Re: COTS software on box ? to replace mainframe was Re: Curious(?) way to ZIP a mainframe file.
Clark et al, Depending on the degree of modifications, isn't it a major negative that mods to a COTS package have to be reapplied or reworked for every upgrade to the package? EdP Clark Morris [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent by: IBM Mainframe Discussion List IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU 02/14/2008 07:56 PM Please respond to IBM Mainframe Discussion List IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU To IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU cc Subject Re: COTS software on box ? to replace mainframe was Re: Curious(?) way to ZIP a mainframe file. On 14 Feb 2008 09:42:02 -0800, in bit.listserv.ibm-main you wrote: Don Leahy wrote: On Wed, Feb 13, 2008 at 10:00 PM, Steve Comstock [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Sorry. What is COTS? Kind regards, -Steve Comstock The Trainer's Friend, Inc. Commercial Off The Shelf. It is the 'silver bullet' solution du jour in the organization that I work for. Ahh! We don't need no steenkin' programmers: we just buy what we want from de' sof'ware store. Which, of course, fails to distinguish your capabilities from those of your competitors. As someone who made his living as a COBOL application programmer-analyst when he wasn't a systems programmer, I wish I could dismiss COTS as something that won't make the grade. However, most of the major COTS packages both enable a company to get good IT practices and tailor the package to meet the organization's needs and goals. SAP or Oracle implementations are not cheap but they can allow major upgrades in the way a company does business because many of the processes have already been coded and tested. Clark Morris Kind regards, -Steve Comstock The Trainer's Friend, Inc. 303-393-8716 http://www.trainersfriend.com z/OS Application development made easier * Our classes include + How things work + Programming examples with realistic applications + Starter / skeleton code + Complete working programs + Useful utilities and subroutines + Tips and techniques -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: COTS software on box ? to replace mainframe was Re: Curious(?) way to ZIP a mainframe file.
The following message is a courtesy copy of an article that has been posted to bit.listserv.ibm-main as well. [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Ed Philbrook) writes: Clark et al, Depending on the degree of modifications, isn't it a major negative that mods to a COTS package have to be reapplied or reworked for every upgrade to the package? re: http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2008d.html#37 COTS software on box ? to replace mainframe was Re: Curious(?) way to ZIP a mainframe file it is all relative ... and/or return-on-investment aka whether overall lower net costs of COTS w/modifications or a wholly developed RYO (roll-your-own) implementation. also there are business opportunity costs ... aka whether the business can better spend the same amount of money someplace else (ROI). for extreme scenario ... a large datacenter (billion or two in mainframe hardware) paid all the engineering and development for a new, significantly better PDU (power distribution unit) ... and then turned it over to a PDU vendor. the business easily justified having a much better PDU ... but couldn't justify actually getting into the PDU business. That PDU is now a staple in large number datacenters. another such example was a large financial institution hired a several experts in complex pattern algorithms and created a sophisticated new fraud detection tool ... and then turned it over to a vendor of fraud detection applications. Again, the business easily justified having much better fraud detection ... but didn't actually justify ongoing development and support ... any competitive business advantage was more than offset by having ongoing supportdevelopment amortized acrossed a large number of customers (and because of competitive business issues they wouldn't have been able to easily vend the products to other institutions) -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: COTS software on box ? to replace mainframe was Re: Curious(?) way to ZIP a mainframe file.
On 15 Feb 2008 08:38:11 -0800, in bit.listserv.ibm-main you wrote: Clark et al, Depending on the degree of modifications, isn't it a major negative that mods to a COTS package have to be reapplied or reworked for every upgrade to the package? It depends on what the customization is and how is it done. Data tables (taxes, account breakdowns, etc.) should survive upgrades with little or no change. Parmlib equivalents also should as should modifications and additions made at the vendor sanctioned change points. Remember that in many ways we are just the installers and modifiers of applications that run and control our data centers (z/OS, CA-1, DB2, etc.). EdP Clark Morris [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent by: IBM Mainframe Discussion List IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU 02/14/2008 07:56 PM Please respond to IBM Mainframe Discussion List IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU To IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU cc Subject Re: COTS software on box ? to replace mainframe was Re: Curious(?) way to ZIP a mainframe file. On 14 Feb 2008 09:42:02 -0800, in bit.listserv.ibm-main you wrote: Don Leahy wrote: On Wed, Feb 13, 2008 at 10:00 PM, Steve Comstock [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Sorry. What is COTS? Kind regards, -Steve Comstock The Trainer's Friend, Inc. Commercial Off The Shelf. It is the 'silver bullet' solution du jour in the organization that I work for. Ahh! We don't need no steenkin' programmers: we just buy what we want from de' sof'ware store. Which, of course, fails to distinguish your capabilities from those of your competitors. As someone who made his living as a COBOL application programmer-analyst when he wasn't a systems programmer, I wish I could dismiss COTS as something that won't make the grade. However, most of the major COTS packages both enable a company to get good IT practices and tailor the package to meet the organization's needs and goals. SAP or Oracle implementations are not cheap but they can allow major upgrades in the way a company does business because many of the processes have already been coded and tested. Clark Morris Kind regards, -Steve Comstock The Trainer's Friend, Inc. 303-393-8716 http://www.trainersfriend.com z/OS Application development made easier * Our classes include + How things work + Programming examples with realistic applications + Starter / skeleton code + Complete working programs + Useful utilities and subroutines + Tips and techniques -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: COTS software on box ? to replace mainframe was Re: Curious(?) way to ZIP a mainframe file.
Don Leahy wrote: On Wed, Feb 13, 2008 at 10:00 PM, Steve Comstock [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Sorry. What is COTS? Kind regards, -Steve Comstock The Trainer's Friend, Inc. Commercial Off The Shelf. It is the 'silver bullet' solution du jour in the organization that I work for. Ahh! We don't need no steenkin' programmers: we just buy what we want from de' sof'ware store. Which, of course, fails to distinguish your capabilities from those of your competitors. Kind regards, -Steve Comstock The Trainer's Friend, Inc. 303-393-8716 http://www.trainersfriend.com z/OS Application development made easier * Our classes include + How things work + Programming examples with realistic applications + Starter / skeleton code + Complete working programs + Useful utilities and subroutines + Tips and techniques -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: COTS software on box ? to replace mainframe was Re: Curious(?) way to ZIP a mainframe file.
On Wed, Feb 13, 2008 at 10:00 PM, Steve Comstock [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Sorry. What is COTS? Kind regards, -Steve Comstock The Trainer's Friend, Inc. Commercial Off The Shelf. It is the 'silver bullet' solution du jour in the organization that I work for. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: COTS software on box ? to replace mainframe was Re: Curious(?) way to ZIP a mainframe file.
On Thu, Feb 14, 2008 at 12:40 PM, Steve Comstock [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Don Leahy wrote: On Wed, Feb 13, 2008 at 10:00 PM, Steve Comstock [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Sorry. What is COTS? Kind regards, -Steve Comstock The Trainer's Friend, Inc. Commercial Off The Shelf. It is the 'silver bullet' solution du jour in the organization that I work for. Ahh! We don't need no steenkin' programmers: we just buy what we want from de' sof'ware store. Which, of course, fails to distinguish your capabilities from those of your competitors. Kind regards, -Steve Comstock The Trainer's Friend, Inc. Competitors? We don't have no steenkin' competitors. If you don't like the way we collect your taxes, then you can take your business elsewherenot. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: COTS software on box ? to replace mainframe was Re: Curious(?) way to ZIP a mainframe file.
On 14 Feb 2008 09:42:02 -0800, in bit.listserv.ibm-main you wrote: Don Leahy wrote: On Wed, Feb 13, 2008 at 10:00 PM, Steve Comstock [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Sorry. What is COTS? Kind regards, -Steve Comstock The Trainer's Friend, Inc. Commercial Off The Shelf. It is the 'silver bullet' solution du jour in the organization that I work for. Ahh! We don't need no steenkin' programmers: we just buy what we want from de' sof'ware store. Which, of course, fails to distinguish your capabilities from those of your competitors. As someone who made his living as a COBOL application programmer-analyst when he wasn't a systems programmer, I wish I could dismiss COTS as something that won't make the grade. However, most of the major COTS packages both enable a company to get good IT practices and tailor the package to meet the organization's needs and goals. SAP or Oracle implementations are not cheap but they can allow major upgrades in the way a company does business because many of the processes have already been coded and tested. Clark Morris Kind regards, -Steve Comstock The Trainer's Friend, Inc. 303-393-8716 http://www.trainersfriend.com z/OS Application development made easier * Our classes include + How things work + Programming examples with realistic applications + Starter / skeleton code + Complete working programs + Useful utilities and subroutines + Tips and techniques -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
COTS software on box ? to replace mainframe was Re: Curious(?) way to ZIP a mainframe file.
On 13 Feb 2008 08:21:59 -0800, in bit.listserv.ibm-main you wrote: -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Steve Comstock Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2008 8:49 AM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Curious(?) way to ZIP a mainframe file. McKown, John wrote: [snip] I don't look for zAAP information on anything. The mainframe is going away is the mantra and nothing that I have done in the past can even get the attention of management. They simply don't seem to want to be bothered with the System z in any manner. John, I was going through some of my old emails the other day and I noticed you writing the mainframe is dying is the motto around here on July 22, 2005. So it seems to be taking its own sweet time. Is this the kind of situation Stephen Y Odo writes about? He's in the 18th year of a five year plan to get rid of the mainframe. Too true. In fact, the mainframe stayed and management went away (was allowed to persue other interests or some such HR-speak). But the motto has stayed. Maybe someone in your management might be amenable to recognizing that the reality is the mainframe is not going away at UICI Insurance Center. The current management still says that it is going away (despite the fact that the workload is growing). They base this on the plan to replace the mainframe software with COTS software running on other platforms such as Linux (Windows is now considered to be also ran around here). They just haven't really found the COTS software that they need yet. Unfortunately even if the mainframe were considered, the probability of finding COTS software that both meets the business need and runs on the mainframe is slim. Kind regards, -Steve Comstock -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: COTS software on box ? to replace mainframe was Re: Curious(?) way to ZIP a mainframe file.
Clark Morris wrote: On 13 Feb 2008 08:21:59 -0800, in bit.listserv.ibm-main you wrote: -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Steve Comstock Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2008 8:49 AM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Curious(?) way to ZIP a mainframe file. McKown, John wrote: [snip] I don't look for zAAP information on anything. The mainframe is going away is the mantra and nothing that I have done in the past can even get the attention of management. They simply don't seem to want to be bothered with the System z in any manner. John, I was going through some of my old emails the other day and I noticed you writing the mainframe is dying is the motto around here on July 22, 2005. So it seems to be taking its own sweet time. Is this the kind of situation Stephen Y Odo writes about? He's in the 18th year of a five year plan to get rid of the mainframe. Too true. In fact, the mainframe stayed and management went away (was allowed to persue other interests or some such HR-speak). But the motto has stayed. Maybe someone in your management might be amenable to recognizing that the reality is the mainframe is not going away at UICI Insurance Center. The current management still says that it is going away (despite the fact that the workload is growing). They base this on the plan to replace the mainframe software with COTS software running on other platforms such as Linux (Windows is now considered to be also ran around here). They just haven't really found the COTS software that they need yet. Unfortunately even if the mainframe were considered, the probability of finding COTS software that both meets the business need and runs on the mainframe is slim. Sorry. What is COTS? Kind regards, -Steve Comstock The Trainer's Friend, Inc. 303-393-8716 http://www.trainersfriend.com z/OS Application development made easier * Our classes include + How things work + Programming examples with realistic applications + Starter / skeleton code + Complete working programs + Useful utilities and subroutines + Tips and techniques -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: COTS software on box ? to replace mainframe was Re: Curious(?) way to ZIP a mainframe file.
On Wed, 13 Feb 2008 20:00:38 -0700, Steve Comstock wrote: Clark Morris wrote: On 13 Feb 2008 08:21:59 -0800, in bit.listserv.ibm-main John wrote: -Original Message- On Behalf Of Steve Comstock Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2008 8:49 AM Subject: Re: Curious(?) way to ZIP a mainframe file. McKown, John wrote: [snip] The current management still says that it is going away (despite the fact that the workload is growing). They base this on the plan to replace the mainframe software with COTS software running on other platforms such as Linux (Windows is now considered to be also ran around here). They just haven't really found the COTS software that they need yet. Unfortunately even if the mainframe were considered, the probability of finding COTS software that both meets the business need and runs on the mainframe is slim. Sorry. What is COTS? COTS == Cheap, Off-The-Shelf (software in this case; it can also apply to hardware... and even to people.) -- Tom Schmidt -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: COTS software on box ? to replace mainframe was Re: Curious(?) way to ZIP a mainframe file.
The following message is a courtesy copy of an article that has been posted to bit.listserv.ibm-main as well. [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Steve Comstock) writes: Sorry. What is COTS? commercial off the shelf ... i believe coined by somebody in gov. sometime around the early 80s ... as alternative to highly customized, one-off, specialty implementations. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
