Re: [Gimp-developer] Please migrate to GitHub/CMake
On Sun, May 7, 2017 at 4:07 PM, Liam R E Quin wrote: > Please remember that English is not the first language of everyone on > this list, and people come from a wide range of cultures. I don't think > Alexandre meant to be dismissive or rude with his "No" (and I think > Carol's comment was meant ironically although I'm not certain). > Oh, in real, they truly concerned me. AND they did make me cry at the meeting about the web site, so it really depends on the day and the mood for how much I agree they are jerks or not. > On Sun, 2017-05-07 at 17:37 +0300, Alexandre Prokoudine wrote: >> On Sun, May 7, 2017 at 5:06 PM, Shlomi Fish wrote: >> >> > I see some problems with GIMP development: >> > >> > 1. It's been taking too long to release new major versions. > Shlomi knows that it is taking the same amount of time that all the others did. I have been concerned because work seems to have stopped on the gtk3 branch > I build GIMP from git on my Mageia cauldron system. Yes, there are some > issues (I have to build gegl without video capture support for > example, because there's no video device on my system since I don't > have a camera) but if you have problems I'm happy to try & help. > I was told by one of the gimp-1.2 guys that Liam had joined the dark side. carol ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list
Re: [Gimp-developer] Please migrate to GitHub/CMake
First, to all - Please remember that English is not the first language of everyone on this list, and people come from a wide range of cultures. I don't think Alexandre meant to be dismissive or rude with his "No" (and I think Carol's comment was meant ironically although I'm not certain). GIMP uses git but not github; GIMP uses Make and the automake tools and not CMake. A project that's less widely used can more easily switch infrastructure. When cmake goes wrong it's even harder to diagnose and fix than automake (as others have pointed out already) and I doubt there'd be enough of an advantage in moving to it to justify the one-time cost to the large numbers of people who package GIMP for redistribution, have automated build systems, port GIMP to Windows and other platforms, and so on. In any case the GIMP team is made of volunteers and we don't have people saying "I've been around for several years and I'll be around for several more years and I know CMake really well and am familiar with supporting it on OpenSolaris and FreeBSD and GNU/Debian Linux™ and Centos and OS X and Microsoft Windows in several versions and platforms... and I'd like to do the work of switching, and I'll spend at least a day every week on it." More inline... On Sun, 2017-05-07 at 17:37 +0300, Alexandre Prokoudine wrote: > On Sun, May 7, 2017 at 5:06 PM, Shlomi Fish wrote: > > > I see some problems with GIMP development: > > > > 1. It's been taking too long to release new major versions. GIMP's internals have been undergoing a very major rewrite. But I think once the new architecture is released it'll be a lot easier for developers to participate, because the interaction between components is becoming explicit (a node-based graph). > > [...] > > 3. GIMP is lacking many features that are present in similar > > proprietary programs. If the feature sets are very different then the programs are not similar :-) > > > > 4. Some people still complain on GIMP being hard to use. We are working on silencing them but we ran out of anthr... er... lookm have you ever been to a graphics design class at a university and asked people whether the proprietary tools that are most widely taught are easy to use? Hint: they aren't. They're harder if anything. Some of that is because professional tools with a lot of features have to be learned, and people do training courses for them. Some of it, yes, includes areas where GIMP's UI can be improved, which is still very much a work in progress but has come a long way. With the next major release "single window mode" will be the default, which will help a lot of people even if we know it's not perfect. > > > > 5. A personal pet peeve - https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?i > > d=781340 > > (minor problem). I build GIMP from git on my Mageia cauldron system. Yes, there are some issues (I have to build gegl without video capture support for example, because there's no video device on my system since I don't have a camera) but if you have problems I'm happy to try & help. Liam [ankh] -- Liam R E Quin ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list
Re: [Gimp-developer] Please migrate to GitHub/CMake
I find conversation typically more friendly on IRC. Also, it's really awesome to be able to chat with project devs and others in the community in near real-time capacity. It's also easier to joke and share stuff without the need to spam the whole mailing list (not that anyone is doing that). My understanding typically increases ten fold every time I go ask questions. It's much easier to get opinions, and discuss things. You'd really never hope to be able to replace all the IRC conversations with mailing list stuff. It's a different dynamic entirely. That's just a personal experience. :) -C On Sun, May 7, 2017 at 8:20 PM, wwp wrote: > Hello, > > > On Sun, 7 May 2017 16:33:49 +0300 Shlomi Fish wrote: > >> Dear Alexandre, >> > [snip] >> As a side note regarding IRC - old does not necessarily imply it is bad (see >> http://www.shlomifish.org/humour/fortunes/show.cgi?id=two-kinds-of-fools ) >> and >> one can normally find some unified clients to communicate on more than one >> service. > > Agreed on that. The whole Claws Mail team is on IRC daily, > communicating about dev topics as well as personal ones, we're a team, > most of us are friends. It's sync and async ways of communicating, and > we have a channel archive. It's fast and lightweight, public and > private, can be done from a phone even, what would we want more or > different? Another thing to re-invent? ;-). IRC is probably (w/ email) > one of the oldest communication ways I se and still happy w/ it, it > does the work. > > > Regards, > >> Sun, 7 May 2017 16:08:24 +0300 Alexandre Prokoudine >> wrote: >> >> > On Sun, May 7, 2017 at 3:54 PM, gregory grey wrote: >> > >> > >>> Now, a person says "I'd like to suggest" and your reply is basically >> > >>> "f*** off". >> > >> >> > >> It's an interesting way to interpret a simple 'no'. >> > >> >> > > >> > > Turning tables much? You should interpret the number of developers on >> > > the projects into reasons of it being so. >> > >> > Irrelevant. >> ___ >> gimp-developer-list mailing list >> List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org >> List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list >> List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list > > -- > wwp > > ___ > gimp-developer-list mailing list > List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org > List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list > List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list > ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list
