Re: [GNC] $0 splits in QIF imported incorrectly, flipping + and - values

[Jim DeLaHunt]

I don't use QIF files, so I have no direct stake in this question. But, 
reading the discussion in bug 551459 
(https://bugs.gnucash.org/show_bug.cgi?id=551459), it seems to me that 
we have the following situation:


1. different bookkeeping applications (Quicken, Moneydance) use what is 
ostensibly the same QIF format in different ways (as Derek Atkins 
pointed out in comment #1)


2. The different uses of QIF are such that GnuCash import behaviour 
which works for one application fails for the other.


3. For Bug 105179 - QIF import reverses deposit/withdrawal - a change 
was made to GnuCash to favour Moneydance's use of QIF at the expense of 
Quicken's use of QIF. This change kept QIF import structured as a single 
unit with no choice of behaviour.


4. This doesn't seem like a difficult technical problem. We have samples 
of the different QIF files. I expect we can find where to change the 
code. Rather it's a problem of product definition and of interaction 
design. The product definition part is identifying how many Quicken 
users are harmed how severely by one behaviour, and how many Moneydance 
users are harmed how severely by the other behaviour. (BWooster alludes 
to this in comment 14.) The interaction design problem is to figure out 
how to let GnuCash accommodate both  behaviours in an easy-to-use way. 
An option on import?  Adding a second QIF for Moneydance option to the 
import menu?


5. And once there is agreement on the design of a fix, someone needs to 
do the development work. It will happen faster if someone with the right 
skills offers to do it.


6. We don't need to stay stuck with the current "Moneydance QIF works at 
the expense of Quicken users" situation, if we don't want to be. To 
answer a Quicken user's question: yes, there is hope.


  —Jim DeLaHunt

On 2020-09-28 14:48, B Wooster wrote:

Found an existing bug report about this, from 2008, and recent comments
from Quicken users pointing out how this makes it impossible to move to
gnucash oh well.

I added my "me too" waiting on the bug (12+ years... wonder if there is
hope?!!) https://bugs.gnucash.org/show_bug.cgi?id=551459#c10

https://bugs.gnucash.org/show_bug.cgi?id=551459#c2  Bug 551459 - Split $0
transactions
says:
"
Rather than completely mangle the import of those files, a decision was
made to reverse the signs on any transaction where:
  split line amounts + "T" line amount = 0
...
So this bug is confirmed, but nothing may be done about it.
"

On Sun, Sep 27, 2020 at 10:38 PM David Carlson 
wrote:


Very few of us veteran users have imported Quicken files with release 4.x
importer, but in the 'olden' days many of us found that due to the many
liberties that Quicken allowed, we needed to start test imports with tiny
chunks , see whether accounts were assigned correctly or not,  matches
found, etc.  Then it was often more efficient to edit some things in the
Quicken file before making fresh qif exports.

Good luck.



On Sun, Sep 27, 2020, 8:43 PM Christopher Lam 
wrote:


Please file a bug, and include .qif and screenshots from Quicken to
illustrate the transaction.

On Sun, 27 Sep 2020 at 23:06, B Wooster  wrote:


Thanks everyone, I think once I clean up my example and terminology,

I'll

file a bug.

Certainly the checking account is all fine as far as total balance is
concerned - but then importing further accounts messes up every account

-

including checking.
That is the same even if I include both checking and savings QIF in one
import session.

Also tested just now with gnucash Version: 4.2 Build ID:

4.2+(2020-09-26)

On Sun, Sep 27, 2020 at 5:21 PM Jim DeLaHunt 
wrote:


Hello, BWooster:

I think I may see a terminology difference, which might be interfering
with you making your question clear in this forum.

On 2020-09-27 11:41, B Wooster wrote:

$0 split transactions are not getting imported from QIF correctly.
Non-zero transactions get imported fine.

In GnuCash terminology, a "split" typically means a "split line" in a
transaction. Each transaction consists of two or more split lines,

with

credits and debits which sum to zero. See the Tutorial and Concepts
Guide, 2.9.3. "Simple vs. Split Transactions",
. A
"simple transaction" is a transactions with two splits, e.g. one split
to a chequing account and another split to an account for insurance
expense, presented in the ledger of the chequing account, so that only
the split to the insurance expense account is displayed and the split

to

the chequing account is implicit.  A "split transaction" is a
transaction with three or more splits. It cannot be fully displayed

with

the split to the chequing account implicit.

When I look at the QIF file example you give, it seems that the S, E,
and $ lines together describe one of what GnuCash would call a

"split".

