[RESULT][VOTE] Accept Zipkin into the Apache Incubator

[Mick Semb Wever]

> This vote will run at least 72 hours. Please VOTE as follows:
> 
> [ ] +1 Accept Zipkin into the Apache Incubator
> [ ] +0 No opinion
> [ ] -1 Do not accept Zipkin into the Apache Incubator because…


72 hours has passed and the vote for accepting Zipkin into Apache Incubator has 
passed with: 

  15 binding "+1" votes
  12 non-binding "+1" votes
  no "0" and 
  no "-1" votes


Binding votes:
 - Ate Douma
 - Henry Saputra
 - Mark Struberg
 - Byung-Gon Chun
 - Kevin A. McGrail
 - Josh Elser
 - Matt Sicker
 - Andrew Purtell
 - Ignasi Barrera
 - Willem Jiang
 - Von Gosling
 - Romain Manni-Bucau
 - James Taylor
- Greg Trasuk
- Mick Semb Wever


Non-binding votes:
- Adrian Cole
 - xin zhang
 - Sheng Wu 吴晟
 - Xin Wang
 - Ashish Paliwal
 - Zen Lin
 - Andrey Redko
 - Mike Drob
 - Arpit Agarwal
 - Deepak Nair
 - Brian Devins
 - Peng Yongsheng 彭勇升


regards,
Mick


References:
 - VOTE: 
https://lists.apache.org/thread.html/3e4fe5458b8e545dbb18c5b54457259ccd74f117bac3d50005e40132@%3Cgeneral.incubator.apache.org%3E
 - PROPOSAL: 
https://lists.apache.org/thread.html/54798a5059db1d5716ed9910a15c92945509a25ec3b7ccb6b1215c53@%3Cgeneral.incubator.apache.org%3E

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Re: Dealing with Unresponsive Mentors

[P. Taylor Goetz]

I increasingly tend to agree. However, if we put the onus on PPMCs to police 
inactive mentors, there should probably be a documented process in place (which 
it is [1]).

My concern with that policy is the potential for a chilling effect. Mentors are 
more often than not ASF Members. I can easily imagine situations where podlings 
might avoid such a move out of fear of offending an ASF Member.

-Taylor


[1] https://incubator.apache.org/guides/ppmc.html#removing_a_mentor

> On Aug 29, 2018, at 7:33 PM, Julian Hyde  wrote:
> 
> There was a long thread about absent mentors a few months ago[1]. The 
> consensus on the thread seemed to be to introduce some metrics. I was and am 
> skeptical of that approach because it requires constant attention from the 
> IPMC.
> 
> The solution I advocated in that thread is to encourage podlings to ask for 
> help if they are not getting service from their mentors. And perhaps to add a 
> "Have your mentors been helpful and responsive?” question to the report 
> template.
> 
> Julian
> 
> [1] 
> https://lists.apache.org/thread.html/e80a611ea233a5f854aae5f63374e6490af70a5ecbe886874111037c@%3Cgeneral.incubator.apache.org%3E
>  
> 
> 
>> On Aug 29, 2018, at 1:46 PM, Justin Mclean  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>>> What is the process of essentially off-boarding unresponsive and inactive
>>> mentors with the sole aim of attracting new mentors who can inject life
>>> into various aspects of podling maturity?
>> 
>> I’d just ask them if they can continue in the role or still have the cycles 
>> to help. If they can’t continue or are unresponsive then just ask for more 
>> mentors for the project on this list.
>> 
>> Thanks,
>> Justin
>> -
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org
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>> 
> 

Re: Dealing with Unresponsive Mentors

[Julian Hyde]

There was a long thread about absent mentors a few months ago[1]. The consensus 
on the thread seemed to be to introduce some metrics. I was and am skeptical of 
that approach because it requires constant attention from the IPMC.

The solution I advocated in that thread is to encourage podlings to ask for 
help if they are not getting service from their mentors. And perhaps to add a 
"Have your mentors been helpful and responsive?” question to the report 
template.

Julian

[1] 
https://lists.apache.org/thread.html/e80a611ea233a5f854aae5f63374e6490af70a5ecbe886874111037c@%3Cgeneral.incubator.apache.org%3E
 


> On Aug 29, 2018, at 1:46 PM, Justin Mclean  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
>> What is the process of essentially off-boarding unresponsive and inactive
>> mentors with the sole aim of attracting new mentors who can inject life
>> into various aspects of podling maturity?
> 
> I’d just ask them if they can continue in the role or still have the cycles 
> to help. If they can’t continue or are unresponsive then just ask for more 
> mentors for the project on this list.
> 
> Thanks,
> Justin
> -
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> 

Re: Poddlings length of time in the incubator

[P. Taylor Goetz]

> On Aug 28, 2018, at 9:01 PM, Roman Shaposhnik  wrote:
> 
>> On Sun, Aug 26, 2018 at 1:40 PM, Julian Hyde  wrote:
>> Regarding Quickstep. I am a mentor. (One mentor resigned earlier this
>> year, but the other mentor, Roman, is sufficiently engaged.)
>> 
>> I am concerned that Quickstep is not going to graduate. They are
>> functioning well as an academic project, as evidenced by papers at top
>> conferences[1], but all of their contributors are from the same
>> university department. They have made a few efforts at community
>> building, but do not seem to be building a user base, or attracting
>> outside contributions.
>> 
>> (Note that traffic for July and August is lower than usual, due to
>> their contributors being in academia. Traffic on the dev list should
>> pick up somewhat in September.)
>> 
>> Embrace of Apache has been half-hearted. Note, for instance, that
>> their twitter account [2] still references their pre-Apache home page
>> [3] rather than their Apache page [4].
>> 
>> Quickstep made their first release in March 2017 but have not made
>> further releases. I am going encourage them to make a new release
>> soon. That will stimulate some community activity. But I am dubious
>> that this will attract outside contributors.
> 
> Basically, I'm +1 on every single point that Julian makes, but having
> said this I'm unsure as to where can we go from here.
> 
> In the past we typically shied away from setting deadlines for certain
> milestones in community development within podlings. This, in my view,
> somewhat encouraged this phenomenon of an "eternal podling" (active
> enough not to be in the attic, not active/ApacheWay'y enough to
> graduate). I feel like Quickstep, for example, can exist in this state
> indefinitely.

FWIW, for the DLab proposal [1], we added a voluntary incubation period max of 
2 years, essentially saying we didn’t want to become a resource drain. I 
haven’t checked to see if any other projects have done this.

I’m also not sure if that’s in any way binding, or what the mechanics of that 
would be. I imagine at the 2-year mark there would be a PPMC vote to either a) 
retire, or b) request additional time from the IPMC. If b, then the IPMC would 
either approve or deny the extension request.

> 
> 
> Thanks,
> Roman.

-Taylor

[1] https://wiki.apache.org/incubator/DLabProposal

> 
>> Julian
>> 
>> [1] http://www.vldb.org/pvldb/vol11/p663-patel.pdf
>> 
>> [2] https://twitter.com/ApacheQuickstep
>> 
>> [3] http://quickstep.cs.wisc.edu/
>> 
>> [4] http://quickstep.apache.org/
>>> On Sun, Aug 26, 2018 at 10:17 AM Mark Thomas  wrote:
>>> 
 On 26/08/18 02:30, Justin Mclean wrote:
 Hi,
 
> I’ve discussed this some on the ODF toolkit dev list. Development was 
> recently moved to Git. The Incubator needs to decide if we will turnover 
> the domains that were donated in 2011 by IBM(?) to the only consistent 
> developer. If that is true then we can quickly let them retire, but 
> survive on Github.
 
 I also saw you mentioned it in a previous incubator report for the 
 podling. What are the domain names in question? I think doing as you 
 suggested sounds like a good idea do you want to take that back to the 
 PPMC and discuss and/or vote on doing that.
 
 Any other IPMC members think differently?
>>> 
>>> The podling PMC can make a recommendation but the decision to release a
>>> domain name to a third party needs the approval of VP Brand Management.
>>> 
>>> We also need to find the transfer agreements (if any) for those domains
>>> to see what the ASF agreed to at the time of donation. It is not unheard
>>> of for such agreements to include a clause that ownership reverts to the
>>> donor if the podling does not graduate.
>>> 
>>> Mark
>>> 
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>>> 
>> 
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>> 
> 
> -
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> 

Re: Dealing with Unresponsive Mentors

[Justin Mclean]

Hi,

> What is the process of essentially off-boarding unresponsive and inactive
> mentors with the sole aim of attracting new mentors who can inject life
> into various aspects of podling maturity?

