Re: [hugin-ptx] Re: Aligning multiple image stacks in the same pano - any way to do this automatically?

[T. Modes]

Hi Jochiam,

j-sc...@gmx.de schrieb am Montag, 9. Oktober 2023 um 23:25:57 UTC+2:

Hi Thomas!
Wow! Now I know why the expert interface is called like that.
Thank you very much. I would never have found this!

Is my use case so unusual that such a function is so hidden?


Hugin is very flexible. But that means also many options. So we can't show 
all on one page.
So this option is only shown when you see the actual stacks. Otherwise you 
don't see direct the effect when linking/unlink the position.

Beside this there are 2 other options:
* when adding the images the user is asked if the stacks should be linked 
or not. (In the current version (also in 2023.0 beta 1) there is a bug in 
the stack detection code. This will be fixed in 2023.0 rc1.)
* when setting the stack size the user can also choose to link or not the 
position.

Thomas

 

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Re: [hugin-ptx] Re: Aligning multiple image stacks in the same pano - any way to do this automatically?

[J. Schneider*]

Hi Thomas!
Wow! Now I know why the expert interface is called like that.
Thank you very much. I would never have found this!

Is my use case so unusual that such a function is so hidden?

Best regards
Joachim


Am 26.09.2023 um 19:44 schrieb T. Modes:

Hi Joachim,

j-sc...@gmx.de schrieb am Dienstag, 26. September 2023 um 19:22:50 UTC+2:

Hello Thomas,
did I understand correctly, the images can be members of a stack
and their positions can be unlinked at the same time?

Yes, in this case the stack is an indicator for e.g. cpfind which
images it should match with other images in the stack.

"Display the image position" - is this?:
Okay, done so.

Is this the place where I should do the unlinking?
"... on the image position" - is there a particular spot where I
have to click to get the according context menu entry? Or is it
only that I don't recognize it?
In the screenshot I have selected the images that have already
been assigned to stacks 0.

I forgot to mentioned that you need to group by stack for this. Then
open the context menu on yaw/pitch/roll/… (not on the filename or
image number) because it affects the image position parameters but not
the filename.


On the Optimiser tab the context menu is the same. I tried
checking the boxes also of the first stack, selecting the images
and then optimize..


You can also unlink the images here. Open the context menu on the
checkbox or the number beside and select unlink.
The checkboxes in the tree should present which position/parameters is
optimized - only one parameter for all images of the stack or each
image individually.

 Thomas
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Re: [hugin-ptx] Re: Aligning multiple image stacks in the same pano - any way to do this automatically?

[T. Modes]

Hi Joachim,

j-sc...@gmx.de schrieb am Dienstag, 26. September 2023 um 19:22:50 UTC+2:

Hello Thomas,
did I understand correctly, the images can be members of a stack and their 
positions can be unlinked at the same time?

Yes, in this case the stack is an indicator for e.g. cpfind which images it 
should match with other images in the stack.
 


"Display the image position" - is this?:
Okay, done so.

Is this the place where I should do the unlinking? 
"... on the image position" - is there a particular spot where I have to 
click to get the according context menu entry? Or is it only that I don't 
recognize it?
In the screenshot I have selected the images that have already been 
assigned to stacks 0. 

I forgot to mentioned that you need to group by stack for this. Then open 
the context menu on yaw/pitch/roll/… (not on the filename or image number) 
because it affects the image position parameters but not the filename. 


On the Optimiser tab the context menu is the same. I tried checking the 
boxes also of the first stack, selecting the images and then optimize.. 


You can also unlink the images here. Open the context menu on the checkbox 
or the number beside and select unlink.
The checkboxes in the tree should present which position/parameters is 
optimized - only one parameter for all images of the stack or each image 
individually.

 Thomas

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Re: [hugin-ptx] Re: Aligning multiple image stacks in the same pano - any way to do this automatically?

[J. Schneider*]

Hello Thomas,
did I understand correctly, the images can be members of a stack and
their positions can be unlinked at the same time?

"Display the image position" - is this?:
Okay, done so.

Is this the place where I should do the unlinking?
"... on the image position" - is there a particular spot where I have to
click to get the according context menu entry? Or is it only that I
don't recognize it?
In the screenshot I have selected the images that have already been
assigned to stacks 0.


On the Optimiser tab the context menu is the same. I tried checking the
boxes also of the first stack, selecting the images and then optimize..

Now the optimisation actually seems to do something, but applying the
results doesn't yield any change - obviously because I haven't unlinked
the images.

Sorry for my dumb questions, I feel like a beginner, in spite of having
used hugin for some 20 years.

Best regards
Joachim

Am 26.09.2023 um 18:10 schrieb T. Modes:

j-sc...@gmx.de schrieb am Dienstag, 26. September 2023 um 00:10:20 UTC+2:

Okay,
>  you need to assign the stacks and unlink the positions when
shooting
> handheld before running cpfind. Cpfind needs this information
for the
> decision which images belong to which stack.
This sounds plausible.
So I guess I have to set Optimise - Geometric (on the Photos tab) to
"Custom Parameters" to get the Optimiser tab. But once the stacks are
defined, I can't do anything to the positions any more. There are
checkboxes only for the stack as a whole. Or what am I missing?

As I already written, you need to unlink the position in the stack.
This can be done on the photos tab or on the optimize tab.
Display the image position and open the context menu on the image
position, there you can it unlink (or link) the image position.

And "cpfind --multirow" is not in the dropdown menu. I guess the
whole
approach has to be done on the command line, right?

No, it can also be done in the GUI. The default cpfind settings
includes already the multirow setting.
You can also create your own settings for the control point detectors
in the GUI.

Thomas

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Re: [hugin-ptx] Re: Aligning multiple image stacks in the same pano - any way to do this automatically?

[T. Modes]

j-sc...@gmx.de schrieb am Dienstag, 26. September 2023 um 00:10:20 UTC+2:

Okay, 
>  you need to assign the stacks and unlink the positions when shooting 
> handheld before running cpfind. Cpfind needs this information for the 
> decision which images belong to which stack. 
This sounds plausible. 
So I guess I have to set Optimise - Geometric (on the Photos tab) to 
"Custom Parameters" to get the Optimiser tab. But once the stacks are 
defined, I can't do anything to the positions any more. There are 
checkboxes only for the stack as a whole. Or what am I missing? 

As I already written, you need to unlink the position in the stack. This 
can be done on the photos tab or on the optimize tab.
Display the image position and open the context menu on the image position, 
there you can it unlink (or link) the image position.

And "cpfind --multirow" is not in the dropdown menu. I guess the whole 
approach has to be done on the command line, right? 

No, it can also be done in the GUI. The default cpfind settings includes 
already the multirow setting.
You can also create your own settings for the control point detectors in 
the GUI.

Thomas

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Fwd: [hugin-ptx] Re: Aligning multiple image stacks in the same pano - any way to do this automatically?

[David W. Jones]

Sorry, accidentally replied just to original poster.

 Forwarded Message 
Subject: 	Re: [hugin-ptx] Re: Aligning multiple image stacks in the same 
pano - any way to do this automatically?

Date:   Mon, 25 Sep 2023 18:57:50 -1000
From:   David W. Jones 
To: J. Schneider* 



On 9/25/23 12:10, J. Schneider* wrote:

Okay,

 you need to assign the stacks and unlink the positions when shooting
handheld before running cpfind. Cpfind needs this information for the
decision which images belong to which stack.

This sounds plausible.
So I guess I have to set Optimise - Geometric (on the Photos tab) to
"Custom Parameters" to get the Optimiser tab. But once the stacks are
defined, I can't do anything to the positions any more. There are
checkboxes only for the stack as a whole. Or what am I missing?
And "cpfind --multirow" is not in the dropdown menu. I guess the whole
approach has to be done on the command line, right?

Best regards,
Joachim

Am 25.09.2023 um 20:12 schrieb T. Modes:

But you need to assign the stacks and unlink the positions when
shooting handheld before running cpfind. Cpfind needs this information
for the decision which images belong to which stack.


Hmm, my thought about it... Assign photos to stacks. For each stack. 
select only those photos and use align_image_stack to align them. After 
that, then select only the photos at the top of the stacks, and optimize 
those for position?


Or vice versa?

--
David W. Jones
gnomeno...@gmail.com
wandering the landscape of god
http://dancingtreefrog.com
My password is the last 8 digits of π.

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Re: [hugin-ptx] Re: Aligning multiple image stacks in the same pano - any way to do this automatically?

[J. Schneider*]

Okay,

 you need to assign the stacks and unlink the positions when shooting
handheld before running cpfind. Cpfind needs this information for the
decision which images belong to which stack.

This sounds plausible.
So I guess I have to set Optimise - Geometric (on the Photos tab) to
"Custom Parameters" to get the Optimiser tab. But once the stacks are
defined, I can't do anything to the positions any more. There are
checkboxes only for the stack as a whole. Or what am I missing?
And "cpfind --multirow" is not in the dropdown menu. I guess the whole
approach has to be done on the command line, right?

