Re: [gentoo-dev] Marking bugs for bugday?
On Sunday 28 February 2010 00:14:36 Mark Loeser wrote: Ben de Groot yng...@gentoo.org said: Its been pretty much dead. We need more developer involvement so users can actually talk to them and help resolve issues. If we can't get enough developers to participate then we should just stop trying to do it instead of putting on such a poor showing. I would like to be involved but not in the current disorganized form. Our #gentoo-bugs channel topic still refers to the thoroughly outdated bugsday.g.o page, and I can't edit either of them. I can modify the channel topic for you. I should have a login for the bugsday.g.o page somewhere, if not...I'm sure we can get one. welp transfered #gentoo-bugs to you last time when i asked him, so you are now the owner. But every developer can change topic by /msg chanserv topic #gentoo-bugs -- Cheers Dawid Węgliński
Re: [gentoo-dev] Marking bugs for bugday?
On Sat, Feb 27, 2010 at 06:38:57PM +0100, Sebastian Pipping wrote: bugday.gentoo.org could still be used as an entry point showing these bugs. http://bugday.gentoo.org/ would easily be made able to show bugs with a specific Bugzilla keyword only. If I recall correctly, we had to do some very naughty things back when Gentoo changed the Bugzilla system to run with a MySQL cluster as backend. Back in the early days of Bugday, the site queried the database directly, but these days it uses Bugzilla's XML API for all the requests, which is why it takes forever to load the page. We did spend one Bugday making it a bit faster though, but it's still not fast enough (yes, it was even worse before that). A rewrite with a cache would probably not be a bad idea and it would be an easy task for any user who wants to contribute with something useful :) Until then, it would probably be a good idea to clean up the ACL of http://bugday.gentoo.org/. I'm still able to log in using my ancient username and password, and I can see on the accesslist that there are multiple former developers who still has access to the site. -- Alexander Færøy pgpJngzegL7g3.pgp Description: PGP signature
[gentoo-dev] sudo vs su
All, I am starting this thread because I don't understand why people are using sudo and su together. They are completely separate utilities that do the same thing. AFAIK, it should be either sudo -i or su -, but not sudo su - which I have seen quite often. sudo su - is redundant because su - does the same thing as sudo -i. sudo -s, afaik, gives you a root shell but does not clear out the environment first. Am I completely missing something? William pgpsWOG5IvAvw.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] sudo vs su
On Sun, Feb 28, 2010 at 12:20 PM, William Hubbs willi...@gentoo.org wrote: I am starting this thread because I don't understand why people are using sudo and su together. They are completely separate utilities that do the same thing. AFAIK, it should be either sudo -i or su -, but not sudo su - which I have seen quite often. sudo su - is redundant because su - does the same thing as sudo -i. sudo -s, afaik, gives you a root shell but does not clear out the environment first. Am I completely missing something? Some systems are configured with a random root password. After a while you get tired of doing 'sudo command' all the time and would like to become root but you can't because you don't know the root password. One way around that is 'sudo su -' which allows to become root using your user password. Denis.
Re: [gentoo-dev] sudo vs su
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Hiya William, Sudo can be used to restrict access, so that only certain programs can be run using it. It asks for your password rather than the user you're trying to login to (unlike su). It also helps maintain a more accurate audit trail (although I don't have details on exactly how it does that). Also su I believe only allows access to people in the wheel group. Therefore, you'll see people using them in conjunction (particularly with systems like ubuntu that don't give you a root user), so that a user can enter their own password and be restricted to a particular program in this case su, and keep better audit logs all thanks to sudo. Whilst at the same time it still gives you complete access to the system/login shell through su (a simpler and therefore presumably easier to secure program). So they can achieve the same results, but it is the differences in the programs and the way they work that makes people choose one over the other (or try and combine their best qualities). That's the best of my understanding, hope it helps? Mike 5:) -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v2.0.14 (GNU/Linux) iEYEARECAAYFAkuKyisACgkQu7rWomwgFXp6KQCfRGn4b10R8onUVIXlaMgGJ/1o gpQAn1wiKNrFzlHZLKozCgaJujSUkKH4 =55Bj -END PGP SIGNATURE-
Re: [gentoo-dev] Marking bugs for bugday?
