RE: Desperately need your immediate help!
RE: Hi all- I have an issue with my dealer and possibly Yamaha. My bike's burning loads of oil due to a bad service job. The dealer and Yamaha say that the problem is due to my using synthetic oil. (never mind the fact that I used the oil for 20,000 miles with no burning issue BEFORE the service) For those who are running synthetic oil, please let me know: o What type of oil is used o How long have you been using it in the GTS o What amount of oil is burned in 1000 miles I need to know this pretty quickly, so please reply directly to me, as soon as you can. Thanks very much, I'll let you know the results of my dealings with the dealer and Yamaha. -K Kelly, You're an engineer.their argument doesn't fly. The bike didn't burn oil and they disassemble it to do warranty work ( having to take out the pistons and rings to complete the job ) and they give it back and it burns oil. It sounds like the mechanic didn't reassemble the pistons back into the cylinders they came out of. Easy to do if he was not careful. The rings and cylinders no longer match. Also, where does it say in Yamaha literature that you can't use any oil but Yamaha's brand. It doesn't...it is illegal to say they have the only oil that will work when other oils exceed their oil's specs. No where in Yamaha manuals does it say you can only use Yamaha oil. It gives a recommended viscosity range and oil rating . Synthetic's exceed all of Yamaha's specs. The real fact is the dealer knows that Yamaha won't pay for any repairs the dealer fucked up. It is the dealer running scared and trying to cover his ass with bullshit excuses for his mechanic's screw up. Push the dealer...push Yamaha...contact the States Attorneys's office...Consumer Affairs...etc..become a pain in the ass. it will be fixed if you don't back down. hawke
Could I use Mercon III automatic transaxle fluid in ScottOile
RE:
Crisler, Jon wrote:
Mercon III ? I would think that any Dexron II/III would work. Arent Mercon
and Dexron standards interchangeable ?
It used to be that Dexron was for General Motors cars with
TurboHydromatic transmissions. Mercon used to be for Ford and some of
the American Motors, ('member them?), ilk.
I'm not sure about today's standards. They may be interchangeable in
current or modern models, but I haven't kept up with the changing
'automotive' world as of late.
That also brings up an interesting point. I have been lead to believe
that automatic transmission fluid carries a certain amount of 'friction'
or 'resistive' components that help the bands 'grab' a hold in the
transmission and to provide 'resistance' in the torque convertor. In
fact, it used to be an 'old mechanics' tale to run some in your engine
just before you changed the oil, it was supposed to 'sand' or remove
corrosion or carbon from the bearings and/or the piston walls. Because
of the 'grittyness' of the fluid, this practice was generally frowned
upon.
So if it can cause wear and tear, should you really be putting it on
something that already gets enough of that?
Brandon (ducking behind asbestos keyboard!)
___
Good point Brandon,
Transmission fluid is not designed to be the best metal lubricant
because it would cause the transmission to slip. It is probably a
better coolant than lubricant. Using a low viscosity lubricant in the
ScottOiler is required to keep it working and reduce the amount of
variation in flow from changing temperatures. The ScottOiler is
totally dependent to operate based on the very low differential
pressures caused by atmospheric pressure and gravity. In cool weather
my ScottOiler feed would stop flowing completely if you use anything
but the lightest viscosity oil. I tried to use Mobil 1 15/50 in mine
and it would top flowing on cool mornings.
Transmission fluid as a chain lubricant is better than WD40, but
not as good as a heavier oil that adheres to the chain and sprocket
surfaces and reduces friction more effectively. I use Mobil 1
15/50wt. or Mobil 1 90wt gear oil to which I add a 1/2 oz of ProLong
oil additive in my HawkeOiler. I like synthetic oils because they
flow well at low temperatures and can find their way into the
tightest space. There ability to flow into close tolerance fits was
initially a negative when they first came on the market...old engines
would often leak oil after changing over to synthetics.
I don't buy all that TV crap about being able to run the engine
without oil after adding ProLong, but I do believe ProLong is a great
metal friction reducer for metal to metal surfaces. It was
originally developed as a cutting oil additive to prolong tool life.
During my last long ride I ran out of it and ran for a while without
it in the oiler. I finally stopped and picked some up at WallyWorld
and added it to the chain oil when I added some oil. I swear I could
hear the difference as the chain became quieter over the next 50
miles. I will be the first one to admit we often hear what we want
to hear. But, I have nearly 20,000 miles on this chain and sprocket
set. The last time I adjusted it was 5,000 miles ago. Both the
chain and sprockets are in great shape. I fully expect to get 50,000
miles out of them.
I'm working on a WEB site for the HawkeOiler. In the meantime if any
one is interested I can Email them a PDF file for the latest brochure
I have written. I have an introductory special running on it right
now.
hawke
Re: GTS-1000 is one of the worst lists on the Net.
Now that I have your attention.. I have never seem such poor EMail posting practice and form. Some of you try to post photos, many post EMail in HTML code (like below), most you copy all previous Emails in total, instead of cutting to shorten, and paste it on your response taking up pages of space and forever to scroll through. Come on guys, you wouldn't get away with this on any other list that I know. Let' s reset our EMail programs so they don't forward HTML code and stop sending pages of past posts. hawke --_=_NextPart_001_01C02743.051CC4FC Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable !DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN" HTML HEAD META HTTP-EQUIV=3D"Content-Type" CONTENT=3D"text/html; = charset=3Diso-8859-1" META NAME=3D"Generator" CONTENT=3D"MS Exchange Server version = 5.5.2650.12" TITLERE: When will Yamaha learn (Was RE: Intermot) /TITLE /HEAD BODY PFONT SIZE=3D2The Vision was a 550, not a 500.nbsp; Just being = picky, my first street bike was a Vision 550 with the full = fairing.nbsp; Nice looking bike I always thought.nbsp; I moved on to = a Seca 650 Turbo, then a Zuki Katana 1100 (1988) then the GTS in = 1995./FONT/P PFONT SIZE=3D2-Original Message-/FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [A = HREF=3D"mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]"mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/A]/FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2Sent: Monday, September 25, 2000 1:45 PM/FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2To: Multiple recipients of list/FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2Subject: Re: When will Yamaha learn (Was RE: = Intermot) /FONT /P BR BR BR PFONT SIZE=3D2In your message dated: Mon, 25 Sep 2000 11:00:23 = EDT,/FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2your pithy ruminations on lt;When will Yamaha learn = (Was RE: Intermot)gt; were:/FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2=3Dgt; /FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2=3Dgt; /FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2=3Dgt; On Mon, 25 Sep 2000, Burton, Bob = wrote:/FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2=3Dgt; /FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2=3Dgt; gt; Yes we noticed but no reason for those = of us in the USA to look at it since/FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2=3Dgt; gt; only the FZ-1 (Fazer) is coming to the = USA this year. Besides it has forks/FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2=3Dgt; gt; :)/FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2=3Dgt; gt; Bob B./FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2=3Dgt; /FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2=3Dgt; When will Yamaha ever figure out the basics = of Marketing 101 and start to/FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2=3Dgt; sell us what we want.nbsp; The new sport = tourer looks good, yes, and Bob's/FONT /P PFONT SIZE=3D2Oh, yes. That's got to be Yamaha's weakest point. = /FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2The only bike that they got quot;rightquot; in = that business model was the FJ. That was /FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2what, 11 years of production, mucho refinement, and = they basically stopped /FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2selling it when the restrictions (noise, power, = primarily) due to being /FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2air-cooled were too much./FONT /P PFONT SIZE=3D2Let's see...Yamaha models that would have been great = if they had kept /FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2selling/developing/refining them, but they stopped = (at least for US sales) too /FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2soon:/FONT BRnbsp;nbsp;nbsp;nbsp;nbsp;nbsp;nbsp; FONT SIZE=3D2Vision = 500/FONT BRnbsp;nbsp;nbsp;nbsp;nbsp;nbsp;nbsp; FONT SIZE=3D2SRX = 600/FONT BRnbsp;nbsp;nbsp;nbsp;nbsp;nbsp;nbsp; FONT SIZE=3D2TDM = 850/FONT BRnbsp;nbsp;nbsp;nbsp;nbsp;nbsp;nbsp; FONT = SIZE=3D2GTS/FONT /P PFONT SIZE=3D2=3Dgt; fork comments notwithstanding, I'd seriously = entertain buying one if I/FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2=3Dgt; could.nbsp; More importantly./FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2=3Dgt; /FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2=3Dgt; I went to Yamaha of Australia's page.nbsp; = Let's see, the bikes I'd seriously/FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2=3Dgt; consider buying../FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2=3Dgt; /FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2=3Dgt; The SZR660, first and foremost.nbsp; If = Yamaha would import it I'd have a/FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2=3Dgt; deposit at my favorite dealer = tomorrow./FONT /P PFONT SIZE=3D2Me too!/FONT /P PFONT SIZE=3D2=3Dgt; /FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2=3Dgt; The TRX850.nbsp; I'd still consider it, but = it would have to displace my Duc/FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2=3Dgt; 900 CR for garage space.nbsp; If Yamaha had = brought this bike in before I/FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2=3Dgt; bought the Duc../FONT /P PFONT SIZE=3D2Maybe.../FONT /P PFONT SIZE=3D2=3Dgt; /FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2=3Dgt; The TDM850.nbsp; Hmm.nbsp; = Interesting.nbsp; No deposit yet, but not out of the/FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2=3Dgt; question./FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2=3Dgt; /FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2=3Dgt; The Diversion 900.nbsp; Since we don't get = the new FJ, this would be an/FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2=3Dgt; alternative./FONT /P PFONT SIZE=3D2Nothing that special, I'm afraid./FONT /P PFONT SIZE=3D2=3Dgt; /FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2=3Dgt; Etc./FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2=3Dgt; /FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2=3Dgt; Not all of us are waiting to buy cruisers, = dirt bikes, or fully faired/FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2=3Dgt; Supersports./FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2=3Dgt; /FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2=3Dgt; Phil/FONT BRFONT SIZE=3D2=3Dgt;
Responses to : Tire report
I'll respond piece meal.my ride / tire post got more flaming response than it deserved but my comments are all in fun. Charlie, you are right the Hot Springs great, especially the one with massages. Though not as good as the Nevada Cotton Club in soothing those sore muscles after a long day in the saddle...:)I think Roger Van Santen has pictures of the handle bar set up. It was on his bike. They don't look as good as they work. Tom, I'm glad Mez4's are working for you. All of those North-South/ East-West streets probably does have a lot to do with the difference in wear. Having been born and raised in the Windy City, I think they removed the last real curve in the Chicago road system when they straightened out the Outer Drive Downtown...:) Louis, the 880 comes in both bias and radial. I agree the Azaro 36 rear tire sucks. I wore mine out in three days and three thousand miles. I have gotten 17,000 miles out of the Avon Azaro 35 front and found it worked great wet and dry. Maybe the reason you got 8k miles out of your MEZ4 front tire and I got 11,000 out of my MEK4 is because I ran it at 40 psig. Higher pressure also helps to avoid the cupping that can quickly destroys a bikes front tire. This comment is based on long discussions with tire company engineers, but more on personal experience in having gone through as many as 6 sets of tire in less than a year. Mr. Ritzalot, Joerg said it more concisely than I could ever have. "Riding a unlubed chain is like f a dry lady." Can I have permission to use that as a marketing slogan for my HawkeOiler? The chain and sprocket companies love the business you guys give them that believe all you need is a periodic spray of WD40. THIS IS AN INFOMERCIAL. By the way my NEW HAWKEOILER is commercially available. It is better, smaller, positive feed, and less expensive than the ScottOiler and can even use WD40 or as I prefer 90 wt. gear oil or 15-50 Mobil 1 as a lubricant. I have few more comments to add to the manual after my last ride. Also, just because you couldn't find someone to rebuild the stock GTS shock doesn't mean they can't be rebuiltif you would have asked Roger Van Santen for the name of the company that rebuilt his shocks you would have save a $1000 bucks. I rode Rogers bike with his rebuilt shocks...better ride than my stock shocks. Small bumps disappear. I'm going to have mine done because the revised valving and set up they do is superior to the factory setting on the stock set up. Also, the company rebuilding the GTS shock commented that they were obviously Ohlins. Mr. Uranus, I gave up a long time ago debating guys that get their facts, knowledge, and education from a factory catalog. If that's what the book says, continue running 36 psig in a front tire and get reduced life and cupping. The tire factory loves your business. I'll bet you have a very difficult time making a decision when a range or more than one pressure is listed.:) By the way the 880 was also not initially recommended for the K1200LT BMW's, and has now become the tire of choice. It has triple to quadrupled tire life on the K bike over any tire previously tested. For a tire that is not recommended for the GTS , I can't figure why it has already lasted for 14,000 miles and I'll probably get close to 20,000 miles out of it and not have the first mechanical, cupping, uneven wear, or handling problem. But remember the GTS isn't listed in the 880 catalog as a tire than an be installed on the GTS so don't you dare use it:) hawke
Tire Report
i just got in from a few days short of four weeks touring the Western national parks and an Iron Butt get together in Gerlach, Nevada. The GTS was well represented in Gerlach with three GTS's, Rogers and SteeliDan being the other bikes. Missed Dave Biasotti, it would have made four GTS's. Two with HawkeOilers no less...:). A lot of time spent comparing how our bikes were set up and a chance to ride two other GTS's. It was great. Roger's Super Bike handle bars are my next mod. They make a significant improvement in handling. I also, found out the stock GTS shocks are Ohlins to start with and can be rebuilt. Makes sense seeing that Yamaha owns a piece of Ohlin and would only want the best on their Super bike. I installed a set of Metzlers, the 880 on the rear and a Mez4 on the front. The rear went on three weeks earlier and had 3,000 miles on it at the start. The trip took me a little over 11,000 miles and both tires lasted the full tour. Both tires saw some hard riding and more twisties than I want to see for a while. Mostly dry weather so I can't comment on how they stick in real wet weather. I ran the rear with 42 psig and front 40 psig, cold. The 880 rear still has at least another 5,000 miles left in it. The front Mez4 got 11,000 miles of life and is shot , with very little thread left. It wore like and inverted triangle with the point worn flat. The side walls were worn well before the center. I will use the 880 on the rear again, but the Mez4 is a handling disaster. From the time I put it on the front it was scary. At very low speed you would think the tire was going flat it let the bike move about so wildly. The Mez4 has a 1" hard rubber strip down the center and softer rubber sides. The sides start to wear very quickly and cause a very unstable condition on anything but a level surface. The slight depressions from trucks in the right hand lane would cause the bike to unpredictably and rapidly climb and shoot off in the direction of the slope. At low speeds it was a handful to keep the bike straight and upright on anything but a flat gravel free surface. I have had good service from the Avon Azaro on the front with out the handling problems. It looks like my next set will be 880 rear and Azaro front. The GTS performed flawlessly. I did have to reset both the ABS and bike computer once, a minor hick-up. ( key on-kill switch-push start a dozen times) If you don't wait for the computers to go through their automatic check before starting you can confuse them hawke
GTS to FZR stuff
Date: Wed, 20 Sep 2000 15:19:31 -0500 From: "Hawkins, Kevin" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Here's the Dyno chart. Modest gains in HP but wonderful gains in torque! http://www.geocities.com/~raddboy/gtsdyno.jpg Kevin Hawkins // Greensboro, NC [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.geocities.com/~raddboy Y2K Kawasaki ZRX1100 // '93 Yamaha GTS1000 _ Kevin, Are we looking at the same charts...it looks like a torque loss for the modified engine to me and a HP gain at high RPM only with a loss in HP at lower revs.. what am I reading wrong? hawke
RE: Aux lights
Before spending any money on aux. lights buy a relay and a 90/130 PIAA bulb for the stock reflector. Take a little time to adjust and Any particular reason for recommending the PIAA 90/130 over any other type/manufacturer? I tried saving a few bucks on several occasions; AJWhitney, etc, only to find the bulb construction to have bad welds on the tabs and end up having very short life. Basically I have had poor experience with cheapy bulbs. The PIAA's give good life and are good quality.and changing a headlight bulb on a GTS on the road is a pain in the ass. Do you use the stock socket for the bulb? NoI went to a higher wattage rating socket, separate relay and a clean 10 gauge wire run direct to the front of the bike. I'll have to see if my modulator can handle that much wattage. What do you recommend if I have to go a step lower in power. I use a modulator from SDC which can handle the wattage. It has a 150 watt rating. http://www.signaldynamics.com The units are of good quality and encapsulated sealed. It has several nice lighting control functions built inlike press the horn button and your headlight will modulate 5 or 6 times at a higher speed during the day and at night. It does a good job of getting the attention of some one you feel may be getting ready to pull out in front of you. The next bulb down in wattage is still better than the stock 55 watts. I have not found any over heating problem or adverse effects from the 90/130. It modulates on high during he day. I just put 5,000 miles on the bike last week and everything is still working fine..no melt down or burn out. I have no intention of spending money or gunking up the looks of the GTS with aux. lighting. It isn't necessary when you have a more powerful headlight bulb. Well, that's certainly what I'd prefer. I'd rather not add auxiliary lighting if I don't have to. You really don't need aux. lights with the 90/130 bulb. I actually like it better than the aux. lighting set up I had on the FJ with PIAA 1100's and and 80XT. Too much light is as bad as not enough. With the FJ set up was great for lighting up the world but I would be night blind for 10 seconds after turning the aux. lights off when on coming traffic approached. On a curve filled 2 lane road at night that gets a little scary. Also I feel the stock GTS reflector fills out the road much better with the 90/130 than more directional lighting. A highly directional pattern becomes very disorienting to the mind when doing a lot of switchback on a curvy road. A broader flood is easy on the eyes and mind. hawke
RE: Aux lights
RE: I have spent the last year perfecting a suitable set of mounting brackets for a set of Piaa 1200 to go on my gts. I've done it. Well really I found someone to do it. I wanted something to come out from under the mirrors and my craftsman did the rest. They are perfect. And the 1200's make night - day!! I hope to have pictures up soon and I hope to have some of these for sale if there is interest. Once you have some real lights like the Piaa's you wonder how you ever rode in the dark before. I'll be interested in seeing your set up and perhaps purchasing one of your brackets. About the only thing I really dislike on the GTS is the lousy headlight. Like you, I was very spoiled by the Concours' headlight which put lots of light where it was needed. Regards, Henry S. Winokur 94 GTS1000, AMA, MRF, MD/MSF Certified Instructor West Bethesda, MD __ Henry, Before spending any money on aux. lights buy a relay and a 90/130 PIAA bulb for the stock reflector. Take a little time to adjust and aim. It is the best lighting I have had on a motorcycle and I have tried a few things; including 1200's and and an 80 XT on past mounts. I just finished a rally in Canada and I rode with another rider that had aux. lighting and dual headlights. My GTS stock headlight made his set up look like he was riding in the dark and did a much better job of lighting both on low and high beam on those twisty back roads. I have no intention of spending money or gunking up the looks of the GTS with aux. lighting. It isn't necessary when you have a more powerful headlight bulb. http://www.abt-compost.com/ldr.htmlsee..F Mods hawke
A number of things
The GTS is a great Long Distance machine...I left last Thurs and just got this afternoon after riding in a Rally in Canada and putting just short of 5,000 miles on my 84' GTS. #1.I installed Helibars before I left but I didn't have a chance to get time on them before leaving...they suck.I have used Helibars on the FJ which worked great, but these a a disaster. They didn't work for me at all. My hands have lost all their strength from the nerve damage they have done. My little finger have no sense of feel. The angle is just all wrong...at least for me. I can not grip them in the normal manner without causing pain in my wrist. The angle is too steep so I ended up gripping them so they put pressure on the carpal tunnel nerve center. i'll be on the phone tomorrow to see if the owner of Helibar can solve the problem...I understand he is a good guy to work with. Bob Taylors recent fix is more like the original Helibars I bought for the FJ..it worked wellthese present Helibars are dangerous in my opinion. I hope my sense of feel and strength full recovers. Bob...what would you charge to do my bars? #2. Bad news.I had a wreck with my new GTS. After finishing a bunch of great mods too. Following is my repost off the LDR list. ...also Anyone on the list have any blue plastic for sale.? Where is the best place to buy? Definitely my right lower, probably the main front panel, and possibly the lower plastic under the engine. The exposed aluminum frame member on the right is pretty torn up. A new exhaust can is in order. Any comments or help is appreciated. _ Those evil Canadians invite us Foreigners to their country knowing full well that the odds of us getting off their highway system unscathed are slim. I now know it was all a plan by Bobb, hoping to get one of there own free of the crash title. The highway departments in the US clean up somewhat and mark dangerous obstacles to some degree, but not in Canada.AYE. Never happenAYE Highway work sites look like garbage dumps.:)AYE I think the whole Highway department work force consists of six high school drop outs...AYE That's all I ever saw workingAYE Here are the facts.. Yeah...I took a dump on my GTS. But at least let's get the story straight...AYE I won't accept the full blameit was caused by the stupid Canadian half wit disorganized highway dept. 10 % of the highway system up there has been ground down with those large asphalt grinders that cut deep parallel groves about 2 inches deep so they an resurface.someday. The work sites around the rebuild areas all like a bunch high school drops outs were given the job, not very organized or neat.AYE dennis k and I had been running on these torn up sections the whole rally, keeping our speed down because the deep grooves alone would throw the bike around. After dennis and I ran for most of the day on sections of highway that would put the curves on a Diamond Rattle snake, ready to strikes, curves to shame. At 5 AM in Sue Saint Marie on a 1/2 mile detour connecting section of Highway 17, the Cross Canada highway; dennis k and I were slowly and carefully riding one of these torn up detours that haven no warning signs or barriers of any kind...just junk scattered around...AYE. The highway was 6 lanes wide at that point and it took a 90 degree turn. No other traffic. The road was all cut down and deeply grooved, so we weren't doing much over 40 mph. The road was dark and gravel and trash was scattered all over. I was in the center lane and was slowly moving toward the right hand lane to make the 90 degree turn. As I looked up I saw dennis was just making the turn a 100 yards ahead. I slowly slide over to the right hand lane, I immediately found myself on my back with the bike sliding out in front of me...AYE No warning or headshake, just immediately on my assAYE The bike slid for 50 yards and I slid about half of the distance behind it, like one of these racers on my back; periodically getting glimpses of the bike as I rotated on my back and hearing the awful grinding on on the coarse cut asphalt from my bike sliding ahead and my stich under meAYE When Dennis came back we picked up the pieces and then we walked it off trying to figure out what happened. The f#*ken highway dept didn't groove the right hand lane, although it was hard to tell in the dark since it was covered with so much broken asphalt. What was a obvious, when up close and personal, there was a 2 inch sharp asphalt edge drop separating the two lanes. No markers, lights, horses, or warning signs. My front wheel caught the edge and flipped the bike on it's side. In the daylight I would have seen the edge but I did not in the dark. In the US we'd at least spend the money on those little rubber cone markersAYE
GTS parts
Does anyone know of anybody parting out a wrecked GTS? I'm looking for a complete set of passenger foot pegs. I'm considering mounting a set onto the Omega frame and use them as highway pegs for LDRing. Having another place to move your legs to reduce leg fatigue is nice. It looks like the passenger foot pegs could be mounted easily onto the frame and not look too bad if they matched. The would have the added advantage of acting like frame/plastic protectors if the bike should go down or fall over. hawke
OIL.... Henry's curiosity
RE: Henry's curiosity From: "Henry S. Winokur" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: Motor Cycle Oils Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Synthetic oils are more slippery and they can cause clutches in some bikes to slip under heavy loads, it doesn't happen to all bikes and is somewhat rider dependent. If you don't have a clutch slippage problem using it...use it. It is a better protective oil under high loads and high temperatures. The comment that Mobil 1 20w-50w is not 20W-50W after 500 miles is correct. What is not said is that this is true of any motor oil. I'm curious how you know this stuff? Do you work for Mobil Oil? Henry, Being a mechanical engineer, lubricants have always been of interest. I both read a lot on the topic and use my own empirical testing to verify. No I don't work for Mobil, but I have spoken to various Mobil and other people in the field over the years. I find most of the industry people really know very little about MC oil and simply are more marketing oriented, often simply stating what they publish in marketing literature as being the only truth.I don't think they spend a lot of time or money testing for performance results in MC's The clutch slipping is both empirical and a frequent topic of discussion on other MC lists. I found it took a few thousand miles on the FJ for Mobil 1 alone to cause the clutch to slip, changing back to non- synthetic and it stopped slipping. I over came the problem by increasing the clutch spring load and sticking with the Mobil 1. Mobil 1 also stopped the FJ overheating problems in stop and go traffic. With conventional oil it would virtually start to stall out as the engine parts would expand and get close to seizing. With Mobil 1 this does not occur. Empirically it simply showed me it was a better lubricant at high temperatures and verifying other test reports. More slippery is based on the clutch slippage problem and also, it you hook up your bike to an electronic tuning tach and simply change one thing...the oil and restart the engine you will find an increase of over 100 RPM occurs at idle speeds. That again is only based what I have experienced. The logical conclusion I reach is that the change is from reduced friction. since laboratory tests show that Mobil 1 is more viscous, the increase RPM is not from a reduction in viscosity. Which also makes sense since synthetic oil has a higher film strength from it's longer molecular chains. What happens is that in all oils, they quickly loose some of the higher viscosity performance from engine heat and shear. What he did not say is that under numerous independent tests, Mobil1 stands up better and looses less performance characteristics than just about any commercial oil, including AMSOIL. Not according to Amsoil. Viscosity Index of Amsoil is 157 compared to Mobil's 170. Amsoil is probably a great MC oil and equal to Mobil 1 in many categories. I am not against using Amsoil in anyway. Mobil 1 is easy for me to buy since it is widely marketed. I've never tried Amsoil. From : http://www.xs11.com/stories/mcnoil94.htm Motorcycle Consumer News Amsol was not run in this particular test but I have seen it run in other and it was not as good as Mobil 1 in holding it's viscosity. TAKEN FROM ABOVE ARTICLE.. Relative Viscosity Retention(as a percentage of initial viscosity retained after normal use in the same motorcycle) 0 miles 800mi 1500mi Mobil 1 100%86.6% 83.0% Castrol Syntec 100%78.1% 74.5% Castrol GTX 100%72.2% 68.0% Honda HP4 100%69.2% 65.6% Spectro 4 100% 68.0% 63.9% .The viscosity of synthetic-based oils generally drops more slowly than that of petroleum-based oils in the same application. 2.Comparing these figures to viscosity retention for the same oils when used in an automobile (see later text by Prof. Woolum) would indicate that motorcycles are indeed harder on oils than cars. 3.The fastest and most significant drop in the viscosity of petroleum-based oils used in motorcycles occurs during the first 800 miles (or less) of use.All of these results (1-3) agree with everything the oil companies have been telling us all along. However, the same test data also indicates that: 4.The viscosities of petroleum-based oils, whether designed for auto or motorcycle application, drop at approximately the same rate when used in a motorcycle. 5.There is no evidence that motorcycle-specific oils out-perform their automotive counterparts in viscosity retention when used in a motorcycle. One of the advantages I have always founds with Mobil 1 20-50w is that the transmission seems to like it better. It makes for smoother shifting than most other oils. As any motor oil ages and looses some
Motor Cycle Oils
RE: Topic No. 17 Date: Fri, 14 Jul 2000 23:56:47 EDT From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: Motorcycle OIL In a message dated 7/14/00 7:09:01 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Why has it taken this long to develop these "new" oils? Actually, motorcycle specific oils are now "new," they are the old oils. Changes to automotive oils now makes them ill-advised for motorcycle use. And because of the relatively low volume of motorcycles compared to cars, we'll simply have to pay a lot more. Jay Jay hit the nail on the head. The oil companies have simply given into the environmental wacko's and are re-blending automobile oils to please. They are removing additives that benefit the engine but may coat catalytic convertors in cars. The additives are a benefit to any engine. They are also pushing much lighter weight oilszero wt, to increase fuel efficiency by reducing the splash hp lost inside the engine with higher viscosity oils. it is good for fuel economy but bad for engine protection and wear. Both of these changes are to the detriment of maximum engine protection. Mobil 1 20w-50w is the only car oil recommended by Mobil for motorcycles, although they may be more and more reluctant to openly admit that, as the push so called special motorcycle oils. If they didn't the next logical question would be why should I spend $8.00 a quart when I can buy the same thing for $4.00 a quart. It is easier to just say use our MC specfic engine oil. Synthetic oils are more slippery and they can cause clutches in some bikes to slip under heavy loads, it doesn't happen to all bikes and is somewhat rider dependent. If you don't have a clutch slippage problem using it...use it. It is a better protective oil under high loads and high temperatures. The comment that Mobil 1 20w-50w is not 20W-50W after 500 miles is correct. What is not said is that this is true of any motor oil. What happens is that in all oils, they quickly loose some of the higher viscosity performance from engine heat and shear. What he did not say is that under numerous independent tests, Mobil1 stands up better and looses less performance characteristics than just about any commercial oil, including AmsOil. You can't go wrong with Mobil 1 20-50w in a MC., unless your clutch slips too much. One of the advantages I have always founds with Mobil 1 20-50w is that the transmission seems to like it better. It makes for smoother shifting than most other oils. As any motor oil ages and looses some of it viscosity, your shifting will get worse and clunkier. Again, I have found here Mobil 1 stands up longer than other oils. The new Mobil 1 MC oils are basically there 20w/50 car oil with a little cadmium or other sort of high pressure additive added for high load temperature friction points. The car Mobil 1 25/50wt with a touch of STP(cadmium) or ProLong(ester based lubricant) would be just a good and a lot cheaper that what they are getting for the special blend of MC oil they are putting on the shelf. I have heard it is more expensive simply because of the low volume purchase not because of any added value. With all that said and my positive comments about Mobil 1 20-50wt, in reality any decent engine oil will work well in a motorcycle. Change it and your filter on a regular basis and I doubt if anyone will see a significant difference in engine life between a $1.00 a quart oil and a $5.00 a quart oil or than clunkier shifting. I use Mobil 1 20-50wtwith a touch of ProLong for the engine and the chain..:). I put 95,000 miles on my last FJ1200 and pushed it hard to over 2,000 miles in 24 hour. I never having the heads off, before I wrecked it. With that oil combo I have gotten 50,000 miles out a single set of chains and sprockets with it in an automatic oiler. I am taking the same approach on the GTS. Would a cheaper oil and no additive have done the same thingmaybe..maybe not! The real key is attentive regular maintenance. hawke
GTS Headlight
RE: Hawke: Did you change any of the stock headlight wiring to run this high wattage bulb? I find that the aim isn't particularly good. I wish I could've put my Concours headlight unit onto the GTS. It was fantastic, while you'd think Yamaha really didn't want you to ride this thing at night. Regards, Henry S. Winokur First thing I do on a new bikeadd two headlight relays (high/low) and make a new 10 gauge wire run to the front of the bike, adding connection block buses for it and a new ground to wire all my add on's. I then use the handle bar switch to activate the headlight relays. The 90/130w would burn up the stock switch. I had heard from other GTS owners that the GTS headlight was the pits, but I have found with the 90/130w PIAA (NON-SUPERWHITE.SUPERWHITES SUCK) bulb in it, it isn't that bad it you take a little time to aim it. It will light up the road a long way off. The higher wattage makes up some for the poor reflector. In fact, I have no plans for adding any high power PIAA's for extra lighting at this moment. I have one small cheap Discount Auto after-market 55watt running light tucked in between the fairing and the fender. It is a flat squished light; I measure closely and it doesn't hit the fender. I installed it for daytime running and to have some sort of headlight light backup for loosing the headlight bulb at night. The problem I have found in over lighting, which I have done, is the problem with your eyes having trouble quickly readjusting to NO PIAA's and low beam light out put when you dim for on coming traffic. It can be like running in the dark for 5 or 10 seconds. On a two lane curvy road at night that can be scary. I find too much light can be as bad as not enough. The 90/130w seems a nice compromise. Aimed properly so the low doesn't bother on coming traffic at all it does a good job. If you think about it, it isn't anymore light than a car or the new two headlight bulb motorcycles puts on the road. hawke
RE: Aerostich
RE: Date: Wed, 12 Jul 2000 08:19:48 -0400 From: "Henry S. Winokur" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: Aerostich Roberto: I'm on my 2nd Roadcrafter one-piece. I purchased the 1-piece because I didn't want to be tempted to ride without the lower body protection one gets from the pants. In the summer time around here, where the temperature and SNIP SNIP I've never crashed hard in either of my suits and hope I never do, but at the shop in Duluth (where my wife is from) they have a bunch of suits on display that have been crashed hard, and in many of the cases the wearer walked away with little or no damage to themselves. The one I remember in particular, was worn by Robert Sinclair, former president of Saab, USA, who went down at about 70 mph and walked away with some bruises and a broken wrist(?). The suit had some damage to the left arm, but as I recall there was little damage elsewhere, and what damage there was easily repaired. Right on and I'll second everything you have said about a Stich. I had the experience of a 70 mph light pole hitting me during the Iron Butt and didn't have a cut or scratch. A lot of broken bones, but no road rash. I just dyed my fading blue Stich to match my 94' GTS, rebuilt a few zippers and have given it new life. I can't say enough about the quality of the product or the lack of intelligence of riders that don't wear one 100% of the time on a bike. SNIP Also, Henry, are you satisfied with that headlight modulator? is it easy to install? It is relatively easy to install, but in order to do a really nice job I took all of the cowlings off, including the front one around the headlight. That by itself is a 1/2 hour job. If you follow the directions, you can have the modulator on and operational in an hour or less. The one I purchased (from Signal Dynamics http://www.signaldynamics.com/ -- SNIP .I just ordered the headlite and taillite unit from Signal Dynamics. I used another brand for the Butt, but again you are right on...I ride using two rules; 1. Do everything possible to make yourself more visible. 2. Ride like you are invisible. I'll add, change out the stock 55/65 headlight to a higher wattage. Independent of DOT rules..it makes for a much safer ride, and I have never heard of anyone being ticketed for having a higher wattage headlight. I run a well aimed 90/130w and have never been stopped for it. It turns night into day and again makes you more visible. I just spoke with the engineer at Signal Dynamics and there std. unit can take the wattage. They test the unit at 150 watts. hawke
Simple Green
RE: Topic No. 11 Date: Sun, 9 Jul 2000 16:31:13 -0700 From: "Dave Morrow" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: cleaning wheels I use Simple Green on my wheels. Seems to do a good job. Dave 93 GTS Fresno CA __ Dave watch Simple green on aluminum. I just read a test report where it shows it reacts with aluminum and will etch it. hawke
530 Chain conversion
I just finished converting over the chain and sprockets to 530 because the OEM chain was making the click click click sound when the bike was simply being pushed around. The obvious sound of a chain with links that are worn and binding. When the bike was put on the center stand and put in gear with the engine running the chain would also pop and shake, even with the proper slack adjustment, again the indication of a chain with bad links and worn out. Also as it rotated on the bike, a wide variation of slack would make it difficult to set up the proper amount of slack. Again an indication of a worn out chain. I had just installed my new "Hawke Oiler" and put 1,000 miles the bike over the weekend. I liberally oiled the chain playing with the oiler. Which might have helped to loosen it up and eliminate the kinking. After pulling the sprockets and chain off today, I'm no longer sure the problems were mainly cause by the chain being worn out. What I thought was obvious indications of a worn out chain may have been caused more by a worn primary OEM drive sprocket than a bad chain. The old chain had no bad kinking links or appeared to be that badly worn. It was very flexible and hung straight. What did appear to be a real problem was the primary sprocket with the urethane donuts on both side. I assume these donuts are a factory way of making the drive quieter. The teeth on both sprocket were pretty well worn, and in the case of the primary, the chain was riding deep in the urethane donuts. The indents on the urethane were pretty deep. The problem is the urethane was keeping the chain from fully seating into the sprocket, it would simply compress like rubber. This appeared to be causing a sloppy mating between the primary drive and chain, which was probably causing all the noise and appearance of a bad chain when most of the problem appears to have been caused by a badly worn primary sprocket. . My point in bringing this up is that on the GTS I think it is imperative to change sprockets the first time you put on a new chain. I always change chains and sprockets at the same time, but I know a lot of owners try save money by only changing out the chain. I was surprised at how badly worn the sprockets where at only 12,000 miles. I have gotten as much 50,000 miles out a set of chains and sprockets after installing the ScottOiler on my FJ1200 by keeping them well lubricated. I have also almost lost a chain thinking the ScottOiler was working when it wasn't during the Iron Butt, which is why I came up with a more positive way to lubricate them. hawke
GTS Chain size / GTS ...GPS and Radar detector mount
RE: Date: Thu, 22 Jun 2000 20:05:45 -0400 From: "Crisler, Jon" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: "'[EMAIL PROTECTED]'" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: GTS Chain size I converted to 530 from 532 because of overall cost, and the high-end DID 530 is slightly stronger than the high-end DID 532. However, the costs I found were very different for 532 than what Hugh found. 532 was about $220 or more every place I looked, vs. less than $100 for the 530. I got a steel front, aluminum rear and top-o-da-line DID 530 Zring something for about $170-180 from Sprocket Specialists. They seemed to have the best prices on chain at the time. Hughe's pricing seems less than I remember.but then my memory is not too great. Also, if anybody wants a brand-new aluminum sprocket, stock size 532 with stock teeth let me know. I accidentally got it from Sprocket Specialists and forgot to return it. Cost me about $70-80, name your price. Much lighter than stock, looks better too. Keven must ride harder than myself, because I have 10k miles on the aluminum and it shows no wear. _ I pulled out the high price Dennis Kirk catalog...great for at least cross referencing. The YZF1000R-97'uses the same type sprockets as the GTS. It has a notation in the book for converting a YZF to a 530 chain. It basically says use the FZR 750R 87-88 sprockets to convert. Using these numbers and putting the number of teeth 17 and 47 for the GTS I checked prices in a few places. The best prices where from Competition Accessories. A 120 link DID ZVM 530 chain was 120.95,, the Gold Link is about $20 bucks less. The front 17 tooth sprocket was 1$6.95 and rear 47 tooth steel rear was $32.95. I just finished fabrication and installing my mount for my StreetPilot GPS and Valentine Radar detector. If anyone is interested I'm email a photo. hawke
GTS Chain size
I know this is old stuffI should have kept the past comments on the topic, but I didn't have the bike then. The chain on the bike is marked a DID 532 ZVM. It has obviously been set up too tight at some point because it is well worn and showing signs of kinking as it rotates on the center stand. I don't see a 532 ZVM in the chain catalog I have.Is It interchangeable with a 530 ZVM ? Where is the best place to buy that expensive baby? An how many links is it. I'm still waiting for my manual. hawke
GTS Chain size
I'm sending this twice because I had a computer crash and I'm not sure if it got out. I know this is old stuffI should have kept the past comments on the topic, but I didn't have the bike then. The chain on the bike is marked a DID 532 ZVM. It has obviously been set up too tight at some point because it is well worn and showing signs of kinking as it rotates on the center stand. I don't see a 532 ZVM in the chain catalog I have.Is It interchangeable with a 530 ZVM ? Where is the best place to buy that expensive baby? An how many links is it. I'm still waiting for my manual. hawke
Re: GTS-1000 digest 407
John, Congratulations. Now I can say "I told you so" and welcome to the club. As you get the bike set up just as you want, you will like it better and better. I look forward to following your progress, and may just have to ride back to check up on you. Roger First I need to get the damn GTS Service manual...:) Then I may be calling for help. By the way how in the hell do you check to see if the ABS system works? Many of you know John from years past. For those that don't know, he is a very serious, accomplished rider. He is one of a handful of people who has ridden a "2KDay"; i.e. 2000 miles in less than 24 hours. When he's participating in an endurance rally, he's very focused. And he can entertain for hours with stories. He's become the resident witness in St. Augustine, FL for the start or finish of many people's Coast to Coast endurance rides. We can look forward to his input on this list. Again, welcome John. Roger Now you opened the bag of worms..here we go with this can't do, shouldn't do, crazy to do, illegal to do, shouldn't do, why the hell do you do it, it isn't safe, it isn't sane, etc...discussions. It really wasn't dangerous the way it was planned. Long Distance riding is all about planning and execution by keeping your ass in the saddle. I didn't know such races existed. Let me see at 83.33m/h, which is above the speed limit, and no stops whatsoever one can do 2,000 miles in 24 hours. How do organizers get away with it? How do they keep the enforcement 'YOU SHALL" types from putting a stop to such event? George would love to participate Next time I try to bust the present record I'll give you a call George. And my "How do" question is more on the riders sidehow does a man feel, sitting on bike for 24 hours, doing a 2.000 mile ride ? With the GTS and normal traffic conditions you can do around 145 - 155 KM per hour on a highway. Germany has no speed limit, but trucks blocking all the lanes at the Autobahn slow you down 3200 KM / 150 = 21, Means you have a riding time of 21 Hours and 40 minutes. You have to have a standard tank fill up every 270 KM, costs you about 7 minutes... 11,85 stops a 3200 KM ride...adds to 83 minutes. Plan to have "extended stops" every third "standard" stop... Add 7 extra minutes for every extended stop filling up oil at the GTS, filling up some water / fuel for the ridergo peeing.comes to 20 extra minutes. Adds to 103 minutes for necessary stops. 1300 minutes for the ride 102 minutes for necessary stops ___ 1402 minutes = 23 Hours 38 minutes Time left: 22 minutes. you can ride 55 KM in this 22 minutes on the other hand: if you drop down from 150 KM per hour to, lets say 147,7 per hour you need those extra minutes !!! Boy. No extra time left for a extra cigarette. I couldn't do this for sure. Joerg Very GOOD Joerg..I think you've got it. Really it was easy...i don't smoke. For anyone interested in a more detailed discussion on the topic I have the 2K Day ride written up on my WEB site http://www.abt-compost.com/ldr.htmlYou GTS owners will have to excuse all the reference to the FJ. It is a great bike and it is a Yamaha. If I was riding the GTS at the time I probably could have come closer to the 2400 mile day I was shooting for...:) hawke
Re: GTS- headlite adjustment
Sorry for stupid questions.don't have a service manual yet. Headlight adjustment. My low beam is lighting up the sky...let alone the high beam. I am assuming from looking at the underside of the head light that the two small bolts sticking down under the headlight module are the ones to turn. Which direction and which one for vertical and horizontal adjustment...standing in front of the bike and facing the headlight? hawke
