Re: [h-cost] Costume College
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Maggie wrote: | It's next weekend! I know I'm going, also LynnD, Regina, and Kimiko. Anyone | else? Maybe we should mark our badges with a big red H, or something. I'll be there. Kathleen -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v2.0.4-svn0 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with SUSE - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFIiUV7l1I2MRCAstYRAq+oAKCIKi3D62mrqZQ1d4e3KKpiHMBQFgCfUFci iteAzIanqMrT3ALsUTwMDGE= =+dgH -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Costume College
Sounds like a plan. We've done that before. I'm also going to wear my GBACG pin and my CGW ribbon. You'll barely be able to see my name on the nametag. I know of several people from Northern California and the GBACG who will attend. See ya thereQ LynnD On Thu, Jul 24, 2008 at 7:20 PM, Maggie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > It's next weekend! I know I'm going, also LynnD, Regina, and Kimiko. Anyone > else? Maybe we should mark our badges with a big red H, or something. > > MaggiRos > > ___ > Maggie Secara > ~A Compendium of Common Knowledge 1558-1603 > ISBN 978-0-9818401-0-9 > http://elizabethan.org/compendium/paperback.html > ___ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Costume College
It's next weekend! I know I'm going, also LynnD, Regina, and Kimiko. Anyone else? Maybe we should mark our badges with a big red H, or something. MaggiRos ___ Maggie Secara ~A Compendium of Common Knowledge 1558-1603 ISBN 978-0-9818401-0-9 http://elizabethan.org/compendium/paperback.html ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Costume Institute Appointments Update
Did anyone else get this? Chiara Francesca > -Original Message- > From: Koda, Harold [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Thursday, July 24, 2008 9:07 AM > Subject: Costume Institute Appointments Update > > July 24, 2008 > > > Dear Colleague: > > Since its founding in 1937, The Costume Institute at The Metropolitan > Museum of Art > has become an invaluable resource of knowledge to a world-wide > audience. In pursuing > our responsibility to ensure its integrity and preservation for future > generations, the > Museum is commencing a detailed survey of the Collection to address > conservation > and storage issues. > > Over the next several years until this project is completed, > appointments in our > Collection, Conservation, and Library will be limited. In addition, > while all current > loan commitments will be fulfilled, a temporary moratorium on loans > will begin as > of July 2008. > > We regret any inconvenience this may cause. Qualified researchers are > encouraged > to explore the resources of New York City's other costume institutions > and libraries including the Metropolitan Museum's Thomas J. Watson > Library. > > If you have any questions we will be pleased to advise you. Please > contact us at > 212-570-3908. We appreciate your support of what we know will result in > our ability > to better serve you and the public at large in the future. > > Sincerely, > > Harold Koda > Curator in Charge > The Costume Institute > ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Odd outfit
In Byz iconography, she is usually shown in a very ornate Byzantine robe and crowned, much bejeweled, holding a cross (the Orthodox symbol of martyrdom). The wheel/sword is not often shown in classic icons. Her hair is usually "properly" covered (you'll see very very little hair on Byz female saints), though she often wears it in a crispine-type net instead of under a veil. Liadain THL Liadain ni Mhordha OFO "You get a wonderful view from the point of no return..." wildernesse, the Outlands http://practical-blackwork.blogspot.com http://www.flickr.com/photos/liadains_fancies -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Robin Netherton Sent: Thursday, July 24, 2008 2:35 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Odd outfit Joan Mielke wrote: > Robin wrote "...visually to evoke the recognizable and distinctive lines of > the sideless surcote, which was tightly associated with Catherine's > iconographic representation at that time. ...the image has the visual cues > that signal "Catherine." > > What are the associated images/icons for Catherine for this time period? I > was thinking Byzantine Catherine. Is this the same St. Catherine, or is > this a different saint? Catherine of Alexandria, probably the third most popular female saint of the Middle Ages (after the Virgin and Mary Magdalene). I do not know about Byzantine iconography, which tends to differ from Western Christian, but in Western art she is typically shown with a crown and/or a wheel and/or a sword. The wheel was the instrument with which she was tortured, and the sword her means of martyrdom. As a martyr, she might carry a palm frond. As a virgin martyr and princess, she typically has her hair down and is dressed richly, as a queen. She might also be trampling a certain pagan king underfoot. Some later artists conflated her image with that of Catherine of Siena, and thus show Catherine of Alexandria in the "mystic marriage" that is part of Catherine of Siena's legend. --Robin collector of Catherines ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Odd outfit
Joan Mielke wrote: Robin wrote "...visually to evoke the recognizable and distinctive lines of the sideless surcote, which was tightly associated with Catherine's iconographic representation at that time. ...the image has the visual cues that signal "Catherine." What are the associated images/icons for Catherine for this time period? I was thinking Byzantine Catherine. Is this the same St. Catherine, or is this a different saint? Catherine of Alexandria, probably the third most popular female saint of the Middle Ages (after the Virgin and Mary Magdalene). I do not know about Byzantine iconography, which tends to differ from Western Christian, but in Western art she is typically shown with a crown and/or a wheel and/or a sword. The wheel was the instrument with which she was tortured, and the sword her means of martyrdom. As a martyr, she might carry a palm frond. As a virgin martyr and princess, she typically has her hair down and is dressed richly, as a queen. She might also be trampling a certain pagan king underfoot. Some later artists conflated her image with that of Catherine of Siena, and thus show Catherine of Alexandria in the "mystic marriage" that is part of Catherine of Siena's legend. --Robin collector of Catherines ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Odd outfit
Robin wrote "...visually to evoke the recognizable and distinctive lines of the sideless surcote, which was tightly associated with Catherine's iconographic representation at that time. ...the image has the visual cues that signal "Catherine." What are the associated images/icons for Catherine for this time period? I was thinking Byzantine Catherine. Is this the same St. Catherine, or is this a different saint? Joan ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] odd outfit
Just as an aside, you can't count on no nekkidness for saints - there are a number of images of the Virgin in the western tradition in which one breast is bared, a couple of Mary Magdalene in which she wears little more than hair (and she's always red-headed!) and a couple of the early virgin saints offering their severed breasts on a platter. As a contrast, in classic eastern iconography, the only female saint I can think of whose hair even SHOWS is Mary of Egypt, who repented her sins and ran away into the desert, where she lived naked for 20? 50? years. Liadain THL Liadain ni Mhordha OFO "You get a wonderful view from the point of no return..." wildernesse, the Outlands http://practical-blackwork.blogspot.com http://www.flickr.com/photos/liadains_fancies -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Becky Rautine Sent: Thursday, July 24, 2008 5:20 AM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] odd outfit > paint the same color. Also I don't think a saint would be allowed to be painted without modesty and respect. Cleavage was fine but not uncovered breasts on a saint. She is wearing the long sleeves of a shiny material. I'd guess that the side is made of that same material. The side is plain and not as ornate as the front. On this same image, can anyone tell me the meaning of the stones used during the Byzantine period? I know it has something to do with the Early Christian/Byzantine church being centered in Constantinople/Istanbul. Most everything was steeped in meaning or relation to the area. I did research on this era while in school, but can't remember the specifics of their meaning. Later times copied the Byzantine styles for elegance and luxury in the use of jewels.Sincerely, Rebecca Rautine> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]> Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2008 18:50:10 - ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] odd outfit
Becky Rautine wrote: I don't think it is a sideless due to the conformaty of the front. It wouldn't lie so snug if not held against her breast. I think the light area is the fabric reflecting the light, or just a bad spot in the painting. Paint was mixed one area at a time then and it was easy to have inconsistant color values. They didn't have Sherman Williams to get a gallon of paint the same color. Also I don't think a saint would be allowed to be painted without modesty and respect. Cleavage was fine but not uncovered breasts on a saint. De wasn't suggesting there was no fabric on the sides, or that any skin was showing. By "sideless," she was using a shorthand term for "sideless surcote," which was a style of overdress rather like an (American) jumper dress, with large armholes that reveal a separate dress, typically close-fitted, worn beneath it. If this were a real sideless surcote, that would have been the underdress showing at the sides. It's clear that the sleeves and the sides are of the same fabric. In this case, as De recognized, this was not a normal sideless surcote. The artist used the contemporary style of a front-opening gown and tweaked it visually to evoke the recognizable and distinctive lines of the sideless surcote, which was tightly associated with Catherine's iconographic representation at that time. The resulting (nonexistent) garment makes no sense from a construction standpoint (the layering gets all fouled up, and it's not clear what parts would be underdress, overdress, or all the same layer), but the image has the visual cues that signal "Catherine." (Can't help you on the Byzantine jewels, sorry, but you might want to post that question separately under a new subject line.) --Robin ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] modest
The neck-handkerchief of 18th-century women's fashion at some point in the 19th began to be called a "modesty piece". The term still gets applied occasionally to a triangle of fabric inserted in a low V neckline to conceal the cleavage. Lauren -- Original message -- From: "Claire Clarke" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Message: 1 > Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2008 20:30:49 +0200 > From: "Leif og Bjarne Drews" > Subject: [h-cost] modest > To: "Historical Costume" > Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > Is there an english term of a piece of clothing called a modest? > In a danish inventory there is the term of modester in plural, have never > heard that word before. Its inventories from 1720 and 1730. > > Bjarne > > You know I'm sure I've heard the term 'modester' in an English costume > context, but I really can't think where. It just rings bells. > > Is it possible the term uses 'mode' in the sense of fashion eg wasn't > 'modiste' > an 18th term for a women's tailor or seamstress? > > Claire/Angharad > > ___ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] fabric use brainstorming
You could make little juggling balls, too. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mary Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2008 9:57 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [h-cost] fabric use brainstorming > I've been cleaning/reorganizing my sewing area, and > have found myself > wondering just how small a piece of fabric is useful This is why I have a kid. If it's not clothes for her then toys. A friend gave us a bunch of bean bags made from many different small bits of odd fabric. Mary ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] odd outfit
I don't think it is a sideless due to the conformaty of the front. It wouldn't lie so snug if not held against her breast. I think the light area is the fabric reflecting the light, or just a bad spot in the painting. Paint was mixed one area at a time then and it was easy to have inconsistant color values. They didn't have Sherman Williams to get a gallon of paint the same color. Also I don't think a saint would be allowed to be painted without modesty and respect. Cleavage was fine but not uncovered breasts on a saint. She is wearing the long sleeves of a shiny material. I'd guess that the side is made of that same material. The side is plain and not as ornate as the front. On this same image, can anyone tell me the meaning of the stones used during the Byzantine period? I know it has something to do with the Early Christian/Byzantine church being centered in Constantinople/Istanbul. Most everything was steeped in meaning or relation to the area. I did research on this era while in school, but can't remember the specifics of their meaning. Later times copied the Byzantine styles for elegance and luxury in the use of jewels.Sincerely, Rebecca Rautine> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]> Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2008 18:50:10 -0500> Subject: [h-cost] odd outfit> > http://www.artsmia.org/viewer/detail.php?v=12&id=547> At a first glance it looks as if St. Catherine is wearing a sideless.> Click on the picture to get to the zoom.> Can someone tell me what she is actually wearing?> > De> ___> h-costume mailing list> h-costume@mail.indra.com> http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _ Keep your kids safer online with Windows Live Family Safety. http://www.windowslive.com/family_safety/overview.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_family_safety_072008 ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] [ h-cost] Renaissance coif or hood
I looked back at the photos. She is wearing a necklace that lies on her chest, one that hangs from her shoulders and the girdle. The middle one is the one that looks like an office insignia. That's the one I meant. The smaller necklace and the insignia one have S on them.Sincerely, Rebecca Rautine> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]> Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2008 01:44:54 -0700> Subject: Re: [h-cost] [ h-cost] Renaissance coif or hood> > Belt part---> Do you mean girdle? Long necklace-like belt that goes around waist and hangs> down center front? > > -Original Message-> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On> Behalf Of Kate M Bunting> Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2008 1:19 AM> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [h-cost] [ h-cost] Renaissance coif or hood> > > > Becky Rautine wrote:> > > >Sorry, the second S is on her large necklace like a baron would wear or an> >official ensignia. Are there many portraits where the perso! n wears 2> >necklaces? I thought they wore a necklace and the belt-like part (I can't> >think of what it's called right now.> > Isn't this the IHS monogram which we discussed a couple of months ago? It> was stated that this symbol (representing the name of Jesus) was worn in> Protestant countries at this time because a crucifix was considered too> Catholic.> > Kate Bunting> Cataloguing & Data Quality Librarian,> University of Derby> ___> h-costume mailing list> h-costume@mail.indra.com> http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume> > ___> h-costume mailing list> h-costume@mail.indra.com> http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _ With Windows Live for mobile, your contacts travel with you. http://www.windowslive.com/mobile/overview.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_mobile_072008 ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] renaissance headwear
What are the gold parts on your design? It looks ornate so far. Form your past work, it will be magnificant. Keep us posted as to it's completion.Sincerely, Rebecca Rautine> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]> Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2008 21:14:20 +0200> Subject: [h-cost] renaissance headwear> > I was allowed to show my headdress after all, not the pattern til later, but you can get an idea how it looks like in shape!> http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/br.htm> I have started the pearl decoration, and it gets quite heavy, so i have interlined with a heavy linnen. Its freshwater pearls and gold pearl purl, gold spangels for decoration...> > Bjarne> ___> h-costume mailing list> h-costume@mail.indra.com> http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _ With Windows Live for mobile, your contacts travel with you. http://www.windowslive.com/mobile/overview.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_mobile_072008 ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] [ h-cost] Renaissance coif or hood
Yes, it's been a while since I did work in the Renaissance era. I know it's not a belt but couldn't remember exactly what it was called. It was late and I was tired. I'm starting back into the era. I'm starting a new garb set for an upcoming Ren Faire event. I'll have to pull out my books and read up on the ins and outs of the period.Sincerely, Rebecca Rautine> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]> Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2008 01:44:54 -0700> Subject: Re: [h-cost] [ h-cost] Renaissance coif or hood> > Belt part---> Do you mean girdle? Long necklace-like belt that goes around waist and hangs> down center front? > > -Original Message-> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On> Behalf Of Kate M Bunting> Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2008 1:19 AM> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [h-cost] [ h-cost] Renaissance coif or hood> > > > Becky Rautine wrote:> > > >Sorry, the second S is on her large necklace like a baron would wear or an> >official ensignia. Are there many portraits where the person wears 2> >necklaces? I thought they wore a necklace and the belt-like part (I can't> >think of what ! it's called right now.> > Isn't this the IHS monogram which we discussed a couple of months ago? It> was stated that this symbol (representing the name of Jesus) was worn in> Protestant countries at this time because a crucifix was considered too> Catholic.> > Kate Bunting> Cataloguing & Data Quality Librarian,> University of Derby> ___> h-costume mailing list> h-costume@mail.indra.com> http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume> > ___> h-costume mailing list> h-costume@mail.indra.com> http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _ Use video conversation to talk face-to-face with Windows Live Messenger. http://www.windowslive.com/messenger/connect_your_way.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_Refresh_messenger_video_072008 ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] modest
Message: 1 Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2008 20:30:49 +0200 From: "Leif og Bjarne Drews" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [h-cost] modest To: "Historical Costume" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Is there an english term of a piece of clothing called a modest? In a danish inventory there is the term of modester in plural, have never heard that word before. Its inventories from 1720 and 1730. Bjarne You know I'm sure I've heard the term 'modester' in an English costume context, but I really can't think where. It just rings bells. Is it possible the term uses 'mode' in the sense of fashion eg wasn't 'modiste' an 18th term for a women's tailor or seamstress? Claire/Angharad ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
