and used an FTP server in FreeDOS to transfer them into the > FreeDOS OS but I don’t have any file called setup.exe ?? Have you unpacked the archives as the how-to guide says? Then changed into the relevant subdirectory to find the setup program? > Do I need to install the NIC driver Yes. > and MS Client 3.0 Yes. > in order to get the net use command to work? Of course. Otherwise it's not there to use. > Because when I type net use in FreeDOS I get the error: Bad command or file > name – “net”. I guess that program is not installed in my FreeDOS. Am I > supposed to have a C:\NET directory? Because I don’t have one. I’m not why? I > did a full install of FreeDOS. But you haven't installed the client yet. It's not there to work yet. > Any help much appreciated! It sounds to me like you are way out of your depth, technically speaking. Start with the basics: why are you doing this? What do you hope to achieve? -- Liam Proven ~ Profile: https://about.me/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk ~ gMail/gTalk/FB: lpro...@gmail.com Twitter/LinkedIn: lproven ~ Skype: liamproven UK: (+44) 7939-087884 ~ Czech [+ WhatsApp/Telegram/Signal]: (+420) 702-829-053 ___ Freedos-user mailing list Freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-user