Re: [Gimp-developer] Please migrate to GitHub/CMake
Hello, On Sun, 7 May 2017 16:33:49 +0300 Shlomi Fish wrote: > Dear Alexandre, > [snip] > As a side note regarding IRC - old does not necessarily imply it is bad (see > http://www.shlomifish.org/humour/fortunes/show.cgi?id=two-kinds-of-fools ) and > one can normally find some unified clients to communicate on more than one > service. Agreed on that. The whole Claws Mail team is on IRC daily, communicating about dev topics as well as personal ones, we're a team, most of us are friends. It's sync and async ways of communicating, and we have a channel archive. It's fast and lightweight, public and private, can be done from a phone even, what would we want more or different? Another thing to re-invent? ;-). IRC is probably (w/ email) one of the oldest communication ways I se and still happy w/ it, it does the work. Regards, > Sun, 7 May 2017 16:08:24 +0300 Alexandre Prokoudine > wrote: > > > On Sun, May 7, 2017 at 3:54 PM, gregory grey wrote: > > > > >>> Now, a person says "I'd like to suggest" and your reply is basically > > >>> "f*** off". > > >> > > >> It's an interesting way to interpret a simple 'no'. > > >> > > > > > > Turning tables much? You should interpret the number of developers on > > > the projects into reasons of it being so. > > > > Irrelevant. > ___ > gimp-developer-list mailing list > List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org > List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list > List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list -- wwp pgpCRJ_4hVwsh.pgp Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list
Re: [Gimp-developer] Please migrate to GitHub/CMake
On Sun, May 7, 2017 at 9:13 PM, Boudewijn Rempt wrote: > And didn't take a lot of time. In 2006, that is, more than eleven years ago. That's the ticket :) Inkscape developers would tell a different story, and their one is fairly recent. Alex ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list
Re: [Gimp-developer] Please migrate to GitHub/CMake
On Sun, 7 May 2017, Øyvind Kolås wrote: > If cmake (or perhaps meson http://mesonbuild.com/ ?) truely is so easy > to use and provides big benefits, a patch that should be simple to > make that uses this or a script that automigrates contents from > autofoo files demonstrating the cross platform and building benefits > would be appreciated. Until the proof of concept is better than what > we currently have the incentive to switch to something requiring more > work for transitioning is unlikely. Well... I ain't gonna do that for GIMP, of course, but moving all of Krita from automake to cmake was really easy, made it much easier for others to add stuff, make the build system way more clear... And didn't take a lot of time. In 2006, that is, more than eleven years ago. I'm just offering this as a data point; Krita is only about twice as big as GIMP when it comes to lines of code, so it might be relevant. Also, all open source VFX related projects are using cmake these days. I have no opinion on Mesa, and I don't particularly _like_ cmake, but it's to autoconf and automake like auto* is to xmake. > The GNOME project which hosts GIMP (and related projects) source code > and issue trackers are considering changes to which > software/infrastructure these are hosted on, GIMP and related projects > will likely follow along + if and when such infrastructure migration > happens. Personally I would look forward to better bug/issue reporting > and tracking, as bugzilla has evolved I think it contains too many > mystery fields and drop-downs that confuse rather than guide the issue > tracking progress. And, of course, no sane open source/free software project should make github its main location. It's like hosting ones stuff on sourceforge; insane. -- Boudewijn Rempt | http://www.krita.org, http://www.valdyas.org ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list
Re: [Gimp-developer] Please migrate to GitHub/CMake
On Sun, May 7, 2017 at 6:25 PM, Chris Moller wrote: > Yes, that's it. Some cool stuff on it, especially the "Future" section, but > it's not clear what's most important to you right now. All the stuff in the "Future" section is unprioritized. It's too far off to deal with it now. Pretty much everything there could be worked on in a branch. We only do bugfixing for 2.10 right now, although tiny new features still do get added (mostly when a patch is submitted by a contributor, and the code is clean and needs not much attention). Alex ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list
Re: [Gimp-developer] Please migrate to GitHub/CMake
Yes, that's it. Some cool stuff on it, especially the "Future" section, but it's not clear what's most important to you right now. --cm On 05/07/17 11:13, Alexandre Prokoudine wrote: On Sun, May 7, 2017 at 6:01 PM, Chris Moller wrote: As to your item 2. "There has been a problem to attract new developers and contributors," I'd personally be glad to pitch in--I'm a retired IBM and Red Hat developer and have been coding for a third of a century--but it's not at all obvious what help the present devs need--the "Roadmap" on the GIMP site doesn't indicate priorities. Er... Are we talking about https://wiki.gimp.org/wiki/Roadmap? Alex ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list
Re: [Gimp-developer] Please migrate to GitHub/CMake
On Sun, May 7, 2017 at 6:01 PM, Chris Moller wrote: > As to your item 2. "There has been a problem to attract new developers and > contributors," I'd personally be glad to pitch in--I'm a retired IBM and Red > Hat developer and have been coding for a third of a century--but it's not at > all obvious what help the present devs need--the "Roadmap" on the GIMP site > doesn't indicate priorities. Er... Are we talking about https://wiki.gimp.org/wiki/Roadmap? Alex ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list
