[Goanet] Timor Leste - an unbiased view
* G * O * A * N * E * T C * L * A * S * S * I * F * I * E * D * S * Enjoy your holiday in Goa. Stay at THE GARCA BRANCA from November to May There is no better, value for money, guest house. Confirm your bookings early or miss-out Visit http://www.garcabranca.com for details/booking/confirmation. --- http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/national/1104AP_East_Timor_What_Went_Wrong.html An excerpt: The territory was a key focus for the United Nations because militias linked to the Indonesian military killed, burned and pillaged after East Timor voted for an end to Indonesian rule. Indonesian civil servants fled, leaving empty posts that could not be filled by untrained local residents. East Timor was left with only 20 percent of its secondary school teachers, only 23 medical doctors, and no pharmacists, according to a World Bank report. Many buildings were quickly rebuilt under U.N. supervision, and advisers from across the world helped train lawyers, judges and the armed forces. East Timor held elections and adopted a constitution. But some observers believe the United Nations left East Timor too soon - U.N. peacekeepers pulled out a year ago - and retained too much authority for too long. _ Do not post admin requests to the list. Goanet mailing list (Goanet@goanet.org)
RE: [Goanet] TIMOR LESTE
, it includes maps. It has been composed by the East Timor Action Network, an organisation based in the USA. And Nasci asks what is there in East Timor to steal Either he is being cynical or he is really ignorant of the facts. Either way, he is doing an excellent job. I rest my case. Best regards Paulo Colaco Dias. -The boundary dispute between East Timor and Australia is a question of life or death, a question of being continually poor, continually begging, or to be self-sufficient. - Xanana Gusmao - President of Timor Leste. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Nasci Caldeira Sent: 30 May 2006 13:42 To: goanet@goanet.org Subject: RE: [Goanet] TIMOR LESTE Nasci: The UN? Did you say? And yet the UN called on Australia to help in every way when the Timorese struggled against the Indons' occupation and their own sections that did not want independence from Indonesia. The UN did this, since they know that Portugal that should have been doing this, was and is not competent enough! The Potuguese are the cause of all the 'turmoil and tragedy' in Timor after giving them freedom; since they did not back it up with defense and other security etc. You are surely owning guilt on behalf of the Portuguese here! Paulo Dias: Australia has signed illegal treaties with Indonesia and has gone as far as betraying East Timor people by being the only country in the world to recognise East Timor's integration into Indonesia. All this for the benefit of the oil of East Timor. All this against International Law. Nasci: On what basis do you say that 'treaties' between two sovereign countries are 'illegal' ?? When the Indons were in control, the treaty was between Indonesia and Australia; now that East Timor is an indendent nation, the new treaty is between East Timor and Australia, on sharing of the produce from the Oil and Gas fields. These fields belong to both East Timor and Australia; they are midway in what is called 'the Timor Gap'. Hence the treaties to clarify and share etc. This is good international co-operation and help and Aid! Nothing wrong with it! -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.8.0/352 - Release Date: 30/05/2006 _ Do not post admin requests to the list. Goanet mailing list (Goanet@goanet.org)
RE: [Goanet] TIMOR LESTE
* G * O * A * N * E * T C * L * A * S * S * I * F * I * E * D * S * Enjoy your holiday in Goa. Stay at THE GARCA BRANCA from November to May There is no better, value for money, guest house. Confirm your bookings early or miss-out Visit http://www.garcabranca.com for details/booking/confirmation. --- Dear Paulo Colaco Dias and Jose Colaco in particular. --- Paulo Colaco Dias [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Australia has been stealing oil from East Timor since 1975. There are thousands of documents describing this. There are UN resolutions and an International Court of Law rulling against Australia illegal exploration of East TImor oil. Nasci: The UN? Did you say? And yet the UN called on Australia to help in every way when the Timorese struggled against the Indons' occupation and their own sections that did not want independence from Indonesia. The UN did this, since they know that Portugal that should have been doing this, was and is not competent enough! The Potuguese are the cause of all the 'turmoil and tragedy' in Timor after giving them freedom; since they did not back it up with defense and other security etc. You are surely owning guilt on behalf of the Portuguese here! Paulo Dias: Australia has signed illegal treaties with Indonesia and has gone as far as betraying East Timor people by being the only country in the world to recognise East Timor's integration into Indonesia. All this for the benefit of the oil of East Timor. All this against International Law. Nasci: On what basis do you say that 'treaties' between two sovereign countries are 'illegal' ?? When the Indons were in control, the treaty was between Indonesia and Australia; now that East Timor is an indendent nation, the new treaty is between East Timor and Australia, on sharing of the produce from the Oil and Gas fields. These fields belong to both East Timor and Australia; they are midway in what is called 'the Timor Gap'. Hence the treaties to clarify and share etc. This is good international co-operation and help and Aid! Nothing wrong with it! Paulo: We will see what happens in the next few days. Then we will talk. Nasci: I am not interested, in your views or in continuing this dialogue; If you are so concerned, you shouild go into East Timor, and help these people and try to bring 'peace' between the 'easterners' and westerners' and not spread falsehood. Beware of the machetes; Take a bag of rice and Goa sausages and some feny with you, please! :-) Regards Nasci Caldeira _ Do not post admin requests to the list. Goanet mailing list (Goanet@goanet.org)
Re: [Goanet] TIMOR LESTE
Martinho I have read about Australian interests in untapped oil in the region and the tensions this has generated. I doubt that Australia is merely returning the favour. If I am not mistaken, your John Pilger takes a rather different view. Cornel - Original Message - From: Anthony and Nolette de Souza [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: goanet@goanet.org Sent: Sunday, May 28, 2006 7:48 AM Subject: [Goanet] TIMOR LESTE It's no big deal that Australia has sent troops to reestablish order in Timor Leste for, during the Second World War, the Timorese saved hundreds or Aussies fighting the Japanese. Australia is merely returning the _ Do not post admin requests to the list. Goanet mailing list (Goanet@goanet.org)
Re: [Goanet] TIMOR LESTE
Bernardo Can you please help me to understand what exactly you mean in your sentence below? Thanks Cornel - Original Message - From: Bernado Colaco [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Goa's premiere mailing list, estb. 1994! goanet@goanet.org Sent: Sunday, May 28, 2006 5:19 AM Subject: RE: [Goanet] TIMOR LESTE Macau is not polarised and is flourishing. _ Do not post admin requests to the list. Goanet mailing list (Goanet@goanet.org)
RE: [Goanet] TIMOR LESTE
Macau is not polarised and is flourishing. Do not condone incompetence and failure like that of Goa and other countries of forced decolonisation. BC == --- Paulo Colaco Dias [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Fred, I agree with the opinion of Damien Kingsbury. ___ Try the all-new Yahoo! Mail. The New Version is radically easier to use The Wall Street Journal http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html _ Do not post admin requests to the list. Goanet mailing list (Goanet@goanet.org)
RE: [Goanet] TIMOR LESTE
Fred, I agree with the opinion of Damien Kingsbury. Unmet expectations: You see this in a lot of postcolonial countries, Damien Kingsbury, an Australian academic and expert on Indonesia and East Timor. Lots of people believe once their colonial masters are gone everything will get better. Well, often that isn't the case. You see, the problem in East Timor is lack of an Administrative Machine good enough to carry out the work planned by the government. The truth is that there is no Administrative infrastructure in East Timor yet. The country is only 4 years old. It has got a legitimate democratically elected government but lacks the remaining necessary administrative infrastructure to rebuild it. There are not enough engineers, not enough architects, not enough doctors. People's expectations are huge, but the government is unable to deliver because there is no infrastructure. The Australian PM and the wife of the President Xanana Gusmao blame the government and say that the ET Government is bad. I personally think that the government is doing what they can however they cannot do it on their own. What can a government do without a proper administrative infrastructure? Of course the solution for the problem is a longer co-operation between ET and the west. It is obvious that they need help and they are not getting enough. And now, to answer your tricky question Fred, I believe that it is more likely that they have learned their violence from the more recent colonial power of Indonesia than with the former Portuguese colonial power... And also a small comment about Martinho's email: Dear Martinho, this is no return of favour from the Australian. Don't even think about that. If Australia did not have any profit in the oil of East Timor, they would have not got involved so strongly as they currently are. Trust me, if it was not for the oil of East Timor (whose main beneficiary is Australia), the East Timorese would have been left completely alone to fall into civil war. Let us not have any illusions about this. Return of favour, yeah, right. East Timor saved by the oil of East Timor Gap. Nothing else! This document dated 2000 gives an introduction to the problem for those who want to read more about this: http://www.wsws.org/articles/2000/oct2000/tim-o25.shtml Best regards Paulo Colaco Dias. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Frederick [FN] Noronha Sent: 26 May 2006 21:48 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; goanet@goanet.org Subject: [Goanet] TIMOR LESTE Hi Martinho, Here's another perspective on what's happening in another former Portuguese colony. Without intending to bait our Lusostalgic friends, could one ask whether there was something specific about Portuguese colonialism that left behind strongly polarised, violent, almost-futureless societies when compared to others (apart from French colonialism too, to a degree ... where we also saw violent implosions like the Portuguese case?). FN http://www.forbes.com/work/feeds/ap/2006/05/26/ap2776496.html From: Anthony and Nolette de Souza Subject: TIMOR LESTE It's no big deal that Australia has sent troops to reestablish order in Timor Leste for, during the Second World War, the Timorese saved hundreds or Aussies fighting the Japanese. Australia is merely returning the favour. Martinho _ Do not post admin requests to the list. Goanet mailing list (Goanet@goanet.org)
[Goanet] TIMOR LESTE
Hi Martinho, Here's another perspective on what's happening in another former Portuguese colony. Without intending to bait our Lusostalgic friends, could one ask whether there was something specific about Portuguese colonialism that left behind strongly polarised, violent, almost-futureless societies when compared to others (apart from French colonialism too, to a degree ... where we also saw violent implosions like the Portuguese case?). FN http://www.forbes.com/work/feeds/ap/2006/05/26/ap2776496.html From: Anthony and Nolette de Souza Subject: TIMOR LESTE It's no big deal that Australia has sent troops to reestablish order in Timor Leste for, during the Second World War, the Timorese saved hundreds or Aussies fighting the Japanese. Australia is merely returning the favour. Martinho E-mail | Comments | E-Mail Newsletters | My Yahoo! | RSS Associated Press Update 10: Troops Try to Prevent War in East Timor By ANTHONY DEUTSCH , 05.26.2006, 02:54 PM Most Popular Stories Best Cars For The Bucks TV Pilots That Crash Fortunes Of Kings, Queens And Dictators How Much Home $1 Million Buys Best Big Companies Most Popular Videos The Perfect Pitch Parties You'd Want To Crash Writing On The Wall Vehicles Loaded With Value Joining The Circuit Hundreds of Australian troops supported by helicopters roaring overhead fanned out across East Timor's capital Friday, aiming to keep violence between the army and former soldiers from exploding into civil war. A small contingent of camouflage-clad U.S. Marines landed in Dili to protect the American Embassy, and Indonesia closed its land border with East Timor as the spiraling conflict drew in police, machete-wielding youths and residents frustrated by poverty and unemployment. In a sign of the depth of hatred dividing the Indian Ocean nation, a mob torched the house of a government minister, killing five children and an adult whose charred bodies were found Friday. The bloodshed that started after the March firing of 600 disgruntled soldiers - nearly half the 1,400-member army - is the most serious crisis East Timor has faced since it broke from Indonesian rule in 1999. The impoverished nation received millions of dollars in international aid over the last seven years, much of it focused on building up the military. After staging deadly riots last month, the sacked troops fled the seaside capital, set up positions in the surrounding hills and threatened guerrilla war if they were not reinstated. Sporadic gunfire and explosions, some near the presidential compound, were heard throughout the day Friday in Dili and from rebel positions on city outskirts. The clashes killed a civilian and a soldier, said Antonio Caleres, director of Dili's main hospital, bringing the death toll to 23 in the past four days. Machete-wielding youths were seen stopping a bus outside the capital Friday, asking passengers where they were from before letting them go. On Thursday, a crowd stormed a Dili neighborhood, where they smashed windows and used gasoline to burn houses, including the residence of Home Affairs Minister Rogerio Lobato. Lobato was not inside but six of his relatives were killed, including two young children and three teenagers, Prime Minister Mari Alkatiri said. I ran away when I saw them coming, neighbor Victor Do Dantos, 20, said of the attackers, declining to speculate on who they were. It was unclear whether the minister's home was deliberately targeted. Hundreds of heavily armed Australian troops patrolled the streets on foot or in armored personnel carriers Friday, backed up by Black Hawk helicopters. More Australians are expected to arrive in the coming days for a total 1,300. New Zealand, Malaysia and Portugal - East Timor's former colonial power - have pledged or sent smaller numbers of troops. Thousands of people have abandoned their homes, many seeking refuge inside the United Nations compound in Dili. I'm afraid and saddened. Australian troops are arriving here because we cannot solve own problems, said Julio Dos Reis, a 34-year-old prison guard standing by a roadside with his 2-year-old daughter. Our leaders don't have the ability to resolve this. East Timor's government asked for international help this week, but tensions grew Thursday when army soldiers attacked the national police headquarters, accusing officers of allying themselves with the renegade former troops. U.N. police and military advisers negotiated a cease-fire under which police were to surrender weapons and leave the building. As unarmed police were escorted out, soldiers opened fire. An injured policewoman screamed for help as U.N. officers and ambulances arrived at a street strewn with bodies and wounded in blood-soaked uniforms. At least 10 people were killed and 26 wounded, including two U.N. advisers, said U.N. spokesman Stephane Dujarric and a hospital director. The renegade soldiers were
