Re: FVWM: fvwm3?
On 3/2/24 01:55, Paul Fox wrote: I realize this discussion is drifting away from fvwm, but... ...a major part of my daily activity has always depended on X11's ability to function on remote displays. Does that functionality (i.e. "DISPLAY=remotehost:0" vs. "DISPLAY=:0") exist if either or both of the hosts is based on Wayland? There's `waypipe` for funnelling a Wayland application connection across a network link (via `ssh` in particular). Not sure if it supports mixed environments though. -- Stuart Longland (aka Redhatter, VK4MSL) I haven't lost my mind... ...it's backed up on a tape somewhere.
Re: FVWM: fvwm3?
> John McCue writes: > I heard of waypipe, but from what I understand is for it to work, the > remote system needs to have wayland too. Well, it's for running a wayland application on a remote machine displaying on your local wayland-running machine. If you want to run an X11 application on a remote displaying on your local wayland-running machine, you just use ssh as usual. Basically any machine with wayland is going to have Xwayland (the X11 component) and will start it when needed, though I guess some distribution who really gets behind wayland could not compile that part if they really didn't want to. > So if for example you want to run a remote X application on a BSD (or > AIX), it will not work. Nope, works just fine (besides that usual caveat about endianness mismatches that you get with all X servers this decade). I'm running wayland right now (with the KDE desktop) and can fire up a local xterm or ssh to a different machine and run xterm and it works just fine. Interestingly, it appears that it's actually the window manager (kwin_wayland) that ends up starting Xwayland. None of it runs as root (just the display manager, which in my case is SDDM). > To me, this indicates it is Linux (or maybe Wayland) specific. Nothing there indicates Linux; I don't personally know if the code is portable but I doubt anyone is going out of their way to make it difficult. Somehow I don't think you'll see many AIX machines running wayland in any case. Of course waypipe is wayland specific; that is its function. For X11 forwarding, ssh handles things as it always has. Now, I don't know if you could use the really old-style remote display stuff where ssh is not involved. Xwayland really is a proper X server so the ability to do it is probably down in there somewhere. - J<
Re: FVWM: fvwm3?
On Fri, Feb 02, 2024 at 06:11:01PM -0600, Jason Tibbitts wrote: Robert Heller writes: I believe Wayland does not support that sort of thing. It does, actually, but not exactly the same way. Look up "waypipe". One does get the impression that it's all an afterthought, though. I heard of waypipe, but from what I understand is for it to work, the remote system needs to have wayland too. So if for example you want to run a remote X application on a BSD (or AIX), it will not work. From: https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/Wayland waypipeAUR (or waypipe-gitAUR) is a transparent proxy for Wayland applications, with a wrapper command to run over SSH To me, this indicates it is Linux (or maybe Wayland) specific.
Re: FVWM: fvwm3?
robert wrote: > > At Fri, 02 Feb 2024 18:11:01 -0600 Jason Tibbitts wrote: > > > > > > Robert Heller writes: > > > > > I believe Wayland does not support that sort of thing. > > > > It does, actually, but not exactly the same way. Look up "waypipe". > > One does get the impression that it's all an afterthought, though. > > Right. Wayland does not want to be a networked display environment and > would > like to be like the MS-Windows and MacOS display environments: purely a > local > machine only display environment. Afterall, no one needs more then one > computer... I confess I'm happy just to know that someone is considering the problem/feature at all. paul =-- paul fox, p...@foxharp.boston.ma.us (arlington, ma, where it's 37.8 degrees)
Re: FVWM: fvwm3?
At Fri, 02 Feb 2024 18:11:01 -0600 Jason Tibbitts wrote: > > > Robert Heller writes: > > > I believe Wayland does not support that sort of thing. > > It does, actually, but not exactly the same way. Look up "waypipe". > One does get the impression that it's all an afterthought, though. Right. Wayland does not want to be a networked display environment and would like to be like the MS-Windows and MacOS display environments: purely a local machine only display environment. Afterall, no one needs more then one computer... > > - J< > > > -- Robert Heller -- Cell: 413-658-7953 GV: 978-633-5364 Deepwoods Software-- Custom Software Services http://www.deepsoft.com/ -- Linux Administration Services hel...@deepsoft.com -- Webhosting Services
Re: FVWM: fvwm3?
> Robert Heller writes: > I believe Wayland does not support that sort of thing. It does, actually, but not exactly the same way. Look up "waypipe". One does get the impression that it's all an afterthought, though. - J<
Re: FVWM: fvwm3?
At Fri, 02 Feb 2024 10:55:46 -0500 Paul Fox wrote: > > I realize this discussion is drifting away from fvwm, but... > > ...a major part of my daily activity has always depended on X11's > ability to function on remote displays. Does that functionality > (i.e. "DISPLAY=remotehost:0" vs. "DISPLAY=:0") exist if either or > both of the hosts is based on Wayland? I believe Wayland does not support that sort of thing. > > paul > > ml-f...@srv.mx wrote: > > Also a bunch of new DE/WM and soon XFCE. There will still be diversity, > > but a new one. > > However I'm not sure Xorg will be out soon there are still missing > > features on Wayland, like screen recording (available only on Gnome), > > which means that softwares like OBS don't work on it. > > > > Le 02/02/2024 à04:28, hw a écrit : > > > On Tue, 2024-01-30 at 14:02 -0700, Jaimos Skriletz wrote: > > >> On Tue, Jan 30, 2024 at 1:25 PM hw wrote: > > >>> > > >>> so is there finally a version that works for wayland? > > >>> > > >> No, fvwm only works with xorg and most likely won't be ported. > > >> > > >>> What are the differences between fvwm2 and fvwm3? > > >>> > > >> See https://github.com/fvwmorg/fvwm3/discussions/878 > > > > > > Good pointer, thanks! > > > > > > It's a pity that there's no fvwm for wayland. Xorg doesn't seem to be > > > maintainted anymore and is on the way out. That only leaves us Gnome > > > and KDE. All the diversity we used to have is gone with that. > > > > > > > > > > > =-- > paul fox, p...@foxharp.boston.ma.us (arlington, ma, where it's 38.9 degrees) > > > > > -- Robert Heller -- Cell: 413-658-7953 GV: 978-633-5364 Deepwoods Software-- Custom Software Services http://www.deepsoft.com/ -- Linux Administration Services hel...@deepsoft.com -- Webhosting Services
Re: FVWM: fvwm3?
> Does wayland have an X11 compatibility feature? Wayland has an 'XWayland' layer that allows regular X clients to talk to a Wayland server. However, this does not support special X clients like window managers or (as I understand it) automation tools like 'xdotool'. So you can run an X-based editor or xterm under Wayland, at least to some degree, but you can't run fvwm; the special X APIs that window managers use don't work. - cks
Re: FVWM: fvwm3?
I realize this discussion is drifting away from fvwm, but... ...a major part of my daily activity has always depended on X11's ability to function on remote displays. Does that functionality (i.e. "DISPLAY=remotehost:0" vs. "DISPLAY=:0") exist if either or both of the hosts is based on Wayland? paul ml-f...@srv.mx wrote: > Also a bunch of new DE/WM and soon XFCE. There will still be diversity, > but a new one. > However I'm not sure Xorg will be out soon there are still missing > features on Wayland, like screen recording (available only on Gnome), > which means that softwares like OBS don't work on it. > > Le 02/02/2024 à 04:28, hw a écrit : > > On Tue, 2024-01-30 at 14:02 -0700, Jaimos Skriletz wrote: > >> On Tue, Jan 30, 2024 at 1:25 PM hw wrote: > >>> > >>> so is there finally a version that works for wayland? > >>> > >> No, fvwm only works with xorg and most likely won't be ported. > >> > >>> What are the differences between fvwm2 and fvwm3? > >>> > >> See https://github.com/fvwmorg/fvwm3/discussions/878 > > > > Good pointer, thanks! > > > > It's a pity that there's no fvwm for wayland. Xorg doesn't seem to be > > maintainted anymore and is on the way out. That only leaves us Gnome > > and KDE. All the diversity we used to have is gone with that. > > > > > =-- paul fox, p...@foxharp.boston.ma.us (arlington, ma, where it's 38.9 degrees)
Re: FVWM: fvwm3?
Also a bunch of new DE/WM and soon XFCE. There will still be diversity, but a new one. However I'm not sure Xorg will be out soon there are still missing features on Wayland, like screen recording (available only on Gnome), which means that softwares like OBS don't work on it. Le 02/02/2024 à 04:28, hw a écrit : On Tue, 2024-01-30 at 14:02 -0700, Jaimos Skriletz wrote: On Tue, Jan 30, 2024 at 1:25 PM hw wrote: so is there finally a version that works for wayland? No, fvwm only works with xorg and most likely won't be ported. What are the differences between fvwm2 and fvwm3? See https://github.com/fvwmorg/fvwm3/discussions/878 Good pointer, thanks! It's a pity that there's no fvwm for wayland. Xorg doesn't seem to be maintainted anymore and is on the way out. That only leaves us Gnome and KDE. All the diversity we used to have is gone with that.
Re: FVWM: fvwm3?
At Fri, 02 Feb 2024 04:28:44 +0100 hw wrote: > > On Tue, 2024-01-30 at 14:02 -0700, Jaimos Skriletz wrote: > > On Tue, Jan 30, 2024 at 1:25â¯PM hw wrote: > > > > > > so is there finally a version that works for wayland? > > > > > No, fvwm only works with xorg and most likely won't be ported. > > > > > What are the differences between fvwm2 and fvwm3? > > > > > See https://github.com/fvwmorg/fvwm3/discussions/878 > > Good pointer, thanks! > > It's a pity that there's no fvwm for wayland. Xorg doesn't seem to be > maintainted anymore and is on the way out. That only leaves us Gnome > and KDE. All the diversity we used to have is gone with that. > Does wayland have an X11 compatibility feature? > > > -- Robert Heller -- Cell: 413-658-7953 GV: 978-633-5364 Deepwoods Software-- Custom Software Services http://www.deepsoft.com/ -- Linux Administration Services hel...@deepsoft.com -- Webhosting Services
