Re: [h-cost] Sound of Music
In a message dated 12/28/2009 9:01:06 PM Eastern Standard Time, monicaspe...@optonline.net writes: Directors and stars have a huge amount of input on what people wear in the movies. I've recommended Edward Maeder's Hollywood and History before in this list, and will do so again. He has great essays about period clothes, as well as a critique, arranged by time period, of many, many costume films. I know it is all theatre, and directors and designers can do what they want. The only quibble I have is IF the makers of a film tout its historical accuracy, and then they throw it out the window. Ann Wass ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Sound of Music
So hubby and I watched The Sound of Music last night (there was nothing else on and those old classics are fun sometimes anyway) and I found myself wondering about the authenticity of the costuming. The outfits that Baroness Schraeder wears struck me as not particularly 1930s, but I really don't know anything about that period, so I thought of asking what this list had to say. Any opinions? Many thanks and happy holidays! -Martha ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Sound of Music
So hubby and I watched The Sound of Music last night (there was nothing else on and those old classics are fun sometimes anyway) and I found myself wondering about the authenticity of the costuming. The outfits that Baroness Schraeder wears struck me as not particularly 1930s, but I really don't know anything about that period, so I thought of asking what this list had to say. Any opinions? The movie was made in the mid 60s and to me, the Baroness' outfits are very *in* that time's fashion look. I don't think the fancy clothing at the ball looks 30s either, but I'm no expert. I'd love to hear more educated opinions, too. Denise ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Sound of Music
Oh, if only they had looked behind the tombstone! -C. This email was sent from Netspace Webmail: http://www.netspace.net.au ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Sound of Music
The outfits that Baroness Schraeder ears struck me as not particularly 1930s, but I really don't know anything bout that period, so I thought of asking what this list had to say. Any pinions? When I worked in a local theatre costume shop, several of the regulars were big fans of the movie, but, given the awful costumes, I couldn't see why. Yes, the Baroness is in '60s fashions. The hairstyles and makeup are even worse. Maria, of course, is in generic middle European peasant style at the beginning. Don't know how authentic the nuns' habits are, but at least they look right. Ann Wass -Original Message- From: Martha Sieting oserm...@msu.edu To: h-cost...@indra.com Sent: Mon, Dec 28, 2009 2:42 pm Subject: [h-cost] Sound of Music So hubby and I watched The Sound of Music last night (there was nothing else n and those old classics are fun sometimes anyway) and I found myself wondering bout the authenticity of the costuming. The outfits that Baroness Schraeder ears struck me as not particularly 1930s, but I really don't know anything bout that period, so I thought of asking what this list had to say. Any pinions? Many thanks and happy holidays! -Martha __ -costume mailing list -cost...@mail.indra.com ttp://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Sound of Music
I noticed that too when watching Giant, I think it was. It starts in the early 1920s but the costumes look like 1950s, when the movie was made. For some reason, it seems like costume designers from the 50s and 60s were not at all interested in any sort of historical accuracy.  Sylvia Rognstad Costume/clothing design construction Alterations home dec http://www.ezzyworld.com On Dec 28, 2009, at 5:15 PM, annbw...@aol.com wrote: The outfits that Baroness Schraeder ears struck me as not particularly 1930s, but I really don't know anything bout that period, so I thought of asking what this list had to say. Any pinions? When I worked in a local theatre costume shop, several of the regulars were big fans of the movie, but, given the awful costumes, I couldn't see why. Yes, the Baroness is in '60s fashions. The hairstyles and makeup are even worse. Maria, of course, is in generic middle European peasant style at the beginning. Don't know how authentic the nuns' habits are, but at least they look right. Ann Wass -Original Message- From: Martha Sieting oserm...@msu.edu To: h-cost...@indra.com Sent: Mon, Dec 28, 2009 2:42 pm Subject: [h-cost] Sound of Music So hubby and I watched The Sound of Music last night (there was nothing else n and those old classics are fun sometimes anyway) and I found myself wondering bout the authenticity of the costuming. The outfits that Baroness Schraeder ears struck me as not particularly 1930s, but I really don't know anything bout that period, so I thought of asking what this list had to say. Any pinions? Many thanks and happy holidays! -Martha __ -costume mailing list -cost...@mail.indra.com ttp://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Sound of Music
Directors and stars have a huge amount of input on what people wear in the movies. Most stay pretty close to the current styles--- which date really fast. However, these were made before the VCR/ DVD era where people can watch and appreciate (or not) the clothes more often and more critically. One star who really wanted to do the right thing with period clothes was Bette Davis. She shaved her hairline, wore wigs and more period gowns for Elizabeth and Exeter. Compare her to Joan Collins in the same movie--her clothes were pure fantasy. Monica Monica E. Spence MA, MA, BA Lead Instructor, Fashion Department Art Institute of New York City monicaspe...@optonline.net -Original Message- From: h-costume-boun...@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-boun...@indra.com] On Behalf Of Sylvia Rognstad Sent: Monday, December 28, 2009 7:47 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Sound of Music I noticed that too when watching Giant, I think it was. It starts in the early 1920s but the costumes look like 1950s, when the movie was made. For some reason, it seems like costume designers from the 50s and 60s were not at all interested in any sort of historical accuracy. ? Sylvia Rognstad Costume/clothing design construction Alterations home dec http://www.ezzyworld.com On Dec 28, 2009, at 5:15 PM, annbw...@aol.com wrote: The outfits that Baroness Schraeder ears struck me as not particularly 1930s, but I really don't know anything bout that period, so I thought of asking what this list had to say. Any pinions? When I worked in a local theatre costume shop, several of the regulars were big fans of the movie, but, given the awful costumes, I couldn't see why. Yes, the Baroness is in '60s fashions. The hairstyles and makeup are even worse. Maria, of course, is in generic middle European peasant style at the beginning. Don't know how authentic the nuns' habits are, but at least they look right. Ann Wass -Original Message- From: Martha Sieting oserm...@msu.edu To: h-cost...@indra.com Sent: Mon, Dec 28, 2009 2:42 pm Subject: [h-cost] Sound of Music So hubby and I watched The Sound of Music last night (there was nothing else n and those old classics are fun sometimes anyway) and I found myself wondering bout the authenticity of the costuming. The outfits that Baroness Schraeder ears struck me as not particularly 1930s, but I really don't know anything bout that period, so I thought of asking what this list had to say. Any pinions? Many thanks and happy holidays! -Martha __ -costume mailing list -cost...@mail.indra.com ttp://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Sound of Music
Edward Maeder's book, Hollywood in History, pretty much sums up what Hollywood does in theory and practice. It is a must-have-must-read. There are even charts of hair and make-up. The general idea is that American audiences apparently cannot relate to main characters that look too foreign and so, while the minor characters might be more accurate, the main characters usually retain make-up, silhouettes, and even modified hairstyles of their own times, regardless of when the movie is to have taken place. I do not think as highly of Bette Davis, when you look at both her efforts as QEI -- her silhouettes are right out of the decades when they were made. The Brits seem to be more interested in verisimilitude (all the Poirot and other mysteries), but then you get King Arthur and Kiera Knightly in a leather bikini. Yikes. From: h-costume-boun...@indra.com [h-costume-boun...@indra.com] On Behalf Of Sylvia Rognstad [syl...@ntw.net] Sent: Monday, December 28, 2009 6:47 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Sound of Music I noticed that too when watching Giant, I think it was. It starts in the early 1920s but the costumes look like 1950s, when the movie was made. For some reason, it seems like costume designers from the 50s and 60s were not at all interested in any sort of historical accuracy.  Sylvia Rognstad Costume/clothing design construction Alterations home dec http://www.ezzyworld.com On Dec 28, 2009, at 5:15 PM, annbw...@aol.com wrote: The outfits that Baroness Schraeder ears struck me as not particularly 1930s, but I really don't know anything bout that period, so I thought of asking what this list had to say. Any pinions? When I worked in a local theatre costume shop, several of the regulars were big fans of the movie, but, given the awful costumes, I couldn't see why. Yes, the Baroness is in '60s fashions. The hairstyles and makeup are even worse. Maria, of course, is in generic middle European peasant style at the beginning. Don't know how authentic the nuns' habits are, but at least they look right. Ann Wass -Original Message- From: Martha Sieting oserm...@msu.edu To: h-cost...@indra.com Sent: Mon, Dec 28, 2009 2:42 pm Subject: [h-cost] Sound of Music So hubby and I watched The Sound of Music last night (there was nothing else n and those old classics are fun sometimes anyway) and I found myself wondering bout the authenticity of the costuming. The outfits that Baroness Schraeder ears struck me as not particularly 1930s, but I really don't know anything bout that period, so I thought of asking what this list had to say. Any pinions? Many thanks and happy holidays! -Martha __ -costume mailing list -cost...@mail.indra.com ttp://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Sound of Music
For some reason, it seems like costume designers from the 50s and 60s were not at all interested in any sort of historical accuracy. They aren't. In America anyway... a little more so in Britain. Accuracy becomes a thing in the late '60's. The 1st movie I can remember as being accurate is Thoroughly Modern Millie! (actually,Gone With the Wind has a respect for the period, but more so in the set and prop dept's than the costume dept. Still, the clothes are not outrageously off like you might see in a western or period piece from the early '30's or the 1920's.) In the late '60's '70's you get the gritty realism school of film and the breakdown of the studio and movies set in modern times work hard to look like there is no production that things are almost a documentary. Think Z, or The French Connection or The Seven Ups. This realism get reflected in period costuming. You see it in Clint Eastwood films like The Good the Bad and the Ugly where the costumes are not really what anyone might wear (some of those things the Mexican's are in..ay yay ay!) but they are dirty and grungy and worn-out in a w! ay rarely seen before. Then you get films like The Three Musketeers The Four Musketeers (it was shot as one film)... the one with Michael York and Richard Chamberlain... where things look like they stepped out of a period portraitexcept Rachel Welch, who is still in the old studio style of period costume (though not bad designs actually...just not cut correctly) Things improve steadily as the years go on.. Now I think we are coming out of a period accuracy mode... but it has left its mark. The best looking things (IMHO of course) are those that have a healthy respect for the period but have bent and worked it to some goala look. Sandy Powell and Colleen Atwood are the best at this! I just watched Silence of the Lambs again (Atwood) and the look is real but still a little heightened with Hannibal in his mask and the sicko murderer in his patchwork quilted tranny robe. But still real. And then she can do Sleepy Hollow or Sweeney Todd where she obviously knows the period but manipulates it for fantastical effects (I'll never forget the shock of the little girls gathering wood in the snow in pink silk and gold lace in Sleepy Hollow) Sandy Powell does real (Michael Collins, Wings of the Dove) and some heightened manipulation (Velvet Goldmine, Gangs of NY) to very heightened manipulation (Shakespeare in Love, Interview with the Vampire, The Other Bol! eyn Girl) Milena Canonero has been designing thru the whole period accuracy era. She does super realistic (Chariots of Fire, Barry Lyndon) and outrageously manipulated (Titus, Dick Tracy, A Clockwork Orange) I know, I pay way too much attention to these trends, but this is the period when I was studying costume design. And it was the film Aunie Mame that got me paying attention to accuracy. Nothing Rosalind Russell wears is correct for the time line of the film. Nobody's clothes are. It's all 1950's, but the plots happens from 1929 - 1940. I asked myselfwhat a designer's dream...the '20s to the 40's... why did they ignore it? (They don't in the musical). The other thing I noticed is that even though all the clothes are not period, they still are perfect in feel and add to the character and mood. But a good designer should be able to do that in the correct periods. But it also shows that more is needed than accuracy alone. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Sound of Music
I noticed that too when watching Giant Moss Mabry designed Liz's costumes for Giant. I worked with him once and we talked about period costuming. He thinks that all period designers have to do is copy portraits. He DESIGNER and will just do fashions for the characters. He tries to get a period nod, but basically he just does a version of modern clothes. He was definitely old school studio. He was hard to work for on an indie, on location film because he just was used to handing the Costume Dept head a sketch and it was made up for him. Here we are in a trailer with a portable sewing machine. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
