[HOT] 3637

2017-11-19 Thread Daniel Specht
I tried to map a tile on #3637 (Bangladesh) and got this message: The task
could not be locked for mapping. Mapping not allowed because:
PROJECT_NOT_PUBLISHED

-- 
Dan
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Re: [HOT] Mapping buildings with new mappers at a maperthon

2017-11-19 Thread Blake Girardot HOT/OSM
Hi,

A lot of this would be addressed if iD had a building mapping tool
like JOSM does. I am going to restart the effort to get that added in
to iD, I have some new ideas for how we might be able to accomplish
it. I think it would save literally hundreds of hours volunteer time
fixing buildings that are mapped by new mappers and help new mappers
increase their productivity and accuracy.

iD is by far the more approachable editor for OSM, it runs on any
desktop or laptop with zero installation issues and has a great
built-in tutorial, so I think we would be well served by helping
improve iD.

If there are any JS wizards out there who want to help complete the
building tool for iD (it is already started, just not completed)
please contact me directly :)

Cheers,
Blake



On Sun, Nov 19, 2017 at 3:40 PM, john whelan  wrote:
> and I totally concur with what Ralph has said.
>
> We asked people who were attending to install JAVA before they arrived and I
> had josm-tested.jar available on a DVD to minimise the stress on the wifi
> network. I had a USB DVD device with me and a bag of mice. The particular
> maperthon I was at was a one off affair but we had someone from the local
> OSM group mention how to find the monthly meetings where mapping took place.
>
> Note I had two machines available that had JAVA, JOSM with the plugins
> already installed so it was just a matter of "come in, sit down, create an
> account, wiggle the mouse now you've mapped your first building."  Upload,
> then we got them to install JOSM on their own machine and when we downloaded
> the tile again their previous mapping was there which reinforced the idea
> that they were mapping on a live database.
>
> It could be just me but my feeling was we got a bit more engagement with
> JOSM as they could see the underlying tags and having shown one mapper how
> to join up two rectangles for an L shaped building I asked them to show
> another mapper how to do it when they wanted to know which helps on the
> confidence building side.
>
> For highways there is less to choose between the two editors but for
> buildings certainly for accuracy currently JOSM and the building_tool plugin
> wins hands down.
>
> I think the large maperthons have their place but perhaps we need more
> mini-maperthons?
>
> Cheerio John
>
> On 19 November 2017 at 03:07,  wrote:
>>
>> A useful guide to running your Mapathon can be found here
>> http://learnosm.org/en/coordination/mapathon/
>>
>>
>>
>> There is no hard and fast rule to running a successful Mapathon. As I
>> point out, each Mapathon will evolve at it’s own pace and in it’s own
>> direction dependent the expertise of the people organizing and leading, on
>> the people attending, the facilities available and the number of people
>> involved.
>>
>>
>>
>> As to the choice of Editor used, I agree with John that JOSM is preferred,
>> unfortunately that choice is not always available. We have found that
>> dealing with new mappers using school or corporate computers/laptops it is
>> not always permitted to download other programmes, or if you have a large
>> group uploading/downloading at the same time can cause problems for the
>> available WiFi, and with one really large group we overloaded the OSM
>> server. So our choice is to start the large group of new mappers with iD
>> Editor so that we can get them mapping as quickly as we can and then deal
>> with any questions they have during the session.
>>
>>
>>
>> I do not count any success on how many squares have been completed
>> although it is encouraging to the group to be shown at the end how much
>> their contribution has advanced the project they are working on. I prefer to
>> concentrate on getting the mappers to a stage where they are comfortable
>> with their mapping and confident enough to try mapping further on their own
>> at home and hopefully interested enough to return for further guidance.
>> Going around the room and looking at what they are doing is paramount to
>> this success. Telling them that they have got it and their work is good
>> gives them the assurance they need to continue and even become more
>> adventurous, so John is correct in saying that the one-to-one does show more
>> promise and achieve better mapping. Even stopping to show a new mapper how
>> to improve and correct their work has a very positive effect on their
>> confidence.
>>
>>
>>
>> Working with small groups definitely is an advantage because of the
>> personal attention they can get, but will be more effective it you can get
>> them meeting on a regular basis to build on their experience and skill with
>> the various tools on JOSM.
>>
>>
>>
>> At the London monthly Mapathon we have three training sections running at
>> the same time … iD , JOSM and Validating. And it is up to the individual as
>> to which session they sign up to. If they want to start straight away with
>> JOSM they are welcome to do so. The mappers know 