I’d just ask them if they can continue in the role or still have the cycles to 
help. If they can’t continue or are unresponsive then just ask for more mentors 
for the project on this list.

Thanks,
Justin
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Re: Poddlings length of time in the incubator

[Roman Shaposhnik]

On Tue, Aug 28, 2018 at 10:22 PM, Greg Stein  wrote:
> On Tue, Aug 28, 2018 at 8:01 PM Roman Shaposhnik 
> wrote:
>>...
>
>> In the past we typically shied away from setting deadlines for certain
>> milestones in community development within podlings. This, in my view,
>> somewhat encouraged this phenomenon of an "eternal podling" (active
>> enough not to be in the attic, not active/ApacheWay'y enough to
>> graduate). I feel like Quickstep, for example, can exist in this state
>> indefinitely.
>
>
> I think there is/can/should be a different bar for TLPs "idle-ness", and
> that of a podling. A TLP has confirmed itself for operation/oversight, even
> when it may slow down. A podling hasn't had that confirmation, however.
>
> One of the more continual issues within the Incubator is the amount of
> mentor energy to "go around". It seems that if a podling has hit a dead
> end, then it is best for the Incubator (as a whole) to go ahead and retire
> it, and apply its energies to podlings that are making progress towards
> graduation.

True, but the other argument is that the process is self-throttling: the slower
the podling gets, the less energy it requires from the mentor
(although, I suppose
there's a "fixed energy cost" in chasing reports, etc. below which it
will never go).

Thanks,
Roman.

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Dealing with Unresponsive Mentors

[lewis john mcgibbney]

Hi Folks,
What is the process of essentially off-boarding unresponsive and inactive
mentors with the sole aim of attracting new mentors who can inject life
into various aspects of podling maturity?
Lewis

-- 
http://home.apache.org/~lewismc/
http://people.apache.org/keys/committer/lewismc

Re: Poddlings length of time in the incubator

[lewis john mcgibbney]

Hi Justin,
Response inline

On Sun, Aug 26, 2018 at 8:29 PM 
wrote:

> From: Justin Mclean 
> To: general@incubator.apache.org
> Cc:
> Bcc:
> Date: Sun, 26 Aug 2018 09:43:36 +1000
> Subject: Poddlings length of time in the incubator
> Hi,
>
> Below is a list of podlings that have been in the incubator for more than
> 2 years. What can be done to encourage these projects along? Do they have
> missing mentors or need some other assistance?
>

W.r.t Joshua, the primary leader moved on to other things. We were also
discussing graduation not too long ago but again, similar to with SensSoft,
the mentorship didn't act in time and we are in the current status.
I think it is time to graduate Joshua as the software itself is very
healthy and I know there are folks using the project. I am going to make an
attempt to reboot the project and encourage graduation.
Lewis

Re: Missing podling board reports

[lewis john mcgibbney]

Hi Justin,
Response inline

On Sun, Aug 26, 2018 at 8:29 PM 
wrote:

> From: Justin Mclean 
> To: general@incubator.apache.org
> Cc:
> Bcc:
> Date: Sun, 26 Aug 2018 09:35:47 +1000
> Subject: Missing podling board reports
> Hi,
>
> The following podlings have missed two (or more) board reports in a row.
> - Annotator
> - Milagro
> - Pony Mail
> - S2Graph
> - SensSoft
>

I was filing for SensSoft. I have not filed two previous two to see what
happened. No other mentors have responded and we definitely need to work
with the PPMC to make them aware that reporting is essential.


>
> I’m  wondering what the issue is here. Do these podlings have missing
> mentors or is there some other reason for not reporting?


With SensSoft, see above. When I stopped filing, no-one stepped up. This is
an issue needing addressing at both mentors-level and PPMC-level.


> While mentors don’t need to write the report they should prompt the PPMC
> to do so.
>

This is exactly what I will be doing from now on.


>
> I see very little traffic on any of these mailing lists.
>

SensSoft PPMC members have been changing employers recently. I think this
is still settling in. I'm going to poll them and see what the status of the
project is. We actually were talking about Graduating not that long ago
https://s.apache.org/DcTA
I also took this to the general@ mailing list, but regrettably never
followed up as the summer kicked in. I am going to restart this and see
where we can get.

Lewis