Re: What's the best way to model an electronic funds transfer pull with hold
Nelson, Just one comment from another user; My banks do not show holds online, or if they do, it is a simple summary of book balance vs available balance. They warn that ACH transfers these-days often clear on the same day. To me, it is too much effort to try to track that, and as others have mentioned, GnuCash does not track those details unless you manually set up mechanisms in your chart of accounts and scheduled transactions, etc. David C On Sun, Oct 1, 2017 at 12:00 PM, John Ralls wrote: > > > > On Oct 1, 2017, at 9:49 AM, Nelson wrote: > > > > Hi John, > > > > What I am doing today is exactly you are saying. I have a "pending" > account > > and I would record two transfers: > > > > - $1 bank-a -> pending > > - $1 pending -> bank-b postdated by 5 business days. > > > > What bothers me with this approach is that when I go online on bank-a I > see > > a different balance than I have in GC. > > > > You could record the transfer to the suspense account 2 business days in > the future so that you’re aware of the obligation but today’s balance still > matches. > > IMO it’s better to just accept that trying to match your books to the > bank’s day-to-day is a fools errand and to recognize transactions in your > books when you initiate them… and maybe reflect on why you’re maintaining > 10 bank accounts and tying up money for days at a time by shifting it among > the accounts. > > Regards, > John Ralls > ___ > gnucash-user mailing list > gnucash-user@gnucash.org > https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user > - > Please remember to CC this list on all your replies. > You can do this by using Reply-To-List or Reply-All. > ___ gnucash-user mailing list gnucash-user@gnucash.org https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user - Please remember to CC this list on all your replies. You can do this by using Reply-To-List or Reply-All.
Re: What's the best way to model an electronic funds transfer pull with hold
Hi Nelson, Such is life in the real world. GnuCash is not designed for the real world, just a simplified approximation. GnuCash reports just one main balance. You can get more by using the reconciled, cleared, present, future minimum and total columns in the main Accounts tab, but that is beside my point. In the bank-a tab, you get just one balance. In contrast, your online view of the bank probably reports at least two balances: one for the total amount of money in the account, including the $10,000, and one for the available balance, excluding the $10,000 while those funds are on hold. Since GnuCash gives you just one balance, you can only model one of those balances. I choose to model the available balance in the moment because that is more important to me at the time. For my long-term records, I choose to model the actual balance, which is why I delete those transactions after the hold expires. Best, John > On Oct 1, 2017, at 12:49 PM, Nelson wrote: > > Hi John, > > What I am doing today is exactly you are saying. I have a "pending" account > and I would record two transfers: > > - $1 bank-a -> pending > - $1 pending -> bank-b postdated by 5 business days. > > What bothers me with this approach is that when I go online on bank-a I see > a different balance than I have in GC. ___ gnucash-user mailing list gnucash-user@gnucash.org https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user - Please remember to CC this list on all your replies. You can do this by using Reply-To-List or Reply-All.
Re: What's the best way to model an electronic funds transfer pull with hold
> On Oct 1, 2017, at 9:49 AM, Nelson wrote: > > Hi John, > > What I am doing today is exactly you are saying. I have a "pending" account > and I would record two transfers: > > - $1 bank-a -> pending > - $1 pending -> bank-b postdated by 5 business days. > > What bothers me with this approach is that when I go online on bank-a I see > a different balance than I have in GC. > You could record the transfer to the suspense account 2 business days in the future so that you’re aware of the obligation but today’s balance still matches. IMO it’s better to just accept that trying to match your books to the bank’s day-to-day is a fools errand and to recognize transactions in your books when you initiate them… and maybe reflect on why you’re maintaining 10 bank accounts and tying up money for days at a time by shifting it among the accounts. Regards, John Ralls ___ gnucash-user mailing list gnucash-user@gnucash.org https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user - Please remember to CC this list on all your replies. You can do this by using Reply-To-List or Reply-All.
Re: What's the best way to model an electronic funds transfer pull with hold
I don't think you can have it both ways. Money in the float doesn't really belong to you so it won't be reflected in your bank statements/online account status. RBM On 10/01/2017 10:49 AM, Nelson wrote: Hi John, What I am doing today is exactly you are saying. I have a "pending" account and I would record two transfers: - $1 bank-a -> pending - $1 pending -> bank-b postdated by 5 business days. What bothers me with this approach is that when I go online on bank-a I see a different balance than I have in GC. -- Sent from: http://gnucash.1415818.n4.nabble.com/GnuCash-User-f1415819.html ___ gnucash-user mailing list gnucash-user@gnucash.org https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user - Please remember to CC this list on all your replies. You can do this by using Reply-To-List or Reply-All. ___ gnucash-user mailing list gnucash-user@gnucash.org https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user - Please remember to CC this list on all your replies. You can do this by using Reply-To-List or Reply-All.
Re: What's the best way to model an electronic funds transfer pull with hold
Hi John, What I am doing today is exactly you are saying. I have a "pending" account and I would record two transfers: - $1 bank-a -> pending - $1 pending -> bank-b postdated by 5 business days. What bothers me with this approach is that when I go online on bank-a I see a different balance than I have in GC. -- Sent from: http://gnucash.1415818.n4.nabble.com/GnuCash-User-f1415819.html ___ gnucash-user mailing list gnucash-user@gnucash.org https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user - Please remember to CC this list on all your replies. You can do this by using Reply-To-List or Reply-All.
Re: What's the best way to model an electronic funds transfer pull with hold
Hi Nelson, Others have suggested a suspend account; you can find those details elsewhere. I find that to be more than I need, but I do sometimes need to track this type of hold in the moment. When that happens, I simply add a transaction to the account that removes the funds to some miscellaneous account and a second transaction reversing that transfer when the funds are scheduled to be released. I usually delete those two transactions after the funds are released from the hold. This keeps me aware that the money is not really available during the hold period, but it does not clutter up my long-term view of the accounts with unnecessary transactions. For what its worth, at least in my experience here in the United States, we can no longer count on even one day of float between banks. My main bank now initiates same-day ACH transfers when I request a pull transfer. I was bitten by this the first time it happened because I did not get around to funding the transfer at the other end for several hours. In the interim bank-b received the pull request, bounced it for NSF and charged me $25. Best, John > On Oct 1, 2017, at 10:48 AM, Nelson wrote: > > Let's assume that we have two accounts, bank-a and bank-b. > > - bank-a has a $11,000.00 balance > - bank-b initiates a $10,000.00 electronic funds transfer pull. > - money shows up in bank-b immediately but there is a 5 business days hold > so money is not available. > - for at least 2 business days, until it clears through the payment network, > the transaction doesn't show up in bank-a but this money should be shown > somehow as unavailable. > > TIA for recommendations. ___ gnucash-user mailing list gnucash-user@gnucash.org https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user - Please remember to CC this list on all your replies. You can do this by using Reply-To-List or Reply-All.
Re: What's the best way to model an electronic funds transfer pull with hold
David, I am well aware that the problem I am raising is not a very common one and want to thank you for your answer. The thing is that I have to work with tens of accounts and each transitory state is extremely important. Imagine that when I have a number of pulls pending on an account becomes quite difficult to track all of them. Any mistake here is expensively penalized by the banks. In the same time, I could waste a lot of resources by not realizing their availability. -- Sent from: http://gnucash.1415818.n4.nabble.com/GnuCash-User-f1415819.html ___ gnucash-user mailing list gnucash-user@gnucash.org https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user - Please remember to CC this list on all your replies. You can do this by using Reply-To-List or Reply-All.
Re: What's the best way to model an electronic funds transfer pull with hold
Nelson, When *I* have entered this in GnuCash, I have simply entered a transaction from one account to the other, effective when I initiated the transaction. The various delays and holds are, to my way of looking at this, background noise, and I just ignore them. They go away in a few days’ time anyhow. If you have a need to track your money at this level of granularity, others have talked about creating “suspense” accounts to hold funds for the time they are neither here nor there (I’d name that account “Limbo” or “Purgatory”, personally). There are discussions about this on the list, which you can google. HTH, David > On Oct 1, 2017, at 7:48 PM, Nelson wrote: > > Let's assume that we have two accounts, bank-a and bank-b. > > - bank-a has a $11,000.00 balance > - bank-b initiates a $10,000.00 electronic funds transfer pull. > - money shows up in bank-b immediately but there is a 5 business days hold > so money is not available. > - for at least 2 business days, until it clears through the payment network, > the transaction doesn't show up in bank-a but this money should be shown > somehow as unavailable. > > TIA for recommendations. > > > > > -- > Sent from: http://gnucash.1415818.n4.nabble.com/GnuCash-User-f1415819.html > ___ > gnucash-user mailing list > gnucash-user@gnucash.org > https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user > - > Please remember to CC this list on all your replies. > You can do this by using Reply-To-List or Reply-All. . ___ gnucash-user mailing list gnucash-user@gnucash.org https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user - Please remember to CC this list on all your replies. You can do this by using Reply-To-List or Reply-All.
What's the best way to model an electronic funds transfer pull with hold
Let's assume that we have two accounts, bank-a and bank-b. - bank-a has a $11,000.00 balance - bank-b initiates a $10,000.00 electronic funds transfer pull. - money shows up in bank-b immediately but there is a 5 business days hold so money is not available. - for at least 2 business days, until it clears through the payment network, the transaction doesn't show up in bank-a but this money should be shown somehow as unavailable. TIA for recommendations. -- Sent from: http://gnucash.1415818.n4.nabble.com/GnuCash-User-f1415819.html ___ gnucash-user mailing list gnucash-user@gnucash.org https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user - Please remember to CC this list on all your replies. You can do this by using Reply-To-List or Reply-All.