Best regards,
Joachim

Am 25.09.2023 um 20:12 schrieb T. Modes:

But you need to assign the stacks and unlink the positions when
shooting handheld before running cpfind. Cpfind needs this information
for the decision which images belong to which stack.


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Re: [hugin-ptx] Re: Aligning multiple image stacks in the same pano - any way to do this automatically?

[T. Modes]

Hi Joachim,

j-sc...@gmx.de schrieb am Sonntag, 24. September 2023 um 21:23:40 UTC+2:

  But in the current version (2022 on Windows) doesn't have "Cpfind 
(multirow/stacked)" as a setting any more. 

This feature has been integrated into cpfind multirow strategy. So just use 
cpfind 
--multirow .
But you need to assign the stacks and unlink the positions when shooting 
handheld before running cpfind. Cpfind needs this information for the 
decision which images belong to which stack.

So the task is:
6 images, handheld!, consisting of 2 stacks of 3 images each, as a 
(vertical, in this case) panorama.
When adding the images, hugin doesn't yet recognise by itself that there 
might be stacks involved.
Ist there a way to
1) make hugin align the images inside the stacks first and
2) then align the 2 stacks as a panorama?

Just optimise all 6 images at once. This should work.

If you want to do it manually, it is just vice versa.
1.) Optimize only the single pano layer first. (disable all other images in 
the stacks)
2.) Then fix the position of the images of this pano layer and optimise 
only the other images of the stacks.

Thomas

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Re: [hugin-ptx] Re: Aligning multiple image stacks in the same pano - any way to do this automatically?

[J. Schneider*]

Hello,
it's been some time since I last made a pano of stacked shots and now
I'm struggling to find out my previous workflow. I have been googeling
and searching through hugin-ptx and found this older post of which the
content seemed familiar. But in the current version (2022 on Windows)
doesn't have "Cpfind (multirow/stacked)" as a setting any more.

So the task is:
6 images, handheld!, consisting of 2 stacks of 3 images each, as a
(vertical, in this case) panorama.
When adding the images, hugin doesn't yet recognise by itself that there
might be stacks involved.
Ist there a way to
1) make hugin align the images inside the stacks first and
2) then align the 2 stacks as a panorama?

There must be a tutorial somewhere that I haven't found. Could someone
be so nice to point me there?
If there is, you needn't read further to tell me what's wrong with the
workflow I thought up myself which doesn't work as expected.


Apart from the fact that it doesn't work as expected, this workflow
would be extremely laborious for more stacks.

1) Images are added, but not yet defined as stacks (so they are 1
separate stack each). Select the images of 1 stack by hand and align
them with CPFind.
2) Optimise the stacks by switching on only the images of the current
stack and define one of them as anchor, optimise.
3) Define the stacks 0 an 1.
4) Let CPFind add control points for aligning the panorama. It generates
points between images 0 and 3 as expected.
5) Optimise. Unexpectedly, the images inside the stacks are optimized
again, they fit worse than before.

Best regards
Joachim


Am 20.10.2018 um 09:44 schrieb T. Modes:


Am Samstag, 20. Oktober 2018 08:41:15 UTC+2 schrieb Geoffrey Liu:


Maybe there is some philosophy behind why this is the behavior.
But I would really like a way to align the images in all my stacks
at once without having to go through this laborious process!
Anybody aware of something I might be missing?


Unlink the image positions in the stacks. Cpfind multirow strategy
already handles stacks. But when the position of the images is linked
it assumes the images in the stacks are already aligned and does not
search cp inside each stack.
If you insist on align_image_stack there is the setting "Cpfind
(multirow/stacked)" which runs align_image_stack on each stack and
then link all stacks with cpfind. Or you can create your own setting
in the control points detectors.
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[hugin-ptx] Re: Aligning multiple image stacks in the same pano - any way to do this automatically?

[T. Modes]

Am Samstag, 20. Oktober 2018 08:41:15 UTC+2 schrieb Geoffrey Liu:
>
>
> Maybe there is some philosophy behind why this is the behavior. But I 
> would really like a way to align the images in all my stacks at once 
> without having to go through this laborious process! Anybody aware of 
> something I might be missing?
>

Unlink the image positions in the stacks. Cpfind multirow strategy already 
handles stacks. But when the position of the images is linked it assumes 
the images in the stacks are already aligned and does not search cp inside 
each stack. 
If you insist on align_image_stack there is the setting "Cpfind 
(multirow/stacked)" which runs align_image_stack on each stack and then 
link all stacks with cpfind. Or you can create your own setting in the 
control points detectors.

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