Re: [GNC] How to record payments for several items paid with a single transaction?
You better use splits for such cases. There is nothing wrong even when a few splits that goes to the same account: e.g. when you want for some reason (for convenience) keep an items of the same bill separately in your expenses account. Otherwise, when you would try to reconcile with, say, bank account statement, you will fail as bank has no idea how did you split your expense among different items and this expense appears as a single row for a total amount in a statement. Sergey. On 7/21/23 11:09, Chris Green wrote: I quite often seem to have cases where several 'items' (see below for the type of thing I mean) are paid for with a single payment to/from a bank account. What is a good way to record this sort of thing? Examples:- I pay in money (cash) from collections and other donations. These need to be recorded as separate items but end up as a single deposit to the bank account. At present I manage these by entering them as separate transactions but with the same deposit slip number in the 'Num' column in GnuCash. Is there a better way? I pay money from (say) a savings account to a current account to cover several payments (to one supplier) from the current account. Similarly the payment from the current account may be a single payment to cover several invoices. How should one record these? I want to be able to see how the single payment is made up from several items but also show that it was a single transaction. There isn't a 'Num' to use in the second case above, this isn't a cheque payment, it's an online transaction so there's no (easy) way to identify it really. Would a split transaction work for this? However I thought split transactions are for joining together payments to 'different' places rather than joining together several payments to and from the same places. Any/all help would be very welcome. ___ gnucash-user mailing list gnucash-user@gnucash.org To update your subscription preferences or to unsubscribe: https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user - Please remember to CC this list on all your replies. You can do this by using Reply-To-List or Reply-All.
Re: [GNC] Maintain two accounts in same machine
You could try to `set HOME` environment variable in a batch file followed by gnucash invocation. According to https://docs.gtk.org/gtk3/running.html a gtk app should inspect it on Windows as well. I can't verify this as I have no Windows, so please share your results. Sergey On Sun, Jun 25, 2023 at 2:07 AM N Srinivasan via gnucash-user < gnucash-user@gnucash.org> wrote: > Hi, > > Is there is a way to maintain two accounts and _reports_ in same > machine. > > > Thanks, > > N.Srinivasan > ___ > gnucash-user mailing list > gnucash-user@gnucash.org > To update your subscription preferences or to unsubscribe: > https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user > - > Please remember to CC this list on all your replies. > You can do this by using Reply-To-List or Reply-All. > ___ gnucash-user mailing list gnucash-user@gnucash.org To update your subscription preferences or to unsubscribe: https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user - Please remember to CC this list on all your replies. You can do this by using Reply-To-List or Reply-All.
Re: [GNC] gnc-fq-update missing
Fred, it is a packaging issue, I filed a bug for you: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=2211176 On Tue, May 30, 2023 at 6:07 PM Fred Tydeman wrote: > On Linux Fedora 37, gnucash 4.14, gnc-fq-update is missing. > Actually, I have many versions of Fedora Linux, each with different > versions of GnuCash, and none of the systems have gnc-fq-update. > In looking at the online gnucash docs, section 11.*, I do not see > instructions on getting gnc-fq-update; just instructions on how to use it. > My system does have: > gnc-fq-check > gnc-fq-dump > gnc-fq-helper > ___ > gnucash-user mailing list > gnucash-user@gnucash.org > To update your subscription preferences or to unsubscribe: > https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user > - > Please remember to CC this list on all your replies. > You can do this by using Reply-To-List or Reply-All. > ___ gnucash-user mailing list gnucash-user@gnucash.org To update your subscription preferences or to unsubscribe: https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user - Please remember to CC this list on all your replies. You can do this by using Reply-To-List or Reply-All.
Re: [GNC] Invoice system and Deffered Income (Sergey Mende)
David, Thank you very much for your advice. Anyway, I will not be maintaining the system being developed forever, so apart from implementing the specific requirements, I have to follow the accounting that could be understood by any particular accountant, so your input is very valuable. Regards, Sergey. On Tue, May 30, 2023 at 5:14 PM wrote: > Hi Sergey, > > I am not a tech guy, but I am an accountant. The advice I gave you was to > allow you to do something technically which fitted your requirement for > "deferred income", but I would not wish to operate an accounting system > that > way myself. > > Typically, in the situation you describe, when a customer is late paying, > you do not have to treat the invoice differently. You create a bad debt > provision ( Credit bad debt provision in liabilities and Debit bad debts in > expenses) outside the invoicing procedures. You do it directly in the > accounts. Its only when you know the customer will never pay that you need > to write the invoice off. The way to do this would be to process a payment, > but instead of selecting a bank account, you select the Bad debt provision > you already set up which will then give you the following entry (credit > account receivables and Debit the bad debt provision) . > > However, that would leave you with a sales revenue and a bad debt expense > in > your income statement, which is not quite what you wanted to do, as your > requirement was never to show the income for an unpaid invoice. This > requirement is very unusual. I would recommend the typical accounting I > describe, because GNU Cash is built to work that way, as are all accounting > systems, and you will make life much easier for yourself with less work. > Obviously though, I know nothing about your business, and your method might > be correct for you. However, in many tax jurisdictions you would have a > problem. For example, sales tax (like VAT) which has to be accounted for as > soon as you invoice a customer and cannot be deferred. > > Hope this helps. > David > > Hi, David, > > yes, probably this is a more convenient option in my case as when a > customer does not pay an invoice before the due date, I still have to deal > with such invoice differently, by posting it to the bad debt asset and take > further actions (all these invoices for the services being provided, so > they are must to pay until a customer clearly terminates subscription). So > unposting is unavoidable in a sense and could be done for both scenarios, > when a customer pays in time and when she does not. Perhaps, I just need to > thoroughly set up the accounts structure. > > Thank you, > Sergey > > On Tue, May 30, 2023 at 5:01?AM wrote: > > > Hi, > > > > I wonder if a simple way is that when you create an invoice, you then > post > > it for some distant time in the future. After all, at some date in the > > future it should become income, it's only a question of time. . That > way, > > when you run an income statement for year to date, I guess you will not > see > > the income. Then when the customer pays, you unpost the invoice and > then > > post it using the date of payment. > > > > If eventually, if the customer never pays, you could just unpost the > > invoice. > > > > II think that might work, but not sure if its exactly what you want. > Seems > > too simple though. > > -Original Message- > From: gnucash-user > On Behalf Of > gnucash-user-requ...@gnucash.org > Sent: Tuesday, May 30, 2023 8:50 PM > To: gnucash-user@gnucash.org > Subject: gnucash-user Digest, Vol 242, Issue 72 > > Send gnucash-user mailing list submissions to > gnucash-user@gnucash.org > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > gnucash-user-requ...@gnucash.org > > You can reach the person managing the list at > gnucash-user-ow...@gnucash.org > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than > "Re: Contents of gnucash-user digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > >1. Re: gunzip test.gnucash fails (R Losey) >2. Re: Revisiting Quotes (Bruce Schuck) (Bruce Schuck) >3. Re: Revisiting Quotes (Bruce Schuck) (Bruce Schuck) >4. Re: Invoice system and Deffered Income (Michael or Penny Novack) >5. Re: Invoice system and Deffered Income (Sergey Mende) >6. Re: Invoice system and Deffered Income (Sergey Mende) > > > -- > > Message: 1 > Date: Mon, 29 May 2
Re: [GNC] Invoice system and Deffered Income
Yes, Michael, you are correct. I meant Debt asset, sorry for mistake (I understand that it could eventually become an expense when appropriate decision would be taken). I am a software engineer, not an accountant and I am still learning all this terminology. Regards, Sergey. On Tue, May 30, 2023 at 3:59 PM Michael or Penny Novack < stepbystepf...@comcast.net> wrote: > On 5/30/2023 8:35 AM, Sergey Mende wrote: > > Hi, David, > > > > yes, probably this is a more convenient option in my case as when a > > customer does not pay an invoice before the due date, I still have to > deal > > with such invoice differently, by posting it to the bad debt asset and > take > > further actions (all these invoices for the services being provided, so > > they are must to pay until a customer clearly terminates subscription). > > Except - The "bad debt" account would usually be an account of type > "expense", not type "asset" > > Look, I'm sorry, gnucash is a great help automating most of keeping > double entry books, but you still have to learn the basics of double > entry bookkeeping in order to use it effectively. Otherwise your ledger > might be a shambles (messed up chart of accounts, aka CoA). Gnucash > cannot tell you what accounts you should have in your CoA. You have to > tell that to gnucash, and where they it in the CoA hierarchy. > > Michael D Novack > > > ___ > gnucash-user mailing list > gnucash-user@gnucash.org > To update your subscription preferences or to unsubscribe: > https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user > - > Please remember to CC this list on all your replies. > You can do this by using Reply-To-List or Reply-All. > ___ gnucash-user mailing list gnucash-user@gnucash.org To update your subscription preferences or to unsubscribe: https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user - Please remember to CC this list on all your replies. You can do this by using Reply-To-List or Reply-All.
Re: [GNC] Invoice system and Deffered Income
Hi Michael, Thank you very much for your clarification. As I just responded to David, I probably need to rethink thoroughly how the existing invoice system could be applied for my needs. Regards, Sergey On Tue, May 30, 2023 at 3:31 PM Michael or Penny Novack < stepbystepf...@comcast.net> wrote: > On 5/29/2023 5:44 PM, Sergey Mende wrote: > > Hi there, > > I am trying to figure out if the existing customer invoice system is > > suitable for my needs. > > For simplicity, let's say I have the following accounts: > > > > Current (Bank) > > Undetermined Income (Income, for bank account transactions just imported > > from the online banking) > > Deferred Income (Income, used at invoice creation to track invoices that > > are posted and sent to the customers but not paid yet) > > Income (for invoices that got paid, so the payment actually received as a > > bank transaction and processed as a payment of an invoice) > > Receivable (A/Receivable, for tracking invoices) > > No, sorry, but the invoices are part of the business system and only for > use with accrual basis accounting. Can't be used for cash basis > accounting, which is what I sense you are thinking about when you see > ":receivables" as "deferred". You will been to familiarize yourself of > the differences between accrual basis accounting and cash basis accounting. > > In accrual based accounting, the "income" is earned when the invoice is > sent, the customer legally obligated to pay and the amount goes into an > asset account "receivables". When the customer later actually pays (you > mark it paid) that gets transferred to cash (you bank account). If you > don't think of "receivables" as real money, look up what a "factor" > does. In other words, "receivables" might be collateral for a loan or > even sold. > > Michael D Novack > > PS: When some of us are using the term "deferred income" it is in the > context of tax sheltered retirement accounts. Things like IRAs and 401Ks > (but money going into Roth IRA is after tax, would not be deferred > income). Thus I might have a 401K through work allowing me to > contribute before tax income up to the regulated limit with the > employer matching up to 3% of salary. In other words, were I selecting > 5% of my salary to go into the 401K THAT would be deferred income and so > would the 3% matched by the employer. Not escaping income tax, just > deferring it till after retirement as distributions are taken form the > 401K. > > ___ > gnucash-user mailing list > gnucash-user@gnucash.org > To update your subscription preferences or to unsubscribe: > https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user > - > Please remember to CC this list on all your replies. > You can do this by using Reply-To-List or Reply-All. > ___ gnucash-user mailing list gnucash-user@gnucash.org To update your subscription preferences or to unsubscribe: https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user - Please remember to CC this list on all your replies. You can do this by using Reply-To-List or Reply-All.
Re: [GNC] Invoice system and Deffered Income
Hi, David, yes, probably this is a more convenient option in my case as when a customer does not pay an invoice before the due date, I still have to deal with such invoice differently, by posting it to the bad debt asset and take further actions (all these invoices for the services being provided, so they are must to pay until a customer clearly terminates subscription). So unposting is unavoidable in a sense and could be done for both scenarios, when a customer pays in time and when she does not. Perhaps, I just need to thoroughly set up the accounts structure. Thank you, Sergey On Tue, May 30, 2023 at 5:01 AM wrote: > Hi, > > I wonder if a simple way is that when you create an invoice, you then post > it for some distant time in the future. After all, at some date in the > future it should become income, it's only a question of time. . That way, > when you run an income statement for year to date, I guess you will not see > the income. Then when the customer pays, you unpost the invoice and then > post it using the date of payment. > > If eventually, if the customer never pays, you could just unpost the > invoice. > > II think that might work, but not sure if its exactly what you want. Seems > too simple though. > > David > > > Hi there, > > I am trying to figure out if the existing customer invoice system is > > suitable for my needs. > > For simplicity, let's say I have the following accounts: > > > > Current (Bank) > > Undetermined Income (Income, for bank account transactions just > > imported from the online banking) Deferred Income (Income, used at > > invoice creation to track invoices that are posted and sent to the > > customers but not paid yet) Income (for invoices that got paid, so the > > payment actually received as a bank transaction and processed as a > > payment of an invoice) Receivable (A/Receivable, for tracking > > invoices) > > > > The problem is that I don't like to see non-paid invoice splits in the > > Income Register until the invoice payment arrives to my bank account, > > imported and processed as invoice payment. > > > > The idea is to assign an incoming imported transaction as a payment > > for an invoice from the Bank account Register and change the Income > > account appropriately, so the paid invoice appears in the Income > > Register > > > > As I got from the docs, this mailing list and my experiments, there is > > no way to change the Income account after the Invoice has been posted > > and specifically at the payment processing step. > > > > Am I missing something? > > > > Thank you, > > Sergey > > > > > > -Original Message- > From: gnucash-user > On Behalf Of > gnucash-user-requ...@gnucash.org > Sent: Tuesday, May 30, 2023 8:06 AM > To: gnucash-user@gnucash.org > Subject: gnucash-user Digest, Vol 242, Issue 70 > > Send gnucash-user mailing list submissions to > gnucash-user@gnucash.org > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > gnucash-user-requ...@gnucash.org > > You can reach the person managing the list at > gnucash-user-ow...@gnucash.org > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than > "Re: Contents of gnucash-user digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > >1. Re: Revisiting Quotes (Bruce Schuck) >2. Problem with using Python with version 5.1 (Bob Reite) >3. Re: experience using Alpha Vantage (John Layman) >4. Re: Finance::Quote Quote Throttling (John Layman) >5. Invoice system and Deffered Income (Sergey Mende) >6. Re: Problem with using Python with version 5.1 (Jon Schewe) >7. Finance-Quote 1.56 released! (Bruce Schuck) >8. Last Num Bug(s) ?? (viking...@san.rr.com) >9. Re: Finance-Quote 1.56 released! (WR D) > 10. Updated: Last Num Bug(s) ?? (viking...@san.rr.com) > 11. Re: Finance-Quote 1.56 released! (Bruce Schuck) > 12. Re: Invoice system and Deffered Income (Vincent Dawans) > > > -- > > Message: 1 > Date: Mon, 29 May 2023 14:31:55 -0700 > From: Bruce Schuck > To: gnucash-user@gnucash.org > Subject: Re: [GNC] Revisiting Quotes > Message-ID: <4c6d310d-9e3b-309f-ff21-dd550cf5a...@asgard-systems.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed > > On Thu May 25, 2023 at 14:59:14 EDT R Losey wrote: > > > From the discussion here, one would get the idea that the only two > > options for q
Re: [GNC] Invoice system and Deffered Income
e heavy-duty one when you want your books to > be in cash-basis at all times. Personally, because I don't use the vendor > bill option and do have that many invoices and only need precise reporting > once a year, I just edit my unpaid invoices and push them to January 1st > when I reach the end of the fiscal year. Not pretty but it does the job for > me. But I could see that not working if you have a lot of invoices or need > cash-basis reporting more often. > > There could also be a way to deal with this purely with reports. It would > keep the registers in accrual mode as they are, not do any pending accounts > and adjustments there, but then provide a cash-basis P and cash-basis > Balance sheet reports that would do the adjustment. That would be the > simplest way to provide at least some functionality without any manual > entries. But the challenge would come from partial payments. If an invoice > has several income accounts in it, and a partial payment is made, there is > no way (for the computer) to tell which income account the partial payment > should be applied to without additional info from the user. One could > decide to either pay the invoice items in the order presented or distribute > proportionally or any other way. Partial payment is an edge case but still > has to be accounted for. The same would need to happen for bills as well of > course. At the end this would still not be ideal since your main registers > would still follow accrual so the info wouldn't match the report. For > instance when closing books, profit/loss would be calculated as accrual in > the register, you would only see the cash-basis in the report. > > The alternative is to automate the workaround above and enable it on a > per book basis. It's actually sort of similar to the type of per book > selection and automation done by the trading accounts (for a completely > different purpose). But it's a substantial amount of work to do it properly. > > Sorry if my explanations are confusing. It's hard to explain this sort of > thing without visuals. I might try to update the wiki page with some of > these ideas and some screenshots. Also it's possible there might be some > other caveats I have not run into of course as each use case can be > different. > > Sincerely, > > Vincent Dawans > > On Mon, May 29, 2023 at 2:46 PM Sergey Mende wrote: > >> Hi there, >> I am trying to figure out if the existing customer invoice system is >> suitable for my needs. >> For simplicity, let's say I have the following accounts: >> >> Current (Bank) >> Undetermined Income (Income, for bank account transactions just imported >> from the online banking) >> Deferred Income (Income, used at invoice creation to track invoices that >> are posted and sent to the customers but not paid yet) >> Income (for invoices that got paid, so the payment actually received as a >> bank transaction and processed as a payment of an invoice) >> Receivable (A/Receivable, for tracking invoices) >> >> The problem is that I don't like to see non-paid invoice splits in the >> Income Register until the invoice payment arrives to my bank account, >> imported and processed as invoice payment. >> >> The idea is to assign an incoming imported transaction as a payment for an >> invoice from the Bank account Register and change the Income account >> appropriately, so the paid invoice appears in the Income Register >> >> As I got from the docs, this mailing list and my experiments, >> there is no way to change the Income account after the Invoice has been >> posted and specifically at the payment processing step. >> >> Am I missing something? >> >> Thank you, >> Sergey >> ___ >> gnucash-user mailing list >> gnucash-user@gnucash.org >> To update your subscription preferences or to unsubscribe: >> https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user >> - >> Please remember to CC this list on all your replies. >> You can do this by using Reply-To-List or Reply-All. >> > ___ gnucash-user mailing list gnucash-user@gnucash.org To update your subscription preferences or to unsubscribe: https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user - Please remember to CC this list on all your replies. You can do this by using Reply-To-List or Reply-All.
[GNC] Invoice system and Deffered Income
Hi there, I am trying to figure out if the existing customer invoice system is suitable for my needs. For simplicity, let's say I have the following accounts: Current (Bank) Undetermined Income (Income, for bank account transactions just imported from the online banking) Deferred Income (Income, used at invoice creation to track invoices that are posted and sent to the customers but not paid yet) Income (for invoices that got paid, so the payment actually received as a bank transaction and processed as a payment of an invoice) Receivable (A/Receivable, for tracking invoices) The problem is that I don't like to see non-paid invoice splits in the Income Register until the invoice payment arrives to my bank account, imported and processed as invoice payment. The idea is to assign an incoming imported transaction as a payment for an invoice from the Bank account Register and change the Income account appropriately, so the paid invoice appears in the Income Register As I got from the docs, this mailing list and my experiments, there is no way to change the Income account after the Invoice has been posted and specifically at the payment processing step. Am I missing something? Thank you, Sergey ___ gnucash-user mailing list gnucash-user@gnucash.org To update your subscription preferences or to unsubscribe: https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user - Please remember to CC this list on all your replies. You can do this by using Reply-To-List or Reply-All.
