RE: [Haskell-cafe] Haskell on the iPhone
Advice, yes; leadership, no. [guidance is ambiguous between those two!] Simon From: haskell-cafe-boun...@haskell.org [mailto:haskell-cafe-boun...@haskell.org] On Behalf Of John A. De Goes Sent: 23 June 2009 15:24 To: Simon Peyton-Jones; Haskell Cafe Subject: Re: [Haskell-cafe] Haskell on the iPhone How about setting up some sort of Summer of Code-type project, where companies can pledge dollars toward a certain goal, which will cover the cost of the work? Is there someone at GHC HQ who could provide guidance to a sponsored developer working on getting additional targets into HEAD? Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Jun 23, 2009, at 8:16 AM, Simon Peyton-Jones wrote: Good news about the iPhone port! There seems to be quite a bit more interest now in supporting platforms other than win/*nix on x86 these days*. Maybe now there will be sufficient motivation to make the fundamental changes required. Caveat: I have absolutely no idea of the scope or complexity of said changes. I will look through the LambdaVM code (and iPwn when available) to get an idea. There is definitely an opportunity here for someone to make an impact. There is no reason in principle why Haskell can't run on a JVM or .net or other platform. But it's not just a simple matter of absorbing some patch or other. Here's a summary I wrote a little while ago: http://haskell.org/haskellwiki/GHC:FAQ#Why_isn.27t_GHC_available_for_.NET_or_on_the_JVM.3F The short summary is: * There is interesting design work to do; and then interesting engineering work to make it a reality. * We (at GHC HQ) would love to see that happen, but are not likely to drive it. * If someone, or a small group, wanted to take up the cudgels and work on it, we'd be happy to advise. * We'd certainly consider folding the results into the HEAD, provided the author(s) are willing to maintain it, and we feel that the result is comprehensible and maintainable. * But another viable route might well be to use the GHC API, which means that the result wouldn't be part of GHC at all, just a client of the API. That would make it much easier to distribute upgrades etc, just as a Cabal package. Simon From: haskell-cafe-boun...@haskell.orgmailto:haskell-cafe-boun...@haskell.org [mailto:haskell-cafe-boun...@haskell.org] On Behalf Of Rick R Sent: 23 June 2009 14:53 To: Haskell Cafe Subject: Re: [Haskell-cafe] Haskell on the iPhone There seems to be quite a bit more interest now in supporting platforms other than win/*nix on x86 these days*. Maybe now there will be sufficient motivation to make the fundamental changes required. Caveat: I have absolutely no idea of the scope or complexity of said changes. I will look through the LambdaVM code (and iPwn when available) to get an idea. Perhaps we can devote a section of Haskell Wiki to generalizing Haskell for multiple targets? The industry has been clamoring for a unified solution to all of the mobile platforms out there. If Haskell can provide that, it would be a huge win for its popularity. * Thanks primarily to the iPhone and Android systems. I think currently iPhone is swaying the most votes but Android is due to be on a dozen phones and possibly even a netbook. (I have heard two announcements and one cancellation with regards to the netbooks). On Tue, Jun 23, 2009 at 8:34 AM, John A. De Goes j...@n-brain.netmailto:j...@n-brain.net wrote: I have strong interest in Haskell on the JVM. Not for Android, however. Seems like every time this topic comes up, the consensus is that it's not easy to support new targets with GHC, but that work is underway to make such developments easier. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Jun 22, 2009, at 11:23 PM, Ryan Trinkle wrote: Rick, I know some work has been done on JVM - iirc, Don Stewart did some work back in the day, www.cse.unsw.edu.au/~pls/thesis/dons-thesis.ps.gzhttp://www.cse.unsw.edu.au/%7Epls/thesis/dons-thesis.ps.gz, but I'm not sure how comprehensive it is. Is anyone else interested in JVM-based Haskell targets? Ryan On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 20:42, Rick R rick.richard...@gmail.commailto:rick.richard...@gmail.com wrote: This is definitely good news! So... who's doing the Android/JVM target? ;) On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 7:37 PM, Daniel Peebles pumpkin...@gmail.commailto:pumpkin...@gmail.com wrote: How exciting! I fully support the creation of a new mailing list about iphone+haskell :) On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 6:30 PM, Ryan Trinkleryant5...@gmail.commailto:ryant5...@gmail.com wrote: Dear Haskellers, Recently, there's been a groundswell of activity in the Haskell community regarding the Haskell's use in developing iPhone games. The iPhone is a powerful, innovative platform (with a great monetization
Re: [Haskell-cafe] Haskell on the iPhone
That sounds sufficient -- basically, just tell the sponsored developer where to look to get started, give him a rough idea of what needs to be done, and let him sort out the rest. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Jun 24, 2009, at 10:00 AM, Simon Peyton-Jones wrote: Advice, yes; leadership, no. [“guidance” is ambiguous between those two!] Simon From: haskell-cafe-boun...@haskell.org [mailto:haskell-cafe-boun...@haskell.org ] On Behalf Of John A. De Goes Sent: 23 June 2009 15:24 To: Simon Peyton-Jones; Haskell Cafe Subject: Re: [Haskell-cafe] Haskell on the iPhone How about setting up some sort of Summer of Code-type project, where companies can pledge dollars toward a certain goal, which will cover the cost of the work? Is there someone at GHC HQ who could provide guidance to a sponsored developer working on getting additional targets into HEAD? Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Jun 23, 2009, at 8:16 AM, Simon Peyton-Jones wrote: Good news about the iPhone port! There seems to be quite a bit more interest now in supporting platforms other than win/*nix on x86 these days*. Maybe now there will be sufficient motivation to make the fundamental changes required. Caveat: I have absolutely no idea of the scope or complexity of said changes. I will look through the LambdaVM code (and iPwn when available) to get an idea. There is definitely an opportunity here for someone to make an impact. There is no reason in principle why Haskell can’t run on a JVM or .net or other platform. But it’s not just a simple matter of absorbing some patch or other. Here’s a summary I wrote a little while ago: http://haskell.org/haskellwiki/GHC:FAQ#Why_isn.27t_GHC_available_for_.NET_or_on_the_JVM.3F The short summary is: · There is interesting design work to do; and then interesting engineering work to make it a reality. · We (at GHC HQ) would love to see that happen, but are not likely to drive it. · If someone, or a small group, wanted to take up the cudgels and work on it, we’d be happy to advise. · We’d certainly consider folding the results into the HEAD, provided the author(s) are willing to maintain it, and we feel that the result is comprehensible and maintainable. · But another viable route might well be to use the GHC API, which means that the result wouldn’t be part of GHC at all, just a client of the API. That would make it much easier to distribute upgrades etc, just as a Cabal package. Simon From: haskell-cafe-boun...@haskell.org [mailto:haskell-cafe-boun...@haskell.org ] On Behalf Of Rick R Sent: 23 June 2009 14:53 To: Haskell Cafe Subject: Re: [Haskell-cafe] Haskell on the iPhone There seems to be quite a bit more interest now in supporting platforms other than win/*nix on x86 these days*. Maybe now there will be sufficient motivation to make the fundamental changes required. Caveat: I have absolutely no idea of the scope or complexity of said changes. I will look through the LambdaVM code (and iPwn when available) to get an idea. Perhaps we can devote a section of Haskell Wiki to generalizing Haskell for multiple targets? The industry has been clamoring for a unified solution to all of the mobile platforms out there. If Haskell can provide that, it would be a huge win for its popularity. * Thanks primarily to the iPhone and Android systems. I think currently iPhone is swaying the most votes but Android is due to be on a dozen phones and possibly even a netbook. (I have heard two announcements and one cancellation with regards to the netbooks). On Tue, Jun 23, 2009 at 8:34 AM, John A. De Goes j...@n-brain.net wrote: I have strong interest in Haskell on the JVM. Not for Android, however. Seems like every time this topic comes up, the consensus is that it's not easy to support new targets with GHC, but that work is underway to make such developments easier. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Jun 22, 2009, at 11:23 PM, Ryan Trinkle wrote: Rick, I know some work has been done on JVM - iirc, Don Stewart did some work back in the day, www.cse.unsw.edu.au/~pls/thesis/dons-thesis.ps.gz , but I'm not sure how comprehensive it is. Is anyone else interested in JVM-based Haskell targets? Ryan On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 20:42, Rick R rick.richard...@gmail.com wrote: This is definitely good news! So... who's doing the Android/JVM target? ;) On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 7:37 PM, Daniel Peebles pumpkin...@gmail.com wrote: How exciting! I fully support the creation of a new mailing list about iphone+haskell :) On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 6:30 PM, Ryan Trinkleryant5...@gmail.com
Re: [Haskell-cafe] Haskell on the iPhone
Ryan Trinkle wrote: Rick, I know some work has been done on JVM - iirc, Don Stewart did some work back in the day, www.cse.unsw.edu.au/~pls/thesis/dons-thesis.ps.gz, but I'm not sure how comprehensive it is. Is anyone else interested in JVM-based Haskell targets? Hello, certainly I am. I think it would be great if someone might combine Haskell code with what's already written in Java (i.e. all those app servers or development environments). In the past I've given a try to LambdaVM[1][2] and it looked like a sane approach to get there. Unfortunately I'm not so power-haskell user to be able to update this patch forward to more recent GHC. I've also submitted ticket for it[3]. Cheers, Karel [1]: http://wiki.brianweb.net/LambdaVM/LambdaVM [2]: http://www.cs.rit.edu/~bja8464/lambdavm/ [3]: http://hackage.haskell.org/trac/ghc/ticket/2959 Ryan On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 20:42, Rick R rick.richard...@gmail.com wrote: This is definitely good news! So... who's doing the Android/JVM target? ;) On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 7:37 PM, Daniel Peebles pumpkin...@gmail.comwrote: How exciting! I fully support the creation of a new mailing list about iphone+haskell :) On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 6:30 PM, Ryan Trinkleryant5...@gmail.com wrote: Dear Haskellers, Recently, there's been a groundswell of activity in the Haskell community regarding the Haskell's use in developing iPhone games. The iPhone is a powerful, innovative platform (with a great monetization scheme, to boot), and it's not surprising that many of us would want to develop apps for it in our favorite language. I am proud to announce today that my company, iPwn Studios Inc., is currently preparing to release an open source patch to GHC that allows it to output binaries for iPhone OS. The patch will be released under a BSD license as soon as possible and hopefully integrated into the GHC main-line in the near future. As the first (to my knowledge) Haskell-based game studio, iPwn Studios is committed to giving back to the Haskell community through open source - contributing to a rising tide that lifts us all. I would like to take this opportunity to propose the creation of a haskell-iphone mailing list, so that all Haskellers working with the iPhone - whether for profit or for pleasure - can come together to make Haskell a force to be reckoned with in the burgeoning iPhone App marketplace. Best wishes, Ryan Trinkle President, iPwn Studios Inc. P.S.: If you wish to be involved in the preparation of the GHC patch or in the creation of iPwn Studios' first game, don't hesitate to contact me by email (ryant5...@gmail.com), AIM (RyanT5000), or IRC (RyanT5000 on irc.freenode.net). ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe -- The greatest obstacle to discovering the shape of the earth, the continents, and the oceans was not ignorance but the illusion of knowledge. - Daniel J. Boorstin ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe
Re: [Haskell-cafe] Haskell on the iPhone
I have strong interest in Haskell on the JVM. Not for Android, however. Seems like every time this topic comes up, the consensus is that it's not easy to support new targets with GHC, but that work is underway to make such developments easier. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Jun 22, 2009, at 11:23 PM, Ryan Trinkle wrote: Rick, I know some work has been done on JVM - iirc, Don Stewart did some work back in the day, www.cse.unsw.edu.au/~pls/thesis/dons-thesis.ps.gz , but I'm not sure how comprehensive it is. Is anyone else interested in JVM-based Haskell targets? Ryan On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 20:42, Rick R rick.richard...@gmail.com wrote: This is definitely good news! So... who's doing the Android/JVM target? ;) On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 7:37 PM, Daniel Peebles pumpkin...@gmail.com wrote: How exciting! I fully support the creation of a new mailing list about iphone+haskell :) On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 6:30 PM, Ryan Trinkleryant5...@gmail.com wrote: Dear Haskellers, Recently, there's been a groundswell of activity in the Haskell community regarding the Haskell's use in developing iPhone games. The iPhone is a powerful, innovative platform (with a great monetization scheme, to boot), and it's not surprising that many of us would want to develop apps for it in our favorite language. I am proud to announce today that my company, iPwn Studios Inc., is currently preparing to release an open source patch to GHC that allows it to output binaries for iPhone OS. The patch will be released under a BSD license as soon as possible and hopefully integrated into the GHC main-line in the near future. As the first (to my knowledge) Haskell-based game studio, iPwn Studios is committed to giving back to the Haskell community through open source - contributing to a rising tide that lifts us all. I would like to take this opportunity to propose the creation of a haskell-iphone mailing list, so that all Haskellers working with the iPhone - whether for profit or for pleasure - can come together to make Haskell a force to be reckoned with in the burgeoning iPhone App marketplace. Best wishes, Ryan Trinkle President, iPwn Studios Inc. P.S.: If you wish to be involved in the preparation of the GHC patch or in the creation of iPwn Studios' first game, don't hesitate to contact me by email (ryant5...@gmail.com), AIM (RyanT5000), or IRC (RyanT5000 on irc.freenode.net). ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe -- The greatest obstacle to discovering the shape of the earth, the continents, and the oceans was not ignorance but the illusion of knowledge. - Daniel J. Boorstin ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe
Re: [Haskell-cafe] Haskell on the iPhone