On Saturday 27 February 2010 06:18:39 Sebastian Pipping wrote: Hello! I'm surprised that there is no keyword in Gentoo's bugzilla [1] to mark bugs for bugday. Is there a good reason why such a keyword does not exist? Would it be hard to set up? Thanks, Sebastian [1] https://bugs.gentoo.org/describekeywords.cgi Do we still have bugdays? Who is taking care of this project and the respective webpage? I think we first need to answer these questions before we even consider resurrect this project -- Markos Chandras (hwoarang) Gentoo Linux Developer Web: http://hwoarang.silverarrow.org signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Re: [gentoo-dev] sudo vs su
Denis Dupeyron calc...@gentoo.org writes: Some systems are configured with a random root password. After a while you get tired of doing 'sudo command' all the time and would like to become root but you can't because you don't know the root password. One way around that is 'sudo su -' which allows to become root using your user password. When I had to do this on a (RHEL) system, I did not think of using 'sudo su -', I used 'sudo bash'.
Re: [gentoo-dev] sudo vs su
On Sun, Feb 28, 2010 at 11:52 AM, Denis Dupeyron calc...@gentoo.org wrote: On Sun, Feb 28, 2010 at 12:20 PM, William Hubbs willi...@gentoo.org wrote: I am starting this thread because I don't understand why people are using sudo and su together. They are completely separate utilities that do the same thing. AFAIK, it should be either sudo -i or su -, but not sudo su - which I have seen quite often. sudo su - is redundant because su - does the same thing as sudo -i. sudo -s, afaik, gives you a root shell but does not clear out the environment first. Am I completely missing something? Some systems are configured with a random root password. After a while you get tired of doing 'sudo command' all the time and would like to become root but you can't because you don't know the root password. One way around that is 'sudo su -' which allows to become root using your user password. Try sudo -s or sudo -i if you want sudo to clean your environment. Denis.
[gentoo-dev] Automated Package Removal and Addition Tracker, for the week ending 2010-02-28 23h59 UTC
The attached list notes all of the packages that were added or removed from the tree, for the week ending 2010-02-28 23h59 UTC. Removals: virtual/talloc 2010-02-26 20:19:52 ssuominen virtual/tdb 2010-02-26 20:19:52 ssuominen media-video/dvbcut 2010-02-26 21:13:07 billie sci-chemistry/psipred 2010-02-28 10:55:51 jlec sys-apps/sdd2010-02-28 16:38:59 vostorga Additions: app-backup/backupninja 2010-02-22 16:41:06 scarabeus media-sound/clementine 2010-02-22 19:57:21 ssuominen x11-libs/libfm 2010-02-22 21:38:46 yngwin net-libs/libmapi2010-02-23 12:31:58 dagger media-gfx/tachyon 2010-02-23 17:44:00 alexxy dev-java/mojarra2010-02-23 22:01:02 nelchael www-apps/cgit 2010-02-23 22:54:11 ramereth sci-chemistry/mars 2010-02-24 08:17:48 jlec net-proxy/cntlm 2010-02-24 13:18:15 mduft sci-libs/tnt2010-02-25 05:59:43 bicatali sci-libs/jama 2010-02-25 06:03:43 bicatali sci-misc/brlcad 2010-02-25 06:15:11 bicatali sci-chemistry/pymol-plugins-emovie 2010-02-25 16:24:20 jlec media-sound/pms 2010-02-25 21:23:18 wired media-plugins/banshee-community-extensions 2010-02-26 06:29:52 ford_prefect app-shells/prll 2010-02-26 10:00:58 jlec kde-misc/knetworkmanager2010-02-26 19:14:01 tampakrap media-libs/clutter 2010-02-26 21:41:15 nirbheek media-libs/clutter-gst 2010-02-26 22:02:42 nirbheek media-libs/clutter-gtk 2010-02-26 22:06:06 nirbheek dev-python/pyclutter2010-02-26 22:42:28 nirbheek dev-python/pyclutter-gtk2010-02-26 22:56:20 nirbheek dev-python/pyclutter-gst2010-02-26 22:56:31 nirbheek dev-libs/gobject-introspection 2010-02-26 23:41:36 nirbheek media-sound/dbmeasure 2010-02-27 01:11:41 robbat2 gpe-utils/gpe-filemanager 2010-02-27 01:15:30 miknix sci-chemistry/psipred 2010-02-27 10:01:52 jlec sci-chemistry/pymol-plugins-bni-tools 2010-02-27 10:36:49 jlec dev-util/piklab 2010-02-28 00:52:41 ssuominen sci-biology/psipred 2010-02-28 10:31:18 jlec -- Robin Hugh Johnson Gentoo Linux Developer E-Mail : robb...@gentoo.org GnuPG FP : 11AC BA4F 4778 E3F6 E4ED F38E B27B 944E 3488 4E85 Removed Packages: virtual/talloc,removed,ssuominen,2010-02-26 20:19:52 virtual/tdb,removed,ssuominen,2010-02-26 20:19:52 media-video/dvbcut,removed,billie,2010-02-26 21:13:07 sci-chemistry/psipred,removed,jlec,2010-02-28 10:55:51 sys-apps/sdd,removed,vostorga,2010-02-28 16:38:59 Added Packages: app-backup/backupninja,added,scarabeus,2010-02-22 16:41:06 media-sound/clementine,added,ssuominen,2010-02-22 19:57:21 x11-libs/libfm,added,yngwin,2010-02-22 21:38:46 net-libs/libmapi,added,dagger,2010-02-23 12:31:58 media-gfx/tachyon,added,alexxy,2010-02-23 17:44:00 dev-java/mojarra,added,nelchael,2010-02-23 22:01:02 www-apps/cgit,added,ramereth,2010-02-23 22:54:11 sci-chemistry/mars,added,jlec,2010-02-24 08:17:48 net-proxy/cntlm,added,mduft,2010-02-24 13:18:15 sci-libs/tnt,added,bicatali,2010-02-25 05:59:43 sci-libs/jama,added,bicatali,2010-02-25 06:03:43 sci-misc/brlcad,added,bicatali,2010-02-25 06:15:11 sci-chemistry/pymol-plugins-emovie,added,jlec,2010-02-25 16:24:20 media-sound/pms,added,wired,2010-02-25 21:23:18 media-plugins/banshee-community-extensions,added,ford_prefect,2010-02-26 06:29:52 app-shells/prll,added,jlec,2010-02-26 10:00:58 kde-misc/knetworkmanager,added,tampakrap,2010-02-26 19:14:01 media-libs/clutter,added,nirbheek,2010-02-26 21:41:15 media-libs/clutter-gst,added,nirbheek,2010-02-26 22:02:42 media-libs/clutter-gtk,added,nirbheek,2010-02-26 22:06:06 dev-python/pyclutter,added,nirbheek,2010-02-26 22:42:28 dev-python/pyclutter-gtk,added,nirbheek,2010-02-26 22:56:20 dev-python/pyclutter-gst,added,nirbheek,2010-02-26 22:56:31 dev-libs/gobject-introspection,added,nirbheek,2010-02-26 23:41:36 media-sound/dbmeasure,added,robbat2,2010-02-27 01:11:41 gpe-utils/gpe-filemanager,added,miknix,2010-02-27 01:15:30 sci-chemistry/psipred,added,jlec,2010-02-27 10:01:52 sci-chemistry/pymol-plugins-bni-tools,added,jlec,2010-02-27 10:36:49
Re: [gentoo-dev] Marking bugs for bugday?
On Sun, 28 Feb 2010 21:04:04 +0100 Sebastian Pipping sp...@gentoo.org wrote: On 02/28/10 20:54, Markos Chandras wrote: Do we still have bugdays? Who is taking care of this project and the respective webpage? I think we first need to answer these questions before we even consider resurrect this project welp - away He's not away, he's retired. It's just taken several months to close his bug. gurligebis - no reply yet I thought gurli was also retired. signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Python-3.2-related changes
On Mon, Mar 01, 2010 at 04:13:10AM +0100, Arfrever Frehtes Taifersar Arahesis wrote: (Please note that wrapper scripts generated by python_generate_wrapper_scripts() work with all versions of Python from 2.4 to 3.2, so shebangs in these scripts do not need any changes.) What is the recommended policy about using or not using wrapper scripts? Maybe it also should be documented? [1] http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/Python/developersguide.xml What about merging (or at least linking) this documentation with Gentoo Development Guide? The latter one already contains distutils related chapter and probably it is a good idea to decribe python.eclass usage in another chapter or eclass reference.
Re: [gentoo-dev] metadata.xml: changepolicies
On Friday 26 February 2010 18:40:47 Alec Warner wrote: On Thu, Feb 25, 2010 at 12:53 PM, Sebastian Pipping sp...@gentoo.org wrote: Stop. Is introduction of such a high level of bureaucracy really a good idea? In my eyes it could backfire and make matters worse as people either - start ignoring it due to high noise - reduce people's activity below set permissions To summarize presented proposal has a few points that may not work well with humans. To my understanding we have the assumption in Gentoo that a Gentoo dev is at least willing to use his brain most of the time. To me such a machine only makes sense when assuming the opposite(!) You mistake the intent I think. We deploy automation because humans fail; even when they have the best intentions. We make typos, copy and paste errors, accidentally leave whitespace, type commands into the wrong shell, hit the wrong key that kills our session, etc. Smart people avoid work by making a computer do parts that are easily automated; which is why the proposed system is so fine-grained. We can likely add some logic to our current toolset to remind the human that they may have further obligations than just typing repoman commit (like asking on a bug, a mailing list, irc, etc.) With a really simple system; we cannot easily automate when to do what because the criteria are so broad. I agree that a moderately complex system is useless for humans (I'd ignore it straight out) which is why we should write software to do the work for us. I am much more likely to respond to a message from repoman telling me I need to file a bug first as opposed to me looking at metadata.xml every time I commit something. Sure there are people who never read repoman output and commit utter crap to the tree; but I do not really expect 100% success from any system we deploy; I'd be happy with 60% honestly. So I would like to propose a much more loose and simple approach: A distinction - between major and minor changes - need for prior interaction or not A sensible default may differ from developer to developer. I propose collecting these defaults somewhere and make it overridable per maintainer per package in metadata.xml (just as robbat2 did). One question to decide would be if access is allowed iff - no one is objecting or - everyone is acknowledging Once all defaults are collected the options are equal, before they are not. How to best handle herds is not clear to me in detail, yet. Anyone seing potential in this minimalistic with a natural extension on herds in mind? Sebastian In my eyes, we don't need a smarter repoman to check whether we are supposed or not to do a specific commit. What we need are rules ( stricter or not ) which DO apply to all developers, and a team ( devrel ) which will be responsible to do that. Repoman will not help the situation but it will add a new level of complexity into our already complex communication system. We need an active devrel team which will postpone commit access to those developers who are repeatedly fail to behave correctly whatever that means. That said, i am totally again messing with metadata.xml as long as there problem resides in a much higher level -- Markos Chandras (hwoarang) Gentoo Linux Developer Web: http://hwoarang.silverarrow.org signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