Re: [HOT] Mapping buildings with new mappers at a maperthon

2017-11-19 Thread john whelan
and I totally concur with what Ralph has said.

We asked people who were attending to install JAVA before they arrived and
I had josm-tested.jar available on a DVD to minimise the stress on the wifi
network. I had a USB DVD device with me and a bag of mice. The particular
maperthon I was at was a one off affair but we had someone from the local
OSM group mention how to find the monthly meetings where mapping took place.

Note I had two machines available that had JAVA, JOSM with the plugins
already installed so it was just a matter of "come in, sit down, create an
account, wiggle the mouse now you've mapped your first building."  Upload,
then we got them to install JOSM on their own machine and when we
downloaded the tile again their previous mapping was there which reinforced
the idea that they were mapping on a live database.

It could be just me but my feeling was we got a bit more engagement with
JOSM as they could see the underlying tags and having shown one mapper how
to join up two rectangles for an L shaped building I asked them to show
another mapper how to do it when they wanted to know which helps on the
confidence building side.

For highways there is less to choose between the two editors but for
buildings certainly for accuracy currently JOSM and the building_tool
plugin wins hands down.

I think the large maperthons have their place but perhaps we need more
mini-maperthons?

Cheerio John

On 19 November 2017 at 03:07,  wrote:

> A useful guide to running your Mapathon can be found here
> http://learnosm.org/en/coordination/mapathon/
>
>
>
> There is no hard and fast rule to running a successful Mapathon. As I
> point out, each Mapathon will evolve at it’s own pace and in it’s own
> direction dependent the expertise of the people organizing and leading, on
> the people attending, the facilities available and the number of people
> involved.
>
>
>
> As to the choice of Editor used, I agree with John that JOSM is preferred,
> unfortunately that choice is not always available. We have found that
> dealing with new mappers using school or corporate computers/laptops it is
> not always permitted to download other programmes, or if you have a large
> group uploading/downloading at the same time can cause problems for the
> available WiFi, and with one really large group we overloaded the OSM
> server. So our choice is to start the large group of new mappers with iD
> Editor so that we can get them mapping as quickly as we can and then deal
> with any questions they have during the session.
>
>
>
> I do not count any success on how many squares have been completed
> although it is encouraging to the group to be shown at the end how much
> their contribution has advanced the project they are working on. I prefer
> to concentrate on getting the mappers to a stage where they are comfortable
> with their mapping and confident enough to try mapping further on their own
> at home and hopefully interested enough to return for further guidance.
> Going around the room and looking at what they are doing is paramount to
> this success. Telling them that they have got it and their work is good
> gives them the assurance they need to continue and even become more
> adventurous, so John is correct in saying that the one-to-one does show
> more promise and achieve better mapping. Even stopping to show a new mapper
> how to improve and correct their work has a very positive effect on their
> confidence.
>
>
>
> Working with small groups definitely is an advantage because of the
> personal attention they can get, but will be more effective it you can get
> them meeting on a regular basis to build on their experience and skill with
> the various tools on JOSM.
>
>
>
> At the London monthly Mapathon we have three training sections running at
> the same time … iD , JOSM and Validating. And it is up to the individual as
> to which session they sign up to. If they want to start straight away with
> JOSM they are welcome to do so. The mappers know that there is going to be
> a Mapathon on the first Tuesday of every month so it becomes a fixed date
> on their calendar which does help with returning mappers. We also keep the
> email addresses of attendees and they will get invited back to future
> Mapathons with an Eventbrite invitation.
>
>
>
> As a guide to success I would point you to the fact that most of the
> trainers at the London Mapathons started off as newcomers and have stayed
> and progressed, a number of attendees have gone on to start up mapping
> groups at their universities. Also at universities and corporate offices
> where we have run Mapathons they have started up inhouse Mapping Parties
> and Mapathons of their own.
>
>
>
> Martin Dittus gave us some statistics early on in the process of evolving
> the London Mapathons which showed approximately 30% return rate but it
> tailed of quickly, which is why we decided to offer the returning mappers
> the option of going onto JOSM, 

Re: [HOT] Mapping buildings with new mappers at a maperthon

2017-11-19 Thread ralph.aytoun
A useful guide to running your Mapathon can be found here 
http://learnosm.org/en/coordination/mapathon/ 

There is no hard and fast rule to running a successful Mapathon. As I point 
out, each Mapathon will evolve at it’s own pace and in it’s own direction 
dependent the expertise of the people organizing and leading, on the people 
attending, the facilities available and the number of people involved.

As to the choice of Editor used, I agree with John that JOSM is preferred, 
unfortunately that choice is not always available. We have found that dealing 
with new mappers using school or corporate computers/laptops it is not always 
permitted to download other programmes, or if you have a large group 
uploading/downloading at the same time can cause problems for the available 
WiFi, and with one really large group we overloaded the OSM server. So our 
choice is to start the large group of new mappers with iD Editor so that we can 
get them mapping as quickly as we can and then deal with any questions they 
have during the session.

I do not count any success on how many squares have been completed although it 
is encouraging to the group to be shown at the end how much their contribution 
has advanced the project they are working on. I prefer to concentrate on 
getting the mappers to a stage where they are comfortable with their mapping 
and confident enough to try mapping further on their own at home and hopefully 
interested enough to return for further guidance. Going around the room and 
looking at what they are doing is paramount to this success. Telling them that 
they have got it and their work is good gives them the assurance they need to 
continue and even become more adventurous, so John is correct in saying that 
the one-to-one does show more promise and achieve better mapping. Even stopping 
to show a new mapper how to improve and correct their work has a very positive 
effect on their confidence.

Working with small groups definitely is an advantage because of the personal 
attention they can get, but will be more effective it you can get them meeting 
on a regular basis to build on their experience and skill with the various 
tools on JOSM.

At the London monthly Mapathon we have three training sections running at the 
same time … iD , JOSM and Validating. And it is up to the individual as to 
which session they sign up to. If they want to start straight away with JOSM 
they are welcome to do so. The mappers know that there is going to be a 
Mapathon on the first Tuesday of every month so it becomes a fixed date on 
their calendar which does help with returning mappers. We also keep the email 
addresses of attendees and they will get invited back to future Mapathons with 
an Eventbrite invitation.

As a guide to success I would point you to the fact that most of the trainers 
at the London Mapathons started off as newcomers and have stayed and 
progressed, a number of attendees have gone on to start up mapping groups at 
their universities. Also at universities and corporate offices where we have 
run Mapathons they have started up inhouse Mapping Parties and Mapathons of 
their own.

Martin Dittus gave us some statistics early on in the process of evolving the 
London Mapathons which showed approximately 30% return rate but it tailed of 
quickly, which is why we decided to offer the returning mappers the option of 
going onto JOSM, this helped the retention of mappers and now we also have a 
MidMonth Mapathon for experienced JOSM mappers to get involved in more advanced 
work.

To sum up, yes JOSM is desirable in getting good building mapping and very 
definitely when the mapping moves into dense city centres or slums where they 
are built butting up against each other. But then for people with no previous 
map experience the learning curve is very steep, having to learn about OSM, the 
Tasking Manager, the Editor, read Satellite Imagery, drawing the features and 
also tagging correctly so reducing this slightly by using the iD Editor to 
start with does make sense when you have a limited time to get them started.

If you have any questions regarding getting started or running your Mapathon 
feel free to email me and I will try to help where I can.

Hope some of this might be useful.

Regards

Ralph


 
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