Re: [Gimp-developer] Please migrate to GitHub/CMake
Any piece of code more complex than "Hello, World!" can asymptotically approach perfection, but it will never get there. In a sense, all code is always broken, so the questions are whether it's broken enough to warrant fixing, and the benefits versus the cost in labour of fixing it. I'd suggest, as a practical matter, that breakage that falls below a certain threshold "ain't broke." I won't presume to assess what "is broke" in GIMP, but I suspect that the location of its git repo isn't an issue worth addressing. As to CMake, I've no idea what advantages it offers, but GIMP is a complex app and I suspect that porting it to CMake would be difficult, time-consuming, likely introduce breakage, and the present auto*/Makefile mechanism has likely had most of the bugs worked out of it over the years. It may not be ideal in non-*ix environments, but GIMP is fundamentally an artefact of the *ix world. As to your item 2. "There has been a problem to attract new developers and contributors," I'd personally be glad to pitch in--I'm a retired IBM and Red Hat developer and have been coding for a third of a century--but it's not at all obvious what help the present devs need--the "Roadmap" on the GIMP site doesn't indicate priorities. As to 4., the hard-to-use bit, the just about universal approach to that complaint involves hiding complexity from novices, but that almost always makes things clumsier for experts. Chris On 05/07/17 10:06, Shlomi Fish wrote: Hi Chris, On Sun, 07 May 2017 09:31:29 -0400 Chris Moller wrote: There's an American expression, "If it ain't broke, don't fix it." You can find a rebuttal of this phrase, in a different context here: https://szabgab.com/what-does--if-it-aint-broke-dont-fix-it--really-mean.html . GIMP development has been working well for a lot of years and I see exactly zero reason to change something that works well. I don't always agree with minor bits of what the devs decide to do, but THEY'RE doing the work and proposing fundamental changes that add nothing to the coolness of GIMP helps no one. I see some problems with GIMP development: 1. It's been taking too long to release new major versions. 2. There has been a problem to attract new developers and contributors. 3. GIMP is lacking many features that are present in similar proprietary programs. 4. Some people still complain on GIMP being hard to use. 5. A personal pet peeve - https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=781340 (minor problem). -- So there's certainly room for improvement and it won't be a good idea not to seek out ways to improve it. I'm not saying that moving to github and/or cmake is the way to go, but we still should try to improve. Regards, Shlomi Fish Chris Moller On 05/07/17 07:14, Marco Ciampa via gimp-developer-list wrote: On Sun, May 07, 2017 at 01:42:57PM +0300, Alexandre Prokoudine wrote: On Sun, May 7, 2017 at 1:40 PM, Ivano Arrighetta wrote: Hello there. My name is Ivano Arrighetta and I'm Italian. I would like to suggest to migrate to GitHub for version control No. and to use CMake for creating build projects for Windows and Mac OS, other than Makefiles for *nix. CMake is just as painful as autohell. I confirm what Alexandre is saying, and I'm from Italy too... ;-) -- Marco Ciampa I know a joke about UDP, but you might not get it. GNU/Linux User #78271 FSFE fellow #364 ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list
Re: [Gimp-developer] Please migrate to GitHub/CMake
On Sun, May 7, 2017 at 12:31 PM, Ivano Arrighetta wrote: > I would like to suggest to migrate to GitHub for version control, and to > use CMake for creating build projects for Windows and Mac OS, other than > Makefiles for *nix. If cmake (or perhaps meson http://mesonbuild.com/ ?) truely is so easy to use and provides big benefits, a patch that should be simple to make that uses this or a script that automigrates contents from autofoo files demonstrating the cross platform and building benefits would be appreciated. Until the proof of concept is better than what we currently have the incentive to switch to something requiring more work for transitioning is unlikely. > GitHub also offers a WebSite builder and a Wiki for each repository, > other than an issue tracker. The GNOME project which hosts GIMP (and related projects) source code and issue trackers are considering changes to which software/infrastructure these are hosted on, GIMP and related projects will likely follow along + if and when such infrastructure migration happens. Personally I would look forward to better bug/issue reporting and tracking, as bugzilla has evolved I think it contains too many mystery fields and drop-downs that confuse rather than guide the issue tracking progress. /pippin ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list
Re: [Gimp-developer] Please migrate to GitHub/CMake
Le 07/05/2017 14:04, gregory grey a écrit : > It's not about Github necessarily, it's about the response tone etc. > You made a blog post, saying how small is the team and how much work you all > do. > Now, a person says "I'd like to suggest" and your reply is basically > "f*** off". Don't misguide yourself by interpreting that X is saying "fuck off" because of a very short answer that didn't say or suppose that, just ask for a bit more of argument. You haven't asked for more besides this mail who's full of anger. I don't blame you and I understand your path to this judgment but it won't help the situation. I too didn't have responses for a long time in some emails that I sent but at some point I get a response. Why is this so long ? Well not all free/libre software developers are on the project 24/7 a lot of them are benevolent and have their own job next to it. Like you, you probably have other activities than just working on image editing software. I wrote 2 emails saying I can help with build infra, which > is listed as a need in YOUR blog post. I got no reply. > Apparently, I have to bring sacrifices and wait until the moon is in > right shape. You are forgetting that there are loads of teams out > there doing open source development. > About your 3 cases of not responding - it's not my problem. It's your > problem, as a maintainer of OSS. > > If you seriously imply that Github is not more useful as a service > than git.gnome.org, than I'm safe in betting you are writing code in > vi or something. > > Every time something like this comes up there is always tha same > mantra about GIMP being so unique and unimaginably cool piece of > software that it grants you the right to do whatever you want. You > know, emulating Linus only works if you wrote Linux. There is plethora > of other image editors, I can't see why I should not help someone else > who knows better than behaving like a jerk. > > 2017-05-07 13:53 GMT+02:00 Alexandre Prokoudine > : >>> There are currently 216 forks of it. Have you _personally_ studied >>> them at any length? Well, _I_ have. Last November or so I actually sat >>> down and went through all the forks with actual changes created in the >>> past 2-3 years. Out of those ca. 200 forks only a handful had actual >>> changes to look at. And there was pretty much nothing to gain from >>> those few. >> >> Oh, and for the record, in 2 or 3 cases when changes looked vaguely >> interesting, I actually tried contacting those developers. Noone ever >> got back to me. >> >> Can you see non-responsive people being a vital part of a successful >> community? Because I can't. >> >> Alex >> ___ >> gimp-developer-list mailing list >> List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org >> List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list >> List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list > > > -- Note: veuillez s'il vous plaît utiliser GnuPg pour nos futures conversations https://emailselfdefense.fsf.org/fr/ Plus d'info ici: http://www.bibmath.net/crypto/index.php?action=affiche&quoi=moderne/pgp Message envoyé avec GNU Icedove un fork de Thunderbird https://directory.fsf.org/wiki/Icedove signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list
Re: [Gimp-developer] Please migrate to GitHub/CMake
Le 07/05/2017 13:31, gregory grey a écrit : > Guys, I respect your work and I like Gimp a lot but this > >>> I would like to suggest to migrate to GitHub for version control >> >> No. > > is how you end up being a dead project. I won't say a dead project, but I can see your are unhappy by the response. You've presented arguments for the benefits of the project and the group for the use of github and you had a small response with little to no argument. Please don't take it personally. In these cases remember that the people who respond to you are humans they may had a bad day that might influence their response, just ask why courteously and things shouldn't go into flame wars. > > > > 2017-05-07 13:14 GMT+02:00 Marco Ciampa via gimp-developer-list > : >> On Sun, May 07, 2017 at 01:42:57PM +0300, Alexandre Prokoudine wrote: >>> On Sun, May 7, 2017 at 1:40 PM, Ivano Arrighetta wrote: Hello there. My name is Ivano Arrighetta and I'm Italian. I would like to suggest to migrate to GitHub for version control >>> >>> No. >>> and to use CMake for creating build projects for Windows and Mac OS, other than Makefiles for *nix. >>> >>> CMake is just as painful as autohell. >> >> I confirm what Alexandre is saying, and I'm from Italy too... ;-) >> >> >> -- >> >> >> Marco Ciampa >> >> I know a joke about UDP, but you might not get it. >> >> >> >> GNU/Linux User #78271 >> FSFE fellow #364 >> >> >> >> ___ >> gimp-developer-list mailing list >> List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org >> List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list >> List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list > > > -- Note: veuillez s'il vous plaît utiliser GnuPg pour nos futures conversations https://emailselfdefense.fsf.org/fr/ Plus d'info ici: http://www.bibmath.net/crypto/index.php?action=affiche&quoi=moderne/pgp Message envoyé avec GNU Icedove un fork de Thunderbird https://directory.fsf.org/wiki/Icedove signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list
Re: [Gimp-developer] Please migrate to GitHub/CMake
On Sun, May 7, 2017 at 5:06 PM, Shlomi Fish wrote: > I see some problems with GIMP development: > > 1. It's been taking too long to release new major versions. > > 2. There has been a problem to attract new developers and contributors. > > 3. GIMP is lacking many features that are present in similar proprietary > programs. > > 4. Some people still complain on GIMP being hard to use. > > 5. A personal pet peeve - https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=781340 > (minor problem). > > -- > > So there's certainly room for improvement and it won't be a good idea not to > seek out ways to improve it. I'm not saying that moving to github and/or cmake > is the way to go, but we still should try to improve. We recognize the issues that you listed above. There is little we can do about 1), 2) and 3) until 2.10 and 3.0 are out. 4) is an uphill battle that will never stop. There seems to be some progress on 5) as far as I can tell. Alex ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list
Re: [Gimp-developer] Please migrate to GitHub/CMake
Hi Chris, On Sun, 07 May 2017 09:31:29 -0400 Chris Moller wrote: > There's an American expression, "If it ain't broke, don't fix it." > You can find a rebuttal of this phrase, in a different context here: https://szabgab.com/what-does--if-it-aint-broke-dont-fix-it--really-mean.html . > GIMP development has been working well for a lot of years and I see > exactly zero reason to change something that works well. I don't always > agree with minor bits of what the devs decide to do, but THEY'RE doing > the work and proposing fundamental changes that add nothing to the > coolness of GIMP helps no one. > I see some problems with GIMP development: 1. It's been taking too long to release new major versions. 2. There has been a problem to attract new developers and contributors. 3. GIMP is lacking many features that are present in similar proprietary programs. 4. Some people still complain on GIMP being hard to use. 5. A personal pet peeve - https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=781340 (minor problem). -- So there's certainly room for improvement and it won't be a good idea not to seek out ways to improve it. I'm not saying that moving to github and/or cmake is the way to go, but we still should try to improve. Regards, Shlomi Fish > Chris Moller > > > > On 05/07/17 07:14, Marco Ciampa via gimp-developer-list wrote: > > On Sun, May 07, 2017 at 01:42:57PM +0300, Alexandre Prokoudine wrote: > >> On Sun, May 7, 2017 at 1:40 PM, Ivano Arrighetta wrote: > >>> Hello there. > >>> My name is Ivano Arrighetta and I'm Italian. > >>> I would like to suggest to migrate to GitHub for version control > >> No. > >> > >>> and to use > >>> CMake for creating build projects for Windows and Mac OS, other than > >>> Makefiles for *nix. > >> CMake is just as painful as autohell. > > I confirm what Alexandre is saying, and I'm from Italy too... ;-) > > > > > > -- > > > > > > Marco Ciampa > > > > I know a joke about UDP, but you might not get it. > > > > > > > > GNU/Linux User #78271 > > FSFE fellow #364 > > > > > > > > ___ > > gimp-developer-list mailing list > > List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org > > List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list > > List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list > > > > > > ___ > gimp-developer-list mailing list > List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org > List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list > List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list
Re: [Gimp-developer] Please migrate to GitHub/CMake
Why do people wants to centralize over github ? I am seeing that question on many projects. Github has been unfriendly over free/libre software See: https://mikegerwitz.com/about/githubbub and the new TOS give them some strange copyright over your copyleft software (if you did put a copyleft license on your code) There's gitlab available if people wants to make their own server which is recommend or use one of the already gitlab servers available somewhere. Le 07/05/2017 12:40, Ivano Arrighetta a écrit : > Hello there. > My name is Ivano Arrighetta and I'm Italian. > I would like to suggest to migrate to GitHub for version control, and to > use CMake for creating build projects for Windows and Mac OS, other than > Makefiles for *nix. > GitHub also offers a WebSite builder and a Wiki for each repository, > other than an issue tracker. > > I'm pretty sure everyone would benefit from this. > > Bye, Ivano. > > ___ > gimp-developer-list mailing list > List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org > List membership: > https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list > List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list > signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list
Re: [Gimp-developer] Please migrate to GitHub/CMake
Dear Alexandre, I agree with Gregory that your original reply to the original suggestion was phrased too laconically, and came across as rude, impolite, and unfriendly. You should try to improve such replies in the future, in order to make potential contributors feel more welcome. I've written about it many years ago here: http://www.gimpusers.com/forums/gimp-developer/5878-rudeness-on-gimp-devel-and-bugzilla-was-re-tools As a side note regarding IRC - old does not necessarily imply it is bad (see http://www.shlomifish.org/humour/fortunes/show.cgi?id=two-kinds-of-fools ) and one can normally find some unified clients to communicate on more than one service. Regards, Shlomi Fish On Sun, 7 May 2017 16:08:24 +0300 Alexandre Prokoudine wrote: > On Sun, May 7, 2017 at 3:54 PM, gregory grey wrote: > > >>> Now, a person says "I'd like to suggest" and your reply is basically > >>> "f*** off". > >> > >> It's an interesting way to interpret a simple 'no'. > >> > > > > Turning tables much? You should interpret the number of developers on > > the projects into reasons of it being so. > > Irrelevant. ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list
Re: [Gimp-developer] Please migrate to GitHub/CMake
On Sun, May 7, 2017 at 4:32 PM, gregory grey wrote: > Using Github is infrastructure decision if there is one. > > Why did you respond to question about it then? Because if nobody replied your emails _at all_, _that_ could be considered rude and unfriendly. > I have experience releasing platforms consisting of dozens of complex > components in CI\CD fashion, developed by hundreds of ppl. > > All I mentioned contributes to speed of releases immensely. I can't help myself noticing that you didn't reply to my question about your hands-on experience with releasing GIMP. Would it be safe to assume that you have none? So your estimation of "immensely contributing to the speed of releases" is based on your general involvement with software project rather than this particular project? Alex ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list
Re: [Gimp-developer] Please migrate to GitHub/CMake
On Sun, May 7, 2017 at 4:33 PM, Shlomi Fish wrote: > Dear Alexandre, > > I agree with Gregory that your original reply to the original suggestion was > phrased too laconically, and came across as rude, impolite, and unfriendly. > You > should try to improve such replies in the future, in order to make potential > contributors feel more welcome. I have already provided a slightly more verbose reply at https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=782284. Alex ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list
Re: [Gimp-developer] Please migrate to GitHub/CMake
There's an American expression, "If it ain't broke, don't fix it." GIMP development has been working well for a lot of years and I see exactly zero reason to change something that works well. I don't always agree with minor bits of what the devs decide to do, but THEY'RE doing the work and proposing fundamental changes that add nothing to the coolness of GIMP helps no one. Chris Moller On 05/07/17 07:14, Marco Ciampa via gimp-developer-list wrote: On Sun, May 07, 2017 at 01:42:57PM +0300, Alexandre Prokoudine wrote: On Sun, May 7, 2017 at 1:40 PM, Ivano Arrighetta wrote: Hello there. My name is Ivano Arrighetta and I'm Italian. I would like to suggest to migrate to GitHub for version control No. and to use CMake for creating build projects for Windows and Mac OS, other than Makefiles for *nix. CMake is just as painful as autohell. I confirm what Alexandre is saying, and I'm from Italy too... ;-) -- Marco Ciampa I know a joke about UDP, but you might not get it. GNU/Linux User #78271 FSFE fellow #364 ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list
Re: [Gimp-developer] Please migrate to GitHub/CMake
Using Github is infrastructure decision if there is one. Why did you respond to question about it then? I have experience releasing platforms consisting of dozens of complex components in CI\CD fashion, developed by hundreds of ppl. All I mentioned contributes to speed of releases immensely. 2017-05-07 15:08 GMT+02:00 Alexandre Prokoudine : > On Sun, May 7, 2017 at 3:54 PM, gregory grey wrote: > Now, a person says "I'd like to suggest" and your reply is basically "f*** off". >>> >>> It's an interesting way to interpret a simple 'no'. >>> >> >> Turning tables much? You should interpret the number of developers on >> the projects into reasons of it being so. > > Irrelevant. > >>> Yes, our email communication needs to improve. However, do I really >>> need to bring up our private email exchange where I explained to you >>> that most dev conversations take place on IRC and that the difficult >>> topics on the list barely ever take off? >>> >> >> Apparently you are not too busy to participate in flame, but too busy >> to see an email from potential contributor. > > I do no make infrastructure decisions. Also, thank you for > acknowledging it's a flame. Next step is to acknowledge your > responsibility for it. > >> Last time I've used IRC was like 10 years ago. Another archaic tech >> I(anyone else willing to participate) have to use because why exactly? > > Because it works for us. > >> I'm not planning to work on GIMP any more, thank you very much. > > That's OK. I'm sure you'll find your talent useful elsewhere. > About your 3 cases of not responding - it's not my problem. It's your problem, as a maintainer of OSS. >>> >>> Blaming is _exactly_ what was sorely missing on the list. Thank you. >>> >> >> Turning tables #2. You pointed to 3 times you did not get the answer >> as a reason to dump Github idea. > > You completely misunderstood my reasoning. > >>> GitHub is full of developers who use Vi. Stuff like node-x11 is >>> actually written by dedicated Vi users, and I can think of a very few >>> things that are more hip than node.js. >>> >> >> https://media0.giphy.com/media/3h5pe45FM9qUM/giphy.gif > > How very mature. > who knows better than behaving like a jerk. >>> >>> Name-calling was sorely missing on this list too. Again, thank you. >>> >>> If you are done with that, what are, in your opinion, the actual >>> advantages of relying on GitHub other than it's full of hip people who >>> despise Vi? >>> >> >> Turning tables #3. >> >> You know, issues, project boards, UI what does not require reloading a >> page to see the update, etc,etc. > > Why do you think any of that would make a huge difference for our > particular project? What actual programming/releasing experience with > GIMP do you have? > > Alex > ___ > gimp-developer-list mailing list > List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org > List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list > List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list -- http://ror6ax.github.io/ ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list
Re: [Gimp-developer] Please migrate to GitHub/CMake
On Sun, May 07, 2017 at 02:04:04PM +0200, gregory grey wrote: > It's not about Github necessarily, it's about the response tone etc. [...] > and your reply is basically "f*** off". [..] > who knows better than behaving like a jerk. Who is the jerk here? -- Marco Ciampa I know a joke about UDP, but you might not get it. GNU/Linux User #78271 FSFE fellow #364 ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list
Re: [Gimp-developer] Please migrate to GitHub/CMake
On Sun, May 7, 2017 at 3:54 PM, gregory grey wrote: >>> Now, a person says "I'd like to suggest" and your reply is basically >>> "f*** off". >> >> It's an interesting way to interpret a simple 'no'. >> > > Turning tables much? You should interpret the number of developers on > the projects into reasons of it being so. Irrelevant. >> Yes, our email communication needs to improve. However, do I really >> need to bring up our private email exchange where I explained to you >> that most dev conversations take place on IRC and that the difficult >> topics on the list barely ever take off? >> > > Apparently you are not too busy to participate in flame, but too busy > to see an email from potential contributor. I do no make infrastructure decisions. Also, thank you for acknowledging it's a flame. Next step is to acknowledge your responsibility for it. > Last time I've used IRC was like 10 years ago. Another archaic tech > I(anyone else willing to participate) have to use because why exactly? Because it works for us. > I'm not planning to work on GIMP any more, thank you very much. That's OK. I'm sure you'll find your talent useful elsewhere. >>> About your 3 cases of not responding - it's not my problem. It's your >>> problem, as a maintainer of OSS. >> >> Blaming is _exactly_ what was sorely missing on the list. Thank you. >> > > Turning tables #2. You pointed to 3 times you did not get the answer > as a reason to dump Github idea. You completely misunderstood my reasoning. >> GitHub is full of developers who use Vi. Stuff like node-x11 is >> actually written by dedicated Vi users, and I can think of a very few >> things that are more hip than node.js. >> > > https://media0.giphy.com/media/3h5pe45FM9qUM/giphy.gif How very mature. >>> who knows better than behaving like a jerk. >> >> Name-calling was sorely missing on this list too. Again, thank you. >> >> If you are done with that, what are, in your opinion, the actual >> advantages of relying on GitHub other than it's full of hip people who >> despise Vi? >> > > Turning tables #3. > > You know, issues, project boards, UI what does not require reloading a > page to see the update, etc,etc. Why do you think any of that would make a huge difference for our particular project? What actual programming/releasing experience with GIMP do you have? Alex ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list
Re: [Gimp-developer] Please migrate to GitHub/CMake
> On Sun, May 7, 2017 at 3:04 PM, gregory grey wrote: >> It's not about Github necessarily, it's about the response tone etc. >> You made a blog post, saying how small is the team and how much work you all >> do. >> Now, a person says "I'd like to suggest" and your reply is basically >> "f*** off". > > It's an interesting way to interpret a simple 'no'. > Turning tables much? You should interpret the number of developers on the projects into reasons of it being so. >> I wrote 2 emails saying I can help with build infra, which >> is listed as a need in YOUR blog post. I got no reply. > > Yes, our email communication needs to improve. However, do I really > need to bring up our private email exchange where I explained to you > that most dev conversations take place on IRC and that the difficult > topics on the list barely ever take off? > Apparently you are not too busy to participate in flame, but too busy to see an email from potential contributor. Last time I've used IRC was like 10 years ago. Another archaic tech I(anyone else willing to participate) have to use because why exactly? Emails are at least searchable. I'm not planning to work on GIMP any more, thank you very much. >> About your 3 cases of not responding - it's not my problem. It's your >> problem, as a maintainer of OSS. > > Blaming is _exactly_ what was sorely missing on the list. Thank you. > Turning tables #2. You pointed to 3 times you did not get the answer as a reason to dump Github idea. You are blaming. I'm underlining your position, along with it's consequences, that's all. >> If you seriously imply that Github is not more useful as a service >> than git.gnome.org, than I'm safe in betting you are writing code in >> vi or something. > > GitHub is full of developers who use Vi. Stuff like node-x11 is > actually written by dedicated Vi users, and I can think of a very few > things that are more hip than node.js. > https://media0.giphy.com/media/3h5pe45FM9qUM/giphy.gif > Personally, whenever I actually open a source code file (which is > maybe once or twice a year), I do it in Sublime Text. > > What's your _actual_ point? Do you have one? > That Gimp project is unfriendly, here I spelled it for you. >> Every time something like this comes up there is always tha same >> mantra about GIMP being so unique and unimaginably cool piece of >> software that it grants you the right to do whatever you want. You >> know, emulating Linus only works if you wrote Linux. There is plethora >> of other image editors, I can't see why I should not help someone else > > Nor can I. > >> who knows better than behaving like a jerk. > > Name-calling was sorely missing on this list too. Again, thank you. > > If you are done with that, what are, in your opinion, the actual > advantages of relying on GitHub other than it's full of hip people who > despise Vi? > Turning tables #3. You know, issues, project boards, UI what does not require reloading a page to see the update, etc,etc. But that is for hipsters, of course. Nothing to do with giving people idea what how than can contribute. > Alex > ___ > gimp-developer-list mailing list > List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org > List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list > List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list -- http://ror6ax.github.io/ ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list
Re: [Gimp-developer] Please migrate to GitHub/CMake
On Sun, May 7, 2017 at 3:10 PM, Carol Spears wrote: >> . There is plethora >> of other image editors, I can't see why I should not help someone else >> who knows better than behaving like a jerk. >> > Oh gosh, and they are so much worse in real life!! Carol, You were banned from the list (and the project) after assaulting a user on the bugtracker while being a team member. If you think now is a great time to have a reminiscence of good ol' times, I kindly suggest you reconsider. Alex ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list
Re: [Gimp-developer] Please migrate to GitHub/CMake
On Sun, May 7, 2017 at 3:04 PM, gregory grey wrote: > It's not about Github necessarily, it's about the response tone etc. > You made a blog post, saying how small is the team and how much work you all > do. > Now, a person says "I'd like to suggest" and your reply is basically > "f*** off". It's an interesting way to interpret a simple 'no'. > I wrote 2 emails saying I can help with build infra, which > is listed as a need in YOUR blog post. I got no reply. Yes, our email communication needs to improve. However, do I really need to bring up our private email exchange where I explained to you that most dev conversations take place on IRC and that the difficult topics on the list barely ever take off? > About your 3 cases of not responding - it's not my problem. It's your > problem, as a maintainer of OSS. Blaming is _exactly_ what was sorely missing on the list. Thank you. > If you seriously imply that Github is not more useful as a service > than git.gnome.org, than I'm safe in betting you are writing code in > vi or something. GitHub is full of developers who use Vi. Stuff like node-x11 is actually written by dedicated Vi users, and I can think of a very few things that are more hip than node.js. Personally, whenever I actually open a source code file (which is maybe once or twice a year), I do it in Sublime Text. What's your _actual_ point? Do you have one? > Every time something like this comes up there is always tha same > mantra about GIMP being so unique and unimaginably cool piece of > software that it grants you the right to do whatever you want. You > know, emulating Linus only works if you wrote Linux. There is plethora > of other image editors, I can't see why I should not help someone else Nor can I. > who knows better than behaving like a jerk. Name-calling was sorely missing on this list too. Again, thank you. If you are done with that, what are, in your opinion, the actual advantages of relying on GitHub other than it's full of hip people who despise Vi? Alex ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list
Re: [Gimp-developer] Please migrate to GitHub/CMake
On Sun, May 7, 2017 at 8:04 AM, gregory grey wrote: > . There is plethora > of other image editors, I can't see why I should not help someone else > who knows better than behaving like a jerk. > Oh gosh, and they are so much worse in real life!! carol ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list
Re: [Gimp-developer] Please migrate to GitHub/CMake
It's not about Github necessarily, it's about the response tone etc. You made a blog post, saying how small is the team and how much work you all do. Now, a person says "I'd like to suggest" and your reply is basically "f*** off". I wrote 2 emails saying I can help with build infra, which is listed as a need in YOUR blog post. I got no reply. Apparently, I have to bring sacrifices and wait until the moon is in right shape. You are forgetting that there are loads of teams out there doing open source development. About your 3 cases of not responding - it's not my problem. It's your problem, as a maintainer of OSS. If you seriously imply that Github is not more useful as a service than git.gnome.org, than I'm safe in betting you are writing code in vi or something. Every time something like this comes up there is always tha same mantra about GIMP being so unique and unimaginably cool piece of software that it grants you the right to do whatever you want. You know, emulating Linus only works if you wrote Linux. There is plethora of other image editors, I can't see why I should not help someone else who knows better than behaving like a jerk. 2017-05-07 13:53 GMT+02:00 Alexandre Prokoudine : >> There are currently 216 forks of it. Have you _personally_ studied >> them at any length? Well, _I_ have. Last November or so I actually sat >> down and went through all the forks with actual changes created in the >> past 2-3 years. Out of those ca. 200 forks only a handful had actual >> changes to look at. And there was pretty much nothing to gain from >> those few. > > Oh, and for the record, in 2 or 3 cases when changes looked vaguely > interesting, I actually tried contacting those developers. Noone ever > got back to me. > > Can you see non-responsive people being a vital part of a successful > community? Because I can't. > > Alex > ___ > gimp-developer-list mailing list > List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org > List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list > List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list -- http://ror6ax.github.io/ ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list
Re: [Gimp-developer] Please migrate to GitHub/CMake
> There are currently 216 forks of it. Have you _personally_ studied > them at any length? Well, _I_ have. Last November or so I actually sat > down and went through all the forks with actual changes created in the > past 2-3 years. Out of those ca. 200 forks only a handful had actual > changes to look at. And there was pretty much nothing to gain from > those few. Oh, and for the record, in 2 or 3 cases when changes looked vaguely interesting, I actually tried contacting those developers. Noone ever got back to me. Can you see non-responsive people being a vital part of a successful community? Because I can't. Alex ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list
Re: [Gimp-developer] Please migrate to GitHub/CMake
On Sun, May 7, 2017 at 2:31 PM, gregory grey wrote: > Guys, I respect your work and I like Gimp a lot but this > >> > I would like to suggest to migrate to GitHub for version control >> >> No. > > is how you end up being a dead project. GIMP has a copy of its Git repo on GitHub, made by GNOME folks. https://github.com/GNOME/gimp There are currently 216 forks of it. Have you _personally_ studied them at any length? Well, _I_ have. Last November or so I actually sat down and went through all the forks with actual changes created in the past 2-3 years. Out of those ca. 200 forks only a handful had actual changes to look at. And there was pretty much nothing to gain from those few. In my experience (that is, closely following GIMP development for the past 12+ years), people who are motivated to make a positive change have no problem cloning from git.gnome.org and sending patches. Of course, that's just _my_ experience. _You_ can run your own study and come up with different results. I dare you to do so :) Alex ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list
Re: [Gimp-developer] Please migrate to GitHub/CMake
Guys, I respect your work and I like Gimp a lot but this > > I would like to suggest to migrate to GitHub for version control > > No. is how you end up being a dead project. 2017-05-07 13:14 GMT+02:00 Marco Ciampa via gimp-developer-list : > On Sun, May 07, 2017 at 01:42:57PM +0300, Alexandre Prokoudine wrote: >> On Sun, May 7, 2017 at 1:40 PM, Ivano Arrighetta wrote: >> > Hello there. >> > My name is Ivano Arrighetta and I'm Italian. >> > I would like to suggest to migrate to GitHub for version control >> >> No. >> >> > and to use >> > CMake for creating build projects for Windows and Mac OS, other than >> > Makefiles for *nix. >> >> CMake is just as painful as autohell. > > I confirm what Alexandre is saying, and I'm from Italy too... ;-) > > > -- > > > Marco Ciampa > > I know a joke about UDP, but you might not get it. > > > > GNU/Linux User #78271 > FSFE fellow #364 > > > > ___ > gimp-developer-list mailing list > List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org > List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list > List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list -- http://ror6ax.github.io/ ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list
Re: [Gimp-developer] Please migrate to GitHub/CMake
On Sun, May 07, 2017 at 01:42:57PM +0300, Alexandre Prokoudine wrote: > On Sun, May 7, 2017 at 1:40 PM, Ivano Arrighetta wrote: > > Hello there. > > My name is Ivano Arrighetta and I'm Italian. > > I would like to suggest to migrate to GitHub for version control > > No. > > > and to use > > CMake for creating build projects for Windows and Mac OS, other than > > Makefiles for *nix. > > CMake is just as painful as autohell. I confirm what Alexandre is saying, and I'm from Italy too... ;-) -- Marco Ciampa I know a joke about UDP, but you might not get it. GNU/Linux User #78271 FSFE fellow #364 ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list
Re: [Gimp-developer] Please migrate to GitHub/CMake
On Sun, May 7, 2017 at 1:40 PM, Ivano Arrighetta wrote: > Hello there. > My name is Ivano Arrighetta and I'm Italian. > I would like to suggest to migrate to GitHub for version control No. > and to use > CMake for creating build projects for Windows and Mac OS, other than > Makefiles for *nix. CMake is just as painful as autohell. > I'm pretty sure everyone would benefit from this. Good. But we aren't. Alex ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list
[Gimp-developer] Please migrate to GitHub/CMake
Hello there. My name is Ivano Arrighetta and I'm Italian. I would like to suggest to migrate to GitHub for version control, and to use CMake for creating build projects for Windows and Mac OS, other than Makefiles for *nix. GitHub also offers a WebSite builder and a Wiki for each repository, other than an issue tracker. I'm pretty sure everyone would benefit from this. Bye, Ivano. ___ gimp-developer-list mailing list List address:gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list
