Re: OT: Perl and Javascript
Kenny, In the past I've put together some perl code that extends LWP::UserAgent. I override or add a few methods using HTTP::Request::Form, HTTP::Cookies, and HTML::TreeBuilder. The end result is that you can come up with an enhanced useragent that lets you fill out forms, handle cookies, and parse HTML output. I recommend looking into the modules I mentioned if you haven't already. I noticed that in my code using my extended user agent, I also used HTTP::Request::Common and URI::URL. All my Javascript parsing was done by looking at the javascript code and simulating it, though (usually it was just putting together a URL in a straightforward fashion). Bob On Tue, Jun 10, 2003 at 04:52:50PM -0400, Kenneth E. Lussier <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Tue, 2003-06-10 at 16:31, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > > > In a message dated: Tue, 10 Jun 2003 16:24:43 EDT > > Morbus Iff said: > > > > > >Since we seem to have an abundance of Perl experts today, I have a > > > >perplexing problem... I am trying to write a script that logs into a > > > >website. The problem that I am running into is that the website requires > > > >javascript. If the site detects that the "browser" doesn't support > > > >javascript, then it loads the login form as an "unmodifiable form text > > > >field" (as reported by lynx). Does anyone know a way around this? > > > > > >If the login is authenticated with javascript (?!!), then you're screwed. > > >What web site is it? Your best bet is to find out what the javascript is > > >exactly doing. > > > > Which shouldn't be too hard, since you should be able to View->Source > > and see the java script lines to determine what's going on. > > I was just looking at the source, and it looks like I have another > problem. The site *ALSO* requires cookies to be enabled (which I can get > around using HTTP::Cookies, I think). The login code on the site doesn't > use javascript, except for the button: > > > > action="/scripts/loginmanager.dll?login" method=post onSubmit="return > prepare(this)" > target=_top> > > > value="647c2fc1fd44c1dbed0f58315e9dd1935876f5ec"> > style="WIDTH: 150px"> > > User > Name > > > size=1>Password > onKeyPress="return b_onkeypress()"> > > > > I looked at CPAN, and I installed JavaScript-0.52. But, in all honesty, > I read through the documentaion on CPAN, and I think I'm more lost now > than I was 20 minutes ago!! > > C-Ya, > Kenny -- Bob Bell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> - "Shipping software is an unnatural act" -- David Stafford ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss
Re: OT: Perl and Javascript
On Tue, 2003-06-10 at 16:31, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > In a message dated: Tue, 10 Jun 2003 16:24:43 EDT > Morbus Iff said: > > > >Since we seem to have an abundance of Perl experts today, I have a > > >perplexing problem... I am trying to write a script that logs into a > > >website. The problem that I am running into is that the website requires > > >javascript. If the site detects that the "browser" doesn't support > > >javascript, then it loads the login form as an "unmodifiable form text > > >field" (as reported by lynx). Does anyone know a way around this? > > > >If the login is authenticated with javascript (?!!), then you're screwed. > >What web site is it? Your best bet is to find out what the javascript is > >exactly doing. > > Which shouldn't be too hard, since you should be able to View->Source > and see the java script lines to determine what's going on. I was just looking at the source, and it looks like I have another problem. The site *ALSO* requires cookies to be enabled (which I can get around using HTTP::Cookies, I think). The login code on the site doesn't use javascript, except for the button: User Name Password I looked at CPAN, and I installed JavaScript-0.52. But, in all honesty, I read through the documentaion on CPAN, and I think I'm more lost now than I was 20 minutes ago!! C-Ya, Kenny -- "Tact is just *not* saying true stuff" -- Cordelia Chase Kenneth E. Lussier Sr. Systems Administrator Zuken, USA PGP KeyID CB254DD0 http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0xCB254DD0 ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss
Re: OT: Perl and Javascript
Hmm, you're writing a perl script that is acting as a browser (of sorts) in order to login to a remote site and then do other things there (I"m assuming.) If so then you should be receiving the HTTP data, including the request from the server that they are using to determine whether or not your 'browser' supports javascript. You could examine what they are asking and perhaps determine how to provide the 'proper' response to fake out the other end. Of course it will then probably throw some JavaScript at your code with the expectation that it will do something with it. You will then need to analyze that and see if you can figure out how to throw back a useful result to the server (despite not actually parsing the JavaScript). All this may be possible but you may need to understand (or learn) a fair amount about HTTP (the protocol itself) to pull it off. Of course, you could surf CPAN to see if someone else already did the grunt work for you. http://www.cpan.org/ Kenneth E. Lussier wrote: Since we seem to have an abundance of Perl experts today, I have a perplexing problem... I am trying to write a script that logs into a website. The problem that I am running into is that the website requires javascript. If the site detects that the "browser" doesn't support javascript, then it loads the login form as an "unmodifiable form text field" (as reported by lynx). Does anyone know a way around this? TIA, Kenny ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss
Re: OT: Perl and Javascript
In a message dated: 10 Jun 2003 16:25:33 EDT "Kenneth E. Lussier" said: >Since we seem to have an abundance of Perl experts today, I have a >perplexing problem... I am trying to write a script that logs into a >website. The problem that I am running into is that the website requires >javascript. If the site detects that the "browser" doesn't support >javascript, then it loads the login form as an "unmodifiable form text >field" (as reported by lynx). Does anyone know a way around this? > http://search.cpan.org/search?query=javascript&mode=all -- Seeya, Paul -- Key fingerprint = 1660 FECC 5D21 D286 F853 E808 BB07 9239 53F1 28EE It may look like I'm just sitting here doing nothing, but I'm really actively waiting for all my problems to go away. If you're not having fun, you're not doing it right! ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss
Re: OT- Comcast Subscriber Agreement
On Tue, 10 Jun 2003 16:22:48 -0400 Jeff Kinz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Mon, Jun 09, 2003 at 06:35:01PM -0400, Michael O'Donnell wrote: > > > > .. > > One of the things I read in attbi.ne.techtalk.general > > is that all a Linux user like me has to do is config > > different IP addrs for the POP, SMTP and NNTP servers, > > reportedly these: > > > > send email (SMTP):smtp.comcast.net > > receive email (POP3): pop3.comcast.net > > news (NNTP): news.comcast.giganews.com > > Spoke to "Mark" at comcast customer service: > > Verified - The New news server will be : > >nntp://news.comcast.giganews.com > > > Limited to 1 GB per month. Overages deducted from the > next month's download quota > (And what happens if you go over that? ) A $$$ conscious company will charge you. A dumb company will cut you off when your quota reaches zero. A smart company will allow you to borrow either for a period of time or until your quota goes to zero then charge you. -- Jerry Feldman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Boston Linux and Unix user group http://www.blu.org PGP key id:C5061EA9 PGP Key fingerprint:053C 73EC 3AC1 5C44 3E14 9245 FB00 3ED5 C506 1EA9 pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: OT: Perl and Javascript
In a message dated: Tue, 10 Jun 2003 16:24:43 EDT Morbus Iff said: > >Since we seem to have an abundance of Perl experts today, I have a > >perplexing problem... I am trying to write a script that logs into a > >website. The problem that I am running into is that the website requires > >javascript. If the site detects that the "browser" doesn't support > >javascript, then it loads the login form as an "unmodifiable form text > >field" (as reported by lynx). Does anyone know a way around this? > >If the login is authenticated with javascript (?!!), then you're screwed. >What web site is it? Your best bet is to find out what the javascript is >exactly doing. Which shouldn't be too hard, since you should be able to View->Source and see the java script lines to determine what's going on. -- Seeya, Paul -- Key fingerprint = 1660 FECC 5D21 D286 F853 E808 BB07 9239 53F1 28EE It may look like I'm just sitting here doing nothing, but I'm really actively waiting for all my problems to go away. If you're not having fun, you're not doing it right! ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss
Re: OT: Perl and Javascript
>Since we seem to have an abundance of Perl experts today, I have a >perplexing problem... I am trying to write a script that logs into a >website. The problem that I am running into is that the website requires >javascript. If the site detects that the "browser" doesn't support >javascript, then it loads the login form as an "unmodifiable form text >field" (as reported by lynx). Does anyone know a way around this? If the login is authenticated with javascript (?!!), then you're screwed. What web site is it? Your best bet is to find out what the javascript is exactly doing. -- Morbus Iff ( i put the demon back in codemonkey ) Culture: http://www.disobey.com/ and http://www.gamegrene.com/ Buy My Book! http://amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0596004605/disobeycom icq: 2927491 / aim: akaMorbus / yahoo: morbus_iff / jabber.org: morbus ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss
Re: OT- Comcast Subscriber Agreement
On Mon, Jun 09, 2003 at 06:35:01PM -0400, Michael O'Donnell wrote: > > .. > One of the things I read in attbi.ne.techtalk.general > is that all a Linux user like me has to do is config > different IP addrs for the POP, SMTP and NNTP servers, > reportedly these: > > send email (SMTP):smtp.comcast.net > receive email (POP3): pop3.comcast.net > news (NNTP): news.comcast.giganews.com Spoke to "Mark" at comcast customer service: Verified - The New news server will be : nntp://news.comcast.giganews.com Limited to 1 GB per month. Overages deducted from the next month's download quota (And what happens if you go over that? ) -- Jeff Kinz, Open-PC, Emergent Research, Hudson, MA. [EMAIL PROTECTED] copyright 2003. Use is restricted. Any use is an acceptance of the offer at http://www.kinz.org/policy.html. Don't forget to change your password often. ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss
OT: Perl and Javascript
Since we seem to have an abundance of Perl experts today, I have a perplexing problem... I am trying to write a script that logs into a website. The problem that I am running into is that the website requires javascript. If the site detects that the "browser" doesn't support javascript, then it loads the login form as an "unmodifiable form text field" (as reported by lynx). Does anyone know a way around this? TIA, Kenny -- "Tact is just *not* saying true stuff" -- Cordelia Chase Kenneth E. Lussier Sr. Systems Administrator Zuken, USA PGP KeyID CB254DD0 http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0xCB254DD0 ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss
Re: OT- Comcast Subscriber Agreement
On Tue, 10 Jun 2003 15:59:05 -0400 "Travis Roy" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Except that all of those things have a nice disclaimer that basically > states that they can change it at any time at any reason to anything > and not tell you, you just have to go look at the agreement online > every once and a while. That is true. But, it gives me some wiggle room if they decide to cut me off. -- Jerry Feldman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Boston Linux and Unix user group http://www.blu.org PGP key id:C5061EA9 PGP Key fingerprint:053C 73EC 3AC1 5C44 3E14 9245 FB00 3ED5 C506 1EA9 pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
RE: OT- Comcast Subscriber Agreement
> The only document I ever signed was the Continental Cablevision > document. Somewhere in my archives I may have email from a VP > authorizing an internal network. I could probably use that if Comcast > starts playing hardball but it would be more like, "our agreement > supercedes that, cease and desist". Except that all of those things have a nice disclaimer that basically states that they can change it at any time at any reason to anything and not tell you, you just have to go look at the agreement online every once and a while. ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss
Re: A useful perl command line skeleton
Morbus Iff wrote: >As a follow-on to my talk about Perl last month I thought I'd put >together a handy code framework that is very useful for creating command >line or cron based utilities. See also: http://sial.org/code/perl/scripts/blank.pl.html Thanks for sharing the pointer! >#!/usr/bin/perl -w If you're looking for crossplatform fun, "use warnings" is more portable than the -w. Good to know, I never tried using perl for other than experiments on Windows. ># Basic verbosity shows at least the program version to the user. ># By comparing for verbosity > some value each bit of output ># can be fine tuned into different verbosity levels. >print "myprogram version $VERSION\n" if $Verbose > 0; If you use $0 here, you can save yourself some editing. True, but only in the main code body itself. Once you get into the data section after the __END__ indicator this no longer works. So you can't use it in the pod text to auto-substitute the program name there. -- Dan Coutu Managing Director Snowy Owl Internet Consulting, LLC http://www.snowy-owl.com/ ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss
Re: A useful perl command line skeleton
>As a follow-on to my talk about Perl last month I thought I'd put >together a handy code framework that is very useful for creating command >line or cron based utilities. See also: http://sial.org/code/perl/scripts/blank.pl.html >#!/usr/bin/perl -w If you're looking for crossplatform fun, "use warnings" is more portable than the -w. ># Basic verbosity shows at least the program version to the user. ># By comparing for verbosity > some value each bit of output ># can be fine tuned into different verbosity levels. >print "myprogram version $VERSION\n" if $Verbose > 0; If you use $0 here, you can save yourself some editing. -- Morbus Iff ( i put the demon back in codemonkey ) Culture: http://www.disobey.com/ and http://www.gamegrene.com/ Buy My Book! http://amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0596004605/disobeycom icq: 2927491 / aim: akaMorbus / yahoo: morbus_iff / jabber.org: morbus ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss
A useful perl command line skeleton
As a follow-on to my talk about Perl last month I thought I'd put
together a handy code framework that is very useful for creating command
line or cron based utilities.
The skeleton doesn't do much by itself but I have found myself making
command line utilities over and over based on this same structure. It
provides easy command line parsing as well as built-in online help and
self-documentation by using pod. Oh, and it also provides a convenient
version variable that is CVS friendly so that you don't have to update
versions by hand each time you check your code into CVS.
You can get details for each of the packages used by using the perldoc
command like this:
perldoc Getopt::Long
perldoc Pod::Usage
and so forth.
I hope this helps those of you who are trying to make sense of perl.
--
Dan Coutu
Managing Director
Snowy Owl Internet Consulting, LLC
http://www.snowy-owl.com/
#!/usr/bin/perl -w
#
# Author:
# Created:
#
# Describe the purpose of the code here.
#
use strict;
use Getopt::Long;
use Pod::Usage;
# Provide a version variable that works nicely with CVS
our $VERSION = (qw( $Revision: 1.0 $ ))[1];
# Command variables
my $Help;
my $Verbose = 0;
# Parse any command line switches.
GetOptions("help|h|?" => \$Help, # A flag (boolean) value
"verbose|v=i" => \$Verbose # An integer value
) || pod2usage(2);
pod2usage(1) if $Help;
# Basic verbosity shows at least the program version to the user.
# By comparing for verbosity > some value each bit of output
# can be fine tuned into different verbosity levels.
print "myprogram version $VERSION\n" if $Verbose > 0;
__END__
=head1 myprogram
Describe your program briefly.
=head1 SYNOPSIS
myprogram [options]
=head1 OPTIONS
=over 8
=item B<--help>
Show this description of the program's use.
=item B<--verbose>
Specifies a positive integer value of zero or greater that controls
the level of verbose detail to be provided by the program. Higher numbers
provide more detail.
The default is zero if the switch is omitted.
Re: postgresql
Sharpe, Richard wrote: Erik I am a DBA and have been for over 20 years and my all time favorite RDBMS is DB2 and now especially that it runs on LINUX and that the LINUX flavor of DB2 is enjoying much attention from IBM, I think it is hands down better than Oracle. Thanks for your thoughts Rich. What are some of the things you like about it? One thing I have noticed about DB2 is that it isn't mentioned as often as Oracle/SQLServer/MySQL in the places I tend to frequent online (mailing lists, sites, etc), but as an IBM offering it seems pretty interesting nonetheless. Erik ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss
RE: postgresql
I will answer but I am off to a meeting with people from the evil empire (M$). Rich -Original Message- From: Cole Tuininga [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, June 10, 2003 1:57 PM To: Sharpe, Richard Cc: GNHLUG List Subject: RE: postgresql On Tue, 2003-06-10 at 13:40, Sharpe, Richard wrote: > Erik > > I am a DBA and have been for over 20 years and my all time favorite > RDBMS is DB2 and now especially that it runs on LINUX and that the LINUX > flavor of DB2 is enjoying much attention from IBM, I think it is hands down > better than Oracle. Ahhh - you've proclaimed knowledge of another RDBMS - you must now subject yourself to public questioning. *grin* Seriously though, I do have some questions: 1) How difficult is it to administrate? With mysql, for the most part we set it up and just leave it. Occassionally we have to add (or remove) permissions to connect to it for a given user or host, but other than that it just sits there. On top of which, mysql is incredibly simple to set up, IMHO. Would we need a full time DBA for DB2? 2) Do I need a super beast of a machine to run a big database? Right now we have a 3.6 Gig database running on a dual Xeon 2.4GHz with 4 GB of memory ... which is actually quite a bit of overkill for our dataset and usage. 3) Does it support realtime replication? Two way replication? 4) I'm assuming it has the full feature set (things I'm not used to having in MySQL) such as triggers, stored procedures, views, etc? What language(s) is/are supported for the stored procedures? 5) Is there a free version that can be used for evaluation/development purposes? I understand you may not know the answer to these questions, but any answers you do have would be interesting, to me at least. 8) -- Those who live by the sword get shot by those who don't. Cole Tuininga Lead Developer Code Energy, Inc [EMAIL PROTECTED] PGP Key ID: 0x43E5755D ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss
Re: OT- Comcast Subscriber Agreement
Andrew W. Gaunt wrote: Well, the farmer awoke to find a nice fattened pig there one Sunday morning. He sure made a fine meal that evening. Wait, I don't understand -- did the other pig jump the farmer? That was a good plan, I bet that farmer never expected there were *two* pigs involved! Of course, I can't imagine the farmer tasted much better than the grain in the barn, since everyone knows pigs can't cook. ;) Erik ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss
RE: postgresql
On Tue, 2003-06-10 at 13:40, Sharpe, Richard wrote: > Erik > > I am a DBA and have been for over 20 years and my all time favorite > RDBMS is DB2 and now especially that it runs on LINUX and that the LINUX > flavor of DB2 is enjoying much attention from IBM, I think it is hands down > better than Oracle. Ahhh - you've proclaimed knowledge of another RDBMS - you must now subject yourself to public questioning. *grin* Seriously though, I do have some questions: 1) How difficult is it to administrate? With mysql, for the most part we set it up and just leave it. Occassionally we have to add (or remove) permissions to connect to it for a given user or host, but other than that it just sits there. On top of which, mysql is incredibly simple to set up, IMHO. Would we need a full time DBA for DB2? 2) Do I need a super beast of a machine to run a big database? Right now we have a 3.6 Gig database running on a dual Xeon 2.4GHz with 4 GB of memory ... which is actually quite a bit of overkill for our dataset and usage. 3) Does it support realtime replication? Two way replication? 4) I'm assuming it has the full feature set (things I'm not used to having in MySQL) such as triggers, stored procedures, views, etc? What language(s) is/are supported for the stored procedures? 5) Is there a free version that can be used for evaluation/development purposes? I understand you may not know the answer to these questions, but any answers you do have would be interesting, to me at least. 8) -- Those who live by the sword get shot by those who don't. Cole Tuininga Lead Developer Code Energy, Inc [EMAIL PROTECTED] PGP Key ID: 0x43E5755D ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss
Re: postgresql
On Tue, 2003-06-10 at 11:58, Erik Price wrote: > Cole Tuininga wrote: > > I don't have any comments except to say thanks for mentioning them Cole, > because I didn't know about any of these. So, just out of curiosity, > which database(s) do you prefer*? Truth be told, the only other one I have any *real* experience with (ie more than just install and see if it runs a basic query) is mysql 3.23.x. > so experimenting with some of Postgres's features has been quite > a bit of fun, I completely agree. The features offered by postgres are great. I've been told repeatedly that postgres also handles heavy loads much better than mysql, but mostly from postgres advocates. 8) I haven't played around with heavy load comparisons myself. > but I've > also been careful to make sure that the project abstracts this enough to > make it trivial to use another DB. This is frequently a good idea anyway, IMHO. -- "Pay attention son! You've got the attention span of an art major in a computer cluster!" - Sam Stoddard Cole Tuininga Lead Developer Code Energy, Inc [EMAIL PROTECTED] PGP Key ID: 0x43E5755D ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss
RE: postgresql
Erik I am a DBA and have been for over 20 years and my all time favorite RDBMS is DB2 and now especially that it runs on LINUX and that the LINUX flavor of DB2 is enjoying much attention from IBM, I think it is hands down better than Oracle. Rich -Original Message- From: Erik Price [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, June 10, 2003 11:58 AM To: Cole Tuininga Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: postgresql Cole Tuininga wrote: > I agree that it has some great features, but when we looked into using > it, we found some serious drawbacks to it. If anybody has comments on > these, I'd be very interested to hear them. I don't have any comments except to say thanks for mentioning them Cole, because I didn't know about any of these. So, just out of curiosity, which database(s) do you prefer*? Again, I've only used MySQL 3.2.x and HSQLDB so experimenting with some of Postgres's features has been quite a bit of fun, but I haven't done any real testing or taken a "serious" look at it. I'm using it as the back-end for the project I'm working on, and none of the mentioned problems are real showstoppers -- but I've also been careful to make sure that the project abstracts this enough to make it trivial to use another DB. (* don't feel you have to limit your answer to OSS DBs, though of course those are always preferred [to me] -- but I personally wouldn't be interested in any DB that doesn't at least run on Linux.) Erik ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss
Re: OT- Comcast Subscriber Agreement
The only document I ever signed was the Continental Cablevision document. Somewhere in my archives I may have email from a VP authorizing an internal network. I could probably use that if Comcast starts playing hardball but it would be more like, "our agreement supercedes that, cease and desist". -- Jerry Feldman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Boston Linux and Unix user group http://www.blu.org PGP key id:C5061EA9 PGP Key fingerprint:053C 73EC 3AC1 5C44 3E14 9245 FB00 3ED5 C506 1EA9 pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: OT- Comcast Subscriber Agreement
It's a big pig, little pig thing. The story goes something like this: There were two baby pigs. Every night after the farmer had gone to bed, they would sneak under the wire, steal a bit of grain from the barn, eat it and and then sneak back before morning. One of the pigs had a larger appetite than the other and would eat a bit more each night. This went on for while until the more ravenous pig got too big to sneak back under the wire and got stuck there. Well, the farmer awoke to find a nice fattened pig there one Sunday morning. He sure made a fine meal that evening. -- __ | 0|___||. Andrew Gaunt *nix Sys. Admin,, etc. Lucent Technologies _| _| : : } [EMAIL PROTECTED] - http://www-cde.mv.lucent.com/~quantum -(O)-==-o\ [EMAIL PROTECTED] - http://www.gaunt.org [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, 9 Jun 2003, at 5:58pm, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Section 6, subsection g of [Comcast's TOS] states ... I'm pretty sure AT&T Broadband's TOS has similar prohibitions on multiplexing their service. They also prohibit a number of other things. At one time, you could read their TOS as prohibiting non-Windows OSes, but I think they changed that. Most ISPs also state that they can terminate your service at any time and for any reason, so the specifics really don't matter much anyway. As far as reality goes, must high-speed ISPs follow a "don't ask, don't tell" policy. As long as you're not causing a problem, they really don't care what you do. So, if you're just browsing from a couple different computers in your home, they likely don't know or care. If you start sucking up massive amounts of bandwidth, or sharing it with others, or call their tech support for help with your router, *then* you're costing them money, and they'll drop the hammer on you. Also, and I know the laws are really flakey in this area, but wouldn't intercepting, decoding and reading my traffic be a breach of my privacy as well as a violation of the reverse engineering laws? Well, IANAL, but AFAIK, all said laws have specific provisions allowing service operators to do what is necessary to maintain and protect their operations. I've had this argument with spammers before, and I can quote specific parts of a few laws if you like. :-) ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss
Re: postgresql
Cole Tuininga wrote: I agree that it has some great features, but when we looked into using it, we found some serious drawbacks to it. If anybody has comments on these, I'd be very interested to hear them. I don't have any comments except to say thanks for mentioning them Cole, because I didn't know about any of these. So, just out of curiosity, which database(s) do you prefer*? Again, I've only used MySQL 3.2.x and HSQLDB so experimenting with some of Postgres's features has been quite a bit of fun, but I haven't done any real testing or taken a "serious" look at it. I'm using it as the back-end for the project I'm working on, and none of the mentioned problems are real showstoppers -- but I've also been careful to make sure that the project abstracts this enough to make it trivial to use another DB. (* don't feel you have to limit your answer to OSS DBs, though of course those are always preferred [to me] -- but I personally wouldn't be interested in any DB that doesn't at least run on Linux.) Erik ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss
Re: OT- Comcast Subscriber Agreement
>This was cut from the email announcement. Yes, that would be an example of one of those lowest-common-denominator messages I referred to. [.] >I believe from this that attbi email forwarding will not >be available if the transition wizard is not used You are, of course, free to believe whatever you like. However, rather than us inflicting any more of our (mostly) ATTBI-specific exchange on this captive GNHLUG audience, I (again) recommend that you avail yourself of the info presented in the newsgroups I mentioned before coming to any conclusions in this matter. Unless you run Windows, that is, in which case you should probably just go ahead and use the "wizard". ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss
Re: [gnhlug-announce] June Merrimack Valley Linux User Group meeting,6/25/03
David Long wrote: Our speaker will be Bill Sconce, who will give an introduction to Python. Go Bill! I like Python. I am definitely planning to be there, all else permitting. Erik ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss
Re: OT- Comcast Subscriber Agreement
This was cut from the email announcement. Time is running out to make the transition to Comcast High-Speed Internet. Take a couple of minutes to make the necessary changes now. If you have already downloaded the Transition Wizard, the only thing you need to do is restart your computer on or after June 30. >> (my emphasis) If you do not choose to use our easy Transition Wizard by June 30, 2003, you will not be able to take advantage of attbi.com e-mail forwarding - but you will still have high-speed Internet access. If you have not already made the transition, simply: I believe from this that attbi email forwarding will not be available if the transition wizard is not used Michael O'Donnell wrote: > >What is even more disturbing from their latest notice > >to subscribers is the fact that unless you use their > >update agent, you will not be able to use the att > >email forwarding That to me seems wrong, coupled > >with the fact that the update agent only works on OE, > >not any other email client... > > Ascribe not to malevolent collusion that which can > be adequately explained by incompetence or inertia. ;-> > > Again, I urge attbi.com customers to read their > attbi-specific newsgroups if you'd like info that's > a bit more useful than what's available from the > clueless lowest-common-denominator messages sent > out by the ATTBI marketing dept. This is apparently > how the email situation will shake out: > > - Your old email address will (in most cases) >continue to be valid for some period of time. > - Emails sent to your old address will be handled >by the same server that will be handling msgs >sent to your new address. > - The hostnames for the old email servers will NOT >be valid after the transition. > > So, for a while, email to both old and new addresses > will be valid. However, unless you tell your email > software about the new servers (which I mentioned > previously) you won't be able to send or receive ANY > email, old or new. This is true for Linux users as > well as Windows users, and you are not required to > run the "wizard" as long as you're comfortable making > the appropriate changes by hand. > ___ > gnhlug-discuss mailing list > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss
Re: OT- Comcast Subscriber Agreement
>What is even more disturbing from their latest notice >to subscribers is the fact that unless you use their >update agent, you will not be able to use the att >email forwarding That to me seems wrong, coupled >with the fact that the update agent only works on OE, >not any other email client... Ascribe not to malevolent collusion that which can be adequately explained by incompetence or inertia. ;-> Again, I urge attbi.com customers to read their attbi-specific newsgroups if you'd like info that's a bit more useful than what's available from the clueless lowest-common-denominator messages sent out by the ATTBI marketing dept. This is apparently how the email situation will shake out: - Your old email address will (in most cases) continue to be valid for some period of time. - Emails sent to your old address will be handled by the same server that will be handling msgs sent to your new address. - The hostnames for the old email servers will NOT be valid after the transition. So, for a while, email to both old and new addresses will be valid. However, unless you tell your email software about the new servers (which I mentioned previously) you won't be able to send or receive ANY email, old or new. This is true for Linux users as well as Windows users, and you are not required to run the "wizard" as long as you're comfortable making the appropriate changes by hand. ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss
[gnhlug-announce] June Merrimack Valley Linux User Group meeting, 6/25/03
Who: Bill Sconce What: An introduction to Python When: 7:30 PM, Wednesday, June 25th, 2003 Where: 2nd floor, Martha's Exchange, Nashua, NH Directions: http://wiki.gnhlug.org/twiki2/bin/view/Www/Marthas_directions The Greater New Hampshire Linux User Group, Merrimack Valley Chapter (MerriLUG), will hold its next monthly meeting on Wednesday June 25th, 2003 at 7:30 PM in the second floor banquet room at Martha's Exchange in Nashua, NH. As always, all interested persons are welcome to attend. Our speaker will be Bill Sconce, who will give an introduction to Python. Dinner @ 18:00ish at Martha's (1rst floor, typically in the back, right-hand side).. For information on this and other GNHLUG activities visit: http://www.gnhlug.org -dl -- David A. Long JumpShift, LLC [EMAIL PROTECTED] 603-891-0316 888-249-JUMP ___ gnhlug-announce mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-announce ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss
Re: OT- Comcast Subscriber Agreement
I recall that Comcast is tight with Microsoft. MS made a big investment in Comcast a few years ago. On Tue, 2003-06-10 at 10:31, Chris wrote: > > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > > On Mon, 9 Jun 2003, at 5:58pm, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > > Section 6, subsection g of [Comcast's TOS] states ... > > > > I'm pretty sure AT&T Broadband's TOS has similar prohibitions on > > multiplexing their service. They also prohibit a number of other things. > > At one time, you could read their TOS as prohibiting non-Windows OSes, but I > > think they changed that. > > > > What is even more disturbing from their latest notice to subscribers is the fact > that unless you use their update agent, you will not be able to use the att > email forwardingThat to me seems wrong, coupled with the fact that the > update agent only works on OE, not any other email client... > > > > ___ > gnhlug-discuss mailing list > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss
Re: OT- Comcast Subscriber Agreement
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > On Mon, 9 Jun 2003, at 5:58pm, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > Section 6, subsection g of [Comcast's TOS] states ... > > I'm pretty sure AT&T Broadband's TOS has similar prohibitions on > multiplexing their service. They also prohibit a number of other things. > At one time, you could read their TOS as prohibiting non-Windows OSes, but I > think they changed that. > What is even more disturbing from their latest notice to subscribers is the fact that unless you use their update agent, you will not be able to use the att email forwardingThat to me seems wrong, coupled with the fact that the update agent only works on OE, not any other email client... ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss
Re: Apache2 questions and Hello Again
Alexander Gallichon wrote: I feel slightly bad about this message because I haven't kept up with reading the mailing list and haven't posted in a few months, nor really made much effort to attend the meetings, but that aside, here are my questions. PHP, I have Apache2 and php, I can run php files through php and get the proper output, but I don't think I have Apache2 configured to properly interpret the php before, so I'm curious what I need to change to get that to work. If you compiled PHP as an Apache module, you'll want to add the following two lines to your httpd.conf: AddInputFilter PHP .php AddOutputFilter PHP .php Also, I have some directories I wish to display to the public (and those that I don't have .htaccess files), but changing permissions on those folders doesn't effect it, understandably. There's something like autoindex that I need to turn on somewhere. Any help? From the Apache 2 manual (http://httpd.apache.org/docs-2.0/mod/mod_autoindex.html): Automatic index generation is enabled with using Options +Indexes. It is turnded off by default, but if you turn it on for a directory, say your document root, it is automatically on for every subdirectory under that one. You can also turn it on or off on a per-directory basis. See the Apache 2 documentation for more information. ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss
Re: SuSE rsync?
In a message dated: Tue, 10 Jun 2003 09:43:33 EDT [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: >On Mon, 9 Jun 2003, at 3:37pm, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: >> Anyone here mirror SuSE from a sight which supports rsync mirroring? > > "sight"? ;-) Doh! You caught me. Maybe it was because there was no rsync site in sight ? ;) > Seriously, I believe SuSE imposes limits on what you can do with their >distribution, since it contains their intellectual property (YaST and other >components). I believe that includes limits on redistribution. That might >explain the dearth of mirrors. I actually did find a couple, they have a list on their website. I may be wrong, but I think their tools are freely redistributable (in binary), just not GPL'ed, which may account for the lack of source for things like YaST. -- Seeya, Paul -- Key fingerprint = 1660 FECC 5D21 D286 F853 E808 BB07 9239 53F1 28EE It may look like I'm just sitting here doing nothing, but I'm really actively waiting for all my problems to go away. If you're not having fun, you're not doing it right! ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss
Re: OT- Comcast Subscriber Agreement
On Mon, 9 Jun 2003, at 5:58pm, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Section 6, subsection g of [Comcast's TOS] states ... I'm pretty sure AT&T Broadband's TOS has similar prohibitions on multiplexing their service. They also prohibit a number of other things. At one time, you could read their TOS as prohibiting non-Windows OSes, but I think they changed that. Most ISPs also state that they can terminate your service at any time and for any reason, so the specifics really don't matter much anyway. As far as reality goes, must high-speed ISPs follow a "don't ask, don't tell" policy. As long as you're not causing a problem, they really don't care what you do. So, if you're just browsing from a couple different computers in your home, they likely don't know or care. If you start sucking up massive amounts of bandwidth, or sharing it with others, or call their tech support for help with your router, *then* you're costing them money, and they'll drop the hammer on you. > Also, and I know the laws are really flakey in this area, but wouldn't > intercepting, decoding and reading my traffic be a breach of my privacy as > well as a violation of the reverse engineering laws? Well, IANAL, but AFAIK, all said laws have specific provisions allowing service operators to do what is necessary to maintain and protect their operations. I've had this argument with spammers before, and I can quote specific parts of a few laws if you like. :-) -- Ben Scott <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | The opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do | | not represent the views or policy of any other person or organization. | | All information is provided without warranty of any kind. | ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss
Re: SuSE rsync?
On Mon, 9 Jun 2003, at 3:37pm, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Anyone here mirror SuSE from a sight which supports rsync mirroring? "sight"? ;-) Seriously, I believe SuSE imposes limits on what you can do with their distribution, since it contains their intellectual property (YaST and other components). I believe that includes limits on redistribution. That might explain the dearth of mirrors. This is all based on my very vague memories of when I looked into this some years ago, so it could be wrong. -- Ben Scott <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | The opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do | | not represent the views or policy of any other person or organization. | | All information is provided without warranty of any kind. | ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss
Gentoo PPC LiveCD
I got both the KDE and the Gnome one last night to try them out on my powerbook and G3 tower. Overall they're okay, they're good to get a feel for linux on a Mac they do have some shortcomings but most of that is probably because I'm spoiled by how well the Knoppix LiveCD works. Both boot just fine when you hold down the "c" key at bootup, neither boot into a GUI like the Knoppix CD. They also don't have XFree setup so you have to run this Xeasyconf and then run startx, then start kde or gnome from there. On the powerbook I couldn't get the airport card to work and that was a bit of a bummer. A Linksys card works fine, but not the internal airport card. On my G3 tower I had an odd problem, I could get the interface up and I could get a lease from the dhcp server, but it was missing a script or something and wouldn't configure the interface. Manually setting everything with static settings worked however. Mac-On-Linux wouldn't work for me and I'm not sure why. I would run th config for it then run startmol and I'd get a nice white screen and the whole system would just lock right up. To bad too, MoL was one of the things I really wanted to try out. The Gnome CD was missing a lot of applications that I wanted to try out like Gaim, Evolution, Abiword, FreeCIV. Also, some things wouldn't run at all. On the KDE disk there was a mr. potato head thing and that wouldn't run due to lack of a graphics sets, some games were missing sound files, other programs just didn't work at all and seg faulted. Finally, I've noticed this in just about every PPC version of XFree I've ever tried (LinuxPPC, YellowDog, Debian for PPC) the default mouse sensitivity is WAY to high, I know it's easy enough to change, but jeeze, you move the thing just a mm and your pointer flys across the screen and that is very annoying on a powerbook with a touchpad. ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss
