Re: [IAEP] [Sugar-devel] Education on the XO
Hi Albert, You don't need an account, you can just log in as guest, although its certainly advised to get an account so you can see the full functionality of Moodle like its user detail manipulation, etc. Some courses were set to non-guest or needed a key. I've changed them all to be free, so just logging in as guest should allow you to browse them all. The worksheets sound awsome, If you want me to look at how they could be put into moodle, take a photo of one, and send it my way, we'll see if we can't easily vectorise it or turn into some kind of interactive web based activity. kind regards, David Van Assche On Mon, Jan 5, 2009 at 5:49 AM, Albert Cahalan wrote: > David Van Assche writes: > >> Actually there are a whole bunch of examples I uploaded >> to schools.sugarlabs.org, the problem we have is of how >> to categorise them. ie... do we put them via subject, >> via class, via country, via language? > > I can't see anything there. It keeps demanding an account. > I have absolutely no desire for yet another web site account, > especially when Moodle will supposedly shove constructivist > bullshit down my throat. > > Why can't I just browse? > >> If there are any course content creators out there, I'd love >> to hear their ideas, and if they need help with creating courses >> on the schools.sugarlabs.org site, I believe I can help. > > Perhaps we can find some way to work together. > > In about 10 months I taught a kid about 10 years of normal honors > math. Along the way I saved all the worksheets that I made for him. > He's now beyond that, being well into my old college calculus textbook. > At the start he was only doing single-digit addition and subtraction. > Nope, it's not constructivist. It actually works. > > I was careful to mark the worksheets that were not my own work. > I think that far less than 10% of the worksheets are thus not free > to be used in some other project. The free worksheets could be used > as the majority of practice problems for a set of free math books. > > It's currently on graph paper, 10 lines to the inch. I don't have a > scanner for it, though maybe my 3016x2008 camera (should do 200 dpi) > would be workable. (really slow though -- I have hundreds of pages) > Conversion would involve dealing with plenty of line art. I'm not > likely to have much time for any of this, but it sure seems wasteful > to let the problems just gather dust. Perhaps success is more about > the teaching method and continuous effort though, in which case the > worksheets are less useful. > > BTW, when faced with teachers that are missing or useless, something > closer to the Robinson Curriculum would be appropriate. Be sure to > note how the subject ordering avoids premature and ineffective study. > ___ IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep
Re: [IAEP] [Sugar-devel] Education on the XO
David Van Assche writes: > Actually there are a whole bunch of examples I uploaded > to schools.sugarlabs.org, the problem we have is of how > to categorise them. ie... do we put them via subject, > via class, via country, via language? I can't see anything there. It keeps demanding an account. I have absolutely no desire for yet another web site account, especially when Moodle will supposedly shove constructivist bullshit down my throat. Why can't I just browse? > If there are any course content creators out there, I'd love > to hear their ideas, and if they need help with creating courses > on the schools.sugarlabs.org site, I believe I can help. Perhaps we can find some way to work together. In about 10 months I taught a kid about 10 years of normal honors math. Along the way I saved all the worksheets that I made for him. He's now beyond that, being well into my old college calculus textbook. At the start he was only doing single-digit addition and subtraction. Nope, it's not constructivist. It actually works. I was careful to mark the worksheets that were not my own work. I think that far less than 10% of the worksheets are thus not free to be used in some other project. The free worksheets could be used as the majority of practice problems for a set of free math books. It's currently on graph paper, 10 lines to the inch. I don't have a scanner for it, though maybe my 3016x2008 camera (should do 200 dpi) would be workable. (really slow though -- I have hundreds of pages) Conversion would involve dealing with plenty of line art. I'm not likely to have much time for any of this, but it sure seems wasteful to let the problems just gather dust. Perhaps success is more about the teaching method and continuous effort though, in which case the worksheets are less useful. BTW, when faced with teachers that are missing or useless, something closer to the Robinson Curriculum would be appropriate. Be sure to note how the subject ordering avoids premature and ineffective study. ___ IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep
Re: [IAEP] Flash at Sugar Labs
On Jan 4, 2009, at 9:23 PM, Wade Brainerd wrote: > Personally, I don't believe that Sugar Labs the organization needs > to be concerned with any of these four points. Ahh, but a recurring question from existing Sugar deployments is how to get Flash, why Flash doesn't run faster, etc. > The question is whether the Sugar *software* is flexible enough to > adapt to the needs of its users. Who are we to say what they > should install, and what tools they should use to make their content? The question is what answer you provide to this crucial question. How crucial ? Any (non-x86) processor design hoping to for MID/ settop/laptop market penetration is paying Adobe to support them from day one. One day, we hope they will instead pay someone to port Gnash + codecs instead... > Currently Sugar is incapable of running software which is not > specifically designed for it. Sugar runs simpler SWF applications just fine, through the Browser. They don't have to be "designed" for Sugar. > This precludes smaller organizations who cannot design custom Sugar > activities from producing good content. Once the Sugar software is > more flexible and able to run arbitrary programs (Gnash, Flash, > Silverlight, GTK, Qt) without massive time investment and hacking > on the part of the content producers, the other questions won't > even reach this list. > > Best regards, > Wade > > On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 8:38 PM, David Farning > wrote: > Bryan Berry started a great thread about activity development a few > days ago. In the initial post he proposed using flash as means of > developing content. Before taking the thread any farther I though we > should stop and look at what flash actually is. > > The term flash is often interchangeably used as: > 1. A brand > 2. A player > 3. A development environment > 4. A protocol > > Yep, confusing. As we continue the discussion, I thought we should > look at how 'flash' relates to Sugar and to more generally to OLPC and > Open Source. I have CCed MaryBeth from Open Media Now and Rob from > Gnash to help clarify the many shortcomings in my explanations. > > First, the brand - > Flash is primarily a brand. It was originally created by MacroMedia > and has been purchased by Adobe. The brand consists of the player, > IDE, protocol, and the support and marketing provided by Adobe. As a > brand, Flash is competing head-to-head with Microsoft's Silverlight. > > Second, the player - > The most visible part of flash is the player. The _Adobe_Flash_Player > is a proprietary product which is developed, supported, and > distributed by Adobe. Currently, the Adobe Flash Player can only be > distributed with Adobe's permission. Binary code for the player can > be downloaded for most operating systems and distributions. > > Third party redistribution is strictly prohibited without permission. > As such it would not be possible for Sugar Labs to distribute the > Adobe_Flash_Player in its code bundles. Deployments can, and often > do, add the Player as an available activity. The Player can be > legally redistributed over an organization's intra-net. > > Third, the authoring tools - > Adobe's business model is to give away the player and sell the > authoring tools. As a result, Adobe sells several very good, yet, > expensive authoring tools. Adobe's development tool costs > approximately $750 US. > > Fourth, the Standards - > Flash deliverables come in two formats .swf and .flv. Swf and > ActionScript, the development language use to create .swfs have been > open sourced. I believe that the ActionScript source code is jointly > held by Adobe and Mozilla. There are possible legal questions about > the patent encumberment status of some of the media codecs used in > swfs and flvs. We would need clarification from the Software Freedom > Conservancy on these issues. > > So, counting backwards how does this affect Sugar Lab? > Fourth, the Standards - > We need to wait for feedback from the SFC and Open Media Now. > > Third, the authoring tools - > Adobe has done a very effective job eliminating the competition for > flash authoring tools. http://osflash.org/ has a number of open > source development tools. I am not enough of a flash developer to > judge if the authoring products are mature enough to be useful or not. > Are there any Flash developers out there, can you judge the quality > of some of these products? > > Second, the player - > The Free Software Foundation has flash player project called Gnash. > The project is makin slow yet steady progress towards being a fully > capable swf player. The project suffers from lack of support. Many > Open Source users either download the Adobe player or forgo using > flash. The itch factor is pretty low. > > As a product, Gnash is approaching, yet is not yet ready for, prime > time. I spent New Years Day with my sister's kids( ages 11, 7, and 4) > looking at their favorites sites under Ubuntu/Flash, Ubuntu/Gnas
Re: [IAEP] [Sugar-devel] Teaching typing and basic math on the XO (was: Re: How to Make Activity Designers Happy , Parts I and II)
On Sat, Jan 3, 2009 at 1:49 AM, Edward Cherlin wrote: > I would like to get hold of Omar Khayyam Moore's Edison Talking > Typewriter program and rewrite it in a modern programming language. It > ran on an IBM 360 and taught three-year-olds to read and write on a > Selectric terminal with very little human intervention required. > My PyGTK port of Ben Sittler's Yay Bee See! could be adapted to mimic the ETT. - After the student has pressed some keys and gets used to the feedback of seeing the letter and pictures, show a random picture and "disable" the keyboard except for the corresponding key, just like ETT. - Add a sound effect for each picture / letter combo, just like the ETT. This is something Ben and I discussed which would not be hard to do. It's mostly a matter of collecting the media. - You could add a constructivist twist by letting the student paste in a new picture and/or sound for each letter, perhaps from Record (see Walter's Typing Turtle suggestion). The collection would be saved to the Journal. Feel like dusting off your Python skills? git://dev.laptop.org/users/wadeb/yay-bee-see -Wade ___ IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep
Re: [IAEP] Flash at Sugar Labs
I should add one assumption that I'm making, which is that Flash will never be considered the *primary* content authoring solution for Sugar activities. If it were to become so, given the current state as outlined by David's 4 points, there needs to be significant support by Sugar Labs for the Flash development tools, financially and with code. But from my perspective, the challenges associated with making it a primary content authoring system are so large as to be not worth pursuing when a few simple tweaks to the current software stack would get you 90% of the way there. Cheers, -Wade On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 9:23 PM, Wade Brainerd wrote: > Personally, I don't believe that Sugar Labs the organization needs to be > concerned with any of these four points. > > The question is whether the Sugar *software* is flexible enough to adapt to > the needs of its users. Who are we to say what they should install, and > what tools they should use to make their content? > > Currently Sugar is incapable of running software which is not specifically > designed for it. This precludes smaller organizations who cannot design > custom Sugar activities from producing good content. Once the Sugar > software is more flexible and able to run arbitrary programs (Gnash, Flash, > Silverlight, GTK, Qt) without massive time investment and hacking on the > part of the content producers, the other questions won't even reach this > list. > > Best regards, > Wade > > On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 8:38 PM, David Farning wrote: > >> Bryan Berry started a great thread about activity development a few >> days ago. In the initial post he proposed using flash as means of >> developing content. Before taking the thread any farther I though we >> should stop and look at what flash actually is. >> >> The term flash is often interchangeably used as: >> 1. A brand >> 2. A player >> 3. A development environment >> 4. A protocol >> >> Yep, confusing. As we continue the discussion, I thought we should >> look at how 'flash' relates to Sugar and to more generally to OLPC and >> Open Source. I have CCed MaryBeth from Open Media Now and Rob from >> Gnash to help clarify the many shortcomings in my explanations. >> >> First, the brand - >> Flash is primarily a brand. It was originally created by MacroMedia >> and has been purchased by Adobe. The brand consists of the player, >> IDE, protocol, and the support and marketing provided by Adobe. As a >> brand, Flash is competing head-to-head with Microsoft's Silverlight. >> >> Second, the player - >> The most visible part of flash is the player. The _Adobe_Flash_Player >> is a proprietary product which is developed, supported, and >> distributed by Adobe. Currently, the Adobe Flash Player can only be >> distributed with Adobe's permission. Binary code for the player can >> be downloaded for most operating systems and distributions. >> >> Third party redistribution is strictly prohibited without permission. >> As such it would not be possible for Sugar Labs to distribute the >> Adobe_Flash_Player in its code bundles. Deployments can, and often >> do, add the Player as an available activity. The Player can be >> legally redistributed over an organization's intra-net. >> >> Third, the authoring tools - >> Adobe's business model is to give away the player and sell the >> authoring tools. As a result, Adobe sells several very good, yet, >> expensive authoring tools. Adobe's development tool costs >> approximately $750 US. >> >> Fourth, the Standards - >> Flash deliverables come in two formats .swf and .flv. Swf and >> ActionScript, the development language use to create .swfs have been >> open sourced. I believe that the ActionScript source code is jointly >> held by Adobe and Mozilla. There are possible legal questions about >> the patent encumberment status of some of the media codecs used in >> swfs and flvs. We would need clarification from the Software Freedom >> Conservancy on these issues. >> >> So, counting backwards how does this affect Sugar Lab? >> Fourth, the Standards - >> We need to wait for feedback from the SFC and Open Media Now. >> >> Third, the authoring tools - >> Adobe has done a very effective job eliminating the competition for >> flash authoring tools. http://osflash.org/ has a number of open >> source development tools. I am not enough of a flash developer to >> judge if the authoring products are mature enough to be useful or not. >> Are there any Flash developers out there, can you judge the quality >> of some of these products? >> >> Second, the player - >> The Free Software Foundation has flash player project called Gnash. >> The project is makin slow yet steady progress towards being a fully >> capable swf player. The project suffers from lack of support. Many >> Open Source users either download the Adobe player or forgo using >> flash. The itch factor is pretty low. >> >> As a product, Gnash is approaching, yet is not yet ready for, prime >> time. I spent N
Re: [IAEP] Flash at Sugar Labs
Personally, I don't believe that Sugar Labs the organization needs to be concerned with any of these four points. The question is whether the Sugar *software* is flexible enough to adapt to the needs of its users. Who are we to say what they should install, and what tools they should use to make their content? Currently Sugar is incapable of running software which is not specifically designed for it. This precludes smaller organizations who cannot design custom Sugar activities from producing good content. Once the Sugar software is more flexible and able to run arbitrary programs (Gnash, Flash, Silverlight, GTK, Qt) without massive time investment and hacking on the part of the content producers, the other questions won't even reach this list. Best regards, Wade On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 8:38 PM, David Farning wrote: > Bryan Berry started a great thread about activity development a few > days ago. In the initial post he proposed using flash as means of > developing content. Before taking the thread any farther I though we > should stop and look at what flash actually is. > > The term flash is often interchangeably used as: > 1. A brand > 2. A player > 3. A development environment > 4. A protocol > > Yep, confusing. As we continue the discussion, I thought we should > look at how 'flash' relates to Sugar and to more generally to OLPC and > Open Source. I have CCed MaryBeth from Open Media Now and Rob from > Gnash to help clarify the many shortcomings in my explanations. > > First, the brand - > Flash is primarily a brand. It was originally created by MacroMedia > and has been purchased by Adobe. The brand consists of the player, > IDE, protocol, and the support and marketing provided by Adobe. As a > brand, Flash is competing head-to-head with Microsoft's Silverlight. > > Second, the player - > The most visible part of flash is the player. The _Adobe_Flash_Player > is a proprietary product which is developed, supported, and > distributed by Adobe. Currently, the Adobe Flash Player can only be > distributed with Adobe's permission. Binary code for the player can > be downloaded for most operating systems and distributions. > > Third party redistribution is strictly prohibited without permission. > As such it would not be possible for Sugar Labs to distribute the > Adobe_Flash_Player in its code bundles. Deployments can, and often > do, add the Player as an available activity. The Player can be > legally redistributed over an organization's intra-net. > > Third, the authoring tools - > Adobe's business model is to give away the player and sell the > authoring tools. As a result, Adobe sells several very good, yet, > expensive authoring tools. Adobe's development tool costs > approximately $750 US. > > Fourth, the Standards - > Flash deliverables come in two formats .swf and .flv. Swf and > ActionScript, the development language use to create .swfs have been > open sourced. I believe that the ActionScript source code is jointly > held by Adobe and Mozilla. There are possible legal questions about > the patent encumberment status of some of the media codecs used in > swfs and flvs. We would need clarification from the Software Freedom > Conservancy on these issues. > > So, counting backwards how does this affect Sugar Lab? > Fourth, the Standards - > We need to wait for feedback from the SFC and Open Media Now. > > Third, the authoring tools - > Adobe has done a very effective job eliminating the competition for > flash authoring tools. http://osflash.org/ has a number of open > source development tools. I am not enough of a flash developer to > judge if the authoring products are mature enough to be useful or not. > Are there any Flash developers out there, can you judge the quality > of some of these products? > > Second, the player - > The Free Software Foundation has flash player project called Gnash. > The project is makin slow yet steady progress towards being a fully > capable swf player. The project suffers from lack of support. Many > Open Source users either download the Adobe player or forgo using > flash. The itch factor is pretty low. > > As a product, Gnash is approaching, yet is not yet ready for, prime > time. I spent New Years Day with my sister's kids( ages 11, 7, and 4) > looking at their favorites sites under Ubuntu/Flash, Ubuntu/Gnash, > Xo/Flash, and Xo,Flash. I bet that was the first time they have ever > heard a adult tell them to, 'come on, play it again, just one more > time, please...' about their favorite games:) > > There was a steady decrease in the availability and usability of sites > with Xo and Gnash. We need to wait for feedback from Gnash about the > product's technical limitations and the project's development > limitations. > > Finally, the brand - > Adobe has recently asked Gnash to call their player a SWF player > rather than a flash player:) > > I appreciate your feedback on the technical aspect of Bryan's propose. > In the next few day
[IAEP] Flash at Sugar Labs
Bryan Berry started a great thread about activity development a few days ago. In the initial post he proposed using flash as means of developing content. Before taking the thread any farther I though we should stop and look at what flash actually is. The term flash is often interchangeably used as: 1. A brand 2. A player 3. A development environment 4. A protocol Yep, confusing. As we continue the discussion, I thought we should look at how 'flash' relates to Sugar and to more generally to OLPC and Open Source. I have CCed MaryBeth from Open Media Now and Rob from Gnash to help clarify the many shortcomings in my explanations. First, the brand - Flash is primarily a brand. It was originally created by MacroMedia and has been purchased by Adobe. The brand consists of the player, IDE, protocol, and the support and marketing provided by Adobe. As a brand, Flash is competing head-to-head with Microsoft's Silverlight. Second, the player - The most visible part of flash is the player. The _Adobe_Flash_Player is a proprietary product which is developed, supported, and distributed by Adobe. Currently, the Adobe Flash Player can only be distributed with Adobe's permission. Binary code for the player can be downloaded for most operating systems and distributions. Third party redistribution is strictly prohibited without permission. As such it would not be possible for Sugar Labs to distribute the Adobe_Flash_Player in its code bundles. Deployments can, and often do, add the Player as an available activity. The Player can be legally redistributed over an organization's intra-net. Third, the authoring tools - Adobe's business model is to give away the player and sell the authoring tools. As a result, Adobe sells several very good, yet, expensive authoring tools. Adobe's development tool costs approximately $750 US. Fourth, the Standards - Flash deliverables come in two formats .swf and .flv. Swf and ActionScript, the development language use to create .swfs have been open sourced. I believe that the ActionScript source code is jointly held by Adobe and Mozilla. There are possible legal questions about the patent encumberment status of some of the media codecs used in swfs and flvs. We would need clarification from the Software Freedom Conservancy on these issues. So, counting backwards how does this affect Sugar Lab? Fourth, the Standards - We need to wait for feedback from the SFC and Open Media Now. Third, the authoring tools - Adobe has done a very effective job eliminating the competition for flash authoring tools. http://osflash.org/ has a number of open source development tools. I am not enough of a flash developer to judge if the authoring products are mature enough to be useful or not. Are there any Flash developers out there, can you judge the quality of some of these products? Second, the player - The Free Software Foundation has flash player project called Gnash. The project is makin slow yet steady progress towards being a fully capable swf player. The project suffers from lack of support. Many Open Source users either download the Adobe player or forgo using flash. The itch factor is pretty low. As a product, Gnash is approaching, yet is not yet ready for, prime time. I spent New Years Day with my sister's kids( ages 11, 7, and 4) looking at their favorites sites under Ubuntu/Flash, Ubuntu/Gnash, Xo/Flash, and Xo,Flash. I bet that was the first time they have ever heard a adult tell them to, 'come on, play it again, just one more time, please...' about their favorite games:) There was a steady decrease in the availability and usability of sites with Xo and Gnash. We need to wait for feedback from Gnash about the product's technical limitations and the project's development limitations. Finally, the brand - Adobe has recently asked Gnash to call their player a SWF player rather than a flash player:) I appreciate your feedback on the technical aspect of Bryan's propose. In the next few days, I will try to summarize the (1) organization/development and (2) the educational/pedagogically issues of his proposal. thanks david ___ IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep
Re: [IAEP] IAEP Digest, Vol 10, Issue 18
> From: Alan Kay > Also, I have given an account in several places of some of the wonderful > teaching approaches of first grade teacher Julia Nishijima (when she was at > the LA Open Magnet School). These include setting up an environment in which > children construct and really do discover 1st and 2nd order growth laws as > arithmetic progressions. Most of her (and Mary Laycocke's) stuff was done > before computers (and doesn't need computers) but can later be enhanced by > computers. > > The biggest limitation by far here is not the knowledge of how to do this > stuff, but the fact that most elementary school teachers have essentially no > sense of math, and very few of these really want to learn anything about math. > > Cheers, > > Alan This approach works well in an idealized situation, one with an extremely well-trained teacher and supportive school administration. The vast majority of classrooms in developing countries-and developed ones-won't have these advantages in the short-term or long-term. We need strategies that don't depend on an exceptional educator leading the classroom. -- Bryan W. Berry Technology Director OLE Nepal, http://www.olenepal.org ___ IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep
Re: [IAEP] foundational skills in literacy and numeracy
This might be of interest - "how do we learn math" by Keith Devlin - http://www.maa.org/devlin/devlin_12_08.html honest appraisal of the state of the research "Still, over the past twenty years I've read a ton of research in [relevant] domains - enough to realize that we know far, far less about how the brain does mathematics, how it acquired that ability, and how young children learn it, than we do about the subject itself." Contrasts two views of math learning He makes a case that the process of abstraction by which we initially learn number concepts, for example, is not the same as how many mathematicians tend to learn more advanced concepts that many often learn in a rule based way, and then deepen and generalise and link what they have learnt - like a chess player learning the rules as arbitrary rules, and only later seeing the patterns and strategies Also expands on Lockhart's lament - which is generally arguing that a rule based approach kills the life out of most early maths education http://www.maa.org/devlin/devlin_05_08.html which I gather is Paperts critique - school maths is being like being fed the menu at a restaurant the contrast between these positions - where and when they are appropriate -seems to be at the heart of the "maths wars" more here: http://www.maa.org/devlin/ Bill, I saw that ABC doco - love the light hearted spoof angle; and it gets you thinking Like the observation that not one Roman mathematician is celebrated today, and the dark ages in Europe also co-incided with the Roman numeral number system, while India math was centuries ahead...someone quoted Whitehead to similar effect - good notation frees the mind to work on the real problems From: iaep-boun...@lists.sugarlabs.org [mailto:iaep-boun...@lists.sugarlabs.org] On Behalf Of Alan Kay Sent: Monday, 5 January 2009 5:06 AM To: Bill Kerr; iaep Subject: Re: [IAEP] foundational skills in literacy and numeracy Bill -- Also check out mathematicians turned great math teachers (such as Mary Laycocke) who have spent decades learning how to get young children to learn "real math". Much of this would be called "constructionalistic" (by those who call themselves "constructionalists"). Also, I have given an account in several places of some of the wonderful teaching approaches of first grade teacher Julia Nishijima (when she was at the LA Open Magnet School). These include setting up an environment in which children construct and really do discover 1st and 2nd order growth laws as arithmetic progressions. Most of her (and Mary Laycocke's) stuff was done before computers (and doesn't need computers) but can later be enhanced by computers. The biggest limitation by far here is not the knowledge of how to do this stuff, but the fact that most elementary school teachers have essentially no sense of math, and very few of these really want to learn anything about math. Cheers, Alan From: Bill Kerr To: iaep Sent: Sunday, January 4, 2009 9:45:04 AM Subject: Re: [IAEP] foundational skills in literacy and numeracy I'm not aware of anything that Papert wrote about teaching foundational skills like number (meaning integers) or basic literacy using phonics. self correction: The Progressive Construction of Mind by Robert Lawler June 1980 (Logo Memo 57, MIT AI Lab) was probably supervised by Papert Naturalistic study of his two children aged 6 (Miriam) and 8 (Robby) includes plenty of observations about how the kids learnt addition, subtraction etc. I need to reread this. Important - This email and any attachments may be confidential. If received in error, please contact us and delete all copies. Before opening or using attachments check them for viruses and defects. Regardless of any loss, damage or consequence, whether caused by the negligence of the sender or not, resulting directly or indirectly from the use of any attached files our liability is limited to resupplying any affected attachments. Any representations or opinions expressed are those of the individual sender, and not necessarily those of the Department of Education and Early Childhood Development. ___ IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep
Re: [IAEP] Education on the XO
Actually there are a whole bunch of examples I uploaded to schools.sugarlabs.org, the problem we have is of how to categorise them. ie... do we put them via subject, via class, via country, via language? The infrastructure needs to be discussed and then agreed upon. That's the main reason why I didn't upload anything else. That and I realised I'm the only one adding anything to the site ;-) That said, the entire Open University content is creative commons, and can be easily ported and there are many sources across the internet that offer moodle material in various languages. I pasted a list of the best curriculum and learning sources on schools.sugarlabs.org. There are enough examples up there for course creators to get an idea of how to create an effective learning course, and even some usable courses (intro to gimp, intro to networking, etc.) Moodle is really quite simple to get the hang off, but like everything else, it requires putting time into it. If there are any course content creators out there, I'd love to hear their ideas, and if they need help with creating courses on the schools.sugarlabs.org site, I believe I can help. I also began creating a database of all the activities so that they can easily be searched for, categorised, etc. but I read that this was being done elsewhere so again, I didn't continue down that avenue, but I'll gladly continue if its of use... kind Regards, David Van Assche On Sat, Jan 3, 2009 at 8:04 PM, Bryan Berry wrote: > On Sat, 2009-01-03 at 07:31 -0500, Tony Anderson wrote: >> The XO's primary tool for education, as opposed to learning experiences, >> is Moodle. The problem is that Moodle for the XO is a tool which is >> ready and waiting to be used (all dressed up and no where to go). > > Thanks for bringing this up Tony. I didn't properly address moodle in my > very long article about Karma, a new activity framework for Sugar. > Whatever karma or the default activity framework Sugar become, a key > element will be easy integration with moodle. > > > -- > Bryan W. Berry > Technology Director > OLE Nepal, http://www.olenepal.org > > ___ > IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) > IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep > ___ IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep
Re: [IAEP] foundational skills in literacy and numeracy
Bill -- Also check out mathematicians turned great math teachers (such as Mary Laycocke) who have spent decades learning how to get young children to learn "real math". Much of this would be called "constructionalistic" (by those who call themselves "constructionalists"). Also, I have given an account in several places of some of the wonderful teaching approaches of first grade teacher Julia Nishijima (when she was at the LA Open Magnet School). These include setting up an environment in which children construct and really do discover 1st and 2nd order growth laws as arithmetic progressions. Most of her (and Mary Laycocke's) stuff was done before computers (and doesn't need computers) but can later be enhanced by computers. The biggest limitation by far here is not the knowledge of how to do this stuff, but the fact that most elementary school teachers have essentially no sense of math, and very few of these really want to learn anything about math. Cheers, Alan From: Bill Kerr To: iaep Sent: Sunday, January 4, 2009 9:45:04 AM Subject: Re: [IAEP] foundational skills in literacy and numeracy I'm not aware of anything that Papert wrote about teaching foundational skills like number (meaning integers) or basic literacy using phonics. self correction: The Progressive Construction of Mind by Robert Lawler June 1980 (Logo Memo 57, MIT AI Lab) was probably supervised by Papert Naturalistic study of his two children aged 6 (Miriam) and 8 (Robby) includes plenty of observations about how the kids learnt addition, subtraction etc. I need to reread this. ___ IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep
Re: [IAEP] foundational skills in literacy and numeracy
> > I'm not aware of anything that Papert wrote about teaching foundational > skills like number (meaning integers) or basic literacy using phonics. > self correction: The Progressive Construction of Mind by Robert Lawler June 1980 (Logo Memo 57, MIT AI Lab) was probably supervised by Papert Naturalistic study of his two children aged 6 (Miriam) and 8 (Robby) includes plenty of observations about how the kids learnt addition, subtraction etc. I need to reread this. ___ IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep
Re: [IAEP] [Sugar-devel] Teaching typing and basic math on the XO
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ocBgc55sEsI On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 11:26 AM, Sascha Silbe < sascha-ml-ui-sugar-de...@silbe.org> wrote: > On Sun, Jan 04, 2009 at 10:23:57AM -0500, Wade Brainerd wrote: > > I know Mavis has a simplified flash version on their website. >> > Got a URL? Cannot find it, even after half an hour of searching the web > (most hits are online software stores). > The screenshots I found suggest at least the included "typing games" are > similar to TuxType (haven't found ones showing anything else). > > > CU Sascha > > -- > http://sascha.silbe.org/ > http://www.infra-silbe.de/ > > -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- > Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) > > iQEVAwUBSWDjKbpz82VMF3DaAQKK/Qf/fihyyFU/Ci4nESfoTOo7C4+ROjNRaEDw > JcPXnuicA37jZEHLkYOmFvdSh2Bl9vZB38Wh5EbI5LtZXaODMJPy/yrq5lVLFrJj > imyula2fWezNOSZHhvGl2TifCWTQo/IhL9KmtBZ2nCIX9zUFdsqdyB7ofxok/RMJ > XgKDMXs1Ap/AKHT6S5OBR6S0npGSoz3/x2F3mCsyaDg0PtYoOzvOQLlb+rtOIwBv > IMWvhjR2XumUT0/yZtI4URZgroTLh4wfy8v5PF5J1TobMpDp9ozYQsxoPUh2wJa8 > XJ1uJyU5V4BMhRVcFmZUs2G6437jFthhEuLNMrtkq18mUpsC+4qiig== > =hiYJ > -END PGP SIGNATURE- > > ___ IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep
[IAEP] Thoughts on Pedagogy and supporting activity creators
These are some of my thoughts in response to both Walter's New Year's message and Bryan's threads on supporting easier activity creation. Before I started Education school my background was all technical and one of my "Ah Ha" moments in my first semester was understanding that Educational Theory is not like scientific theory. Scientists actually believe that each new model of the atom is fundamentally more correct then the previous ones. I think this is not so with educational theories. My analogy is that they are hills from which to survey the battle, each giving you a different perspective on what actions you might take to improve learning. Sugar's pedagogical foundation is Constructionism. Wikipedia states: "Constructionism holds that learning can happen most effectively when people are actively making things in the real world." One of the huge values that computers bring to education is the ability to create more learning artifacts that are both better and more authentic. By authentic I mean that the many artifacts a student can create with a computer to show what they have learned about a topic are fundamentally similar to the work products many information workers create. Computers let us keep and organize more work products per student more easily than folders of paper. Our goal, that Walter and Evangeline are currently working towards with the portfolio project, is that keeping and organizing these artifacts results in reflection and thus supports learning. Computers in general, and Sugar in particular, also support collaboration. Vygotsky is a source of pedagogy that stresses the importance of social relationships and context in learning. Notice how, though it might change what an activity would emphasize, this is = not contradictory to the importance of actively creating things. Thus my goal for Sugar would be that it encourages: 1. Creating rich artifacts. 2. Sharing and learning in a social context 3. Reflection So our goal for supporting activity designers is as they transfer their ideas from the Mimeograph world to Sugar that the process of "Sugarizing" the mimeograph content encourages movement towards what we consider important. I like concrete user stories that help situate thinking. So let's make up a story of the young teacher and the similarly aged aunt/uncle of one of the students who has recently graduated from a local technical computer skills program and has the desire to volunteer to spend hours with the young teacher helping to create a Sugarized activity that the students will use. You can set this story in Nepal or Birmingham but take a minute to make a mental picture of these people working together; Situated Cognition theory says that you will learn better and remember more if you have rich imagery. :) So the teacher wants to help the students with a problem that they will be tested on using standardized testing. Perhaps it's using a grammatical structure that is present in the official formal language but not present or different in the local venacular, e.g. "I ain't got no pencil" to "I don't have any pencils". The teacher has a bunch of zeroxed sheets of exercises that have been used since the mimeograph ages and the school has always gotten very low standardized test scores in this area. Yes we need to think about whether these people are using Python, eToys, JavaScript or Flash to convert these worksheets into a Sugarized activity, but we also need to think about how the process of Sugarizing can help them create a more effective learning experience for these students then the original mimeographed exercises. If our documentation on sharing activities includes examples and information on why social learning is important perhaps this pair will decide to create an activity where students correct each other's work, or make challenges for each other to change from informal to formal grammar. If our documentation about saving things to the journal includes information on how the students use the journal for reflection and how it improves learning the pair may get ideas on how to create an activity that allows the students to progress and see how their work has improved from one month or year to the next. So as we discuss how we are going to make it easier for activity developers to use what they know, such as Flash, JavaScript etc. let's also keep our eye on the goal of helping them to create better learning experiences by sharing, in context and in an accessible manner, what the Sugar developers know about pedagogy and learning. -- Caroline Meeks Solution Grove carol...@solutiongrove.com 617-500-3488 - Office 505-213-3268 - Fax ___ IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep
[IAEP] etoys initial usability compared with scratch
Bryan: It takes a long time to train teachers to use Etoys who have never used a computer before. Etoys _requires_ mastery of the touchpad and that was more than we could teach in 2 weeks of training. Dragging and dropping is a non-trivial skill. I think we can train teachers familiar w/ computers how to use Etoys. Unfortunately, 95% of the teachers we deal and will deal w/ are not very familiar w/ computers. This is one of the major differences b/w Nepal's deployments and those of more developed countries like Uruguay Walter: I presume the same thing applies to Javascript and Flash that uses drag and drop? Bryan: It is does if you require a lot of dragging-and-dropping together w/ right-clicking. For example, our teachers got the hang of Draw during training but they struggled w/ Etoys. They could do point-click-activities like GCompris, E-Paath, Maze, etc. w/out a problem Bill: If you did a usability study comparing the etoys interface with the scratch interface you'll find that scratch provides for a much easier startup This includes the touchpad issue (eg. in etoys you have to draw and keep a sprite before you can begin to program) but also there are many other factors which makes scratch easier to use for a beginner eg. * colour coding of different function * all the function areas are visible to start with * clear physical separation of blocks palette from scripting area from stage * easier, more intuitive to see how blocks fit together I recently had a collaborative session with some xos and was introduced to the excellent etoys collaborative features (etoys chat and ability to pass scripted objects b/w users). These are great. I'm just arguing here about the getting started features which have impacted on the Nepal teacher training. ___ IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep
[IAEP] foundational skills in literacy and numeracy
I'm cutting and pasting because the discussion became broken up. Bryan: I love constructionism but too often we focus exclusively high-level math and science and not "foundational" skills or art, literature, grammar, health, etc. By foundational skills I mean basic literacy and numeracy. Kids can't create an Etoys game until they can count properly. They can't read the dialogues until they understand phonics properly. Some vocabulary has to be memorized and kids have to be able to add #'s quickly in their head. When was the last time you reached for a calculator to compute 5 + 5? If you did, you would work much more slowly. I find that Sugar contributors from developed countries are focused more on high-level thinking because that is a deficiency in their local school systems. Their kids can do basic math and _usually_ know basic grammar. Poorer countries are focused on basic numeracy and literacy. You can't program until you can add and read. Countries like Peru and Brazil have schools where kids are ready to focus on high level problems. They also probably have schools struggling to impart basic literacy and numeracy Walter: I don't understand the construing of constructionism with "exclusively high-level math and science" and I don't quite what you mean by "foundational skills". I don't think anyone would argue that we don't want numeracy and literacy to be "low shelf" tools in every child's repertoire, but what does this have to do with the other topics in this thread? Bryan: It has to do w/ this thread because it is easy to create simple animations using Flash but hard to add collaboration and "View Source." I am trying to make the point that a lot of activities don't need those features in order to be very effective Bill: It might be best to drop the word constructionism because it is generally used in a religious sense or alternatively as a swear word I'm not aware of anything that Papert wrote about teaching foundational skills like number (meaning integers) or basic literacy using phonics. btw I recently saw a brilliant and funny video about the evolution of human understanding of number which others might like to watch as food for thought: http://billkerr2.blogspot.com/2009/01/drama-and-humour-of-numbers.html Idit Harel as a student and collaborator with Papert did a brilliant thesis about fraction knowledge which is a foundational skill and widely regarded as poorly taught in primary schools in the industrialized world. See http://www.olpcnews.com/content/education/tidying_up_the_const.html Logo or turtle art does require knowledge of number to start with. I like the sound of Ed Cherlin's suggestion to develop a version with new tiles that may not initially require that. Some people now argue (in Australia) that it would be best if calculators were banned in primary school because many kids arrive in secondary school with a poor sense of number, eg. can't add up or estimate a grocery bill in their heads. Others argue that kids develop a good real life sense of number just through growing up in the modern world but that they find the formalism of arithmetic, eg, the use of operations such as plus, minus, multiply, divide, quite confusing and that it does not transfer readily to their real life experiences. eg. Children and Number by Martin Hughes http://books.google.com.au/books?id=jEMPmGS-ROwC&pg=PA12&source=gbs_toc_r&cad=0_0&sig=ACfU3U14WR9cpeAekaK75LMYYwUDJIPksw#PPR6,M1 That particularly references discusses games as a possibly solution. I'm not claiming expertise in this issue but there is a lot of good educational research out there. Teaching basic literacy (reading and writing) has been a controversial area (phonics versus whole language, perhaps it still is). Once again, I'm not an expert language teacher (my main area is maths, science and IT secondary education) but I have been following the issue of teaching literacy to aboriginal children in Australia, a severely disadvantaged group. The methods used (Accelerated Literacy and Making up Lost Time in Literacy – MULTILIT) do not use computer mediation as far as I am aware. They are teacher intensive. However, I have watched videos of the methods used and I think that aspects of them could be programmed. See the videos on the LHS of this page: http://www.multilit.com.au/ This would seem to me to be well worth further investigation with literacy experts. The point I'm making here is that I can't see how quality activities in these foundational areas will be developed through the methods being suggested by Bryan. They will only be developed through educational research into the best way to teach these areas and then working out how this can be enhanced by computer mediation. ___ IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep
Re: [IAEP] [Sugar-devel] Teaching typing and basic math on the XO
I know Mavis has a simplified flash version on their website. On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 8:37 AM, Sascha Silbe < sascha-ml-ui-sugar-de...@silbe.org> wrote: > On Fri, Jan 02, 2009 at 08:42:21PM -0500, Wade Brainerd wrote: > > I'm following the format used by programs like MicroType and Mavis Beacon >> Teaches Typing (what I personally learned on). Both have demo versions >> for >> Windows available. >> > Do you know where I could find some screenshots or similar showing the > basic concept? > I don't really fancy booting Windows and downloading a 380MB (!) demo. > Otherwise... > > We are working towards an alpha in early January.. When it's ready I will >> announce it on the sugar list. >> > ... I'll just wait for that one. :) > > > CU Sascha > > -- > http://sascha.silbe.org/ > http://www.infra-silbe.de/ > > -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- > Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) > > iQEVAwUBSWC7gbpz82VMF3DaAQIthAf9FYjDR/jthfsnaQnZV5pLifKTrQxWGzY8 > LQBrGPZQRa2D2+0jnvmiSCqsxKZXIuZArUbJP2pt7RSJ+T2w6UygZkbu81SStMmX > AyOtTpKHjQniJzz15rozw23hXVTP1Qo2gncZambMgG123jb2q1D79GUPZL1yczFP > sxrvW+13tlQq8PjUwuTnZiD8h3EG9wlQpGXWJuBXtNiqg2g1M7B8fO12dMkeTrBg > VLt9Y8jBgMY50ecvg7qpSDK9fn1fF78TPGEljEiPlf7AslDK3p7/4BplfwZKwGDh > zhT69cCub/fY01CJ5aUFe5xav9/WJiWD8rLU2pU5PZXI/FJuZLNOeg== > =AKsd > -END PGP SIGNATURE- > > ___ IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep
Re: [IAEP] [Sugar-devel] How to Make Activity Designers Happy , Parts I and II
On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 15:16, Bill Kerr wrote: > On Sat, Jan 3, 2009 at 6:55 AM, Bryan Berry wrote: >> >> On Fri, 2009-01-02 at 15:18 -0500, Walter Bender wrote: >> >> > (3) We need lots more Activities. >> >> While there is consensus on this point, there is not consensus on the >> best way to get a lot more Activities. That is, pulling a lot more >> developers into building learning activities that run on Sugar. > > I think what we need are quality activities from both a technical and > educational perspective, which is a different position from more activities > > The way I read Bryan's position is that it is based on some particularities > of the Nepal situation some of which have been spelt out in the article but > some other educational conditions which were not spelt out > > What has been spelt out: > > Nepal is a poor country cf Uruguay and other Latin American countries > (Purchasing Power Parity PPP$ adjusted income per person Uruguay 8,653; > Nepal 1052) > Most Nepal teachers have not seen computers before unlike their Latin > American counterparts > Nepal developers have existing skills in certain technologies (HTML, CSS, > Javsscript, Flash) and not in others (Python, PyGTK) > Nepal developers are time strapped and have strong obligations to their > families > They do have time and willingness to contribute to more activities but that > requires acceptance, understanding and incorporation of their existing > skill set into the sugar project > > What was not spelt out (Bryan will correct me if I am incorrect): > > Existing Nepal curriculum is very structured > Strong pressure on teachers and students to pass existing curriculum because > of penalties involved for failing > > I can see the logic of Bryan's position when the whole spectrum of Nepal > circumstances are spelt out but I'm wondering how much these factors, some > of which are local to Nepal, should influence the whole project. How much > should Bryan's Nepal necessity - FOSS paradox be transferred to the whole > project of activity development? Well, I see the changes requested by Bryan as additive, so potentially not causing any harm to other users of Sugar. Of course, for OLPC Nepal would make more sense if their work on top of Sugar is used by others, so the burden of maintaining it would be shared. Also, by discussing it with the community first, other users of Sugar can detect areas where it would be worth joining forces, thus decreasing the burden of initial development. Regards, Tomeu > Local factors - such as the ability and willingness of the existing > education system to bend and adapt - will influence how the project develops > in different countries. > > I'll write another comment which addresses the issues raised about > foundational skills and constructivism (by Bryan, Walter, Wade) > > The main point I'm trying to make in this comment is that there may well be > a difference between the current Nepal necessity of developing more > activities due to all the factors above (local issues) and what I see as the > general need for quality activities. I don't see processes or much > discussion for quality control from an educational perspective in place. > Making activity developers happy is not the same thing as making all > educators happy. > > > > > ___ > Sugar-devel mailing list > sugar-de...@lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > > ___ IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep
Re: [IAEP] [Sugar-devel] How to Make Activity Designers Happy , Parts I and II
On Sat, Jan 3, 2009 at 6:55 AM, Bryan Berry wrote: > On Fri, 2009-01-02 at 15:18 -0500, Walter Bender wrote: > > > (3) We need lots more Activities. > > While there is consensus on this point, there is not consensus on the > best way to get a lot more Activities. That is, pulling a lot more > developers into building learning activities that run on Sugar. I think what we need are quality activities from both a technical and educational perspective, which is a different position from more activities The way I read Bryan's position is that it is based on some particularities of the Nepal situation some of which have been spelt out in the article but some other educational conditions which were not spelt out What has been spelt out: - Nepal is a poor country cf Uruguay and other Latin American countries (Purchasing Power Parity PPP$ adjusted income per person Uruguay 8,653; Nepal 1052) - Most Nepal teachers have not seen computers before unlike their Latin American counterparts - Nepal developers have existing skills in certain technologies (HTML, CSS, Javsscript, Flash) and not in others (Python, PyGTK) - Nepal developers are time strapped and have strong obligations to their families - They do have time and willingness to contribute to more activities but that requires acceptance, understanding and incorporation of their existing skill set into the sugar project What was not spelt out (Bryan will correct me if I am incorrect): - Existing Nepal curriculum is very structured - Strong pressure on teachers and students to pass existing curriculum because of penalties involved for failing I can see the logic of Bryan's position when the whole spectrum of Nepal circumstances are spelt out but I'm wondering how much these factors, some of which are local to Nepal, should influence the whole project. How much should Bryan's Nepal necessity - FOSS paradox be transferred to the whole project of activity development? Local factors - such as the ability and willingness of the existing education system to bend and adapt - will influence how the project develops in different countries. I'll write another comment which addresses the issues raised about foundational skills and constructivism (by Bryan, Walter, Wade) The main point I'm trying to make in this comment is that there may well be a difference between the current Nepal necessity of developing more activities due to all the factors above (local issues) and what I see as the general need for quality activities. I don't see processes or much discussion for quality control from an educational perspective in place. Making activity developers happy is not the same thing as making all educators happy. ___ IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep
