Re: [gatortalk] Talk about the fake FG
What do you call the team that beats MSU, Georgia, Vanderbilt and South Carolina, but loses to Appalachian State and FSU? SEC East champs! A. Leon Polhill, Gator "I was gratified to be able to answer promptly, and I did. I said I didn't know." - Mark Twain From: Ken Kirkley To: gatortalk@googlegroups.com Sent: Mon, October 11, 2010 9:45:40 AM Subject: RE: [gatortalk] Talk about the fake FG I don't disagree that we lost the game and could have played better. I do disagree that after we made a miraculous comeback, the game is decided on a bad call. You have to keep all of this in perspective, we could have made more plays, they could have and the officials could have. End result, we lost. And while yes we are 1 game away from wait till next year, we are also on track to win the SECE and have a shot at an SECC and BCS bowl. Ken K MNGator [clipped for Steve] -- GATORS: ONE VOICE ON SATURDAY - NO VOICE ON SUNDAY! 1996 National Football Champions | 2006 National Basketball Champions 2006 National Football Champions | 2007 National Basketball Champions 2008 National Football Champions | Three Heisman Trophy winners: Steve Spurrier (1966), Danny Wuerffel (1996), Tim Tebow (2007) - Visit our website at www.gatornet.us
RE: [gatortalk] Talk about the fake FG
Ken, It sure looked like the holder had his right knee on the yard line. He flips the ball over his head and you could not see exactly where his hand left the ball. However, when you look at the replay, you are able to see his right leg on the yard line. The ball appeared to hit on the yard line. Consequently, the ball must have left his hand behind the yard line-thus a forward pass. I will grant that there could have been a parallax error there but the camera angle looked dead on. That being said, it should have never gotten to that point. Jerry From: gatortalk@googlegroups.com [mailto:gatort...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Ken Kirkley Sent: Sunday, October 10, 2010 11:14 AM To: gatortalk@googlegroups.com Subject: [gatortalk] Talk about the fake FG I am never one to complain about the refs, as I believe they are human (at least most except the Childress crew) and are apt to err from time to time. If you play well, generally any officiating mistakes don't come into play. I have seen a lot of people complaining about the fake FG, there are several issues with the call: - since the holders knee was on the ground and no kicker behind him, was he down? - if it was a backwards pass and it hit the ground, why was the kicker able to advance the fumble on 4th down? - was it a forward pass that hit the ground? As to the holders knee on the ground, that is legal. The rule states that it is okay if you are simulating a kick. While you could interpret that has a kicker must be there, it is accepted as once you line up and snap the ball with the kicker in position, that satisfies the simulating a kick requirement. The second point, a backwards pass is different than a fumble. While a fumble can only be advanced by the fumbler on 4th down, a backwards pass is deemed a loose ball and can be picked up by anyone on the offense. Was it a forward pass? This one is close and is probably the best place for Gator fans to argue. The rules state that when in doubt, it is a forward pass. Here is the rule: Forward and Backward Pass ARTICLE 2. a. A forward pass is determined by the point where the ball first strikes the ground, a player, an official or anything beyond the spot of the pass. All other passes are backward passes. When in question, it is a forward pass rather than a backward pass when thrown in or behind the neutral zone. I don't think you can look at the replay and tell definitively, you would have needed a camera exactly along the line of the pass to determine. You can google parallax error to figue out why the camera angle we saw wouldn't necessarily be accurate. It does look like it was forward slightly and the ref should have ruled so initially, when he didn't there wasn't enough video evidence to overturn. Unfortunately, this call didn't go our way. This same play was used against us two years ago and we should have been in FG safe, especially on a 54 yard kick, especially on the edges. A block of a kick that long will come in the middle, the kick will come out low and quick. The guys on the edge had to hold contain, they weren't going to block the kick. I blame this on the coaches, just like Kirby Smart was jumping up and down for the jump pass last week, I was yelling at the TV to watch the biggest gambler in football and the fake. Nobody listened... Ken K MNGator -- GATORS: ONE VOICE ON SATURDAY - NO VOICE ON SUNDAY! 1996 National Football Champions | 2006 National Basketball Champions 2006 National Football Champions | 2007 National Basketball Champions 2008 National Football Champions | Three Heisman Trophy winners: Steve Spurrier (1966), Danny Wuerffel (1996), Tim Tebow (2007) - Visit our website at www.gatornet.us -- GATORS: ONE VOICE ON SATURDAY - NO VOICE ON SUNDAY! 1996 National Football Champions | 2006 National Basketball Champions 2006 National Football Champions | 2007 National Basketball Champions 2008 National Football Champions | Three Heisman Trophy winners: Steve Spurrier (1966), Danny Wuerffel (1996), Tim Tebow (2007) - Visit our website at www.gatornet.us
[gatortalk] Talk about the fake FG
I am never one to complain about the refs, as I believe they are human (at least most except the Childress crew) and are apt to err from time to time. If you play well, generally any officiating mistakes don't come into play. I have seen a lot of people complaining about the fake FG, there are several issues with the call: - since the holders knee was on the ground and no kicker behind him, was he down? - if it was a backwards pass and it hit the ground, why was the kicker able to advance the fumble on 4th down? - was it a forward pass that hit the ground? As to the holders knee on the ground, that is legal. The rule states that it is okay if you are simulating a kick. While you could interpret that has a kicker must be there, it is accepted as once you line up and snap the ball with the kicker in position, that satisfies the simulating a kick requirement. The second point, a backwards pass is different than a fumble. While a fumble can only be advanced by the fumbler on 4th down, a backwards pass is deemed a loose ball and can be picked up by anyone on the offense. Was it a forward pass? This one is close and is probably the best place for Gator fans to argue. The rules state that when in doubt, it is a forward pass. Here is the rule: Forward and Backward Pass ARTICLE 2. a. A forward pass is determined by the point where the ball first strikes the ground, a player, an official or anything beyond the spot of the pass. All other passes are backward passes. When in question, it is a forward pass rather than a backward pass when thrown in or behind the neutral zone. I don't think you can look at the replay and tell definitively, you would have needed a camera exactly along the line of the pass to determine. You can google parallax error to figue out why the camera angle we saw wouldn't necessarily be accurate. It does look like it was forward slightly and the ref should have ruled so initially, when he didn't there wasn't enough video evidence to overturn. Unfortunately, this call didn't go our way. This same play was used against us two years ago and we should have been in FG safe, especially on a 54 yard kick, especially on the edges. A block of a kick that long will come in the middle, the kick will come out low and quick. The guys on the edge had to hold contain, they weren't going to block the kick. I blame this on the coaches, just like Kirby Smart was jumping up and down for the jump pass last week, I was yelling at the TV to watch the biggest gambler in football and the fake. Nobody listened... Ken K MNGator -- GATORS: ONE VOICE ON SATURDAY - NO VOICE ON SUNDAY! 1996 National Football Champions | 2006 National Basketball Champions 2006 National Football Champions | 2007 National Basketball Champions 2008 National Football Champions | Three Heisman Trophy winners: Steve Spurrier (1966), Danny Wuerffel (1996), Tim Tebow (2007) - Visit our website at www.gatornet.us