None of these sets of QIF lines have a value of zero. So your file

does

not have what GnuCash would call a "$0 split".


Right, the 

Re: [GNC] clip board paste across catagories

[John Ralls]

> On Sep 28, 2020, at 9:25 PM, ToddAndMargo via gnucash-user 
>  wrote:
> 
> On 2020-09-26 23:44, ToddAndMargo via gnucash-user wrote:
>> Hi All,
>> Fedora 32, x64
>> Xfce 4.14
>> gnucash-4.1-1.fc32.x86_64
>> I has a situation where I have the Date, Number, Description, Transfer, 
>> Payment, Charge loaded into the secondary clipboard (, ctrl).  
>> (Linux has four clipboards.)
>> When I paste (ctrl) into GnuCash, I can't get it to paste
>> across boundaries.  In other words everything goes into "date".
>> I am using tabs as delimiters.  What should I be using?
>> Many thanks,
>> -T
> 
> Just entered:
> 
> tabs fail to move to new new fields when pasted:
> https://bugs.gnucash.org/show_bug.cgi?id=797957
> 

There's no need to post here about bugs. Anyone interested in being notified of 
bugs can subscribe to bug mail in Bugzilla.

Regards,
John Ralls

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Re: [GNC] clip board paste across catagories

[ToddAndMargo via gnucash-user]

On 2020-09-26 23:44, ToddAndMargo via gnucash-user wrote:

Hi All,

Fedora 32, x64
Xfce 4.14
gnucash-4.1-1.fc32.x86_64


I has a situation where I have the Date, Number, Description, Transfer, 
Payment, Charge loaded into the secondary clipboard (, 
ctrl).  (Linux has four clipboards.)


When I paste (ctrl) into GnuCash, I can't get it to paste
across boundaries.  In other words everything goes into "date".

I am using tabs as delimiters.  What should I be using?


Many thanks,
-T


Just entered:

tabs fail to move to new new fields when pasted:
https://bugs.gnucash.org/show_bug.cgi?id=797957



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Re: [GNC] GnuCash 4.2 Released

[Jimmy R via gnucash-user]

I'm using Linux Mint 20.04
I think flathub updated GNC 4.1 > 4.2 automatically ?
I can't remember updating it unless it was in the list of upgrades and did
not notice it

Jimmy



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Re: [GNC] $0 splits in QIF imported incorrectly, flipping + and - values

[David Carlson]

That is interesting.  I had not seen that bug report.  It goes back to
GnuCash Release 2.2.something.  It seems like a real stretch to have a zero
value transaction in account 'C' to record a transfer between accounts 'A'
and 'B'. Quicken did and does allow some strange things  I don't recall
having that as an issue back in 2004 when I briefly tried Moneydance, then
another program before switching to GnuCash in 2007 or thereabouts.

I am not sure if that's the gist of the difference between Moneydance
exports and Quicken exports, But I would agree that GnuCash should prefer
to import Quicken files correctly over Moneydance files. Perhaps another
user might be interested in writing a Bash program to convert these
mal-formed QIF files to to something that GnuCash could import.  Another
thing to look into is whether it is still possible to find the QIF
conversion to CSV macro for MS Office or Libre Office.

On Mon, Sep 28, 2020 at 4:49 PM B Wooster  wrote:

> Found an existing bug report about this, from 2008, and recent comments
> from Quicken users pointing out how this makes it impossible to move to
> gnucash oh well.
>
> I added my "me too" waiting on the bug (12+ years... wonder if there is
> hope?!!) https://bugs.gnucash.org/show_bug.cgi?id=551459#c10
>
> https://bugs.gnucash.org/show_bug.cgi?id=551459#c2  Bug 551459 - Split $0
> transactions
> says:
> "
> Rather than completely mangle the import of those files, a decision was
> made to reverse the signs on any transaction where:
>  split line amounts + "T" line amount = 0
> ...
> So this bug is confirmed, but nothing may be done about it.
> "
>
> On Sun, Sep 27, 2020 at 10:38 PM David Carlson <
> david.carlson@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Very few of us veteran users have imported Quicken files with release 4.x
>> importer, but in the 'olden' days many of us found that due to the many
>> liberties that Quicken allowed, we needed to start test imports with tiny
>> chunks , see whether accounts were assigned correctly or not,  matches
>> found, etc.  Then it was often more efficient to edit some things in the
>> Quicken file before making fresh qif exports.
>>
>> Good luck.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sun, Sep 27, 2020, 8:43 PM Christopher Lam 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Please file a bug, and include .qif and screenshots from Quicken to
>>> illustrate the transaction.
>>>
>>> On Sun, 27 Sep 2020 at 23:06, B Wooster  wrote:
>>>
>>> > Thanks everyone, I think once I clean up my example and terminology,
>>> I'll
>>> > file a bug.
>>> >
>>> > Certainly the checking account is all fine as far as total balance is
>>> > concerned - but then importing further accounts messes up every
>>> account -
>>> > including checking.
>>> > That is the same even if I include both checking and savings QIF in one
>>> > import session.
>>> >
>>> > Also tested just now with gnucash Version: 4.2 Build ID:
>>> 4.2+(2020-09-26)
>>> >
>>> > On Sun, Sep 27, 2020 at 5:21 PM Jim DeLaHunt 
>>> > wrote:
>>> >
>>> > > Hello, BWooster:
>>> > >
>>> > > I think I may see a terminology difference, which might be
>>> interfering
>>> > > with you making your question clear in this forum.
>>> > >
>>> > > On 2020-09-27 11:41, B Wooster wrote:
>>> > > > $0 split transactions are not getting imported from QIF correctly.
>>> > > > Non-zero transactions get imported fine.
>>> > >
>>> > > In GnuCash terminology, a "split" typically means a "split line" in a
>>> > > transaction. Each transaction consists of two or more split lines,
>>> with
>>> > > credits and debits which sum to zero. See the Tutorial and Concepts
>>> > > Guide, 2.9.3. "Simple vs. Split Transactions",
>>> > > . A
>>> > > "simple transaction" is a transactions with two splits, e.g. one
>>> split
>>> > > to a chequing account and another split to an account for insurance
>>> > > expense, presented in the ledger of the chequing account, so that
>>> only
>>> > > the split to the insurance expense account is displayed and the
>>> split to
>>> > > the chequing account is implicit.  A "split transaction" is a
>>> > > transaction with three or more splits. It cannot be fully displayed
>>> with
>>> > > the split to the chequing account implicit.
>>> > >
>>> > > When I look at the QIF file example you give, it seems that the S, E,
>>> > > and $ lines together describe one of what GnuCash would call a
>>> "split".
>>> > > None of these sets of QIF lines have a value of zero. So your file
>>> does
>>> > > not have what GnuCash would call a "$0 split".
>>> > >
>>> >
>>> > Right, the file is actual (dummied) data from a large 15+ year Quicken
>>> QIF
>>> > export.
>>> > That transaction originated from a Quicken split entry.
>>> >
>>> > Whether the final amount to checking is 0.01 (deposit), -0.01
>>> (withdrawal),
>>> > or 0.00, I was expecting all three to show up similarly in gnucash.
>>> > The first two do, the last one does not.
>>> > The first two also work correctly  when loading further accounts - it
>>> 

Re: [GNC] 8.1.1. Find Transaction

[David Carlson]

Jamestk,

Please do not change topics in an existing thread.  Start a new topic.  In
this case Liz was able to provide a good answer, but often others may also
want to help but their help would get lost under the wrong topic.

On Mon, Sep 28, 2020 at 4:45 PM Liz Dodd  wrote:

> On Mon, 28 Sep 2020 12:31:54 -0500 (CDT)
> Jamestk  wrote:
>
> > Liz, what version if GNU Cash are you using please, might be worth
> > upgrading as useful tool.
> >
> > On another topic, just noticed when using quote feature it almost (not
> > quite) publishes your email address ?
> >
>
> 1. I can recall that from sometime in the past, but when I checked on
> my later version the find box did close.
> This is interesting, because there are options like "modify last
> search" (not correct name) and they are meaningless when the box
> disappears after an initial search
>
> 2. If you use a normal mail client, you will see every poster's email
> address. I use claws-mail. I see that you have used a nabble, a third
> party interface to the mailing list.
>
> Liz
> ___
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-- 
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Re: [GNC] GnuCash 4.2 Released

[David Cousens]

James,

Linux Mint generally doesn't upgrade application packages between releases.
They usually use whatever version of GnuCash was current in the Ubuntu
release on which the Linux MInt release is based although for LM20 that
lists 3.8b and V4.0 was what was initially installed for the repository when
I first upgraded to LM20. GnuCash is not loaded as a default package in LM
but is avavilable from the LM/Ubuntu apt repository.

The following command in a terminal will list the packages installed
initially in LM
zgrep '^Package:' /var/log/installer/initial-status.gz|sed 's/.* //'|sort

If you want to upgrade to the latest version it is usually necessary to
either  build from the sources
(https://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/Building_On_Linux) 
or if there is a flathub or snap copy of the version you want, load that.

David Cousens



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Re: [GNC] $0 splits in QIF imported incorrectly, flipping + and - values

[B Wooster]

Found an existing bug report about this, from 2008, and recent comments
from Quicken users pointing out how this makes it impossible to move to
gnucash oh well.

I added my "me too" waiting on the bug (12+ years... wonder if there is
hope?!!) https://bugs.gnucash.org/show_bug.cgi?id=551459#c10

https://bugs.gnucash.org/show_bug.cgi?id=551459#c2  Bug 551459 - Split $0
transactions
says:
"
Rather than completely mangle the import of those files, a decision was
made to reverse the signs on any transaction where:
 split line amounts + "T" line amount = 0
...
So this bug is confirmed, but nothing may be done about it.
"

On Sun, Sep 27, 2020 at 10:38 PM David Carlson 
wrote:

> Very few of us veteran users have imported Quicken files with release 4.x
> importer, but in the 'olden' days many of us found that due to the many
> liberties that Quicken allowed, we needed to start test imports with tiny
> chunks , see whether accounts were assigned correctly or not,  matches
> found, etc.  Then it was often more efficient to edit some things in the
> Quicken file before making fresh qif exports.
>
> Good luck.
>
>
>
> On Sun, Sep 27, 2020, 8:43 PM Christopher Lam 
> wrote:
>
>> Please file a bug, and include .qif and screenshots from Quicken to
>> illustrate the transaction.
>>
>> On Sun, 27 Sep 2020 at 23:06, B Wooster  wrote:
>>
>> > Thanks everyone, I think once I clean up my example and terminology,
>> I'll
>> > file a bug.
>> >
>> > Certainly the checking account is all fine as far as total balance is
>> > concerned - but then importing further accounts messes up every account
>> -
>> > including checking.
>> > That is the same even if I include both checking and savings QIF in one
>> > import session.
>> >
>> > Also tested just now with gnucash Version: 4.2 Build ID:
>> 4.2+(2020-09-26)
>> >
>> > On Sun, Sep 27, 2020 at 5:21 PM Jim DeLaHunt 
>> > wrote:
>> >
>> > > Hello, BWooster:
>> > >
>> > > I think I may see a terminology difference, which might be interfering
>> > > with you making your question clear in this forum.
>> > >
>> > > On 2020-09-27 11:41, B Wooster wrote:
>> > > > $0 split transactions are not getting imported from QIF correctly.
>> > > > Non-zero transactions get imported fine.
>> > >
>> > > In GnuCash terminology, a "split" typically means a "split line" in a
>> > > transaction. Each transaction consists of two or more split lines,
>> with
>> > > credits and debits which sum to zero. See the Tutorial and Concepts
>> > > Guide, 2.9.3. "Simple vs. Split Transactions",
>> > > . A
>> > > "simple transaction" is a transactions with two splits, e.g. one split
>> > > to a chequing account and another split to an account for insurance
>> > > expense, presented in the ledger of the chequing account, so that only
>> > > the split to the insurance expense account is displayed and the split
>> to
>> > > the chequing account is implicit.  A "split transaction" is a
>> > > transaction with three or more splits. It cannot be fully displayed
>> with
>> > > the split to the chequing account implicit.
>> > >
>> > > When I look at the QIF file example you give, it seems that the S, E,
>> > > and $ lines together describe one of what GnuCash would call a
>> "split".
>> > > None of these sets of QIF lines have a value of zero. So your file
>> does
>> > > not have what GnuCash would call a "$0 split".
>> > >
>> >
>> > Right, the file is actual (dummied) data from a large 15+ year Quicken
>> QIF
>> > export.
>> > That transaction originated from a Quicken split entry.
>> >
>> > Whether the final amount to checking is 0.01 (deposit), -0.01
>> (withdrawal),
>> > or 0.00, I was expecting all three to show up similarly in gnucash.
>> > The first two do, the last one does not.
>> > The first two also work correctly  when loading further accounts - it
>> > matches up transactions correctly between savings and checking, etc.
>> >
>> >
>> > > In the transaction "PPay Check Incorrect Withdrawal from Savings", the
>> > > S, E, and $ lines add up to $0. This corresponds to the $0.00 in the U
>> > > and T lines. It appears that you are calling this a "$0 split" or "$0
>> > > split transaction". In GnuCash terms, I would call it a correct,
>> > > balanced transaction.  Note that none of the S lines mention the
>> > > "L[Checking]" account.
>> > >
>> > > In the transaction "PPay Check Correct Deposit to Savings", the S, E,
>> > > and $ lines add up to $1,200. This corresponds to the $1,200.00 in
>> the U
>> > > and T lines. It appears you are calling this a "non-zero transaction".
>> > > In GnuCash terms, I would call it in incorrect, unbalanced
>> transaction —
>> > > unless you assume an implicit entry of $1,200.00 to the "L[Checking]"
>> > > account. That would make it a balanced transaction.
>> > >
>> > > So, it appears that GnuCash is not importing transactions correctly
>> from
>> > > the "L[Checking]" account QIF file if the S, E, and $ lines add up to
>> > > $0, 

Re: [GNC] GnuCash 4.2 Released

[David Cousens]

Not sure about 19.1 but Ulyana (LM 20) came with GnuCash v4.0 as the
repository version although apt-cache show lists 3.8b-1ubuntu1 from the main
ubuntu repository. For LM19.1 Ubuntu(18.04) it should be 2.6.19 as that is
what was listed in the Ubuntu package list for Bionic which LM19 was based
on.

The repository has both the Flathub and a normal binary version availbale.
It is possible the Flathub version may be more up to date It will be
maintained by one of the packagers in the Linux Mint community or simply use
the Ubuntu repository versions current at the LM version release date. It
likely will depend on what versions of the major library packages are
included in that release and the dependency of GnuCash on them.





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Re: [GNC] 8.1.1. Find Transaction

[Liz Dodd]

On Mon, 28 Sep 2020 12:31:54 -0500 (CDT)
Jamestk  wrote:

> Liz, what version if GNU Cash are you using please, might be worth
> upgrading as useful tool.
> 
> On another topic, just noticed when using quote feature it almost (not
> quite) publishes your email address ?
> 

1. I can recall that from sometime in the past, but when I checked on
my later version the find box did close.
This is interesting, because there are options like "modify last
search" (not correct name) and they are meaningless when the box
disappears after an initial search

2. If you use a normal mail client, you will see every poster's email
address. I use claws-mail. I see that you have used a nabble, a third
party interface to the mailing list.

Liz
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Re: [GNC] Just installed 4.2

[w...@theprescotts.com]

Mike,

I use Gnucash with two different data files  and switch between them all the 
time. Occasionally, when Gnucash opens I will get a message that the database 
is locked by another user. I just tell it to go ahead anyway, and it works fine.

Will

On 2020 Sep 27, at 09-27 17:41:24, mike823  wrote:

Will,

I did what you did, closed GnuCash and started for the second time. I got an
error on closing "cannot save database" I believe, but the second time Net
Work Line Chart works just fine.

Still have the error in top of the Advanced Portfolio report. 



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Re: [GNC] GnuCash 4.2 Released

[Tommy Trussell]

On Mon, Sep 28, 2020 at 2:09 PM Jamestk  wrote:

> Not yet a full time Linux user but noticed another GNUCash icon within the
> Office menu (Mint Cinnamon 19.1) this loads a very fast GNUCash 4.2 without
> the normal installation - is it installed as an upgrade if you have an
> older
> version already installed?
>

What do you consider "the normal installation" in Mint Cinnamon 19.1? I
would presume that the Mint repositories would contain an older version of
GnuCash (3.8 or older). SO if you have 4.2 I would expect you to have
installed a FlatPak or built it yourself.

If you don't remember how you installed it, what version and build does
GnuCash show when you choose

Help --> About


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[GNC] Report headings, can one separate the company name from the report name?

[Chris Green]

I have just been looking at and printing some reports, the 'Company
Name' set in Properties is just put on the same line as the report
name.

Is there any way to get the Company Name on a line by itself at the
top of the report?

-- 
Chris Green
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Re: [GNC] GnuCash 4.2 Released

[Jamestk]

Thanks for all of the hard work put into GNUCash, always appreciated.

Not yet a full time Linux user but noticed another GNUCash icon within the
Office menu (Mint Cinnamon 19.1) this loads a very fast GNUCash 4.2 without
the normal installation - is it installed as an upgrade if you have an older
version already installed?

Thanks 



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Re: [GNC] 8.1.1. Find Transaction

[Jamestk]

Liz, what version if GNU Cash are you using please, might be worth upgrading
as useful tool.

On another topic, just noticed when using quote feature it almost (not
quite) publishes your email address ?



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Re: [GNC] GnuCash 4.2 Released

[Manfred Usselmann]

Void Linux package updated to 4.2 without issue. Thanks a lot from my 
side as well.


Manfred

Am 28.09.2020 03:01, schrieb David Cousens:

Built on Linux Mint Ulyana (20) from the tarball.
No obvious problems.
Thanks for all the work John, Geert, Frank  and all involved

David Cousens



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