This is great news! I'd love to be able to write our cellphone automated vehicle location clients in Haskell. -- Jeff On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 6:38 PM, Don Stewartd...@galois.com wrote: If you're doing it in Haskell, please feel free to keep plugging. A new market for Haskell apps is highly welcome. ryant5000: Jason, iPwn is currently in pre-production for its first title, which will be an action-RPG reminiscent of Diablo and Fallout. I'll try to keep the shameless plugging on Haskell-cafe to a minimum, but I make no promises :P I will definitely let people know when our website is put together in some useful way. Ryan On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 18:34, Jason Dagit da...@codersbase.com wrote: On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 3:30 PM, Ryan Trinkle ryant5...@gmail.com wrote: Dear Haskellers, Recently, there's been a groundswell of activity in the Haskell community regarding the Haskell's use in developing iPhone games. The iPhone is a powerful, innovative platform (with a great monetization scheme, to boot), and it's not surprising that many of us would want to develop apps for it in our favorite language. I am proud to announce today that my company, iPwn Studios Inc., is currently preparing to release an open source patch to GHC that allows it to output binaries for iPhone OS. The patch will be released under a BSD license as soon as possible and hopefully integrated into the GHC main-line in the near future. As the first (to my knowledge) Haskell-based game studio, iPwn Studios is committed to giving back to the Haskell community through open source - contributing to a rising tide that lifts us all. Hi Ryan, This is great news! Thanks! Does iPwn have any up coming titles? Perhaps a blog where we could read about them so the advertising doesn't hit the list. I would like to take this opportunity to propose the creation of a haskell-iphone mailing list, so that all Haskellers working with the iPhone - whether for profit or for pleasure - can come together to make Haskell a force to be reckoned with in the burgeoning iPhone App marketplace. Sounds good to me. Please post back here if it gets created. Jason ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe
Re: [Haskell-cafe] Haskell on the iPhone
There seems to be quite a bit more interest now in supporting platforms other than win/*nix on x86 these days*. Maybe now there will be sufficient motivation to make the fundamental changes required. Caveat: I have absolutely no idea of the scope or complexity of said changes. I will look through the LambdaVM code (and iPwn when available) to get an idea. Perhaps we can devote a section of Haskell Wiki to generalizing Haskell for multiple targets? The industry has been clamoring for a unified solution to all of the mobile platforms out there. If Haskell can provide that, it would be a huge win for its popularity. * Thanks primarily to the iPhone and Android systems. I think currently iPhone is swaying the most votes but Android is due to be on a dozen phones and possibly even a netbook. (I have heard two announcements and one cancellation with regards to the netbooks). On Tue, Jun 23, 2009 at 8:34 AM, John A. De Goes j...@n-brain.net wrote: I have strong interest in Haskell on the JVM. Not for Android, however. Seems like every time this topic comes up, the consensus is that it's not easy to support new targets with GHC, but that work is underway to make such developments easier. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Jun 22, 2009, at 11:23 PM, Ryan Trinkle wrote: Rick, I know some work has been done on JVM - iirc, Don Stewart did some work back in the day, www.cse.unsw.edu.au/~pls/thesis/dons-thesis.ps.gzhttp://www.cse.unsw.edu.au/%7Epls/thesis/dons-thesis.ps.gz, but I'm not sure how comprehensive it is. Is anyone else interested in JVM-based Haskell targets? Ryan On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 20:42, Rick R rick.richard...@gmail.com wrote: This is definitely good news! So... who's doing the Android/JVM target? ;) On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 7:37 PM, Daniel Peebles pumpkin...@gmail.comwrote: How exciting! I fully support the creation of a new mailing list about iphone+haskell :) On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 6:30 PM, Ryan Trinkleryant5...@gmail.com wrote: Dear Haskellers, Recently, there's been a groundswell of activity in the Haskell community regarding the Haskell's use in developing iPhone games. The iPhone is a powerful, innovative platform (with a great monetization scheme, to boot), and it's not surprising that many of us would want to develop apps for it in our favorite language. I am proud to announce today that my company, iPwn Studios Inc., is currently preparing to release an open source patch to GHC that allows it to output binaries for iPhone OS. The patch will be released under a BSD license as soon as possible and hopefully integrated into the GHC main-line in the near future. As the first (to my knowledge) Haskell-based game studio, iPwn Studios is committed to giving back to the Haskell community through open source - contributing to a rising tide that lifts us all. I would like to take this opportunity to propose the creation of a haskell-iphone mailing list, so that all Haskellers working with the iPhone - whether for profit or for pleasure - can come together to make Haskell a force to be reckoned with in the burgeoning iPhone App marketplace. Best wishes, Ryan Trinkle President, iPwn Studios Inc. P.S.: If you wish to be involved in the preparation of the GHC patch or in the creation of iPwn Studios' first game, don't hesitate to contact me by email (ryant5...@gmail.com), AIM (RyanT5000), or IRC (RyanT5000 on irc.freenode.net). ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe -- The greatest obstacle to discovering the shape of the earth, the continents, and the oceans was not ignorance but the illusion of knowledge. - Daniel J. Boorstin ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe -- The greatest obstacle to discovering the shape of the earth, the continents, and the oceans was not ignorance but the illusion of knowledge. - Daniel J. Boorstin ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe
RE: [Haskell-cafe] Haskell on the iPhone
Good news about the iPhone port! There seems to be quite a bit more interest now in supporting platforms other than win/*nix on x86 these days*. Maybe now there will be sufficient motivation to make the fundamental changes required. Caveat: I have absolutely no idea of the scope or complexity of said changes. I will look through the LambdaVM code (and iPwn when available) to get an idea. There is definitely an opportunity here for someone to make an impact. There is no reason in principle why Haskell can't run on a JVM or .net or other platform. But it's not just a simple matter of absorbing some patch or other. Here's a summary I wrote a little while ago: http://haskell.org/haskellwiki/GHC:FAQ#Why_isn.27t_GHC_available_for_.NET_or_on_the_JVM.3F The short summary is: * There is interesting design work to do; and then interesting engineering work to make it a reality. * We (at GHC HQ) would love to see that happen, but are not likely to drive it. * If someone, or a small group, wanted to take up the cudgels and work on it, we'd be happy to advise. * We'd certainly consider folding the results into the HEAD, provided the author(s) are willing to maintain it, and we feel that the result is comprehensible and maintainable. * But another viable route might well be to use the GHC API, which means that the result wouldn't be part of GHC at all, just a client of the API. That would make it much easier to distribute upgrades etc, just as a Cabal package. Simon From: haskell-cafe-boun...@haskell.org [mailto:haskell-cafe-boun...@haskell.org] On Behalf Of Rick R Sent: 23 June 2009 14:53 To: Haskell Cafe Subject: Re: [Haskell-cafe] Haskell on the iPhone There seems to be quite a bit more interest now in supporting platforms other than win/*nix on x86 these days*. Maybe now there will be sufficient motivation to make the fundamental changes required. Caveat: I have absolutely no idea of the scope or complexity of said changes. I will look through the LambdaVM code (and iPwn when available) to get an idea. Perhaps we can devote a section of Haskell Wiki to generalizing Haskell for multiple targets? The industry has been clamoring for a unified solution to all of the mobile platforms out there. If Haskell can provide that, it would be a huge win for its popularity. * Thanks primarily to the iPhone and Android systems. I think currently iPhone is swaying the most votes but Android is due to be on a dozen phones and possibly even a netbook. (I have heard two announcements and one cancellation with regards to the netbooks). On Tue, Jun 23, 2009 at 8:34 AM, John A. De Goes j...@n-brain.netmailto:j...@n-brain.net wrote: I have strong interest in Haskell on the JVM. Not for Android, however. Seems like every time this topic comes up, the consensus is that it's not easy to support new targets with GHC, but that work is underway to make such developments easier. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Jun 22, 2009, at 11:23 PM, Ryan Trinkle wrote: Rick, I know some work has been done on JVM - iirc, Don Stewart did some work back in the day, www.cse.unsw.edu.au/~pls/thesis/dons-thesis.ps.gzhttp://www.cse.unsw.edu.au/%7Epls/thesis/dons-thesis.ps.gz, but I'm not sure how comprehensive it is. Is anyone else interested in JVM-based Haskell targets? Ryan On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 20:42, Rick R rick.richard...@gmail.commailto:rick.richard...@gmail.com wrote: This is definitely good news! So... who's doing the Android/JVM target? ;) On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 7:37 PM, Daniel Peebles pumpkin...@gmail.commailto:pumpkin...@gmail.com wrote: How exciting! I fully support the creation of a new mailing list about iphone+haskell :) On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 6:30 PM, Ryan Trinkleryant5...@gmail.commailto:ryant5...@gmail.com wrote: Dear Haskellers, Recently, there's been a groundswell of activity in the Haskell community regarding the Haskell's use in developing iPhone games. The iPhone is a powerful, innovative platform (with a great monetization scheme, to boot), and it's not surprising that many of us would want to develop apps for it in our favorite language. I am proud to announce today that my company, iPwn Studios Inc., is currently preparing to release an open source patch to GHC that allows it to output binaries for iPhone OS. The patch will be released under a BSD license as soon as possible and hopefully integrated into the GHC main-line in the near future. As the first (to my knowledge) Haskell-based game studio, iPwn Studios is committed to giving back to the Haskell community through open source - contributing to a rising tide that lifts us all. I would like to take this opportunity to propose the creation of a haskell-iphone mailing list, so that all Haskellers working with the iPhone - whether for profit
Re: [Haskell-cafe] Haskell on the iPhone
How about setting up some sort of Summer of Code-type project, where companies can pledge dollars toward a certain goal, which will cover the cost of the work? Is there someone at GHC HQ who could provide guidance to a sponsored developer working on getting additional targets into HEAD? Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Jun 23, 2009, at 8:16 AM, Simon Peyton-Jones wrote: Good news about the iPhone port! There seems to be quite a bit more interest now in supporting platforms other than win/*nix on x86 these days*. Maybe now there will be sufficient motivation to make the fundamental changes required. Caveat: I have absolutely no idea of the scope or complexity of said changes. I will look through the LambdaVM code (and iPwn when available) to get an idea. There is definitely an opportunity here for someone to make an impact. There is no reason in principle why Haskell can’t run on a JVM or .net or other platform. But it’s not just a simple matter of absorbing some patch or other. Here’s a summary I wrote a little while ago: http://haskell.org/haskellwiki/GHC:FAQ#Why_isn.27t_GHC_available_for_.NET_or_on_the_JVM.3F The short summary is: · There is interesting design work to do; and then interesting engineering work to make it a reality. · We (at GHC HQ) would love to see that happen, but are not likely to drive it. · If someone, or a small group, wanted to take up the cudgels and work on it, we’d be happy to advise. · We’d certainly consider folding the results into the HEAD, provided the author(s) are willing to maintain it, and we feel that the result is comprehensible and maintainable. · But another viable route might well be to use the GHC API, which means that the result wouldn’t be part of GHC at all, just a client of the API. That would make it much easier to distribute upgrades etc, just as a Cabal package. Simon From: haskell-cafe-boun...@haskell.org [mailto:haskell-cafe-boun...@haskell.org ] On Behalf Of Rick R Sent: 23 June 2009 14:53 To: Haskell Cafe Subject: Re: [Haskell-cafe] Haskell on the iPhone There seems to be quite a bit more interest now in supporting platforms other than win/*nix on x86 these days*. Maybe now there will be sufficient motivation to make the fundamental changes required. Caveat: I have absolutely no idea of the scope or complexity of said changes. I will look through the LambdaVM code (and iPwn when available) to get an idea. Perhaps we can devote a section of Haskell Wiki to generalizing Haskell for multiple targets? The industry has been clamoring for a unified solution to all of the mobile platforms out there. If Haskell can provide that, it would be a huge win for its popularity. * Thanks primarily to the iPhone and Android systems. I think currently iPhone is swaying the most votes but Android is due to be on a dozen phones and possibly even a netbook. (I have heard two announcements and one cancellation with regards to the netbooks). On Tue, Jun 23, 2009 at 8:34 AM, John A. De Goes j...@n-brain.net wrote: I have strong interest in Haskell on the JVM. Not for Android, however. Seems like every time this topic comes up, the consensus is that it's not easy to support new targets with GHC, but that work is underway to make such developments easier. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Jun 22, 2009, at 11:23 PM, Ryan Trinkle wrote: Rick, I know some work has been done on JVM - iirc, Don Stewart did some work back in the day, www.cse.unsw.edu.au/~pls/thesis/dons-thesis.ps.gz , but I'm not sure how comprehensive it is. Is anyone else interested in JVM-based Haskell targets? Ryan On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 20:42, Rick R rick.richard...@gmail.com wrote: This is definitely good news! So... who's doing the Android/JVM target? ;) On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 7:37 PM, Daniel Peebles pumpkin...@gmail.com wrote: How exciting! I fully support the creation of a new mailing list about iphone+haskell :) On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 6:30 PM, Ryan Trinkleryant5...@gmail.com wrote: Dear Haskellers, Recently, there's been a groundswell of activity in the Haskell community regarding the Haskell's use in developing iPhone games. The iPhone is a powerful, innovative platform (with a great monetization scheme, to boot), and it's not surprising that many of us would want to develop apps for it in our favorite language. I am proud to announce today that my company, iPwn Studios Inc., is currently preparing to release an open source patch to GHC that allows it to output binaries for iPhone OS. The patch will be released under a BSD license as soon as possible and hopefully integrated into the GHC main-line in the near future
[Haskell-cafe] Haskell on the iPhone
Dear Haskellers, Recently, there's been a groundswell of activity in the Haskell community regarding the Haskell's use in developing iPhone games. The iPhone is a powerful, innovative platform (with a great monetization scheme, to boot), and it's not surprising that many of us would want to develop apps for it in our favorite language. I am proud to announce today that my company, iPwn Studios Inc., is currently preparing to release an open source patch to GHC that allows it to output binaries for iPhone OS. The patch will be released under a BSD license as soon as possible and hopefully integrated into the GHC main-line in the near future. As the first (to my knowledge) Haskell-based game studio, iPwn Studios is committed to giving back to the Haskell community through open source - contributing to a rising tide that lifts us all. I would like to take this opportunity to propose the creation of a haskell-iphone mailing list, so that all Haskellers working with the iPhone - whether for profit or for pleasure - can come together to make Haskell a force to be reckoned with in the burgeoning iPhone App marketplace. Best wishes, Ryan Trinkle President, iPwn Studios Inc. P.S.: If you wish to be involved in the preparation of the GHC patch or in the creation of iPwn Studios' first game, don't hesitate to contact me by email (ryant5...@gmail.com), AIM (RyanT5000), or IRC (RyanT5000 on irc.freenode.net). ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe
Re: [Haskell-cafe] Haskell on the iPhone
On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 3:30 PM, Ryan Trinkle ryant5...@gmail.com wrote: Dear Haskellers, Recently, there's been a groundswell of activity in the Haskell community regarding the Haskell's use in developing iPhone games. The iPhone is a powerful, innovative platform (with a great monetization scheme, to boot), and it's not surprising that many of us would want to develop apps for it in our favorite language. I am proud to announce today that my company, iPwn Studios Inc., is currently preparing to release an open source patch to GHC that allows it to output binaries for iPhone OS. The patch will be released under a BSD license as soon as possible and hopefully integrated into the GHC main-line in the near future. As the first (to my knowledge) Haskell-based game studio, iPwn Studios is committed to giving back to the Haskell community through open source - contributing to a rising tide that lifts us all. Hi Ryan, This is great news! Thanks! Does iPwn have any up coming titles? Perhaps a blog where we could read about them so the advertising doesn't hit the list. I would like to take this opportunity to propose the creation of a haskell-iphone mailing list, so that all Haskellers working with the iPhone - whether for profit or for pleasure - can come together to make Haskell a force to be reckoned with in the burgeoning iPhone App marketplace. Sounds good to me. Please post back here if it gets created. Jason ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe
Re: [Haskell-cafe] Haskell on the iPhone
Jason, iPwn is currently in pre-production for its first title, which will be an action-RPG reminiscent of Diablo and Fallout. I'll try to keep the shameless plugging on Haskell-cafe to a minimum, but I make no promises :P I will definitely let people know when our website is put together in some useful way. Ryan On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 18:34, Jason Dagit da...@codersbase.com wrote: On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 3:30 PM, Ryan Trinkle ryant5...@gmail.com wrote: Dear Haskellers, Recently, there's been a groundswell of activity in the Haskell community regarding the Haskell's use in developing iPhone games. The iPhone is a powerful, innovative platform (with a great monetization scheme, to boot), and it's not surprising that many of us would want to develop apps for it in our favorite language. I am proud to announce today that my company, iPwn Studios Inc., is currently preparing to release an open source patch to GHC that allows it to output binaries for iPhone OS. The patch will be released under a BSD license as soon as possible and hopefully integrated into the GHC main-line in the near future. As the first (to my knowledge) Haskell-based game studio, iPwn Studios is committed to giving back to the Haskell community through open source - contributing to a rising tide that lifts us all. Hi Ryan, This is great news! Thanks! Does iPwn have any up coming titles? Perhaps a blog where we could read about them so the advertising doesn't hit the list. I would like to take this opportunity to propose the creation of a haskell-iphone mailing list, so that all Haskellers working with the iPhone - whether for profit or for pleasure - can come together to make Haskell a force to be reckoned with in the burgeoning iPhone App marketplace. Sounds good to me. Please post back here if it gets created. Jason ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe
Re: [Haskell-cafe] Haskell on the iPhone
If you're doing it in Haskell, please feel free to keep plugging. A new market for Haskell apps is highly welcome. ryant5000: Jason, iPwn is currently in pre-production for its first title, which will be an action-RPG reminiscent of Diablo and Fallout. I'll try to keep the shameless plugging on Haskell-cafe to a minimum, but I make no promises :P I will definitely let people know when our website is put together in some useful way. Ryan On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 18:34, Jason Dagit da...@codersbase.com wrote: On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 3:30 PM, Ryan Trinkle ryant5...@gmail.com wrote: Dear Haskellers, Recently, there's been a groundswell of activity in the Haskell community regarding the Haskell's use in developing iPhone games. The iPhone is a powerful, innovative platform (with a great monetization scheme, to boot), and it's not surprising that many of us would want to develop apps for it in our favorite language. I am proud to announce today that my company, iPwn Studios Inc., is currently preparing to release an open source patch to GHC that allows it to output binaries for iPhone OS. The patch will be released under a BSD license as soon as possible and hopefully integrated into the GHC main-line in the near future. As the first (to my knowledge) Haskell-based game studio, iPwn Studios is committed to giving back to the Haskell community through open source - contributing to a rising tide that lifts us all. Hi Ryan, This is great news! Thanks! Does iPwn have any up coming titles? Perhaps a blog where we could read about them so the advertising doesn't hit the list. I would like to take this opportunity to propose the creation of a haskell-iphone mailing list, so that all Haskellers working with the iPhone - whether for profit or for pleasure - can come together to make Haskell a force to be reckoned with in the burgeoning iPhone App marketplace. Sounds good to me. Please post back here if it gets created. Jason ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe
Re: [Haskell-cafe] Haskell on the iPhone
How exciting! I fully support the creation of a new mailing list about iphone+haskell :) On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 6:30 PM, Ryan Trinkleryant5...@gmail.com wrote: Dear Haskellers, Recently, there's been a groundswell of activity in the Haskell community regarding the Haskell's use in developing iPhone games. The iPhone is a powerful, innovative platform (with a great monetization scheme, to boot), and it's not surprising that many of us would want to develop apps for it in our favorite language. I am proud to announce today that my company, iPwn Studios Inc., is currently preparing to release an open source patch to GHC that allows it to output binaries for iPhone OS. The patch will be released under a BSD license as soon as possible and hopefully integrated into the GHC main-line in the near future. As the first (to my knowledge) Haskell-based game studio, iPwn Studios is committed to giving back to the Haskell community through open source - contributing to a rising tide that lifts us all. I would like to take this opportunity to propose the creation of a haskell-iphone mailing list, so that all Haskellers working with the iPhone - whether for profit or for pleasure - can come together to make Haskell a force to be reckoned with in the burgeoning iPhone App marketplace. Best wishes, Ryan Trinkle President, iPwn Studios Inc. P.S.: If you wish to be involved in the preparation of the GHC patch or in the creation of iPwn Studios' first game, don't hesitate to contact me by email (ryant5...@gmail.com), AIM (RyanT5000), or IRC (RyanT5000 on irc.freenode.net). ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe
Re: [Haskell-cafe] Haskell on the iPhone
Rick, I know some work has been done on JVM - iirc, Don Stewart did some work back in the day, www.cse.unsw.edu.au/~pls/thesis/dons-thesis.ps.gz, but I'm not sure how comprehensive it is. Is anyone else interested in JVM-based Haskell targets? Ryan On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 20:42, Rick R rick.richard...@gmail.com wrote: This is definitely good news! So... who's doing the Android/JVM target? ;) On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 7:37 PM, Daniel Peebles pumpkin...@gmail.comwrote: How exciting! I fully support the creation of a new mailing list about iphone+haskell :) On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 6:30 PM, Ryan Trinkleryant5...@gmail.com wrote: Dear Haskellers, Recently, there's been a groundswell of activity in the Haskell community regarding the Haskell's use in developing iPhone games. The iPhone is a powerful, innovative platform (with a great monetization scheme, to boot), and it's not surprising that many of us would want to develop apps for it in our favorite language. I am proud to announce today that my company, iPwn Studios Inc., is currently preparing to release an open source patch to GHC that allows it to output binaries for iPhone OS. The patch will be released under a BSD license as soon as possible and hopefully integrated into the GHC main-line in the near future. As the first (to my knowledge) Haskell-based game studio, iPwn Studios is committed to giving back to the Haskell community through open source - contributing to a rising tide that lifts us all. I would like to take this opportunity to propose the creation of a haskell-iphone mailing list, so that all Haskellers working with the iPhone - whether for profit or for pleasure - can come together to make Haskell a force to be reckoned with in the burgeoning iPhone App marketplace. Best wishes, Ryan Trinkle President, iPwn Studios Inc. P.S.: If you wish to be involved in the preparation of the GHC patch or in the creation of iPwn Studios' first game, don't hesitate to contact me by email (ryant5...@gmail.com), AIM (RyanT5000), or IRC (RyanT5000 on irc.freenode.net). ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe -- The greatest obstacle to discovering the shape of the earth, the continents, and the oceans was not ignorance but the illusion of knowledge. - Daniel J. Boorstin ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe
