Re: [Freedos-user] Dial-up emulation

[Jose Senna via Freedos-user]

Robert Riebisch said:
> This collection of **packet drivers** is still available at
> . And packet drivers are typically for
> Ethernet network cards, not modems.

Thank you for pointing that most modems do
not need device drivers. I had not used
one for over 10 years. External modems mostly
use a COM port and internal ones emulate one in
hardware/firmware. But they still need dialers
and use packet drivers for internet access.
This is what LSPPP and DOSPPP are all about.
Maybe there aren"t PPP packet drivers in Crynwr;
I did not look.

This is, however, a digression from the
Brandon Taylor problem. Why does he want
to use dial-up emulation for internet access?
He did not mention what kind of physical
network his computer is connected to,



___
Freedos-user mailing list
Freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-user

Re: [Freedos-user] Dial-up emulation?

[Eric Auer via Freedos-user]

Here is a neat summary of the DOS PPP drivers:
http://www.oldskool.org/guides/tvdog/internet.html#I

...but, someone has already raised this question:
Do you have a "counterpart"?



I mean - a dial-in service answering with a modem and a PPP stack.
Or at least a null-modem connection to a PPP "server", such as pppd
running on Linux. Or possibly Windows running the "server side of
RAS" would work too.


On BTTR, there is a thread about this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wLVHXn79l8M

"Let's Make a DOS BBS in a offensively modern way"

00:00 - Intro
00:15 - A Word from our sponsors
00:39 - What is a BBS
05:16 - How does a BBS work
13:15 - Lets get modern (containers)
23:51 - Kubernetes
26:56 - Build a server install Kubernetes
31:30 - Ceph, lets store some files
38:09 - Doors
42:38 - Lets make a helm chart
49:03 - Dial in and modems
53:17 - fTelnet
55:28 - Fidonet
58:13 - Thanks

https://github.com/jgoerzen/docker-bbs-renegade

Might fit with the topic discussed here, but on the
other side, it might not answer the question which
SLIP or PPP servers can be recommended and whether
you connect them to real or rather simulated modems?
I have not watched the video yet. Let me know :-)

Regards, Eric




___
Freedos-user mailing list
Freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-user

Re: [Freedos-user] Dial-up emulation

[Robert Riebisch via Freedos-user]

Hi Jose,

>  Tomas said:
>  > network card =/= modem
> 
>  I never said nor implied they are the same.

What you said is:
"Anyway, you will still need a **modem driver** for DOS."
(** added by me to emphasize)

You continued with:
"There used to be many of them in old software repositories as the
Crynwr collection."

This collection of **packet drivers** is still available at
. And packet drivers are typically for
Ethernet network cards, not modems.

Cheers,
Robert
-- 
BTTR Software   https://www.bttr-software.de/
DOS ain't dead  https://www.bttr-software.de/forum/


___
Freedos-user mailing list
Freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-user

Re: [Freedos-user] Dial-up emulation?

[Frantisek Rysanek via Freedos-user]

Here is a neat summary of the DOS PPP drivers:
http://www.oldskool.org/guides/tvdog/internet.html#I

...but, someone has already raised this question:
Do you have a "counterpart"?
I mean - a dial-in service answering with a modem and a PPP stack.
Or at least a null-modem connection to a PPP "server", such as pppd 
running on Linux. Or possibly Windows running the "server side of 
RAS" would work too.

You have mentioned that one of the PC emulators contains a "Hayes 
modem emulation". What is the use for that, exactly? What does it do?
Suggestion: it answers to a few AT commands, including ATD, to which 
it responds with CONNECT, and puts you through onto a serial line - 
either a physical outside COM port, or e.g. an emulated virtual COM 
port in your host OS (where the emulator / VM is running).

This might be useful to bamboozle some old DOS software, that insists 
on dialing out a modem (when accessing a serial line for whatever 
final purpose) - while in reality all you have is a null-modem cable, 
or a virtual equivalent thereof.

The other option would be, that the "modem emulator" also provides 
the "server side PPP stack", effectively to set up a network 
connection, probably TCP/IP (although in principle, PPP can 
encapsulate other L3 protocols, such as Novell IPX/SPX or MS NetBEUI 
if I have all the ancient buzzwords right).

Note that theoretically, at some sub-layers, PPP is really 
symmetrical, a conversation between equal parties. The client/server 
distinction stems from one party asking the other to authenticate, 
again using a modular mechanism supporting several protocols. For 
your practical purposes, these details are somewhat esoteric...
Should you be interested, try reading RFC1661.

If you don't insist on PPP / dial-up, and you really mean "I want to 
open Google in Arachne", just go down the "packet driver" route. You 
will save yourself quite a bit of hassle (configuring PPP).
If OTOH it is the pain that you are after, go ahead with PPP client 
side and server side :-) and the follow-up networking stuff on the 
server part.

Frank

> 
> I'm not looking for anything out of Qmodem specifically. I'm 
> searching for a TSR that handles dial-up networking in the background 
> while I use TCP/IP utilities like PING, TRACERT and FTP; and/or a web 
> browser like Arachne.
> 
> Brandon Taylor
> 
> 
> From: Frantisek Rysanek 
> Sent: Wednesday, April 24, 2024 4:52 PM
> To: Brandon Taylor via Freedos-user 
> 
> Cc: Brandon Taylor 
> Subject: Re: [Freedos-user] Dial-up emulation? 
> 
> Hello there Brandon,
> 
> to me the key question is - what do you expect of Qmodem?
> What would you like to achieve in / by using that program?
> I've never used it, but I figure it would be a "terminal emulator"
> with some added candy. An analog (predecessor, really) of Putty or
> Hyperterminal in Windows.
> 
> A terminal was originally a hardware device, having a screen and a
> keyboard. I believe the rows of text on the screen were an evolution
> / innovation after line printers. The text no longer rolled on paper,
> now it rolled on a screen. The terminal needed to connect to
> something, typically a relatively large computer (like an early UNIX
> or mainframe machine), and the computer presented a command-line
> interface to the user using that terminal. A single server could
> cater for several terminals simultaneously, already back then.
> 
> Later, when PC's and other computers became common-place, the
> so-called "terminal emulator" programs allowed you to use your PC
> (which is a pretty versatile computer) as a dumb terminal = to
> display what arrived by an RS232 serial line, and to send your
> keystrokes to the opposite party. You can actually connect two
> terminals (or emulators) together over a cross-over RS232 line (also
> called a Null Modem) and chat with each other...
> 
> A modem is a device that originally allowed two parties to connect
> over a phonecall, via the POTS/PSTN (telephone network). You first
> needed to talk to your modem a little, to have it dial out the call.
> If the call got picked up by an opposite modem, the two modems would
> establish a "virtual serial line" spanning potentially hundreds of
> kilometers. You could then chat or transfer files with a friend
> (terminal emulators supported file transfer protocols such as X-modem
> and Z-modem), or there were machines called "bulettin board systems",
> nowadays I'd call them early servers, that you could dial into to
> download or upload files, maybe do a bit of messaging... I don't
> really have much of a clue what these could do, because this was
> before I got my hands on a PC with a modem :-) Obviously you could
> dial in remotely i

Re: [Freedos-user] Dial-up emulation?

[tsiegel--- via Freedos-user]

On 4/24/2024 11:33 PM, Brandon Taylor via Freedos-user wrote:
I'm not looking for anything out of Qmodem specifically. I'm searching 
for a TSR that handles dial-up networking in the background while I 
use TCP/IP utilities like PING, TRACERT and FTP; and/or a web browser 
like Arachne.



In that case, what you need is one of two things.

either the crin packet drivers (already mentioned by Frank), which is 
probably the most useful option here,


or

something like rlfossil which pretends to be a fossil driver, that 
allows your programs to pretend to dial out to the internet even though 
none of that is necessary.  Both have their advantages, depending on 
what you're doing, but it sounds like for you, the packet drivers are 
what you want/need.  With those loaded, and configured properly, you 
should be able to run your other software as desired without worrying 
about the connection at all.


The key words here are configured properly, because there are separate 
configuration items for software that uses a config file to read it's 
options (like some dos software does), and those that expect the 
connection to already be live when you open them.


For what it's worth, there is actually a third option, you can run a 
program that contains multiple protocols built in already. there are 
programs that do this, but they were pretty nitch programs.  There's 
also something like KA9Q which was a piece of software that could turn 
your dos box into an internet server, providing things like email, ftp, 
early web access (I believe they only support version 1.0 of the http 
protocol).   but it doesn't sound like a server is what you're after.


For your case, (as mentioned above), you'll most likely want to load the 
packet driver associated with your network card (most can pretend to be 
a ne2000 card, so just try that driver first, if it works, then you 
won't need to play around with anything else. Many 3com cards are also 
emulated these days, so if the ne2000 driver doesn't work, try the 
various 3com ones, one of those may do the trick for you.


I can't recall the name of it now, but there was a package someone put 
together to allow you to use your packet driver to make the connection, 
then drop back to dos, with batch files to run the various programs, 
including ftp, email, and web browsing (using archne browser (apologies 
if I get any of the names wrong, it's been a while).


If you want to go the fossil driver route, then you can use qmodem, but 
unless you're connecting to another machine (such as a shell account), 
this will be of extreme limited use/capabily.  To use the rlfossil 
driver, you just type atdt  and it will make a telnet 
connection to the hostname of choice (you can provide a port number as 
well).  This was handy for playing muds back then, or for logging into a 
unix shell, but beyond that, it's use was pretty much useless, but it's 
there if you want to mess around with it.


This is likely more information than you needed, but maybe something in 
here will trigger some wish to experiment or something.


Basically, the packet drivers are what you want unless you want to do 
something specific that isn't covered by their use.


I.E. running nettamer for irc chatting.

Hope this helps, and good luck making it all work. I wish I still had a 
real dos machine operational, but I lost my last one in a forced move a 
bit over 2 years ago, so I can't actually try any of this stuff anymore 
sadly.



___
Freedos-user mailing list
Freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-user

Re: [Freedos-user] Dial-up emulation?

[Brandon Taylor via Freedos-user]

I'm not looking for anything out of Qmodem specifically. I'm searching for a 
TSR that handles dial-up networking in the background while I use TCP/IP 
utilities like PING, TRACERT and FTP; and/or a web browser like Arachne.

Brandon Taylor

From: Frantisek Rysanek 
Sent: Wednesday, April 24, 2024 4:52 PM
To: Brandon Taylor via Freedos-user 
Cc: Brandon Taylor 
Subject: Re: [Freedos-user] Dial-up emulation?

Hello there Brandon,

to me the key question is - what do you expect of Qmodem?
What would you like to achieve in / by using that program?
I've never used it, but I figure it would be a "terminal emulator"
with some added candy. An analog (predecessor, really) of Putty or
Hyperterminal in Windows.

A terminal was originally a hardware device, having a screen and a
keyboard. I believe the rows of text on the screen were an evolution
/ innovation after line printers. The text no longer rolled on paper,
now it rolled on a screen. The terminal needed to connect to
something, typically a relatively large computer (like an early UNIX
or mainframe machine), and the computer presented a command-line
interface to the user using that terminal. A single server could
cater for several terminals simultaneously, already back then.

Later, when PC's and other computers became common-place, the
so-called "terminal emulator" programs allowed you to use your PC
(which is a pretty versatile computer) as a dumb terminal = to
display what arrived by an RS232 serial line, and to send your
keystrokes to the opposite party. You can actually connect two
terminals (or emulators) together over a cross-over RS232 line (also
called a Null Modem) and chat with each other...

A modem is a device that originally allowed two parties to connect
over a phonecall, via the POTS/PSTN (telephone network). You first
needed to talk to your modem a little, to have it dial out the call.
If the call got picked up by an opposite modem, the two modems would
establish a "virtual serial line" spanning potentially hundreds of
kilometers. You could then chat or transfer files with a friend
(terminal emulators supported file transfer protocols such as X-modem
and Z-modem), or there were machines called "bulettin board systems",
nowadays I'd call them early servers, that you could dial into to
download or upload files, maybe do a bit of messaging... I don't
really have much of a clue what these could do, because this was
before I got my hands on a PC with a modem :-) Obviously you could
dial in remotely into a UNIX machine and work in its command line
"shell" = work with files, read and send e-mail, use NNTP newsgroups
and whatnot.
All of the above was possible using a PC with a modem and a terminal
emulator - I assume your Qmodem belongs to this category.
I wouldn't call this usage style "the internet", except maybe in a
very broad sense :-)

RS232-style async serial lines, and their modem-based long-distance
extensions, were also useful for other styles of traffic.

As a side note, I'd mention UUCP, as a distributed worldwide e-mail
system, predating TCP/IP-based SMTP (in practical popularity, if not
by actual age). There were in fact several e-mail standards before
SMTP, and UUCP was one of them. UUCP was an "open standard" - unlike
other e-mail protocols/systems that were proprietary.

RS232-style direct lines and modem connections can also be used to
transport TCP/IP - in case this is what you mean by "internet".
To "encapsulate" IP packets over an async serial line, you need an
intermediate layer, called a "layer 2 protocol" (IP is layer 3).
See also the layered ISO/OSI networking model (of which the Internet
is not a verbatim implementation).
So for serial links, there were two popular L2 protocols: SLIP and
PPP. During that era, PPP pretty much took over - being generally
more advanced / flexible / extensible... more suitable to the age of
mammoth modem pools and dial-up internet access.

To start PPP, you generally need two things:

1) a piece of software that talks to the modem, to make it dial a
number, and wait for the modem to establish connection (the modem
reports CONNECT  and maybe some further info).
You can do this by hand in a terminal emulator, or by a script, or by
a dedicated unattended piece of software called a "dialer".

2) an implementation of PPP. After you dial the modem connection, you
need a way to hand over the established modem session to a PPP
"driver" (protocol talker).

On top of PPP, you can then run a TCP/IP stack, which in turn gets
used by "internet" applications such as e-mail clients, web browsers,
FTP clients and whatnot (you can also run a server with a PPP
connection to the internet).

For instance, Windows since 95 have an ex-works "connection software"
called "Microsoft Dial-Up Networking" (if memory serves) or RAS in
the N

Re: [Freedos-user] Dial-up emulation?

[Frantisek Rysanek via Freedos-user]

bove).

As for Internet in DOS:

Both MS-DOS and FreeDOS can connect to the internet.
But, the first question is, what sort of "experience" you expect :-)
Yes you could probably find some SMTP e-mail client.
Yes there is an FTP client, a Telnet client...
Yes there are even HTTP browsers - but, these were very basic! Think 
basic HTTP (hypertext). No JavaScript, hardly any graphics, text mode 
preferred. Web standards at the level of mid/late nineties.

To get "internet" (TCP/IP support) in DOS, yes you need drivers.
It is in fact a driver "stack", because the drivers are layered.
Lower layer drivers are hardware-specific, upper-layer drivers 
implement HW-agnostic networking protocols.
In DOS, drivers have the form of "resident" programs - aka TSR = 
Terminate and Stay Resident.

DOS is a rudimentary mono-task OS. At face value, it cannot do 
multiple things at once. TSR's are one way to achieve such operation.
A TSR looks like just any other program - except, upon its return to 
the command prompt, it hasn't really unloaded itself from the memory. 
A piece of its executable code has remained in RAM, with official 
approval of the OS, and has probably hooked a hardware IRQ (e.g. from 
a network card) or a so-called "software interrupt vector" = really a 
service callgate. Thus, it can be invoked in the background, do a bit 
of work, and return control to your interactive foreground 
application.

There were actually several TCP/IP stacks (libraries) for DOS, from 
different vendors. A key concept, around which those TCP/IP stacks 
revolve, is a "network driver interface" (API).
There is the Microsoft family of NDIS2 drivers.
Novell had its own family of ODI drivers.
Then there is the "Crynwr Packet Driver" interface - very popular in 
MS-DOS TCP/IP software made by anyone except Microsoft :-)

In general, if you have a particular application program that you'd 
like to use for internet access in DOS, this program probably 
contains a particular TCP/IP stack (either linked in, or as an 
external protocol driver) and therefore dictates the interface that 
you need to make available in your DOS setup = what set of drivers 
you need to load.

For the most popular brands and models of Network Interface Cards 
(Ethernet), the vendors still make DOS drivers available. For some 
cards, you can get a hardware-specific "crynwr packet driver".
Alternatively, you will also find HW-specific NDIS or ODI drivers.
Note that if you need a "packet driver", but all you can find is an 
NDIS or ODI driver, do not despair - there are generic ndispkt and 
odipkt "shims" to provide a Crynwr interface on top of an NDIS or ODI 
hw-specific driver.

I recall that there were also at least two implementations of a PPP 
packet driver for DOS. One of them was a nice but proprietary package 
called Klos-PPP. I don't recall the name of the other free PPP stack.
Those two stacks both could dial out via a Hayes modem, I seem to 
recall a chat-script, and once the modem connected, start PPP and 
serve the Crynwr interface on top.

Do you need modem and PPP for internet access from DOS?
Definitely not! If you're speaking emulators, just check what legacy 
NIC the emulator emulates. You will likely find one of Intel gigabit, 
Intel 100Mb, Realtek RTL8139, NE2000 or some such.
So you enable the NIC in your emulator, and then you just need to 
find the old DOS driver for that NIC.
You also need some know how, about how the driver stack fits 
together.
I'd say that the PPP stack with a dialer would take more conventional 
RAM (it's a TSR, see) compared to an Ethernet NIC driver. No need to 
mess with PPP, unless of course you enjoy the nostalgic value.

If you're interested to find out e.g. what web browsers could run on 
top of a Crynwr packet driver, I recall that there were DOS builds of 
Lynx and Links, and a graphical browser caller Arachne.

I also recommend you to check Michael Brutman's mTCP utility pack, as 
well as his homepage - it has many explanations and links to further 
reading, on the broad topic of DOS networking and the (Crynwr) packet 
driver interface.
http://www.brutman.com/
The website and software keep receiving updates!

If this is overwhelming, well there you have it :-)
On my part, questions to the point are always welcome.
You have my sympathy for being curious.

Frank

> 
> Indeed, I'm using an old-school program called Qmodem. My question 
> now is – would I be able to use the Internet using the emulated 
> modem?
> 
> Brandon Taylor
> 
> 
> From:Jim Hall via Freedos-user 
> Sent:Tuesday, April 23, 2024 10:12 PM
> To:Discussion and general questions about FreeDOS. 
> 
> Cc:Jim Hall 
> Subject:Re: [Freedos-user] Dial-up emulation? 
> 
> 
> 
> On Tue, Apr 23, 2024, 9:38 PM Brandon Taylor via Freedos-user 
>  wrote:
> Since FreeDOS doesn't support ph

Re: [Freedos-user] Dial-up emulation

[Jose Senna via Freedos-user]

 Tomas said:
 > network card =/= modem

 I never said nor implied they are the same.
 I said that, if an user has a machine with a network card,
 and a suitable DOS driver for the card is available, he/she
 may use it, instead of setting a dial-up connection.



___
Freedos-user mailing list
Freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-user

Re: [Freedos-user] Dial-up emulation?

[Brandon Taylor via Freedos-user]

My apologies for the confusion. I know FreeDOS has internet capability, but not 
on 86Box, since FreeDOS for some reason treats 86Box as if it were a real 
computer.

Get Outlook for Android<https://aka.ms/AAb9ysg>

From: Robert Riebisch via Freedos-user 
Sent: Wednesday, April 24, 2024 2:04:17 PM
To: freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net 
Cc: Robert Riebisch 
Subject: Re: [Freedos-user] Dial-up emulation?

Hi Brandon,

> Since FreeDOS doesn't support physical network hardware (even if it's
> emulated in a program like PCem or 86Box), I figure there's no way
> FreeDOS is gonna be able to connect to the Internet, right? Well...

Says who?

Cheers,
Robert
--
BTTR Software   https://www.bttr-software.de/
DOS ain't dead  https://www.bttr-software.de/forum/


___
Freedos-user mailing list
Freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-user
___
Freedos-user mailing list
Freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-user

Re: [Freedos-user] Dial-up emulation?

[Tomas By via Freedos-user]

On Wed, 24 Apr 2024 21:08:49 +0200, Michał Dec via Freedos-user wrote:
> So I would try to get regular DOS drivers for that modem if I were you.


There were no DOS drivers for modems? There were "winmodems" that
needed drivers, maybe that is what you are thinking of.

/Tomas


___
Freedos-user mailing list
Freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-user

Re: [Freedos-user] Dial-up emulation?

[Michał Dec via Freedos-user]

> Since FreeDOS doesn't support physical network hardware (even if it's 
emulated in a program like PCem or 86Box), I figure there's no way 
FreeDOS is gonna be able to connect to the Internet, right? Well...


Lol. Lmao, even. I did manage to connect my FreeDOS to the Internet at 
some point but it's not as glamorous as one would think.


> The developers of the 86Box project have recently implemented 
emulation of a Hayes-compatible dial-up modem. So my question is... will 
FreeDOS support the emulated modem?


This isn't FreeDOS' scope. If that modem has DOS drivers, then since it 
falls into FD's scope to be ABI-compatible with Microsoft DOS up to and 
including 6.22, supporting that modem and therefore its drivers is a 
welcome and in fact intended consequence of this rigid scope. So I would 
try to get regular DOS drivers for that modem if I were you. Best of luck.


Best regards,

Michał Dec



___
Freedos-user mailing list
Freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-user

Re: [Freedos-user] Dial-up emulation?

[Robert Riebisch via Freedos-user]

Hi Brandon,

> Since FreeDOS doesn't support physical network hardware (even if it's
> emulated in a program like PCem or 86Box), I figure there's no way
> FreeDOS is gonna be able to connect to the Internet, right? Well...

Says who?

Cheers,
Robert
-- 
BTTR Software   https://www.bttr-software.de/
DOS ain't dead  https://www.bttr-software.de/forum/


___
Freedos-user mailing list
Freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-user

Re: [Freedos-user] Dial-up emulation?

[Brandon Taylor via Freedos-user]

Well, I did find a nice package in the FreeDOS repository called LSPPP. Would 
that work better?

Get Outlook for Android<https://aka.ms/AAb9ysg>

From: tom ehlert via Freedos-user 
Sent: Wednesday, April 24, 2024 11:48:03 AM
To: Discussion and general questions about FreeDOS. 

Cc: tom ehlert 
Subject: Re: [Freedos-user] Dial-up emulation?


> Indeed, I'm using an old-school program called Qmodem.

>  My question now is – would I be able to use the Internet using the emulated 
> modem?
yes (if you had any idea what you are doing). But definitively not with QMODEM.

Tom


> Brandon Taylor
> 
> From: Jim Hall via Freedos-user 
> Sent: Tuesday, April 23, 2024 10:12 PM
> To: Discussion and general questions about FreeDOS. 
> 
> Cc: Jim Hall 
> Subject: Re: [Freedos-user] Dial-up emulation?



> On Tue, Apr 23, 2024, 9:38 PM Brandon Taylor via Freedos-user 
> mailto:freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net>>
>  wrote:
> Since FreeDOS doesn't support physical network hardware (even if it's 
> emulated in a program like PCem or 86Box), I figure there's no way FreeDOS is 
> gonna be able to connect to the Internet, right? Well...

> The developers of the 86Box project have recently implemented emulation of a 
> Hayes-compatible dial-up modem. So my question is... will FreeDOS support the 
> emulated modem?


> Well, it's not that "FreeDOS" would support the Hayes modern, but that 
> terminal/dialer software would then be able to. FreeDOS is not like Linux, 
> which uses a Hardware Abstraction Layer (HAL) to support the hardware 
> directly. FreeDOS, like any DOS, does normal DOS things and leaves certain 
> hardware access (like playing sounds through a sound card, or accessing a 
> network to browse the web or check email, or dialing out through a modem) to 
> other software.

> So if you had a terminal/dialer program like Procomm or Telix, then yes, I 
> expect you'd be able to dial out through this emulated Hayes modem from 
> FreeDOS.





___
Freedos-user mailing list
Freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-user
___
Freedos-user mailing list
Freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-user

Re: [Freedos-user] Dial-up emulation?

[tom ehlert via Freedos-user]

> Indeed, I'm using an old-school program called Qmodem.

>  My question now is – would I be able to use the Internet using the emulated 
> modem?
yes (if you had any idea what you are doing). But definitively not with QMODEM.

Tom


> Brandon Taylor
> 
> From: Jim Hall via Freedos-user 
> Sent: Tuesday, April 23, 2024 10:12 PM
> To: Discussion and general questions about FreeDOS. 
> 
> Cc: Jim Hall 
> Subject: Re: [Freedos-user] Dial-up emulation?



> On Tue, Apr 23, 2024, 9:38 PM Brandon Taylor via Freedos-user 
> mailto:freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net>>
>  wrote:
> Since FreeDOS doesn't support physical network hardware (even if it's 
> emulated in a program like PCem or 86Box), I figure there's no way FreeDOS is 
> gonna be able to connect to the Internet, right? Well...

> The developers of the 86Box project have recently implemented emulation of a 
> Hayes-compatible dial-up modem. So my question is... will FreeDOS support the 
> emulated modem?


> Well, it's not that "FreeDOS" would support the Hayes modern, but that 
> terminal/dialer software would then be able to. FreeDOS is not like Linux, 
> which uses a Hardware Abstraction Layer (HAL) to support the hardware 
> directly. FreeDOS, like any DOS, does normal DOS things and leaves certain 
> hardware access (like playing sounds through a sound card, or accessing a 
> network to browse the web or check email, or dialing out through a modem) to 
> other software.

> So if you had a terminal/dialer program like Procomm or Telix, then yes, I 
> expect you'd be able to dial out through this emulated Hayes modem from 
> FreeDOS.





___
Freedos-user mailing list
Freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-user

Re: [Freedos-user] Dial-up emulation?

[Brandon Taylor via Freedos-user]

Indeed, I'm using an old-school program called Qmodem. My question now is – 
would I be able to use the Internet using the emulated modem?

Brandon Taylor

From: Jim Hall via Freedos-user 
Sent: Tuesday, April 23, 2024 10:12 PM
To: Discussion and general questions about FreeDOS. 

Cc: Jim Hall 
Subject: Re: [Freedos-user] Dial-up emulation?



On Tue, Apr 23, 2024, 9:38 PM Brandon Taylor via Freedos-user 
mailto:freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net>> 
wrote:
Since FreeDOS doesn't support physical network hardware (even if it's emulated 
in a program like PCem or 86Box), I figure there's no way FreeDOS is gonna be 
able to connect to the Internet, right? Well...

The developers of the 86Box project have recently implemented emulation of a 
Hayes-compatible dial-up modem. So my question is... will FreeDOS support the 
emulated modem?


Well, it's not that "FreeDOS" would support the Hayes modern, but that 
terminal/dialer software would then be able to. FreeDOS is not like Linux, 
which uses a Hardware Abstraction Layer (HAL) to support the hardware directly. 
FreeDOS, like any DOS, does normal DOS things and leaves certain hardware 
access (like playing sounds through a sound card, or accessing a network to 
browse the web or check email, or dialing out through a modem) to other 
software.

So if you had a terminal/dialer program like Procomm or Telix, then yes, I 
expect you'd be able to dial out through this emulated Hayes modem from FreeDOS.
___
Freedos-user mailing list
Freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-user

Re: [Freedos-user] Dial-up emulation?

[Jim Hall via Freedos-user]

On Tue, Apr 23, 2024, 9:38 PM Brandon Taylor via Freedos-user <
freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net> wrote:

> Since FreeDOS doesn't support physical network hardware (even if it's
> emulated in a program like PCem or 86Box), I figure there's no way FreeDOS
> is gonna be able to connect to the Internet, right? Well...
>
> The developers of the 86Box project have recently implemented emulation of
> a Hayes-compatible dial-up modem. So my question is... will FreeDOS support
> the emulated modem?
>


Well, it's not that "FreeDOS" would support the Hayes modern, but that
terminal/dialer software would then be able to. FreeDOS is not like Linux,
which uses a Hardware Abstraction Layer (HAL) to support the hardware
directly. FreeDOS, like any DOS, does normal DOS things and leaves certain
hardware access (like playing sounds through a sound card, or accessing a
network to browse the web or check email, or dialing out through a modem)
to other software.

So if you had a terminal/dialer program like Procomm or Telix, then yes, I
expect you'd be able to dial out through this emulated Hayes modem from
FreeDOS.

>
___
Freedos-user mailing list
Freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-user

Re: [Freedos-user] Dial-up emulation?

[Michael Brutman via Freedos-user]

You clearly don't use search engines too much ...

Try "FreeDOS" and "Networking" as your two words for the search.



On Tue, Apr 23, 2024 at 7:38 PM Brandon Taylor via Freedos-user <
freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net> wrote:

> Since FreeDOS doesn't support physical network hardware (even if it's
> emulated in a program like PCem or 86Box), I figure there's no way FreeDOS
> is gonna be able to connect to the Internet, right? Well...
>
> The developers of the 86Box project have recently implemented emulation of
> a Hayes-compatible dial-up modem. So my question is... will FreeDOS support
> the emulated modem?
>
> Brandon Taylor
> ___
> Freedos-user mailing list
> Freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-user
>
___
Freedos-user mailing list
Freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-user

[Freedos-user] Dial-up emulation?

[Brandon Taylor via Freedos-user]

Since FreeDOS doesn't support physical network hardware (even if it's emulated 
in a program like PCem or 86Box), I figure there's no way FreeDOS is gonna be 
able to connect to the Internet, right? Well...

The developers of the 86Box project have recently implemented emulation of a 
Hayes-compatible dial-up modem. So my question is... will FreeDOS support the 
emulated modem?

Brandon Taylor
___
Freedos-user mailing list
Freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-user